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Discussion on the "Vaccine"


oldiesman
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45 minutes ago, Allan said:

Not trying to build anything at all, simply stating that the graph Rocky posted was missing major details.

You are factually incorrect. The graphIC (it wasn't a graph)  was a complete statement of fact.

Your narrative from the beginning of this thread has been wrong, even if some details may have been right.

You OPPOSED and DEFIED rationality, logic and FACT.*

IF you had any reasonable level of communication skill, you would have been able to look in the mirror, or inside yourself, to realize that it's okay to have questions about the interpretation of FACTS and formulated a narrative to incorporate those questions to actually add to discussion in this thread.

*Oppositional defiant disorder (ODD), is a pattern of negativistic, defiant, disobedient and hostile behaviour, and is one of the most prevalent disorders from preschool age to adulthood. ODD is marked by defiant and disobedient behavior towards authority figures. 

** I am NOT a medical professional and am not attempting any kind of diagnosis of anyone. However, your consistently inappropriate interaction on this thread has not added to any kind of uplifted group understanding of the issue at hand. I am describing the interaction as potentially mimicking ODD.

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1 hour ago, Rocky said:

You are factually incorrect. The graphIC (it wasn't a graph)  was a complete statement of fact.

Your narrative from the beginning of this thread has been wrong, even if some details may have been right.

You OPPOSED and DEFIED rationality, logic and FACT.*

IF you had any reasonable level of communication skill, you would have been able to look in the mirror, or inside yourself, to realize that it's okay to have questions about the interpretation of FACTS and formulated a narrative to incorporate those questions to actually add to discussion in this thread.

*Oppositional defiant disorder (ODD), is a pattern of negativistic, defiant, disobedient and hostile behaviour, and is one of the most prevalent disorders from preschool age to adulthood. ODD is marked by defiant and disobedient behavior towards authority figures. 

** I am NOT a medical professional and am not attempting any kind of diagnosis of anyone. However, your consistently inappropriate interaction on this thread has not added to any kind of uplifted group understanding of the issue at hand. I am describing the interaction as potentially mimicking ODD.

and your welcome to your opinion...hilarious as it is...so someone who disagrees with you regarding getting a still 'experimental' drug injected into them because the Government told you to and disregard all the side effects (including deaths) and unknown mid to long term debilitating effects just so you can 'be part of the crowd' or 'peer pressure' or a 'misguided sense of duty to fellow man' or even just because of 'fear' and saying that person has Oppositional Defiance Disorder really smacks of immaturity....also...I don't see how this topic could be uplifting in any way regardless...it really could be a matter of life or death..just exactly whose, we'll have to wait it out....I'm just glad I don't have to go to bed at night worried if some of those spike proteins are going to turn on my own bodies immune system after the 1st or 2nd or third or fourth or fifth or sixth jab !!

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4 hours ago, Allan said:

I'm just glad I don't have to go to bed at night worried if some of those spike proteins are going to turn on my own bodies immune system after the 1st or 2nd or third or fourth or fifth or sixth jab !!

This is just stubborn ignorance. Do yourself and everyone else a favor by educating yourself on how the vaccine works. As it is, it looks like you don't have a clue.

 

We don't know how long natural immunity lasts or how strong it will be for any one particular individual because we don't know that individual's exposure level. Dosage is controlled with the vaccine and so we can make more calculated projections. 

 

You say you have had Covid twice now. This is a bit distressing when you consider the long-running success your country had with low infection rates. How did you manage to get infected not once but twice? How long was it between your first and second infection? How long do you expect it to be before your third.... or fourth or fifth?

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6 hours ago, Allan said:

Not trying to build anything at all, simply stating that the graph Rocky posted was missing major details.

Of course you are. The data did not tell us the patients' ages, whether they were obese or if they had comorbidities so you thought it was okay to simply invent some data. (build a patient profile) That is definitely not okay.

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4 hours ago, Allan said:

and your welcome to your opinion...hilarious as it is...so someone who disagrees with you regarding getting a still 'experimental' drug injected into them because the Government told you to and disregard all the side effects (including deaths) and unknown mid to long term debilitating effects just so you can 'be part of the crowd' or 'peer pressure' or a 'misguided sense of duty to fellow man' or even just because of 'fear' and saying that person has Oppositional Defiance Disorder really smacks of immaturity....also...I don't see how this topic could be uplifting in any way regardless...it really could be a matter of life or death..just exactly whose, we'll have to wait it out....I'm just glad I don't have to go to bed at night worried if some of those spike proteins are going to turn on my own bodies immune system after the 1st or 2nd or third or fourth or fifth or sixth jab !!

For those who have no idea what Allan's talking about, I'll translate:

"experimental drug" -  all the different forms of vaccines formulated, made and distributed around the world, from a variety of countries

"because the Government told you to"-  all the dialogues around the world between elected officials and the public, including health officials,  all from countries that normally disagree on everything

"disregard all the side effects (including deaths)  and unknown mid-to long-term debilitating effects"-  the few known dangers for a few people getting vaccinated (as always happens)  is far more dangerous than the far greater risks of death or permanent injury from getting Covid because Allan says so

"just so you can 'be part of the crowd' or 'peer pressure' or a 'misguided sense of duty to fellow man" - paying attention to the medical experts and understanding them and agreeing, rather than bucking the establishment because it's the establishment and following the secret knowledge like Allan

"I don't see how this topic could be uplifting in any way regardless" - decreasing the body counts doesn't matter much

"It really could be a matter of life or death, just exactly whose, we'll have to wait it out"-  let's ignore all the stats that say that the innoculated survive Covid at greater rates than the uninnoculated and claim all the facts aren't in when plenty are in and conclusions can already be drawn as to whether the vaccines are safer than the illness

"I'm just glad I don't have to go to bed at night worried if some of those spike proteins are going to turn on my own bodies immune system after the 1st or 2nd or third or fourth or fifth or sixth jab !! " - I'm glad none of us have to worry about that, since it's a make-believe illness based on a misunderstanding of the biology.   I'm also glad I don't have to go to bed at night worried about catching the gol-bloots from the hind legs of the boo-shoo bird.

 

The world I live in doesn't even superficially resemble the world Allan thinks he sees.   Then again, my world overcame the Spanish Flu, I don't know what the story is in his world.

 

 

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16 hours ago, Allan said:

"authority" ?? "Demand" ?? you're sounding more and more Marxist everyday :jump:

You said Marxist so I hear dialectic

Quote

To the Ancients, "it was nothing but the logic of illusion. It was a sophistic art of giving to one's ignorance, indeed even to one's intentional tricks, the outward appearance of truth, by imitating the thorough, accurate method which logic always requires, and by using its topic as a cloak for every empty assertion."

Quote

 

 

 

Edited by Bolshevik
BAD interlocutor
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5 hours ago, Allan said:

and your welcome to your opinion...hilarious as it is...so someone who disagrees with you regarding getting a still 'experimental' drug injected into them because the Government told you to and disregard all the side effects (including deaths) and unknown mid to long term debilitating effects just so you can 'be part of the crowd' or 'peer pressure' or a 'misguided sense of duty to fellow man' or even just because of 'fear' and saying that person has Oppositional Defiance Disorder really smacks of immaturity....also...I don't see how this topic could be uplifting in any way regardless...it really could be a matter of life or death..just exactly whose, we'll have to wait it out....I'm just glad I don't have to go to bed at night worried if some of those spike proteins are going to turn on my own bodies immune system after the 1st or 2nd or third or fourth or fifth or sixth jab !!

Allan, you shared earlier that you got the disease, twice.   I'd be interested in knowing what your antibody numerical value is.. have you considered taking the "quantitative" blood test?    I would bet your value is higher than mine and I'm curious.       Also curious how high a jabbed person's value is too... please consider getting the blood test and share the results... Thx...

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1 hour ago, oldiesman said:

Allan, you shared earlier that you got the disease, twice.   I'd be interested in knowing what your antibody numerical value is.. have you considered taking the "quantitative" blood test?    I would bet your value is higher than mine and I'm curious.       Also curious how high a jabbed person's value is too... please consider getting the blood test and share the results... Thx...

 

You're asking for data which is fair enough.  What are the collection methods or will the limits be noted?

Is there a hypothesis?  Are you making a prediction?  Would you state it?

How will the data support or falsify your prediction?

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16 minutes ago, waysider said:

the antibody test was free and let my employer know I could go back to work

the PCR test cost $$$$ and let governments know I could leave the continent.  

The T-decect test . . . is this just data collection at this time?

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59 minutes ago, oldiesman said:

Only curious, nothing more.    

Quote

This is especially important for people who may have exhibited symptoms previously or believe they have been exposed but have not tested positive for COVID-19 using a molecular or antigen diagnostic test. 

Help me out here . . . what is the point?  

How are you comparing test results?

Edited by Bolshevik
testing
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2 hours ago, Bolshevik said:

My midichlorian count is usually higher on the weekends.

Did someone say Mandalorian ?

OIP.3LGW_rz1RWzWnEz0SUbrCQHaE4?pid=ImgDe

Every time he comes to Grease Spot he says “this is the way
I say “no, this is Grease Spot

Baby Yoda says "in depth spiritual perception  and  awareness you are not"
 

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7 minutes ago, T-Bone said:

Did someone say Mandalorian ?

OIP.3LGW_rz1RWzWnEz0SUbrCQHaE4?pid=ImgDe

Every time he comes to Grease Spot he says “this is the way
I say “no, this is Grease Spot

Baby Yoda says "in depth spiritual perception  and  awareness you are not"
 

Yes . . . Mandalorian . . . Disney . . . Ironman . . Iron Triangle . . . it all comes back to circular reasoning

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15 minutes ago, Bolshevik said:

the antibody test was free and let my employer know I could go back to work

the PCR test cost $$$$ and let governments know I could leave the continent.  

The T-decect test . . . is this just data collection at this time?

I really don't know much about it. I was just curious if this is what Oldies was talking about. I don't think an antibody test is going to give you the data you want because antibodies fade rather quickly. T-cell and B-cell presence is what is key, as these are the long-term cells that generate antibodies.

 

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32 minutes ago, waysider said:

I really don't know much about it. I was just curious if this is what Oldies was talking about. I don't think an antibody test is going to give you the data you want because antibodies fade rather quickly. T-cell and B-cell presence is what is key, as these are the long-term cells that generate antibodies.

 

Right now all I understand is he's talking about the quantitative antibody test (versus a qualitative result) . . . 

I just counted the pens and markers on my desk . . . and in my drawer . . . I have numbers . . . so what?

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1 hour ago, waysider said:

I just got my test back and it's 42.

That number would certainly put my mind at ease.

 

 

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2785530

https://www.gavi.org/vaccineswork/covid-19-why-we-cant-use-antibody-tests-show-vaccines-are-working

If COVID-19 antibody tests can’t currently be used to assess an individual’s immune response, then what are they used for? To date, the main use for these tests has been for ‘serosurveillance studies’, in which large numbers of people in a population are tested so that scientists can estimate how many were infected in the past and calculate how fast the virus spread. These kinds of studies can give us an idea of the general level of COVID-19 immunity in a population and help to inform public health measures and predict the future course of the pandemic. The World Health Organization recommends that interpretations of antibody tests should always be made by an expert.

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5 hours ago, WordWolf said:

For those who have no idea what Allan's talking about, I'll translate:

"experimental drug" -  all the different forms of vaccines formulated, made and distributed around the world, from a variety of countries

"because the Government told you to"-  all the dialogues around the world between elected officials and the public, including health officials,  all from countries that normally disagree on everything

"disregard all the side effects (including deaths)  and unknown mid-to long-term debilitating effects"-  the few known dangers for a few people getting vaccinated (as always happens)  is far more dangerous than the far greater risks of death or permanent injury from getting Covid because Allan says so

"just so you can 'be part of the crowd' or 'peer pressure' or a 'misguided sense of duty to fellow man" - paying attention to the medical experts and understanding them and agreeing, rather than bucking the establishment because it's the establishment and following the secret knowledge like Allan

"I don't see how this topic could be uplifting in any way regardless" - decreasing the body counts doesn't matter much

"It really could be a matter of life or death, just exactly whose, we'll have to wait it out"-  let's ignore all the stats that say that the innoculated survive Covid at greater rates than the uninnoculated and claim all the facts aren't in when plenty are in and conclusions can already be drawn as to whether the vaccines are safer than the illness

"I'm just glad I don't have to go to bed at night worried if some of those spike proteins are going to turn on my own bodies immune system after the 1st or 2nd or third or fourth or fifth or sixth jab !! " - I'm glad none of us have to worry about that, since it's a make-believe illness based on a misunderstanding of the biology.   I'm also glad I don't have to go to bed at night worried about catching the gol-bloots from the hind legs of the boo-shoo bird.

 

The world I live in doesn't even superficially resemble the world Allan thinks he sees.   Then again, my world overcame the Spanish Flu, I don't know what the story is in his world.

 

 

Speaking of Spanish Flu....
Flu survivors still immune after 90 years (nationalgeographic.com)

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5 hours ago, oldiesman said:

Allan, you shared earlier that you got the disease, twice.   I'd be interested in knowing what your antibody numerical value is.. have you considered taking the "quantitative" blood test?    I would bet your value is higher than mine and I'm curious.       Also curious how high a jabbed person's value is too... please consider getting the blood test and share the results... Thx...

I'd be thrilled if my God-given immune system works the way it was designed to !

Flu survivors still immune after 90 years (nationalgeographic.com)

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