Wierwille's Summit: Spiritual Noblesse

[chockfull]

I don't know exactly how SIT got pulled into this thread, but it appeared to be on - topic and skyrider didn't seem to object, so I guess it's on-topic. My first post was intended to be limited to how I thought TWI used SIT both as bait and as a kind of self - deception that was socially reinforced. Again, on-topic. Allan proceeded to challenge an aspect of my point, and I responded to him. Nothing more. Is that "Buzz Killington"? Maybe. I don't see it as my job to sustain someone's buzz, especially when I think that buzz is based on a spiked drink.

I guess I specifically thought your post was confrontationally challenging Allen and throwing a gauntlet down to have him enter a million dollar challenge to prove the genuine nature of what he feels is a genuine act. Actually that's about exactly how it came off. And rather than rehash an old prolonged heated argument again I just thought that maybe you dialing it back a couple notches and respecting that others who post here have a different opinion than yourself on this matter would be warranted. That's all. Sorry if you didn't understand what I meant by "Buzz Killington". It seems to me that one side of this argument isn't the only place "spiritual elitism" as an attitude is encountered. I didn't mean to get in the middle of you guys argument.

Edited July 26, 2014 by chockfull

[chockfull]

But I must say.....that the ritual of twig manifestations, 3X a week and/or "believer's meetings EVERY morning with sleepy, snarky wow family sure put a damper on "hearing from God." Oh, vanity of vanities. I am firmly in the camp that these manifestations are present AND available......BUT NOT THERE ON A WHIM OR 'LOOK HOW SPIRITUAL I AM' SIGN TO UNBELIEVERS.

For me, wierwille muddied the waters by his blatant disregard to live with spiritual integrity.

Yes we were taught to be gong players for sure in the ministry. And VP's lack of integrity is the foundation of TWI.

[Raf]

Just as you say that one should not express his opinion as fact, I am entitled to call people on it when they express their opinions as fact. Allan made a statement of fact, not opinion. I'm simply pointing out that what he said was not a fact at all. If that makes me a spiritual elitist, that's a pretty backwards definition of the term.

Edited July 26, 2014 by Raf

[Allan]

My apologies to Raf if he felt challenged by me simply because I stated something that is real to me and some others on this site. It's great, you have your opinion and I have mine. I did not intend to challenge your NOT speaking in tongues.:) As for the 'other' manifestations I 'opine' :) that where one has a group of people that genuinely love God with all their h,s,m,s you will see them evidenced as I myself have and I am sure others on the site have as well. L N B

[Raf]

Cool.

[WordWolf]

Ok, I guess we're all cool again.

*passes out snow-cones and hot chocolate*

[waysider]

Somebody pass me a s'more.

[Allan]

s'mores...another one of those 'bad' habits we foreigners picked up from you 'mericans lol

[chockfull]

Just as you say that one should not express his opinion as fact, I am entitled to call people on it when they express their opinions as fact. Allan made a statement of fact, not opinion. I'm simply pointing out that what he said was not a fact at all. If that makes me a spiritual elitist, that's a pretty backwards definition of the term.

You are entitled to call people on the fact vs. opinion. And I agree with Allan that I'm not challenging your views on this either. Or implying that views on one side of this or another indicate anything else.

I do think you read a little into my comment on spiritual elitist. I was commenting on the flavor of one post, not an overall assessment of someone's life. I do think one horrible habit we picked up in TWI was an extreme intolerance for opposing views. So I want to act more normally in this setting, not like a cult member. After a little more reflection I also wanted to add that because TWI taught a spiritual elitist attitude on one side of the manifestations, I acknowledge that for many people developing a strong attitude on the other side of the argument helps them balance things out for them.

My apologies to Raf if he felt challenged by me simply because I stated something that is real to me and some others on this site. It's great, you have your opinion and I have mine. I did not intend to challenge your NOT speaking in tongues.:)/>/> As for the 'other' manifestations I 'opine' :)/>/> that where one has a group of people that genuinely love God with all their h,s,m,s you will see them evidenced as I myself have and I am sure others on the site have as well. L N B

I agree.

Edited July 27, 2014 by chockfull

[Raf]

Seriously, enough with the rehashing. I have nothing new to add. Let's move on.

[excathedra]

some of you are really sarcastic and almost mean about your beliefs

i know i am a complete biatch at times myself

Edited July 27, 2014 by excathedra

[Grace Valerie Claire]

On 7/25/2014 at 4:43 PM, Raf said:

God would have to be pretty stupid to allow such a thing to happen.

I mean, if He knew that there are people who would believe, but kept them out of heaven because of a church's marketing strategy, that would be pretty darned evil.

I see this as evidence that these people didn't really trust God (or have the slightest idea what they were talking about. Or both).

Or both!