Should I attend or not?

[Twinky]

So, Catcup, when is the wedding?

And what does your heart tell you about attending? You said you'd already made your decision.

I say, go, if you reasonably can. Make sure your person knows you're there (get some photos).

Be ready with some appropriate scriptures for anyone who gets mean with you (like, which part of that comment you just made fits within Phil 4:8, or Gal 6:10(a) or 1 Cor 13:4? or some other verse of your choosing)

And at the get-together afterwards - leave, if you feel uncomfortable, unsafe, got at, picked on, etc. You'll have the photographic evidence that you were there for the ceremony.

But probably you'll just have a good time, and enjoy the people you meet. Unless the invitation to you is merely a "token" invitation, your relative and new spouse have invited everyone because they want these guests there, they like them, and they want to share this special occasion with all of you.

You could also look forward to it as being a time of healing - for repairing and reconciling some of the more strained relationships you might have with some Wayfers. You don't have to be best buddies thereafter - just reconciled. Not at daggers drawn.

[HAPe4me]

I don;t know you or your specific experience upon leaving TWI, but for the sake of your relative, I agree with Paw. Go, be kind, and honor them on their day. I would nix the 666 mark someone mentioned, but a nice Greasespot Cafe t-shirt under my sport jacket might be in order.(with a tie of course)

[Jerry Baritone]

If I were confronted with the same situation in which you now find yourself, I would go to the Father and seek His will in the matter. Asking people for their will for your situation is your choice. Thankfully, Jesus Christ always did his Father's Will. He knew that in every situation in his life, because he asked. We are exhorted to do the same.

God usually prefers us to be in the midst of lost souls, so that, as His sons and daughters, we can have a Godly effect on the lives of others, by giving them words to believe.

And, remember, you will be spending eternity with these folks! I've heard Rosalie Rivenbark speak in tongues, so she'll be there, too.

[waysider]

If I were confronted with the same situation in which you now find yourself, I would go to the Father and seek His will in the matter. Asking people for their will for your situation is your choice. Thankfully, Jesus Christ always did his Father's Will. He knew that in every situation in his life, because he asked. We are exhorted to do the same.

God usually prefers us to be in the midst of lost souls, so that, as His sons and daughters, we can have a Godly effect on the lives of others, by giving them words to believe.

And, remember, you will be spending eternity with these folks! I've heard Rosalie Rivenbark speak in tongues, so she'll be there, too.

Since you've chosen to bring the Bible into the discussion, you may want to recall that Proverbs speaks to the value of a multitude of counsellors. As to the "speaking in tongues" reference, that might be better handled in another forum.

Edited December 27, 2010 by waysider

[Imagine]

Go. One who knows.

[rascal]

I think that if you were to attend showing your undeniable good health, peace, joy, prosperity etc....it might be a witness of sorts as to the goodness of God as a part of your life even outside of twi.

Maybe people wouldn`t feel so entrapped.

Edited December 28, 2010 by rascal

[Ductape]

go, don't go

We can all rest assured this thread has created more buzz than HQ has had since Loy was caught with his pants down......again

[IRead]

This is a tough question, but it has been clearly pointed out that the wedding is FOR the happy couple and you want to wish them well despite how stupid you know the circumstances they are under. Be the most loving and supportive you can be.

While not held in Ohio, my wedding was officiated under TWI auspices. Our words were "This ring I give you in token and in pledge of my abiding faith and enduring love for you." We still recite them to each other frequently. While we drifted away from TWI in 1987 and know it is radically different today, we have nothing but fond memories for our friends and family on that wonderful day in June 1985.

Keep only the good memories and let God (whatever you perceive him to be) push the bad memories to a dark, forgotten place.

[Catcup]

I mentioned that I had already made my decision when I started the poll, and after all is said and done, I'm still sticking with my original thought.

When the kids were small and we were still in TWI, we were fairly close. But leaving TWI changed all that, and for the past 13 years or so, we have had very limited contact. I am not close at all with the kids or their parents, and have not been for over a decade.

When one of the kids got married a few years ago, our family was not invited to the wedding. We were invited to the reception, which was off grounds. I did not go to the reception.

Now, I'm invited to the next wedding, which is on grounds.

However, I don't care to ever again grace the grounds of TWI with my presence. That place is full of painful memories. It is where I was betrayed by people I trusted. Repeatedly. It is where friends were raped. Repeatedly. Even if I WAS still close with my niece, which I am not, I would not go there for those reasons.

And, although TWI is now willing to "welcome" me back on grounds, it's a little lopsided. You see, in their own eyes they are being "charitable" and playing the part of "The Forgiving Father" by allowing a "prodigal son" to come back "home". But hell, that's not even lopsided. It's bass-ackwards.

The Way International is no "forgiving father". It is the organization of The Way International and their salaried representatives who committed offenses against me and my family; grievous offenses, which cost us dearly in many ways. For these offenses The Way International never directly admitted their error nor apoligized to me or to my family personally, formally, nor even informally. They simply want to act as if nothing ever happened.

And, my family which is still in TWI has also grievously hurt me, my husband, and especially my daughter by shunning us for years. After we left TWI, their hateful correspondence, snide comments, backhanded insinuations, and double entendres long ago made my daughter and I decide we would limit their access to us. These offenses have neither been admitted to us nor apologized for, personally, formally, nor even informally. No one-- neither The Way International nor our family still in TWI--- wants to admit they f*ked up, badmouthed us to our friends, destroyed our reputations, and hurt us even to our faces--without cause. They now want to act as if it never happened.

I'm all for acting as if it never happened, AFTER a proper recognition of the pain they caused and an apology for their actions which caused that pain. That I can forgive.

My husband is much more willing to ignore their offenses than I am. He plans on attending and will bring a gift. They are his blood relatives, so I understand, and am fine with that. But I will not go, nor will my daughter.

Fences need to be mended. And you don't mend fences by ignoring the gaping hole you ripped into the fence. I'm willing to let bygones be bygones once the offence is recognized and apologized for. Otherwise, I am leaving myself open to be hurt again by people who hurt me in the past, who refuse to recognize they have done so.

If I were still close to my innie family, I would send a gift. A gift will arrive, regardless. But I will NEVER set foot on the grounds of The Way International again.

Edited December 31, 2010 by Catcup

[PurpleDays]

Good thoughts, good decision.

[Rocky]

I mentioned that I had already made my decision when I started the poll, and after all is said and done, I'm still sticking with my original thought.

When the kids were small and we were still in TWI, we were fairly close. But leaving TWI changed all that, and for the past 13 years or so, we have had very limited contact. I am not close at all with the kids or their parents, and have not been for over a decade.

When one of the kids got married a few years ago, our family was not invited to the wedding. We were invited to the reception, which was off grounds. I did not go to the reception.

Now, I'm invited to the next wedding, which is on grounds.

However, I don't care to ever again grace the grounds of TWI with my presence. That place is full of painful memories. It is where I was betrayed by people I trusted. Repeatedly. It is where friends were raped. Repeatedly. Even if I WAS still close with my niece, which I am not, I would not go there for those reasons.

And, although TWI is now willing to "welcome" me back on grounds, it's a little lopsided. You see, in their own eyes they are being "charitable" and playing the part of "The Forgiving Father" by allowing a "prodigal son" to come back "home". But hell, that's not even lopsided. It's bass-ackwards.

The Way International is no "forgiving father". It is the organization of The Way International and their salaried representatives who committed offenses against me and my family; grievous offenses, which cost us dearly in many ways. For these offenses The Way International never directly admitted their error nor apoligized to me or to my family personally, formally, nor even informally. They simply want to act as if nothing ever happened.

And, my family which is still in TWI has also grievously hurt me, my husband, and especially my daughter by shunning us for years. After we left TWI, their hateful correspondence, snide comments, backhanded insinuations, and double entendres long ago made my daughter and I decide we would limit their access to us. These offenses have neither been admitted to us nor apologized for, personally, formally, nor even informally. No one-- neither The Way International nor our family still in TWI--- wants to admit they f*ked up, badmouthed us to our friends, destroyed our reputations, and hurt us even to our faces--without cause. They now want to act as if it never happened.

I'm all for acting as if it never happened, AFTER a proper recognition of the pain they caused and an apology for their actions which caused that pain. That I can forgive.

My husband is much more willing to ignore their offenses than I am. He plans on attending and will bring a gift. They are his blood relatives, so I understand, and am fine with that. But I will not go, nor will my daughter.

Fences need to be mended. And you don't mend fences by ignoring the gaping hole you ripped into the fence. I'm willing to let bygones be bygones once the offence is recognized and apologized for. Otherwise, I am leaving myself open to be hurt again by people who hurt me in the past, who refuse to recognize they have done so.

If I were still close to my innie family, I would send a gift. A gift will arrive, regardless. But I will NEVER set foot on the grounds of The Way International again.

Makes complete sense to me.

[leafytwiglet]

Sending hugs your way Catcup... as everyone said... this decision hinged so much on your feelings about the couple the family and what happened to you .... I think in light of what you wrote you made teh best decision for you... and in the end that is really what matters.

And more hugs because teh whole thing has reopened old wounds that you should not have had to endure in the first place.

[Ham]

I dunno. I saw an interview of Grace Slick..

she was ready for the big meetup with then president Nixon..

Now you just know.. if one of us showed up with an invitation.. they aren't going to let us anywhere near the punch bowl..

[Catcup]

I dunno. I saw an interview of Grace Slick..

she was ready for the big meetup with then president Nixon..

Now you just know.. if one of us showed up with an invitation.. they aren't going to let us anywhere near the punch bowl..

LOL!

I might react in a totally different manner had recognitions and apologies been made. But they haven't. So as far as I am concerned, it is their loss.

I do interact with them in a limited fashion-- at family reunions, on neutral territory. There, we are also seeing family who are not in TWI, who have not behaved in such a manner toward us. Hell, I'm willing to forgive my family if they simply acknowleged to me what they did, and that it was wrong and hurtful. But they never do. They simply want to behave as if nothing ever happened. Which to me, means nothing was ever learned. So, if I give them the unlimited access to my heart they had in the past, I am the one being foolishly open to being hurt again. That I will not do.

I do appreciate the opinions of my fellow 'spotters. The poll results reflect what few innies will admit: the folks here are reasonable people who are not "disgruntled former followers", but people who recognize how toxic The Way International is, and the complications that can result from their involvment in your family.

Thank you for all of your responses.

Edited January 2, 2011 by Catcup

[chockfull]

I mentioned that I had already made my decision when I started the poll, and after all is said and done, I'm still sticking with my original thought.

When the kids were small and we were still in TWI, we were fairly close. But leaving TWI changed all that, and for the past 13 years or so, we have had very limited contact. I am not close at all with the kids or their parents, and have not been for over a decade.

When one of the kids got married a few years ago, our family was not invited to the wedding. We were invited to the reception, which was off grounds. I did not go to the reception.

Now, I'm invited to the next wedding, which is on grounds.

However, I don't care to ever again grace the grounds of TWI with my presence. That place is full of painful memories. It is where I was betrayed by people I trusted. Repeatedly. It is where friends were raped. Repeatedly. Even if I WAS still close with my niece, which I am not, I would not go there for those reasons.

And, although TWI is now willing to "welcome" me back on grounds, it's a little lopsided. You see, in their own eyes they are being "charitable" and playing the part of "The Forgiving Father" by allowing a "prodigal son" to come back "home". But hell, that's not even lopsided. It's bass-ackwards.

The Way International is no "forgiving father". It is the organization of The Way International and their salaried representatives who committed offenses against me and my family; grievous offenses, which cost us dearly in many ways. For these offenses The Way International never directly admitted their error nor apoligized to me or to my family personally, formally, nor even informally. They simply want to act as if nothing ever happened.

And, my family which is still in TWI has also grievously hurt me, my husband, and especially my daughter by shunning us for years. After we left TWI, their hateful correspondence, snide comments, backhanded insinuations, and double entendres long ago made my daughter and I decide we would limit their access to us. These offenses have neither been admitted to us nor apologized for, personally, formally, nor even informally. No one-- neither The Way International nor our family still in TWI--- wants to admit they f*ked up, badmouthed us to our friends, destroyed our reputations, and hurt us even to our faces--without cause. They now want to act as if it never happened.

I'm all for acting as if it never happened, AFTER a proper recognition of the pain they caused and an apology for their actions which caused that pain. That I can forgive.

My husband is much more willing to ignore their offenses than I am. He plans on attending and will bring a gift. They are his blood relatives, so I understand, and am fine with that. But I will not go, nor will my daughter.

Fences need to be mended. And you don't mend fences by ignoring the gaping hole you ripped into the fence. I'm willing to let bygones be bygones once the offence is recognized and apologized for. Otherwise, I am leaving myself open to be hurt again by people who hurt me in the past, who refuse to recognize they have done so.

If I were still close to my innie family, I would send a gift. A gift will arrive, regardless. But I will NEVER set foot on the grounds of The Way International again.

Cat,

Thanks for the details and explanation. I feel the same way you do regarding fences. IMO TWI's attitude prevents mending fences - by sweeping things under the carpet, never apologizing, and never admitting the damage that their actions and attitudes have had and continue to have, fences do have gaping holes in them, and thus the cows still freely get out metaphorically.

In reality, until they come to the place where they can admit their sin, they are a continual open conduit for the adversary to attack. And yes, I'm saying this in terms of their teachings so those that have ears can hear. These are those who say "Lord,Lord", but never really knew Him.

[cman]

You can't control what they think by going or not going.

How does forgiveness apply to anyone involved?

Base your decision on your own heart of love of which forgiveness is yours.

Whether they do or don't, does not matter.

Is going or not going making a statement to you or them?

Or does it really matter?

Catcup, you said you don't want to go on the grounds of twi.

That's cool, if you do or don't. For whatever reasons.

I just think there is too much thinking about what someone else may or may not think.

How much is their thinking still having a grip on you.

Only you can answer that for yourself.

I give this with much care and not to put you on the spot on this board,

but possibly help, I hope it's just something to think about...

[Catcup]

You can't control what they think by going or not going.

How does forgiveness apply to anyone involved?

Base your decision on your own heart of love of which forgiveness is yours.

Whether they do or don't, does not matter.

Is going or not going making a statement to you or them?

Or does it really matter?

Catcup, you said you don't want to go on the grounds of twi.

That's cool, if you do or don't. For whatever reasons.

I just think there is too much thinking about what someone else may or may not think.

How much is their thinking still having a grip on you.

Only you can answer that for yourself.

I give this with much care and not to put you on the spot on this board,

but possibly help, I hope it's just something to think about...

I appreciate your response, but I don't give a rat's patootie about what my innie family thinks. It's about what they do whenever I have given them access to me. They have repeatedly hurt me and my daughter-- so we simply refuse to give them access to do so anymore.

There is something sick about continually opening your heart to people who stab it if they see the opportunity. It's the same kind of sick people suffer from who repeatedly return to abusive spouses believing they will change. I refuse to do that. It is not mentally healthy.

As far as TWI, I care even less about what they think. I simply have no desire to visit a place that holds so many bad memories. I have no need to revisit such a place. I have moved on from those people and that place to a new life, one so much more fulfilling and satisfying than I ever enjoyed there. I have so much more in my life now than I ever had then. There simply are more reasons to move forward and leave them behind, than to look back.

Edited January 3, 2011 by Catcup

[cman]

It's about what they do whenever I have given them access to me.

O, I didn't know that. I thought it was about thinking.

I thought wrong. Thanks.

[mstar1]

sort of

in their own eyes they are being "charitable" and playing the part of "The Forgiving Father"

They still haven't figured out that they're not God???

The veneer may be slightly different but nothing has changed...

God......people 'playing parts' make me sick

Edited January 3, 2011 by mstar1

[Catcup]

O, I didn't know that. I thought it was about thinking.

I thought wrong. Thanks.

Quite alright, cman. I do appreciate your concern, though, and your input.

[Sunesis]

Ok, now that I know the background - you made the totally right decision.

I had no idea the background information.

I wouldn't set foot, send a gift, or possibly even have responded.

Good for you!

[GrouchoMarxJr]

...I'd have sent them a telegram...encouraging them to pound salt in their arse...

[dabobbada]

...I'd have sent them a telegram...encouraging them to pound salt in their arse...

Considering the inclinations of their Chairman Mao Tse Rosie, your sugestion is probably close to the present truth on the taking of that covenant. :blink: :P

Catcup,

Upon reading the rest of your story, I also agree you made the right decision and for the right reasons too. Probably the greatest sin of the denizons of the TWIlight zone is the perfection of the self-righteousness that makes them never ever wrong. Those who aren't with them are enemies of god and unworthy of any kindness. Indeed they must be watched and vigorously opposed.

In reality, I imagine they quake in their boots for fear that you will breath on them, melt their faces, and suck out their souls. I have found that when people have treated me evilly, it is because they can't out argue me, so they turn to personal attacks and other rippings to bring me down and defame me before those I love or work with.

The title Satan means "The Accuser" doesn't it.

[Twinky]

Thanks for letting us know your decision, Catcup.

Sounds like the right one, in the circumstances.

Your middle names are not "Punchbag" or "Doormat" and you are exactly right to withdraw from those who cause dissention.

[TrustAndObey]

In reality, I imagine they quake in their boots for fear that you will breath on them, melt their faces, and suck out their souls. I have found that when people have treated me evilly, it is because they can't out argue me, so they turn to personal attacks and other rippings to bring me down and defame me before those I love or work with.

The title Satan means "The Accuser" doesn't it.

Lol.. Classic case of a group of narcissistic people who are taught ad hominem as a legitimate art form.. Yeah, Satan already mastered it.