It was 1989 and six teens were driving out to Fresno, CA in a van, a compact car, and a sedan. We were very low on money and even more low on hope. Since you only needed something like $400 back then to go WOW - no matter where you might be sent in the country - it seemed impossible that we'd make it to CA from OH on a little money and still have enough left to get an apartment and set up for our year in Fresno.
Nonetheless, we stopped in AZ hoping to get some food, rest, and then back on the road. The family coordinator, who was maybe 17 at the time, stated we weren't to purchase food or that we could only spend $2/ea for food. Even in 1989, $2 didn't get much.
I remember we futzed around the rest stop area and ended up talking with a really nice lady with long blonde hair. She was in her late 30's and was driving somewhere for a business conference. She happened to be a health food distributor and had a trunk load of food and juice - and when she learned what we were doing, she blessed us with a bunch of protein bars and juice drinks - really good fuel. She just seemed to want to get rid of it and my WOW brother, who had worked in a health food store prior to going WOW, knew the brand name and knew it was good stuff. He also knew it was really expensive stuff.... He commented, "She was an angel!" I didn't take it as being literal for some time... thinking back on it now, I'm sure he was right.
Whew! Sorry for the delay in responding Chas...the last few days have been very busy.
I think that your friend was probably correct. As I recall God or Angels under His direction (or His Son's) dont need to give you a brand new Mercedes to get you to work everyday. More often than not they do things that are much simpler, like give a lost hitchiker a ride or push someones car out of a snow bank or feed a bunch of hungry kids. Certainly the fact that it's not a Mercedes doesnt detract from the blessing or the joy that the intervention brings.
I think I posted about this on Waydale, back in the daze of yore...but here we go, a day late and a dolla short...
Oak Street Beach, Chicago's northside, circa earliest 70s. This is a beautiful stretch of city beach, popular to all during the daylight hours...but come night time, you would be less than stupid to be there...it was a hotbed incubator for nocturnal trouble.
What is a crowded, bustling beachfront by day, turns echo-empty by the time nite falls.
So there I am, natch. Not just me, but my good friend and travelling compadre, Chrissy, along with a sinewy, long-haired fella named Leon. We overstayed our blistering daytime fun, which had something to do with Boone's Farm and hemp...
Dusk was being bullied away by absorbing darkness. Not a good time for two spring chicks to be on the lakefront. In a city of millions, you can be all but alone in seconds, it seems. Alone except for the lurking baddies waiting for opportunity.
Well, that nite "opportunity" (that'd be me, wearing an Annette Funicello swimsuit doncha know) presented itself. Strolling along the shore, I was oblivious to the fact that Chrissy and Leon were not with me. I wasn't really worried becuz, well, becuz I was really stupid..lol...that's why. Sweet young thing, breasts saluting the moon, trippling thru the stony fresh water surf...an invisible neon sign pointing to me from every direction. Danger, Will Robinson.
Seriously, in what seemed an instant, I had company...and it wasn't Chris or Leon. It was a young teen on my one side, smiling with teeth that lit up the nite sky. Another few seconds, and there were two more, and then three, until I was quite surrounded, but still walking...or more exactly, being walked down the beach. It was like being caught in a current, on land.
From my left, over and thru my crowding "walkers," someone called my name. "Where are your friends?" it said.
Yes, where were my friends? Eeek. I woulda been & coulda been, a sad, city statistic that nite. But there, to my left, stepping out of the light and into the darkness were two young men...they were young white men, in tees and shorts...when they reached me, they pierced thru the "entourage" and walked on each side of me, steering the current in a different direction.
There were badgering voices and sounds around me, but what I heard and locked onto was one of the guys saying to "walk with them, stay quiet, and don't freak." As we did, Chris and Leon were near and walked, with us, in the direction of Chrissy's car.
Still accompanied by a loosened crowd about us, we reached the car, we five got in, and drove away, the howling and jeering left behind.
We knew it was something wild. We were all very grateful to the two guys in the back seat of the Comet. We told them thank you alot...lol...and that we would gladly take them anywhere they wanted to go.
We asked where they'd like to be dropped off, and they replied that it didn't matter, "anywhere was fine. Here is good."
103rd and Stony Island? We let them out, and when we turned the car around intending to holler a last thank you and wave goodbye, they were nowhere to be seen. They didn't poof, or vanish...they just were not there anymore, within the space of a very few seconds.
This was a year or so before I took an out loud, active stand on "the Word."
I'm feeling certain that without those fellas help, my "ministry" would never have happened.
I'm retelling this story now, thinking about it...and it still is my thinking that a very personal, spiritual intervention was made.
OOOOh, this is such a wonderful thread. The accounts are goose-bump-inspiring. Socks - you're like some kind of elder brother Yoda, or something (and I mean that as a sincere compliment, which reveals my nerdness). "Elder" is only a cosmetic term, of course.
It's wonderful to be able to read this discussion.
matilda, that was a very eerie account! You are quite the writer...I could almost feel the breeze from the water and sand between my toes. Gotta love the way Angels just take control of a situation and steer it in the right direction.
It is so good to hear that despite the focus of twi and other cult groups being on the negative there was and is God's presence among us helping us out when we least expect it. Who knows what may have happened had they not intervened in our lives when they did.
ya know.. in that little "diversion" I was on between Bluefield and Princeton WV.. I could have been a "god for a day"..but I chose not to be..
I don't know if this makes much sense..
I told the "bigwig" in charge about this.. and he said I should have told the poor people I was lucifer, or something.. that they were serving the wrong god..
Weird in a way.. I could have actually had a following at the time..
Yes, where were my friends? Eeek. I woulda been & coulda been, a sad, city statistic that nite. But there, to my left, stepping out of the light and into the darkness were two young men...they were young white men, in tees and shorts...when they reached me, they pierced thru the "entourage" and walked on each side of me, steering the current in a different direction.
*Stepping out of the light, into the darkness*. That says it all. :)
I was passinh through the bookshop belonging to the Abbey today and right near the door was a display of books including one called Walking with Angels: True Stories of Heavenly Encounters by Carmel Reilly.
Being aware of this thread, I had a quick look through the book. It seems to be full of stories rather like those in this thread. Same sorts of situations, and others not so far described by Cafe people. Beneficiaries are people in a difficult or stressful or frightening situation, and then some calming boy/old woman/man/driver appears, says "the right words" or does "the right action", helps the beneficiary through whatever the situation is, and then when the beneficiary turns to thank the boy/woman/man - there's nobody there, and no way a person could disappear so fast.
Several of the reports said that they couldn't really focus on the face no matter how hard they tried; or that the eyes seemed really piercing, as if they could see right into you. But all reports that I browsed said, calming, peaceful, comforting.
. . . background -- just like my name is a joke, my heavy revy is often ridiculous (last week, miraculously, I got the outside window of my office cleaned, after the risk manager told me I could not go out on the roof and clean it myself). . .
That is really neat! But, how did you wash your outside window?
Just noticed a response was needed. . .
The Corporate Vice President of Compliance and Internal Audit was visiting at my casino, at my office and he asked how things were going and I groused, ". . . everything's ok except they won't let me wash my own window. . . " And he went out and washed my window and the office window next door. He was not a literal angel, but he was and is one of those drops of golden sunshine the Good God puts into our life whenever He can.
The Corporate Vice President of Compliance and Internal Audit was visiting at my casino, at my office and he asked how things were going and I groused, ". . . everything's ok except they won't let me wash my own window. . . " And he went out and washed my window and the office window next door. He was not a literal angel, but he was and is one of those drops of golden sunshine the Good God puts into our life whenever He can.
Maybe he really was.. angels come in all kinds of sizes, shapes, Demeanours, , etc.. mostly they wear their skins well. Well.. mostly..
It was, as I recall, Christmas Eve of 1978. Mr. Garden and I were on our way home in a really heavy snowstorm, just us and the puppy, Brandy. We drove a VW Beetle. We had stopped spent Christmas Even with relatives and then attended a service at HQ. Mr. Garden was a college student and we were driving back to Athens, Ohio.
The little VW Bug was recalcitrant at best, and really hated the cold weather and snow. Several times we had to stop, shut off the engine, and wait for several minutes. It was a real nightmare of a ride, bitterly cold in a car that didn't provide any heat. We made it to Nelsonville, Ohio, at 1:00 AM on Christmas morning, and just over the railroad tracks the little car coughed discreetly and died. Finito. Nada.
We sat there wondering what to do. Most of our friends had gone to spend Christmas with their parents. One fellow we knew who actually lived in the area resided with his mother, who was not in good health and we hesitated to awaken him on such an icy morning. There was not one other soul in sight, no porch lights were on. The only sound was the gentle hiss of falling snow.
As we tried in vain to stop shivering and to get the bug to turn over, what to our wondering eyes should appear but a very nice car headed in the other direction. As we sat watching, the car passed us, drove over the railroad tracks, and made a U turn. The driver pulled in ahead of us and Mr. Garden went up to the driver's window to explain our situation. The driver, a middle-aged Black man, offered to take all three of us home.
We hastily piled into his blessedly warm car, abandoning the Volkswagen for the time being. He drove us right up to our back door in Athens, refused gas money, and drove off into the night. He never told us his name or where he lived, or what on earth he was doing driving around on a snowy Christmas morning. He did say he lived in the area and had "just decided to go for a drive." Yeah, right!
We got into the house we shared with other believers and even found that our housemates' cat had decided to make an appearance after a couple of months of being lost.
We fed the cat, fed the dog, and snuggled up for a long winter's nap, only to realize the next morning that we had been rescued by an angel. I'm sure of it.
no. can't say i have .wish i could but not even on the wow field.
the only "encounters" i know of are the typical second and third,fourth,fifth hand stories made up by others and then relayed to me by useful idiots who were never there to see them to sustain their own delusion and the twi's illusion of walking in the spirit and power.
power perceived is power acheived right?
and as usual,lacking any physical evidence to substantiate the claims of those who made/relayed them.
that's the funny thing about these so called angelic and spiritual phenomenom.
they always seem to happen.... whenever i'm not there to see them.
Please tell me I'm not the only one who's ever wondered about the obvious scriptural contradiction this subject presents. According to scripture, you're not supposed to be able to see spirits because they have no physical attributes. Angels are spirits, right? Well, another place in the scriptures says you could meet an angel and not be aware they are not human. How does one reconcile the incongruity?
all nine all the time? "greater works than i shall you do for i go unto my father"-jesus.
ever see or meet anyone who could work those wonders? even by accident? i never did!
and i sincerely wish i had.
as i said earlier this weekend,science is busting the myths of the bible constantly.and that the bible belongs on the shelf next to collections of greek mythology.
Please tell me I'm not the only one who's ever wondered about the obvious scriptural contradiction this subject presents. According to scripture, you're not supposed to be able to see spirits because they have no physical attributes. Angels are spirits, right? Well, another place in the scriptures says you could meet an angel and not be aware they are not human. How does one reconcile the incongruity?
Contradictions: That one is pretty easy for me. We have spiritual eyes (e.g. for visions and revelations) that work by faith more or less. Stories are frequent that some see and some don't both in the referenced stories and in the Bible.
To continue in this vein will only put this thread into lockdown or oblivion.Please keep this subject to angel stories. If you guys want to argue about stuff, start another thread in the twi section or in the doctrine section. There are some really nice posts on here. It would be sad if you could send this into oblivion. Please.
I have to address this as it's something I've held forth on recently to some folks, in incredible scintillating dynamic. Wish you could have heard the original but alas this will have to do.
In the interest of letting the Bible's message speak, such as it is and for better or worse, I hold to a basic premise - let each thing, each part, idea, verse, story, record, passage - stand "as is".
With the benefit of investigation, study, illumination and effort yea. And ultimately to present itself as-is, as best I can understand it at the time. That time, and there will be more time to come one hopes but if not, at any given point I know what I know, don't what I don't and get on with it from there.
Out of respect for Kit's guidance here I won't address the specific issue you note here but - it is a good example of the method I'm describing.
I wouldn't take a single thing that I read about "angels" - they're "spirit" -
And then take another thing that I read, like they're encounters with humans in the Bible, or the possibility of being able to encounter them in our lives and "see them" and interact with them -
And deduce there's a conflict, that these two pieces of information don't "add up" or make sense when compared to each other.
Rather -
I would deduce that I now know -
Two things about "angels", and that those two things comprise a partial but more complete impression of "angels".
Considering that I didn't know anything about angels - at all - before I read about them in the Bible which is the source material you are addressing here.
In much the same way that someone might say it's 7:00 pm. And someone else might say it's 10:00 pm. And someone else might say they're an hour late. And someone else they overslept and got up REALLY late. And someone else that they feel sleepy. And all of that as pieces of information to answer the question "what time is it?"
Yes, anyone really DOES know what time it is, to answer Chicago's question. We just have to be willing to look at our watches and respond.
For anyone who hasn't met an angle though and would like to, I'm available. I'm a real right angle, no fooling!
I believe you are an angel without an angle, Socks, you definitely blew into my life with a touch of life saving kindness for which I am eternally grateful.
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ChasUFarley
Yes, I'm quite sure of it...
It was 1989 and six teens were driving out to Fresno, CA in a van, a compact car, and a sedan. We were very low on money and even more low on hope. Since you only needed something like $400 back then to go WOW - no matter where you might be sent in the country - it seemed impossible that we'd make it to CA from OH on a little money and still have enough left to get an apartment and set up for our year in Fresno.
Nonetheless, we stopped in AZ hoping to get some food, rest, and then back on the road. The family coordinator, who was maybe 17 at the time, stated we weren't to purchase food or that we could only spend $2/ea for food. Even in 1989, $2 didn't get much.
I remember we futzed around the rest stop area and ended up talking with a really nice lady with long blonde hair. She was in her late 30's and was driving somewhere for a business conference. She happened to be a health food distributor and had a trunk load of food and juice - and when she learned what we were doing, she blessed us with a bunch of protein bars and juice drinks - really good fuel. She just seemed to want to get rid of it and my WOW brother, who had worked in a health food store prior to going WOW, knew the brand name and knew it was good stuff. He also knew it was really expensive stuff.... He commented, "She was an angel!" I didn't take it as being literal for some time... thinking back on it now, I'm sure he was right.
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Eyesopen
Whew! Sorry for the delay in responding Chas...the last few days have been very busy.
I think that your friend was probably correct. As I recall God or Angels under His direction (or His Son's) dont need to give you a brand new Mercedes to get you to work everyday. More often than not they do things that are much simpler, like give a lost hitchiker a ride or push someones car out of a snow bank or feed a bunch of hungry kids. Certainly the fact that it's not a Mercedes doesnt detract from the blessing or the joy that the intervention brings.
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MATILDA
even before we knew to know Him, He knew us...
I think I posted about this on Waydale, back in the daze of yore...but here we go, a day late and a dolla short...
Oak Street Beach, Chicago's northside, circa earliest 70s. This is a beautiful stretch of city beach, popular to all during the daylight hours...but come night time, you would be less than stupid to be there...it was a hotbed incubator for nocturnal trouble.
What is a crowded, bustling beachfront by day, turns echo-empty by the time nite falls.
So there I am, natch. Not just me, but my good friend and travelling compadre, Chrissy, along with a sinewy, long-haired fella named Leon. We overstayed our blistering daytime fun, which had something to do with Boone's Farm and hemp...
Dusk was being bullied away by absorbing darkness. Not a good time for two spring chicks to be on the lakefront. In a city of millions, you can be all but alone in seconds, it seems. Alone except for the lurking baddies waiting for opportunity.
Well, that nite "opportunity" (that'd be me, wearing an Annette Funicello swimsuit doncha know) presented itself. Strolling along the shore, I was oblivious to the fact that Chrissy and Leon were not with me. I wasn't really worried becuz, well, becuz I was really stupid..lol...that's why. Sweet young thing, breasts saluting the moon, trippling thru the stony fresh water surf...an invisible neon sign pointing to me from every direction. Danger, Will Robinson.
Seriously, in what seemed an instant, I had company...and it wasn't Chris or Leon. It was a young teen on my one side, smiling with teeth that lit up the nite sky. Another few seconds, and there were two more, and then three, until I was quite surrounded, but still walking...or more exactly, being walked down the beach. It was like being caught in a current, on land.
From my left, over and thru my crowding "walkers," someone called my name. "Where are your friends?" it said.
Yes, where were my friends? Eeek. I woulda been & coulda been, a sad, city statistic that nite. But there, to my left, stepping out of the light and into the darkness were two young men...they were young white men, in tees and shorts...when they reached me, they pierced thru the "entourage" and walked on each side of me, steering the current in a different direction.
There were badgering voices and sounds around me, but what I heard and locked onto was one of the guys saying to "walk with them, stay quiet, and don't freak." As we did, Chris and Leon were near and walked, with us, in the direction of Chrissy's car.
Still accompanied by a loosened crowd about us, we reached the car, we five got in, and drove away, the howling and jeering left behind.
We knew it was something wild. We were all very grateful to the two guys in the back seat of the Comet. We told them thank you alot...lol...and that we would gladly take them anywhere they wanted to go.
We asked where they'd like to be dropped off, and they replied that it didn't matter, "anywhere was fine. Here is good."
103rd and Stony Island? We let them out, and when we turned the car around intending to holler a last thank you and wave goodbye, they were nowhere to be seen. They didn't poof, or vanish...they just were not there anymore, within the space of a very few seconds.
This was a year or so before I took an out loud, active stand on "the Word."
I'm feeling certain that without those fellas help, my "ministry" would never have happened.
I'm retelling this story now, thinking about it...and it still is my thinking that a very personal, spiritual intervention was made.
X
M
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notinKansasanymore
OOOOh, this is such a wonderful thread. The accounts are goose-bump-inspiring. Socks - you're like some kind of elder brother Yoda, or something (and I mean that as a sincere compliment, which reveals my nerdness). "Elder" is only a cosmetic term, of course.
It's wonderful to be able to read this discussion.
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Eyesopen
matilda, that was a very eerie account! You are quite the writer...I could almost feel the breeze from the water and sand between my toes. Gotta love the way Angels just take control of a situation and steer it in the right direction.
It is so good to hear that despite the focus of twi and other cult groups being on the negative there was and is God's presence among us helping us out when we least expect it. Who knows what may have happened had they not intervened in our lives when they did.
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Ham
ya know.. in that little "diversion" I was on between Bluefield and Princeton WV.. I could have been a "god for a day"..but I chose not to be..
I don't know if this makes much sense..
I told the "bigwig" in charge about this.. and he said I should have told the poor people I was lucifer, or something.. that they were serving the wrong god..
Weird in a way.. I could have actually had a following at the time..
:)
sorry, too much power for me.. heheh.
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Eyesopen
I'm honestly not sure what I would have done in that situation. It could have been a hoot if you were in a 'pull their legs' frame of mind.
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dmiller
*Stepping out of the light, into the darkness*. That says it all. :)
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Eyesopen
Heehee that brought a smile
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Twinky
I was passinh through the bookshop belonging to the Abbey today and right near the door was a display of books including one called Walking with Angels: True Stories of Heavenly Encounters by Carmel Reilly.
Being aware of this thread, I had a quick look through the book. It seems to be full of stories rather like those in this thread. Same sorts of situations, and others not so far described by Cafe people. Beneficiaries are people in a difficult or stressful or frightening situation, and then some calming boy/old woman/man/driver appears, says "the right words" or does "the right action", helps the beneficiary through whatever the situation is, and then when the beneficiary turns to thank the boy/woman/man - there's nobody there, and no way a person could disappear so fast.
Several of the reports said that they couldn't really focus on the face no matter how hard they tried; or that the eyes seemed really piercing, as if they could see right into you. But all reports that I browsed said, calming, peaceful, comforting.
I will try to post a link.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/images/...9977&sr=1-1
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Kit Sober
Just noticed a response was needed. . .
The Corporate Vice President of Compliance and Internal Audit was visiting at my casino, at my office and he asked how things were going and I groused, ". . . everything's ok except they won't let me wash my own window. . . " And he went out and washed my window and the office window next door. He was not a literal angel, but he was and is one of those drops of golden sunshine the Good God puts into our life whenever He can.
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Twinky
Oh Kit, so glad you found this thread again.
We have new people since it was started; perhaps they can add their stories?
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Ham
Maybe he really was.. angels come in all kinds of sizes, shapes, Demeanours, , etc.. mostly they wear their skins well. Well.. mostly..
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Ham
I dunno.
It's old stuff now.. but still seems new today..
have you ever nearly had your skin burned off by the light?
Met an angel.. heh..
maybe.. it was an angel in time out for half a lifetime or something..
the logical part of me is still working this over..
might never have an answer..
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waysider
Isn't there a scripture someplace about entertaining angels in their unner-wears?
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Ham
heh..
but really, that wasn't it. Not even casually clothed, half or more nekkid..
The perceptive side of me can still see the vision.
The logical side of me is still laughing it's a** off at the perceptive side of me..
It's nice and logical. "If you want to go and get funny in the head.. well, there's not a heck of a lot that I can really do about it.."..
Is there a real answer here?
I don't know even if I really would want to know it even if I could..
who wants certainty, when one can have this kind of entertainment?
sowy. I'm sure this makes some kind of sense in the context of this thread to somebody..
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Watered Garden
It was, as I recall, Christmas Eve of 1978. Mr. Garden and I were on our way home in a really heavy snowstorm, just us and the puppy, Brandy. We drove a VW Beetle. We had stopped spent Christmas Even with relatives and then attended a service at HQ. Mr. Garden was a college student and we were driving back to Athens, Ohio.
The little VW Bug was recalcitrant at best, and really hated the cold weather and snow. Several times we had to stop, shut off the engine, and wait for several minutes. It was a real nightmare of a ride, bitterly cold in a car that didn't provide any heat. We made it to Nelsonville, Ohio, at 1:00 AM on Christmas morning, and just over the railroad tracks the little car coughed discreetly and died. Finito. Nada.
We sat there wondering what to do. Most of our friends had gone to spend Christmas with their parents. One fellow we knew who actually lived in the area resided with his mother, who was not in good health and we hesitated to awaken him on such an icy morning. There was not one other soul in sight, no porch lights were on. The only sound was the gentle hiss of falling snow.
As we tried in vain to stop shivering and to get the bug to turn over, what to our wondering eyes should appear but a very nice car headed in the other direction. As we sat watching, the car passed us, drove over the railroad tracks, and made a U turn. The driver pulled in ahead of us and Mr. Garden went up to the driver's window to explain our situation. The driver, a middle-aged Black man, offered to take all three of us home.
We hastily piled into his blessedly warm car, abandoning the Volkswagen for the time being. He drove us right up to our back door in Athens, refused gas money, and drove off into the night. He never told us his name or where he lived, or what on earth he was doing driving around on a snowy Christmas morning. He did say he lived in the area and had "just decided to go for a drive." Yeah, right!
We got into the house we shared with other believers and even found that our housemates' cat had decided to make an appearance after a couple of months of being lost.
We fed the cat, fed the dog, and snuggled up for a long winter's nap, only to realize the next morning that we had been rescued by an angel. I'm sure of it.
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faith no more
no. can't say i have .wish i could but not even on the wow field.
the only "encounters" i know of are the typical second and third,fourth,fifth hand stories made up by others and then relayed to me by useful idiots who were never there to see them to sustain their own delusion and the twi's illusion of walking in the spirit and power.
power perceived is power acheived right?
and as usual,lacking any physical evidence to substantiate the claims of those who made/relayed them.
that's the funny thing about these so called angelic and spiritual phenomenom.
they always seem to happen.... whenever i'm not there to see them.
hmmm.......
keepin' it real, that's what i do.
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waysider
Please tell me I'm not the only one who's ever wondered about the obvious scriptural contradiction this subject presents. According to scripture, you're not supposed to be able to see spirits because they have no physical attributes. Angels are spirits, right? Well, another place in the scriptures says you could meet an angel and not be aware they are not human. How does one reconcile the incongruity?
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faith no more
easy waysider. the bible is bullsh!t.
all nine all the time? "greater works than i shall you do for i go unto my father"-jesus.
ever see or meet anyone who could work those wonders? even by accident? i never did!
and i sincerely wish i had.
as i said earlier this weekend,science is busting the myths of the bible constantly.and that the bible belongs on the shelf next to collections of greek mythology.
there are no angels and there is no god.
the proof is all around us.
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waysider
Didn't Wierdwilly say, in the Piffle class, that you could use his special "keys" to solve apparent contradictions?
So, which keys can you use to solve this one?....used before, scripture build-up, to whom addressed, correct administration?
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Kit Sober
From Waysider:
Contradictions: That one is pretty easy for me. We have spiritual eyes (e.g. for visions and revelations) that work by faith more or less. Stories are frequent that some see and some don't both in the referenced stories and in the Bible.
To continue in this vein will only put this thread into lockdown or oblivion.Please keep this subject to angel stories. If you guys want to argue about stuff, start another thread in the twi section or in the doctrine section. There are some really nice posts on here. It would be sad if you could send this into oblivion. Please.
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socks
Here here, way's, I'm your huckleberry....
But only cuz I love ya man!
I have to address this as it's something I've held forth on recently to some folks, in incredible scintillating dynamic. Wish you could have heard the original but alas this will have to do.
In the interest of letting the Bible's message speak, such as it is and for better or worse, I hold to a basic premise - let each thing, each part, idea, verse, story, record, passage - stand "as is".
With the benefit of investigation, study, illumination and effort yea. And ultimately to present itself as-is, as best I can understand it at the time. That time, and there will be more time to come one hopes but if not, at any given point I know what I know, don't what I don't and get on with it from there.
Out of respect for Kit's guidance here I won't address the specific issue you note here but - it is a good example of the method I'm describing.
I wouldn't take a single thing that I read about "angels" - they're "spirit" -
And then take another thing that I read, like they're encounters with humans in the Bible, or the possibility of being able to encounter them in our lives and "see them" and interact with them -
And deduce there's a conflict, that these two pieces of information don't "add up" or make sense when compared to each other.
Rather -
I would deduce that I now know -
Two things about "angels", and that those two things comprise a partial but more complete impression of "angels".
Considering that I didn't know anything about angels - at all - before I read about them in the Bible which is the source material you are addressing here.
In much the same way that someone might say it's 7:00 pm. And someone else might say it's 10:00 pm. And someone else might say they're an hour late. And someone else they overslept and got up REALLY late. And someone else that they feel sleepy. And all of that as pieces of information to answer the question "what time is it?"
Yes, anyone really DOES know what time it is, to answer Chicago's question. We just have to be willing to look at our watches and respond.
For anyone who hasn't met an angle though and would like to, I'm available. I'm a real right angle, no fooling!
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Kit Sober
I believe you are an angel without an angle, Socks, you definitely blew into my life with a touch of life saving kindness for which I am eternally grateful.
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