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T-Bone

The Callousness of TWI...

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I think the callousness that’s so prevalent in TWI is empathy’s mortal enemy.

There have been a number of threads discussing wierwille’s narcissism ...It’s pretty evident in his doctrine and practice that he was fixated on achieving some kind of power over others, gave off an air of superiority and among other things he never seemed willing to empathize with the feelings, wishes and needs of other people – it was always his way or the highway.

As a person of great influence to those who were his biggest fans - I think it’s inevitable that a lot of those narcissistic traits would rub off onto others. What do you think ?

I’m NOT saying that everyone who admired him and followed his example became a narcissist. Here’s what I think - no matter how much you were able to empathize with others, the unspoken protocol of TWI tended to squelch any personal observations or logical reasoning – “yeah, that’s just five-senses stuff anyway – because what people really need is the word”… right?

How many times have you sat through a meeting on how to put a class together and heard something along the lines of “does it really matter if they can’t pay their bills, don’t have a job or have some hard-luck story ? Bottom line is they need to take the class because they’ll learn how to believe God to overcome any situation.”

I had this dumb idea of what it took to be a successful “salesman” for whatever TWI wanted me to promote;  it took real discipline and the love of God in the renewed mind in manifestation (oh gag!) to suppress any natural rapport or compassion I might have toward others - and instead challenge the person to put God first – buying into whatever I was promoting…if I wanted to really tease them with the power of PFAL (double-gag in 2 barf bags!) I’d say something like “it may not feel right five-senses-wise right now, but spiritual-wise it will make a lot of sense to you later on” (ay-yai-yai 3 barf bags with a twist!).

…Have you ever done something along those lines?

Have you ever went against the grain of how you would have normally treated someone before you got into TWI – to try to motivate them to participate in something with The Way Ministry? Did you feel you had to wrap up your cold, clinical prescription of believing-the-word-is-the-answer-to-everything in something warm and fuzzy (whatever that means) so you could tell yourself you can still empathize with people?

I think to be a really good leader in TWI – you had to be a really good salesman…a really good salesman will always find a way to circumvent any objection, reason, situation, or excuse you could throw at them in order that one way or another you wind up doing what they suggest.

I think in the long run (depending on length of time and involvement) many folks (including myself) developed somewhat of a “callus” of variable thickness over a heart that was subjected to the friction and irritation from the hard-hearted unspoken protocol that our “dear” narcissistic leader "encouraged" us to follow.

 

Perhaps one of the things that drives cult leaders to be insensitive and have a cruel disregard for others is the fear of losing  control over some aspect of the person…just speculating here – but I would be interested in getting input from Grease Spotters on anything that I've said.

 

love & peace

T-Bone

 

Edited by T-Bone
given enough time I usually like to edit the life outta something (LOL)

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Dunno, .T-Bone. I always thought of people's situations and tried to help. But then,  I also thought that TWI was the answer. I wasn't a good salesman, but caring and being interested in people did encourage or even entice people to want to know more about TWI's wares.

But ask some leaders for help ... I met some great caring folk. And some really hard ones, that you wouldn't naturally want to turn to. And I also watched so move from the first group to the second group.  Not sure that I ever saw second group move to the first group. 

Glad to be out.  I don't have to take my minister's advice, turn to him or her for help; there are many Christian people I know whose advice I can take seriously should I choose to seek it. 

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I don't think one can get more callous than to sexually assault women who have given their heart to the lord....and it was rampant, even in little old New Zealand. When we were in- rez we were phoned by the country co-ord and abused over the phone for the most ridiculous reasons, thousands of miles away. Realize now, he was 'grooming us' for our arrival after graduating...oirish git

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I also personally know of some girls who turned to prostitution after being sexually assaulted by leadership...I guess they figured might as well make some money out of it.

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Some thoughts:  Callousness - can remember different situations over the years (~77-94) where the prevailing attitude toward was believe "the word" regardless of the situation.  If people were having hard times, they needed to "believe," but that was never really well defined - particularly in my own mind.  Reading posts along this topic got me thinking how we'd tell people to believe the word, and usually it meant whatever the "collaterals" said, reading the collaterals was a 'convenient' way of 'researching the scriptures' to find out if those things were so.  

In retrospect, i can recall how insensitive i'd began to get.  Left (actually booted) in the early 1990s.  That seemed to allow empathy and kindness to resurface in my life.    

Anyway, that was many years ago. 

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They didn't give a sh!!t about us. Used us for our labor & dollars and laughed all the way to the bank. We were suckers. Fed us full of b.s to keep us motivated to promote their organization...deceived us into believing it was our organization. 

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Twinky:

I think you have always been an exceptional Christian minister. I certainly didn’t mean to suggest the insensitivity and stoicism of wierwille and those of his ilk tainted everyone in TWI. I certainly knew some good caring folks who served in some leadership capacity…guess I wasn’t clear enough in my post – but it was really me being  more self-reflective – as is often my focus on Grease Spot. As I said “I think in the long run (depending on length of time and involvement) many folks (including myself) developed somewhat of a “callus” of variable thickness over a heart that was subjected to the friction and irritation from the hard-hearted unspoken protocol that our “dear” narcissistic leader "encouraged" us to follow.”…I guess my excuse - or reason - for adopting an almost dispassionate manner of interacting with those I wanted to help – was ignorance. I didn’t know much about the Bible (still don’t  :biglaugh:  ) and figured The Way was teaching me the right approach.

== == ==

Allan:

I agree – I don’t think there’s anything more callous than a supposed servant of the Lord sexually assaulting women who also serve the same Lord; I did say that not everyone who admired wierwille would become a narcissist - - but I can certainly imagine sociopaths in the midst of an environment like TWI – with certain elements that are conducive or cater to their lifestyle, having a field day…I cannot even fathom how such predatory a$$holes must justify or rationalize their behavior…As I mentioned to Twinky, my post was somewhat of a confession as to how TWI’s insidious nature affected me…I did not become a sexually depraved criminal…no…it was more like putting my conscience on a slow morphine drip…as I expressed on a thread TWI's sedative to the conscience  as I became more indoctrinated going through the way corps training program, the more my sense of right and wrong was dulled…To be honest – I’m glad I got out in time! Who knows – I don’t think I would have become a sexual predator, that’s definitely not in my DNA, but I could foresee a situation where I might be tempted to cheat on my wife a time or two…and rationalize the $hit out of it with wierwille’s licentious logic.

== == == ==

Peruser:

Yeah howdy ! it seems us common folk were the stiff-upper-lip-stoics while certain upper crust of the crusty butts (a$$hole hypocritical leaders) were living the epicurean life like it was going out of style…for some reason that brings to mind Jesus addressing the hypocritical leaders in Matthew 23:4 They crush people with unbearable religious demands and never lift a finger to ease the burden…NLT

== == ==

Infoabsorption:

Yes – it was quite a startling realization for me when I first came to Grease Spot and found out what liars and thieving weasels there were in TWI! (it’s a shame Grease Spot is going to close down   )…II Peter 2: 1-3 comes to mind - But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. 2 And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed. 3 And in their greed they will exploit you with false words. Their condemnation from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.

== == == 

thanks all for some great input !!!

Edited by T-Bone
said the callus to the wart "you ain't so tough!"

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Oh, thanks, T-Bone, for your kind words, but really I'm just a nobody trying to help a few people less fortunate than myself. I think God gave me a few "smarts" in trust to help others. And he gave me great parents to model how to help, selflessly. 

And God is kind enough to help all of us who want to help others. Even those who later behaved callously. I think most had a genuine desire to help others,  originally.  Then TWI perverted them with promiscuity coupledwith supposed "tough love." I pray they can recover their true Godly selves one day.

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On 9/21/2018 at 3:45 PM, Allan said:

I also personally know of some girls who turned to prostitution after being sexually assaulted by leadership...I guess they figured might as well make some money out of it.

Allan, I know from personal experience, that women who have been sexually assaulted, sometimes display poor thinking skills.  I hope these women that you mentioned, receive counseling.  I know counseling has helped me tremendously, in getting my life together.

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