STFI could be just fine, if Schoenheit came to the realization that "the Adminstration of the Sacred Secret" is a theological hoax, and all the "rightly dividing" research supporting it is nothing more than rationalization that magnifies a faulty logic over what is actually written in the Word.
Love,
Steve
P.S. - Schoenheit didn't withstand me to my face. He sent me a postcard saying essentially "I'm too busy preaching the truth to verify whether or not it's actually true."
Eagle, JS may have been a good guy at one time but now he has become egotistical, just like Wierwille, Martindale, Geer, Rivernbark, Hendricks. Schoenheit seemed nice to me when I wrote to him and Glasser, buying their books, the best being One God and One Lord( far better book than JCING)because of better hitorical background than Wierwille. However after firing Mark and Karen, and slowly becoming more paranoid I droped any affliation with S&T with their internal squables.
I appreciate your honesty.. But from my view, Schoenheit really has lost credibility, at least with me. Every interaction I have had with the man, ends up being he is unwilling to even mention one breath about about something different than his beliefs yet alone think differently. And there's plenty of old TWI beliefs he holds onto.
The whole "adultery" paper I think is made more of a fiasco than it was. It wasn't "new truth" or "groundbreaking" research in any way. Just an basic honest biblical truth paper on a basic subject that was rejected and he got the boot for it. To give Schoenheit actually a medal for writing the paper, nah, he didn't know he'd be rung through the cleaners for it. And it wasn't anything "great".
Maybe he's willing to discuss things with you, but I have yet had the opportunity. Oh, there have been plenty of opportunities I've tried, but Schoenheit himself sticks with what he thinks, and doesn't care to discuss otherwise unless it's just dissing other views. Humility is a big necessity to lead any "Christian" organization IMHO.. And I just have yet to see it from him.
I have had first hand conversations with the man, questioning what he's teaching/writing for clarification. He refuses to consider any discussion beyond stating he is absolutley correct. When questioned, one can see his eyes glaze over, and his body stiffen in a defensive posture. A researching ministry must be an open one. He can make mistakes like anyone, but he bristles at the thought.
Wishing him well, is one thing, but you should wish everyone well. Don't swap out VPW adulation for JS adulation---it is the same trap. NO ONE is above reproach. That organization has turned into just that...and "Organization"
A researching ministry must be an open one. He can make mistakes like anyone, but he bristles at the thought.
What is about "research" ministries that seem to produce this sort of egotistical behavior? Perhaps the scripture is true where God states "Knowledge puffeth up." Of course when I mentioned this to JAL he quickly let me know that I was taking it out of context. Oh well. I'll keep the plans I made when I left TWI. Those plans? Stay out of the ditch from now on!
What is about "research" ministries that seem to produce this sort of egotistical behavior? Perhaps the scripture is true where God states "Knowledge puffeth up." Of course when I mentioned this to JAL he quickly let me know that I was taking it out of context. Oh well. I'll keep the plans I made when I left TWI. Those plans? Stay out of the ditch from now on!
JAL was trained by TWI---and very well! He uses the same phrases to discredit any honest question. He likes you as long as you 'high-five' his opinion. JS was trained by TWI too. His mode is to get huffy and defensive with a superior aire...
I knew JS well. Very well. I spent a lot of time with the guy. He went back and forth between clueless and arrogant. It was cute for a while - the clueless part. Both grate on the nerves if no steps are taken to correct deficiencies. The problem is that JS doesn't perceive any personal deficiency beyond the occasional need to lose a few pounds or get a haircut. He didn't screw around in the TWI years - he was too socially inept. He still was the last time I talked or saw him. Appallingly so.
When it comes to the Bible, he is always right. He is so sure he is right that he rewrote the NT to fit his theology. That's the only way he could get "it is written" to agree with what he thinks it should have said. He reworded it, and called it new light. Gotta love it.
Seriously - the whole bunch needs to be b!tch-slapped.
STFI could be just fine, if Schoenheit came to the realization that "the Adminstration of the Sacred Secret" is a theological hoax, and all the "rightly dividing" research supporting it is nothing more than rationalization that magnifies a faulty logic over what is actually written in the Word.
Love,
Steve
P.S. - Schoenheit didn't withstand me to my face. He sent me a postcard saying essentially "I'm too busy preaching the truth to verify whether or not it's actually true."
He learned that trick of dodging questions and comments from VPW. It is a cowardly reaction at best...
I dunno.. what particular paper, or work has he done beyond the adultery word study that you consider to be generally biblically honest, and actually relevant, i.e. useful in practical life?
I saw only one difference in one god, one lord and twi doctrine, the treatment of one verse of scripture.
Something in Collosians. It's been so long, I'd have to look it up.
That's about how relevant, or useful in this particular work that I have personally found it so to be..
I dunno.. what particular paper, or work has he done beyond the adultery word study that you consider to be generally biblically honest, and actually relevant, i.e. useful in practical life?
I saw only one difference in one god, one lord and twi doctrine, the treatment of one verse of scripture.
Something in Collosians. It's been so long, I'd have to look it up.
That's about how relevant, or useful in this particular work that I have personally found it so to be..
One other area of difference, which is what I have put in bold face.
5 This is the written account of Adam’s family line.
When God created mankind, he made them in the likeness of God. 2 He created them male and female and blessed them. And he named them “Mankind”[a] when they were created.
3 When Adam had lived 130 years, he had a son in his own likeness, in his own image; and he named him Seth. 4 After Seth was born, Adam lived 800 years and had other sons and daughters. 5 Altogether, Adam lived a total of 930 years, and then he died.
I refuted the TWI Body soul spirit doctrine with that snippet. Apparently they agreed - but not enough to give me credit.
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Steve Lortz
STFI could be just fine, if Schoenheit came to the realization that "the Adminstration of the Sacred Secret" is a theological hoax, and all the "rightly dividing" research supporting it is nothing more than rationalization that magnifies a faulty logic over what is actually written in the Word.
Love,
Steve
P.S. - Schoenheit didn't withstand me to my face. He sent me a postcard saying essentially "I'm too busy preaching the truth to verify whether or not it's actually true."
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Thomas Loy Bumgarner
Eagle, JS may have been a good guy at one time but now he has become egotistical, just like Wierwille, Martindale, Geer, Rivernbark, Hendricks. Schoenheit seemed nice to me when I wrote to him and Glasser, buying their books, the best being One God and One Lord( far better book than JCING)because of better hitorical background than Wierwille. However after firing Mark and Karen, and slowly becoming more paranoid I droped any affliation with S&T with their internal squables.
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TrustAndObey
Eagle,
I appreciate your honesty.. But from my view, Schoenheit really has lost credibility, at least with me. Every interaction I have had with the man, ends up being he is unwilling to even mention one breath about about something different than his beliefs yet alone think differently. And there's plenty of old TWI beliefs he holds onto.
The whole "adultery" paper I think is made more of a fiasco than it was. It wasn't "new truth" or "groundbreaking" research in any way. Just an basic honest biblical truth paper on a basic subject that was rejected and he got the boot for it. To give Schoenheit actually a medal for writing the paper, nah, he didn't know he'd be rung through the cleaners for it. And it wasn't anything "great".
Maybe he's willing to discuss things with you, but I have yet had the opportunity. Oh, there have been plenty of opportunities I've tried, but Schoenheit himself sticks with what he thinks, and doesn't care to discuss otherwise unless it's just dissing other views. Humility is a big necessity to lead any "Christian" organization IMHO.. And I just have yet to see it from him.
T&O
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Rejoice
I have had first hand conversations with the man, questioning what he's teaching/writing for clarification. He refuses to consider any discussion beyond stating he is absolutley correct. When questioned, one can see his eyes glaze over, and his body stiffen in a defensive posture. A researching ministry must be an open one. He can make mistakes like anyone, but he bristles at the thought.
Wishing him well, is one thing, but you should wish everyone well. Don't swap out VPW adulation for JS adulation---it is the same trap. NO ONE is above reproach. That organization has turned into just that...and "Organization"
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OldSkool
What is about "research" ministries that seem to produce this sort of egotistical behavior? Perhaps the scripture is true where God states "Knowledge puffeth up." Of course when I mentioned this to JAL he quickly let me know that I was taking it out of context. Oh well. I'll keep the plans I made when I left TWI. Those plans? Stay out of the ditch from now on!
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Rejoice
JAL was trained by TWI---and very well! He uses the same phrases to discredit any honest question. He likes you as long as you 'high-five' his opinion. JS was trained by TWI too. His mode is to get huffy and defensive with a superior aire...
I like your plan of action!
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OldSkool
Thanks!!
And I guess the acorn doesn't fall far from the oak.
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Tzaia
I knew JS well. Very well. I spent a lot of time with the guy. He went back and forth between clueless and arrogant. It was cute for a while - the clueless part. Both grate on the nerves if no steps are taken to correct deficiencies. The problem is that JS doesn't perceive any personal deficiency beyond the occasional need to lose a few pounds or get a haircut. He didn't screw around in the TWI years - he was too socially inept. He still was the last time I talked or saw him. Appallingly so.
When it comes to the Bible, he is always right. He is so sure he is right that he rewrote the NT to fit his theology. That's the only way he could get "it is written" to agree with what he thinks it should have said. He reworded it, and called it new light. Gotta love it.
Seriously - the whole bunch needs to be b!tch-slapped.
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OldSkool
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Ham
I'm still looking for a definition of what is "Just Fine"..
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Thomas Loy Bumgarner
maybe Larry Fine(Feinberg) from the 3 Stooges?
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waysider
Nyuck Nyuck Nyuck
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Ham
I wonder how "just fine" they are, trying to sell off over-valued property..
I thought I heard a few stories indicating otherwise.. stories of adultery and such.
I think twi hired him only because he had a loud enough of a mouth..
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Rejoice
He learned that trick of dodging questions and comments from VPW. It is a cowardly reaction at best...
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Ham
I dunno.. what particular paper, or work has he done beyond the adultery word study that you consider to be generally biblically honest, and actually relevant, i.e. useful in practical life?
I saw only one difference in one god, one lord and twi doctrine, the treatment of one verse of scripture.
Something in Collosians. It's been so long, I'd have to look it up.
That's about how relevant, or useful in this particular work that I have personally found it so to be..
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Tzaia
The former wife partook. He claims he did not. I point blank asked.
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Tzaia
One other area of difference, which is what I have put in bold face.
5 This is the written account of Adam’s family line.
When God created mankind, he made them in the likeness of God. 2 He created them male and female and blessed them. And he named them “Mankind”[a] when they were created.
3 When Adam had lived 130 years, he had a son in his own likeness, in his own image; and he named him Seth. 4 After Seth was born, Adam lived 800 years and had other sons and daughters. 5 Altogether, Adam lived a total of 930 years, and then he died.
I refuted the TWI Body soul spirit doctrine with that snippet. Apparently they agreed - but not enough to give me credit.
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