No Estimated Prophet, I wasn`t baiting you. Thank you for giving me the benefit of the doubt.
I seriously wanted to know what you thought was made up. Sometimes when we are uncomfortable with the truth of a situation ... I have noticed that we have a tendency to discount the information by branding the bearer as a liar.
I wondered exactly what you thought was made up. It would give us a chance to examine the information and determine if the person who presented it was an actual liar.
Either somebody lied A, or B, you simply didn`t like the information presented. I seriously wanted to know which was the case in which post that you were referring to.
The example you sighted, I cannot tell out of context which part, or to whom it is referring, that you have an issue with. I cannot say that I agree or disagree with you there....I will have to go back and read in context.
No Estimated Prophet, I wasn`t baiting you. Thank you for giving me the benefit of the doubt.
'''
The example you sighted, I cannot tell out of context which part, or to whom it is referring, that you have an issue with. I cannot say that I agree or disagree with you there....I will have to go back and read in context.
Rascal,
I was referencing. Post 630.
I believe the person who made that post was expressing their honest opinion,
I wouldn't call them a liar, just misguided.
The same poster has made many other valid observations that I agree with,
and I really appreciate the passion and hunger for righteousness that they display.
So just like with my freinds at CES, and with prophecies;
I am grateful that people care enough to speak into my life,
and I consider what they are saying, but I don't always have to agree with it.
I don't doubt , having read your response, that you are sincere in not wanting to bait me.
Its cool.
and I recognize the I am also capable of being wrong at times and "inventing" notions that just aren't true.
My whole point was for us to emphasize the positive and not magnify the negatives.
and keep asking the Father of Lights for wisdom that works the fruits of righteousness.
So please don't let that stop you from pressing into Him with whom we have to do;
and to flow in the spirit of His Way,
namely Jesus Christ.
Thanks for the advice, but a quick physical walk down one of my roads in life over here, will possibly convince you it's a lot easier and safer to keep preaching behind a keyboard. All that flowing wisdom sounds great, I just wish you were here to help me implement more of it. I keep telling people to expand their comfort zones and come visit but no takers so far...except MrtheEvan from Keeenya!
Thanks for the invitation Bumpy.
I'm sorry I can't be with you,
but the flowing wisdom is always with you as you walk your road.
There is substance to what I'm saying if you're willing to believe it,
because it is based upon the Word of Truth
which is based upon the Integrity of God
which is based upon the Power of God.
Rejoice that we have a Lord whose support and supply are constantly working in your life and in your situation.
I suspect the spider prophecies didn't resonate so much within Elizabeth. But it looks like the system she was in wouldn't allow for her to disagree with the 'prophets of God'.
I dunno--seems to me this practice is like explaing the virtues and benefits of a roaring fire and then handing a box of matches to your four year old.
But then I see 'leadership' in the same light. Since so few can actually handle the responsibility, there needs to be safe guards and balancing of powers to protect the little people. But people want to have that fantasy of the stupendous tapped in leader--it makes things so much easier, just do what you're told...he's a man of Gawd, he can't be wrong...
Yeah. I think when answers to honest questions are anticipated with the response "if you disagree with me, read my book".. it's PRACTICALLY a lost cause. "I'm right, you're wrong, because discounting prophecy as false IN ITSELF is unbiblical.." More posturing.. "I'm da man, listen to me.."
I didn't close the door.
To say that the "critics" who disagree with him are discounting prophecy as false in itself is an unwarranted assumption.
I don't discount prophecy in itself, but 99.9 % of the ones I've heard, I would say were made up in the imagination of the one giving them. Say the right catch-phrases, maybe quote a few verses of scripture, and everything is OK. Or is it?
MY bible has a few things to say about "da man" that opens his mouth, and says "The Lord Sayeth", when the Lord has NOT spoken.
But then I see 'leadership' in the same light. Since so few can actually handle the responsibility, there needs to be safe guards and balancing of powers to protect the little people
So few that can handle the "power".. and I can count them easily on one hand.
They had "safeguards" in old testament times, but I think we'd get in *slightly* a little trouble implementing them here..
Just makes me wonder though.. so many words, so many "prophecies"- how many of them would be spoken, if the speaker's life depended on whether it was genuine or not.
No "practice sessions" till I get it right..
No excuses.
"Now, if you'd just put down those rocks, and read my book first.."
Right you are Hammer...I think this whole dog and pony show (personal prophesy), is a left-over from waybrain. "All nine all the time" type of thinking...They had to have a gimmick, a magic show, something that not only seperated them from the boring, run of the mill Christians at church...but something that would dazzle the on lookers.
There used to be these "fortune tellers" who sat on stage and would tell people remarkable things about their lives...as if they had some "spiritual insight". Actually, there are techniques to this "art form"...How difficult would it be to give someone a "personal prophesy" that contained relevant information?...How easy would it be to manipulate people with this "tool"?
I hesitate to say that they deliberately make up their prophesies...but where do they get off putting such importance on this stuff that comes out of THEIR mouths? The old saying used to go..."The guy with the biggest stick makes the rules", but in this case it's..."Whoever has authority of the prophesies controls your life"
Well, again we see the fruit of such foolishness...witch of Endor indeed!
I'm sure Mark Sanguinetti was not the only voice of reason they have heard, too bad they didn't harken to it.
Reading Elizabeth's letter smacks of all the tactics used by TWI heavy handed cronies, same fear tactics, same smear campaigns, same mark and avoid of those labeled with spirits. No new thing under the sun. Very sad indeed.
...
Geez, no wonder the whole freakin generation of those stiffnecked children of Israel had to die off before Moses could lead them to the promised land, when will they ever learn?
Great Points.
The Elizabeth Lynn saga is very hard for me to comprehend, but it did happen.
I known of at least one person who received what I consider a genuine revelation
concerning John and Elizabeth before they divorced which was totally unheeded.
It doesn't seem to appear on the prophetic council's report.
Why ?
I have to believe if the B.O.D. will look and see why only the attacks upon Elizabeth were given an audience, then they will see how they are now in a crisis.
I believe that its another case of a man's agenda supersceding the Lord Jesus Christ's agenda.
I pray that my friends will truely hold Jesus as the Head of the Body and allow Him to bring things back into order.
Also.
I believe the Lord Jesus Christ raised up The Sprit and Truth Fellowship Int.
as a blessing for the Next Genration.
For the generation that wasn't subjected to waybrainitis.
I have high hope for this organization and pray it will weather the storm
Why do you need another person to prophesy for your life? Does your God nor deal with you directly? It has to be through someone else? So instead of trying to hear directly from your God, you go to someone else?
Good question Bramble.
I think we all, at times can let a man's agenda superscede the Lord's agenda.
I know I have.
Sometimes we need a confirmation of exactly what the Almighty God is trying to tell us,
or if we are only hearing a human's speculation.
When you're in a situation that is very pressing,
sometimes a word from above makes a huge difference.
When my cousin was facing surgury, my mother went to visit.
My mother spoke something reassuring to my cousin regarding God,
that was exactly what her pastor ahd told her earlier that day.
My mother,
who wasn't even aware that she was prophecying,
was moved by the spirit of God to speak those words,
which confirmed for my cousin that God would work to bring her healing,
because He said it to her twice in a way that could not be pre-arranged
which energized her faith.
and she came through the surgury successfully.
I don't know if that answers your question,
but experiences like that make me marvel at the Wonders of our God.
Estimated Prophet, are we talking about the same thing?
You, of your own free will, choose to go to someone you believe has spiritual insight or prophcey,whatever, to get something confirmed that you think God might be trying to tell you. I have no problem with that. Heck, I've had my cards read before.
Here is problem#1.
Are you then required to obey that person's prophesy, on pain of divorce or mark and avoid? You are expected to make changes A,B and C?
It becomes their business? The business of the elders in your church?
Problem #2.
People who you haven't asked to prophesy for you suddenly pop up with wacky stuff about you that God told them. Your husband, being so full of love and stuff, divorces you because you are wacky, the prophets said so. Obviously their words must be obeyed.
I got a big problem with that. I would call that boundary jumping, people being busybodies.
That's personal prophecy? Where the person prophesied about is like in third person ?
God told me to tell you that your wife...
That you would still consider those people church leaders and elders boggles my mind.
Well, not really. Twenty years in TWI-- I know that people are often expendable for the Work of the Ministry.
The "PC" - the "Prophetic Council" - I'm still trying to digest that one.
It's another one of those bizarre expressions which awakens my evil dark side,
the comic book reader/artist.
I imagine this "PC" like the council in the old "Green Lantern" comics, comprised of those short, big-headed, white-haired, blue/or/green-skinned elders seated at their judgment bench, yappin' and deliberating about God-knows-what. It's been a while since I read those.
I have to believe if the B.O.D. will look and see why only the attacks upon Elizabeth were given an audience, then they will see how they are now in a crisis.
I believe that its another case of a man's agenda supersceding the Lord Jesus Christ's agenda.
I pray that my friends will truely hold Jesus as the Head of the Body and allow Him to bring things back into order.
Estimated,
I find what was done to Elizabeth Lynn exceptionally grievous and disturbing. It reminds me so much of how chosen "lower rung believers" or those whom had been marked, for whatever reason, were shredded and thrown into the spin cycle by "elders" of TWI, some of which I was a personal witness to back in the day.
I do not believe there would ever be compensation enough in this life, to rectify what has been done to this woman.
And why was this done to her, because someone in a position of responsibility had an elevated viewpoint of themselves, thought their stuff don’t stink, took their own personal sense of righteousness to a obtuse unmeek level, was jealous, was threatened, wanted John Lynn job, perhaps for one or all of these reasons, and the rest of you followed her down the same path and even chose to actively conspire against an innocent one. None of these actions, thoughts and behaviors are remotely right, moral or a characteristic of a elder biblically. Let alone this personal vendetta war was waged, conducted and endorsed in the name of God.
Look, I don’t want to beat up on you personally, this is not just directed at you, but regarding the practice of personal prophecy, something obviously wasn’t practiced in the holy spirit or in truth and light-spiritually.
You all will have to have the humility of David to be able to look at this practice dead in the face and determine that you missed the mark, that you made a series of bad decisions which brought you to the place of practicing such error.
Frankly, all I have seen so far is the humility of Saul, who never did get over his problems with the Lord or with David. Saul, who saw light, on and off through the years, but for the most part never regained his standing with the Lord-which led to his ultimate destruction in misery.
I understand that those of you who originally “bought in” to the idea of this practice have a lot invested in it, your personal reputations, your personal ministry, the public promotion of the error of the doctrine surrounding this practice and theology, hours and hours of research and teaching, the time and years involved, the burden of the weight of the responsibility you have to the household, the leading of so many down this path, your whole basis of why you feel you were right, the basis by which you have made so many decisions.
I understand that this is monumental, but really, there was obviously a problem in what you were doing that you were not aware of until others pointed it out to you. Please take heed to the biblical guidance that has been offered here thus far.
Estimated Prophet, are we talking about the same thing?
Yes and no.
[I think I'm talking about the best case scenarios of prophecy,
and your addressing the worst case, or abuses in prophecy.]
You, of your own free will, choose to go to someone you believe has spiritual insight or prophcey,whatever, to get something confirmed that you think God might be trying to tell you. I have no problem with that. Heck, I've had my cards read before.
Here is problem#1.
Are you then required to obey that person's prophesy, on pain of divorce or mark and avoid? You are expected to make changes A,B and C?
[My personal opinion is that you would be required to take those words to the feet of the Master, and consider them before Him (Jesus). Obeying God in Christ is paramont.
I never like the "permission to fail" that CES extended to prophetic utterance.
But that notion also serves to alert us that the prophecies may be flawed.]
It becomes their business? The business of the elders in your church?
[ that is a sad fact of life !!
I get a flash of Jack Nicolson shoutng "You can't handle the Truth"
whenever I think about really opening up to Christian Counselors.
There are some you can trust, and some that you can't.]
Problem #2.
People who you haven't asked to prophesy for you suddenly pop up with wacky stuff about you that God told them. Your husband, being so full of love and stuff, divorces you because you are wacky, the prophets said so. Obviously their words must be obeyed.
I got a big problem with that. I would call that boundary jumping, people being busybodies.
[ When I see that happening I see Red Flags waving. MOst people will tell you if they have a Word for you and then let you decide if you want to hear it.
And I would say Never Never automatically obey a prophecy without geting alone with God in Christ and being clear with them in your hert of hearts.]
That's personal prophecy? Where the person prophesied about is like in third person ?
God told me to tell you that your wife...
That you would still consider those people church leaders and elders boggles my mind.
[ The gifts and callings of God are without repentance,
and His mercy is rich and everlasting,
and my Lord wants us to receive one another,
even as he has already received us,
into his grace and Glory.
but that does not mean I allow them to run my life,
nor have I folowed their lead that has drifted away from the love of Christ ]
Well, not really. Twenty years in TWI-- I know that people are often expendable for the Work of the Ministry.
I find what was done to Elizabeth Lynn exceptionally grievous and disturbing. It reminds me so much of how chosen "lower rung believers" or those whom had been marked, for whatever reason, were shredded and thrown into the spin cycle by "elders" of TWI, some of which I was a personal witness to back in the day.
...
Look, I don’t want to beat up on you personally, this is not just directed at you, but regarding the practice of personal prophecy, something obviously wasn’t practiced in the holy spirit or in truth and light-spiritually.
...
Who do you wanna be like, Saul or David?
God bless you,
You are always welcome at the bema.
God Bless You too , But Now I See.
That was an excellent post.
We will all be giving an account for our words and actions at the Bema.
and there will be much weeping and knashing of teeth.
I am also not involved in the leadership of S&T,
so I don't take any of your words personally,
but you speak the Truth in Love and I salute you for for that.
I saw the ship heading for troubled waters three years ago,
but never expected it to become this troubled.
I believe they have allowed their passion for holiness and purity
to justify taking harmful actions against their brothers and sisters in Christ.
I believe the goodness of God causes men to repent.
That the Love of God constrains us to do His will.
and that the Wisdom from above works the peacable fruits of righteousness.
All of those elements are needed in the S&T BOD.
They must also eliminate the wisdom that is earthly, sensual and devilish
Just gotta say, it seems to me that if a minister devoted his full time career to the work of the ministry--for say, twenty to thirty years!-- teaching the 'greatest known truth since the first century church,' there would be more good fruit to show for it than broken marriages, broken friendships, law suits, internal power plays and weird prophecies and manipulations.
Something basic and important is wrong. IMO, to continue following these leaders is foolish.
Just gotta say, it seems to me that if a minister devoted his full time career to the work of the ministry--for say, twenty to thirty years!-- teaching the 'greatest known truth since the first century church,' there would be more good fruit to show for it than broken marriages, broken friendships, law suits, internal power plays and weird prophecies and manipulations.
Something basic and important is wrong. IMO, to continue following these leaders is foolish.
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rascal
No Estimated Prophet, I wasn`t baiting you. Thank you for giving me the benefit of the doubt.
I seriously wanted to know what you thought was made up. Sometimes when we are uncomfortable with the truth of a situation ... I have noticed that we have a tendency to discount the information by branding the bearer as a liar.
I wondered exactly what you thought was made up. It would give us a chance to examine the information and determine if the person who presented it was an actual liar.
Either somebody lied A, or B, you simply didn`t like the information presented. I seriously wanted to know which was the case in which post that you were referring to.
The example you sighted, I cannot tell out of context which part, or to whom it is referring, that you have an issue with. I cannot say that I agree or disagree with you there....I will have to go back and read in context.
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Estimated Prophet
Rascal,
I was referencing. Post 630.
I believe the person who made that post was expressing their honest opinion,
I wouldn't call them a liar, just misguided.
The same poster has made many other valid observations that I agree with,
and I really appreciate the passion and hunger for righteousness that they display.
So just like with my freinds at CES, and with prophecies;
I am grateful that people care enough to speak into my life,
and I consider what they are saying, but I don't always have to agree with it.
I don't doubt , having read your response, that you are sincere in not wanting to bait me.
Its cool.
and I recognize the I am also capable of being wrong at times and "inventing" notions that just aren't true.
My whole point was for us to emphasize the positive and not magnify the negatives.
and keep asking the Father of Lights for wisdom that works the fruits of righteousness.
Peace
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Estimated Prophet
Yes Bramble,
that possibility exists.
But I think manipulaters will still manipulate, so we maut always be on guard.
I hold to Dr W.'s idea that Giod will tell you first,
so that a prophetic Word will resonate with what you already know inside.
Prophc y is a gift of God's Grace that he wants us to use
and to use Wisely.
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Estimated Prophet
Thanks for the invitation Bumpy.
I'm sorry I can't be with you,
but the flowing wisdom is always with you as you walk your road.
There is substance to what I'm saying if you're willing to believe it,
because it is based upon the Word of Truth
which is based upon the Integrity of God
which is based upon the Power of God.
Rejoice that we have a Lord whose support and supply are constantly working in your life and in your situation.
Yea and Amen
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Bramble
I suspect the spider prophecies didn't resonate so much within Elizabeth. But it looks like the system she was in wouldn't allow for her to disagree with the 'prophets of God'.
I dunno--seems to me this practice is like explaing the virtues and benefits of a roaring fire and then handing a box of matches to your four year old.
But then I see 'leadership' in the same light. Since so few can actually handle the responsibility, there needs to be safe guards and balancing of powers to protect the little people. But people want to have that fantasy of the stupendous tapped in leader--it makes things so much easier, just do what you're told...he's a man of Gawd, he can't be wrong...
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Ham
Yeah. I think when answers to honest questions are anticipated with the response "if you disagree with me, read my book".. it's PRACTICALLY a lost cause. "I'm right, you're wrong, because discounting prophecy as false IN ITSELF is unbiblical.." More posturing.. "I'm da man, listen to me.."
I didn't close the door.
To say that the "critics" who disagree with him are discounting prophecy as false in itself is an unwarranted assumption.
I don't discount prophecy in itself, but 99.9 % of the ones I've heard, I would say were made up in the imagination of the one giving them. Say the right catch-phrases, maybe quote a few verses of scripture, and everything is OK. Or is it?
MY bible has a few things to say about "da man" that opens his mouth, and says "The Lord Sayeth", when the Lord has NOT spoken.
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Ham
So few that can handle the "power".. and I can count them easily on one hand.
They had "safeguards" in old testament times, but I think we'd get in *slightly* a little trouble implementing them here..
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Bramble
Heehee--can't we just talk about them on an internet forum, or fire them (if we're in that position)?
Stoning is sooo last millenium.
Some denoms have a congregational vote of condfidence--maybe we should take one!
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Ham
Yeah.. but one can dream, can't one?
Just makes me wonder though.. so many words, so many "prophecies"- how many of them would be spoken, if the speaker's life depended on whether it was genuine or not.
No "practice sessions" till I get it right..
No excuses.
"Now, if you'd just put down those rocks, and read my book first.."
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GrouchoMarxJr
Right you are Hammer...I think this whole dog and pony show (personal prophesy), is a left-over from waybrain. "All nine all the time" type of thinking...They had to have a gimmick, a magic show, something that not only seperated them from the boring, run of the mill Christians at church...but something that would dazzle the on lookers.
There used to be these "fortune tellers" who sat on stage and would tell people remarkable things about their lives...as if they had some "spiritual insight". Actually, there are techniques to this "art form"...How difficult would it be to give someone a "personal prophesy" that contained relevant information?...How easy would it be to manipulate people with this "tool"?
I hesitate to say that they deliberately make up their prophesies...but where do they get off putting such importance on this stuff that comes out of THEIR mouths? The old saying used to go..."The guy with the biggest stick makes the rules", but in this case it's..."Whoever has authority of the prophesies controls your life"
Well, again we see the fruit of such foolishness...witch of Endor indeed!
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Estimated Prophet
"Jehova Jehova Jehova "
sorry, just some Monty Python humor.
Yes, there can and have been some dog and pony shows with prophecy.
So shall we categorically ban all prophesying?
And there have been misleading and manipulative bible teachings.
Shall we ban teaching from the bible?
fear has ruined more ministries...
Let me just say that over the past twenty or so years as I've endeavored to grow in my faith,
I've been very blessed to have people like John Lynn and John Schoenheit and Mark Graeser
to converse with and consider all the possibilities. Them and tons of other good folks.
My friends at CES have done their best to give sound biblical advice,
and share on their practical experiences. We have all learned as we have grown.
The personal prophecy is no longer promoted as much as it used to be,
likewise Momentous.
When they recognize problems they do address them.
Its a circumspectful walk,
and Paul prayed for Love to abound in all knowledge and jusdgement.
"so that you may approve the things that are excellent,
in order to be sincere and blameless
until the day of Christ" Philippians 1:10 NASB
John Lynn likes to live on the edge you know, and I admire that.
If were to neber open his mouth to prophecy,
then he would never do it wrong.
I much prefer, however, having the freedom to persue the things of God;
than to have remained in Roman Catholocism and adhering the religious status quo.
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Estimated Prophet
Great Points.
The Elizabeth Lynn saga is very hard for me to comprehend, but it did happen.
I known of at least one person who received what I consider a genuine revelation
concerning John and Elizabeth before they divorced which was totally unheeded.
It doesn't seem to appear on the prophetic council's report.
Why ?
I have to believe if the B.O.D. will look and see why only the attacks upon Elizabeth were given an audience, then they will see how they are now in a crisis.
I believe that its another case of a man's agenda supersceding the Lord Jesus Christ's agenda.
I pray that my friends will truely hold Jesus as the Head of the Body and allow Him to bring things back into order.
Also.
I believe the Lord Jesus Christ raised up The Sprit and Truth Fellowship Int.
as a blessing for the Next Genration.
For the generation that wasn't subjected to waybrainitis.
I have high hope for this organization and pray it will weather the storm
and achieve all of its potential.
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Estimated Prophet
Good question Bramble.
I think we all, at times can let a man's agenda superscede the Lord's agenda.
I know I have.
Sometimes we need a confirmation of exactly what the Almighty God is trying to tell us,
or if we are only hearing a human's speculation.
When you're in a situation that is very pressing,
sometimes a word from above makes a huge difference.
When my cousin was facing surgury, my mother went to visit.
My mother spoke something reassuring to my cousin regarding God,
that was exactly what her pastor ahd told her earlier that day.
My mother,
who wasn't even aware that she was prophecying,
was moved by the spirit of God to speak those words,
which confirmed for my cousin that God would work to bring her healing,
because He said it to her twice in a way that could not be pre-arranged
which energized her faith.
and she came through the surgury successfully.
I don't know if that answers your question,
but experiences like that make me marvel at the Wonders of our God.
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Bramble
Estimated Prophet, are we talking about the same thing?
You, of your own free will, choose to go to someone you believe has spiritual insight or prophcey,whatever, to get something confirmed that you think God might be trying to tell you. I have no problem with that. Heck, I've had my cards read before.
Here is problem#1.
Are you then required to obey that person's prophesy, on pain of divorce or mark and avoid? You are expected to make changes A,B and C?
It becomes their business? The business of the elders in your church?
Problem #2.
People who you haven't asked to prophesy for you suddenly pop up with wacky stuff about you that God told them. Your husband, being so full of love and stuff, divorces you because you are wacky, the prophets said so. Obviously their words must be obeyed.
I got a big problem with that. I would call that boundary jumping, people being busybodies.
That's personal prophecy? Where the person prophesied about is like in third person ?
God told me to tell you that your wife...
That you would still consider those people church leaders and elders boggles my mind.
Well, not really. Twenty years in TWI-- I know that people are often expendable for the Work of the Ministry.
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TheInvisibleDan
The "PC" - the "Prophetic Council" - I'm still trying to digest that one.
It's another one of those bizarre expressions which awakens my evil dark side,
the comic book reader/artist.
I imagine this "PC" like the council in the old "Green Lantern" comics, comprised of those short, big-headed, white-haired, blue/or/green-skinned elders seated at their judgment bench, yappin' and deliberating about God-knows-what. It's been a while since I read those.
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socks
Heap big magic, I-Dan.
But there is a way...
In brightest day, in blackest night
No evil shall escape my sight.
Let those who worship evils' might
Beware my power...
Green Lanterns' light!
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now I see
Estimated,
I find what was done to Elizabeth Lynn exceptionally grievous and disturbing. It reminds me so much of how chosen "lower rung believers" or those whom had been marked, for whatever reason, were shredded and thrown into the spin cycle by "elders" of TWI, some of which I was a personal witness to back in the day.
I do not believe there would ever be compensation enough in this life, to rectify what has been done to this woman.
And why was this done to her, because someone in a position of responsibility had an elevated viewpoint of themselves, thought their stuff don’t stink, took their own personal sense of righteousness to a obtuse unmeek level, was jealous, was threatened, wanted John Lynn job, perhaps for one or all of these reasons, and the rest of you followed her down the same path and even chose to actively conspire against an innocent one. None of these actions, thoughts and behaviors are remotely right, moral or a characteristic of a elder biblically. Let alone this personal vendetta war was waged, conducted and endorsed in the name of God.
Look, I don’t want to beat up on you personally, this is not just directed at you, but regarding the practice of personal prophecy, something obviously wasn’t practiced in the holy spirit or in truth and light-spiritually.
You all will have to have the humility of David to be able to look at this practice dead in the face and determine that you missed the mark, that you made a series of bad decisions which brought you to the place of practicing such error.
Frankly, all I have seen so far is the humility of Saul, who never did get over his problems with the Lord or with David. Saul, who saw light, on and off through the years, but for the most part never regained his standing with the Lord-which led to his ultimate destruction in misery.
I understand that those of you who originally “bought in” to the idea of this practice have a lot invested in it, your personal reputations, your personal ministry, the public promotion of the error of the doctrine surrounding this practice and theology, hours and hours of research and teaching, the time and years involved, the burden of the weight of the responsibility you have to the household, the leading of so many down this path, your whole basis of why you feel you were right, the basis by which you have made so many decisions.
I understand that this is monumental, but really, there was obviously a problem in what you were doing that you were not aware of until others pointed it out to you. Please take heed to the biblical guidance that has been offered here thus far.
Who do you wanna be like, Saul or David?
God bless you,
You are always welcome at the bema.
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Estimated Prophet
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Estimated Prophet
God Bless You too , But Now I See.
That was an excellent post.
We will all be giving an account for our words and actions at the Bema.
and there will be much weeping and knashing of teeth.
I am also not involved in the leadership of S&T,
so I don't take any of your words personally,
but you speak the Truth in Love and I salute you for for that.
I saw the ship heading for troubled waters three years ago,
but never expected it to become this troubled.
I believe they have allowed their passion for holiness and purity
to justify taking harmful actions against their brothers and sisters in Christ.
I believe the goodness of God causes men to repent.
That the Love of God constrains us to do His will.
and that the Wisdom from above works the peacable fruits of righteousness.
All of those elements are needed in the S&T BOD.
They must also eliminate the wisdom that is earthly, sensual and devilish
which lead to contentions and Every Evil Work.
God Have Mercy
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WordWolf
I disagree with you about regrets at the Bema, but if you want to discuss it, we can open a thread
in the Doctrinal forum and not derail this one.
I agree with you here.
It's up to God, and to the individual Christians in question.
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Bramble
Just gotta say, it seems to me that if a minister devoted his full time career to the work of the ministry--for say, twenty to thirty years!-- teaching the 'greatest known truth since the first century church,' there would be more good fruit to show for it than broken marriages, broken friendships, law suits, internal power plays and weird prophecies and manipulations.
Something basic and important is wrong. IMO, to continue following these leaders is foolish.
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rich
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now I see
Dittos....
The fruit tells the story.
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Estimated Prophet
Well I hope you are correct on this one, Word Wolf.
I think the topic would make for a great discission.
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