Jump to content
GreaseSpot Cafe

THE other side of the Welfare Coin


templelady
 Share

Recommended Posts

Abi,

What I have as problem with is the idea that having a personality disorder-whether treated or not- means that someone is automatically incapable of holding gainful employment. It has become a carte blanc to deny responsibility for one's own life

To my knowledge, having a personality order isn't carte blanc to deny responsibility, and it most certainly doesn't render someone automatically incapable of holding gainful employment. My close family member, who is bipolar, is employed, as been with the same company for about 10 years, and has worked her way up the corp. ladder. She is fortunate though, in that she is not severely bipolar and has been able to find medications that work. However, it took several years to find the right meds.

I don't know how things work in other states, but in Michigan, getting SSI for a personality disorder, or even for a physical disorder, is a daunting and difficult task. It usually requies the assistance of an attorney - and if you can't afford one (and what unemployed, physically or otherwise disabled person can?) you can pretty much forget it. Here they say it is a given that your application will be denied right off the bat, and you will have to go through one, if not several appeals before you are approved for disability. It usually takes a year or more.

In fact, it is because they cannot get disability that they must apply for welfare. Of course, disability isn't going to cover the bills anyway and a person will probably need assistance from both.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 112
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Some may find THIS ARTICLE interesting:

Record numbers in Michigan seek food stamps, other assistance

Midday Update

Associated Press

About 1.9 million residents in economically struggling Michigan are receiving government food assistance, the highest number here in the more than 40-year history of the federal food stamp program and more than in all but five states.

The cost of providing the food stamps for Michigan families grew to $1.24 billion last year, up 145 percent from just five years earlier. And the government estimates that more than 300,000 residents who are not receiving assistance could qualify for it.

"We've seen a pretty steady climb since December 2000 and it's gone up by a few thousand cases each and every month," said Maureen Sorbet, spokeswoman for the Michigan Department of Human Services. "There must be a time when we reach the saturation point, but it's difficult to determine when that will be."

The numbers of people relying on nongovernment food banks, pantries and shelters for food needs are also growing. The Food Bank Council of Michigan says more than 1 million people received in excess of 75 million pounds of free food from charitable and religious groups last year.

"Our agencies say there is more demand, more working-poor families and more people who are coming in for the first time ever," said Jane Marshall, the council's executive director.

The trend is being driven by massive downsizing in the state's auto industry and the disappearance of manufacturing jobs. Michigan's December unemployment rate of 7.1 percent was second-highest to Mississippi's 7.5 percent and trailed the national average of 4.5 percent.

Rule changes, such as a 2000 rule that increased the income threshold for food assistance, also have increased participation.

The federal government pays 100 percent of the food stamp program and half of its administrative costs. The remainder is covered by states. In Michigan, that was $93 million in 2006.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I see this area hurting more since we moved here also which is part of why we are leaving the area. It is concerning that more and more we see this and that is part of why I can't understand how we could give away to other countries what we don't have for ourselves. It truly makes my head want to explode when I hear things like we have promised Africa 40 or 50 million bucks for Aids research. Where is that money hidden at? I think the song about the village fighting for the gold hidden in that fort on the hill and ending with a piece of paper inside rather than gold saying "peace on earth and good will to man" should apply to the confines of this country. We are so eager to give away what we do not have yet we seem hesitant to help our own mankind on this soil. It will never make sense to me, never.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I see this area hurting more since we moved here also which is part of why we are leaving the area. It is concerning that more and more we see this and that is part of why I can't understand how we could give away to other countries what we don't have for ourselves. It truly makes my head want to explode when I hear things like we have promised Africa 40 or 50 million bucks for Aids research. Where is that money hidden at? I think the song about the village fighting for the gold hidden in that fort on the hill and ending with a piece of paper inside rather than gold saying "peace on earth and good will to man" should apply to the confines of this country. We are so eager to give away what we do not have yet we seem hesitant to help our own mankind on this soil. It will never make sense to me, never.

Kathy- You are referring perhaps to THIS song?:

ONE TIN SOLDIER

(The Legend of Billy Jack)

words and music by Dennis Lambert and Brian Potter

Copyright © 1969 by ABC / Dunhill Music, Inc. Listen children to a story that was written long ago

'bout a kingdom on a mountain and the valley folk below.

On the mountain was a treasure buried deep beneath a stone,

and the valley people swore they'd have it for their very own.

So the people of the valley sent a message up the hill

asking for the buried treasure, tons of gold for which they'd kill.

Came an answer from the kingdom: "With our brothers we will share

all the secrets of our mountain, all the riches buried there."

Now the valley cried with anger; mount your horses, draw your sword,

and they killed the mountain people, so they won their just reward.

Now they stood beside the treasure on the mountain, dark and red,

turned the stone and looked beneath it. "Peace on earth" was all it said.

Go ahead and hate your neighbor, go ahead and cheat a friend.

Do it in the name of heaven, justify it in the end.

There won't be any trumpets blowin' come the judgment day

on the bloody morning after one tin soldier rides away.

The movie, Legend of Billy Jack, was hardly about isolating ourselves and taking care of our own selves. IMO, it was about reaching out, helping others who are different then ourselves, and the moral was that the weaker can ban together and help themselves in spite of the odds, although there may be some expense to their own lives. I especially like the chorus lines:

Go ahead and hate your neighbor, go ahead and cheat a friend.

Do it in the name of heaven, justify it in the end.

There won't be any trumpets blowin' come the judgment day

on the bloody morning after one tin soldier rides away.

~HAP

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The movie was also about it being just plain wrong to hate others who are trying to help themselves. (i.e. the town folk hating and abusing the kids at the school.) Such hatred will come back to bite us in the ars as Billy Jack taught the more combative of the townies.

~HAP

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So it was a bad example I reckon. <_<

And the only thing I hate in this issue is giving what we don't have to people that if the roles were reversed would shoot our butts full of arrows if we dare walk into their countries and demand what we are giving them in our country.

But this subject has been beat to death and it isn't going to change until the ones that have to give from their tables today no longer have to give because they gave it all away.

Until then my words are merely p!$$ing in the wind, enough said on all of this.

I still love those Billy Jack movies and song though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

CHATTY,

WHEN writing my last post, last week sometime I think, I was not remotely thinking about you at all.

Just thought I would take a second to clear that up. I dont even know you. Sorry that you thought it was directed at you somehow, in fact, that couldnt have been any further from the truth or what it was directed at.

Dawn

Link to comment
Share on other sites

While these women are responsible for getting pregnant and having children they cannot afford, the responsibility is not their's alone. It takes two to make a baby and there are far, far too many daddies out there who refuse to help raise their children, financially and otherwise.

I agree that it is not just the woman's responsibility. My ex husband had many illegitimate children all over the nation. Most of the women ended up on welfare. Some had more children to stay in the system. My ex husband paid child support to the system because these women still refused to work and add to the pot.

One of his exes had 2 teenage daughters and got pregnant again to keep herself in for another 18 years. She never wanted to work. The mother bought cigarettes and alcohol for herself and the teenage daughters.

THe teenage daughters grew to be the same. Now they are in the system, and don't want to work. Who knows if the fathers of their children are paying the system. It sure seems that if fathers are paying the system, that the system would would out a situation for able-bodied mothers to get to working as well so they can stop sucking off society.

Edited by Nottawayfer
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree that it is not just the woman's responsibility. My ex husband had many illegitimate children all over the nation. Most of the women ended up on welfare. Some had more children to stay in the system. My ex husband paid child support to the system because these women still refused to work and add to the pot.

One of his exes had 2 teenage daughters and got pregnant again to keep herself in for another 18 years. She never wanted to work. The mother bought cigarettes and alcohol for herself and the teenage daughters.

THe teenage daughters grew to be the same. Now they are in the system, and don't want to work. Who knows if the fathers of their children are paying the system. It sure seems that if fathers are paying the system, that the system would would out a situation for able-bodied mothers to get to working as well so they can stop sucking off society.

A baby is a wonderful thing, people have rights to have children.

NY now has child suport laws in which eventualy a father can go to jail. Which doesnt help really with the supporting of the child does it? they first lose the license to drive, which also doesnt help with finding gainful employment.

so once they lose their license and have a jail record employment is even more difficult.

I do not see the positive side of this route. In NY a mother can only be on welfare a total of two years in her life time!!! one or six kids they can and will be shut off within that time!

so what happens is the kids go to the foster system or often times being raised by gramma or great gramma. NOT good .

drugsand alcohol dependence are linked to this type of poverty and hopelessness and gramma doesnt ask how the 13 or ten year old got some money this week( even if it was running drugs) because his mom her own child is now living on the same streets . it is a cycle of dependence and very strong, losing children has little effect and frankly our city has no where to put these "kids at risk" .

I think we should help if we can always. I honor my ability to work enough to not be bitter or angry at those who can not or do not know how .

it isnt as easy as they do not WANT to .

some will pull out of the trap.. sadly many will never.

one of our judges has ordered birth control to a mom ging to jail pregnate with her 9th , all of them high needs and disabled and in the system.

it is going up to the court of supreme to make a law, the civil liberties are flying high on this one.

what do YOU think is the solution? just stop those youngins from having some sex? tell them they can not have a baby? force them to be sterile?

i have no solution i do know Jesus said the poor will alwys be with us.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There's no doubt we will always have this problem.. And there certainly is no quick fix.

I was raised with 3 other siblings by my single mom.. 4 of us.. And she never once got a handout. She worked and she worked hard. 2 jobs most of the time. Both in very low paying jobs like McDonalds! Hehe.. But with God's grace, we all made it by with the little income she made. I can't remember a single time we went without food or shelter. Maybe our clothes were a bit old, but at least we had some good food at times (the left over McDonalds that they were going to throw away! lol)..

In all honesty, I think we would be doing good to go back to the way things were in the Old Testament. If a man/woman was unable to make a living for themselves, their family - parents, uncle, grandparents, all took care of one another. And if that didn't work they becamse another's servant for a set period. What's wrong with that? Too much humility I guess in this world that none are willing to have. But given the unwillingness to be meek and humble and get a low paying servant type job, and the terrible family structures this nation has developed, there's not much hope because it was never meant to be a problem the government was suppose to handle. It was a problem the FAMILY's would handle. But I know, in this day and time everyone is so seperated, so isolated, that the destroyer has an easy time.. Divide and conquer.. That's what they always say.. And it's the sign of the times.. (Not the end times though)..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There's no doubt we will always have this problem.. And there certainly is no quick fix.

I was raised with 3 other siblings by my single mom.. 4 of us.. And she never once got a handout. She worked and she worked hard. 2 jobs most of the time. Both in very low paying jobs like McDonalds! Hehe.. But with God's grace, we all made it by with the little income she made. I can't remember a single time we went without food or shelter. Maybe our clothes were a bit old, but at least we had some good food at times (the left over McDonalds that they were going to throw away! lol)..

In all honesty, I think we would be doing good to go back to the way things were in the Old Testament. If a man/woman was unable to make a living for themselves, their family - parents, uncle, grandparents, all took care of one another. And if that didn't work they becamse another's servant for a set period. What's wrong with that? Too much humility I guess in this world that none are willing to have. But given the unwillingness to be meek and humble and get a low paying servant type job, and the terrible family structures this nation has developed, there's not much hope because it was never meant to be a problem the government was suppose to handle. It was a problem the FAMILY's would handle. But I know, in this day and time everyone is so seperated, so isolated, that the destroyer has an easy time.. Divide and conquer.. That's what they always say.. And it's the sign of the times.. (Not the end times though)..

a very nice post.

I hear a sense of pride in your voice, heck your post made even me proud of you and your mom... and you cary that with you today because she put the work in to give you that pride!

pride in being able to feed and house your family in taking responsibility for your life.

it is a gift a valuable gift.

it is a feeling of belonging of knowing regardless of what happens YOU can make it if you work hard and keep trying.

it is the american manner of life ( or used to be!) this sense you have and give is priceless and it is what is the very foundation of ALL success in life.

now score that with a person who was raised on being dependent on a system that also breeds poverty that does not meet the basic needs of a family . they come away with the poverty mode of thinking AND the inability to know any other manner of living.

instead of producing adults who now learn what being poor met but a way out by different choices and circumstance learned from the parents down fall, they learned NO way out.

your mom gave you a chance a chance to see it can and will work if you keep trying, she taught you life is not all about material stuff, but that honor and pride and willingness to keep working will work.

I believe it does.

but some in prison of poverty that have NEVER known any other way to buy food other than food stamps or any other home other than in the decaying neighborhood welfare can afford, some think it is just life when a child is taken from its parents because the drugs or alcohol are more important. A child does not understand why it happens , but when they grow up they do! and the sadness and choices of the parent are already instilled and the hope of repeating that learned behaviour is mighty .

you are a solid citizen with a pride in taking care of yourself. congrats to you and your mom for the success.

how could you be so fortunate if no one ever showed you how?

it is a very difficult thing to overcome, because as a cycle go you must leave all of the relationships encased in the lifestyle and venture out to a world unknown. and it is risky and unsafe and lonely without those who always loved you the best they knew how, and you will feel as tho you bad bad different and wrong .

No one enjoys being dependent NO ONE but to become Independent is so very unknown and frightening and risky the courage it takes is just overwhelming for so many.

your mom tuaght you we eat because i go to work . If i do not go to work we will all die. a person on the system has been taught we do not know how to find food we do not know how to live in a different neighborhood, and the system does so we must be on it. do not lose it or you will die. and they educate their children to what they know.

both parents love their children . both parents instill a thought pattern difficult to shake.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

Announcements


×
×
  • Create New...