“Most of neuroscience has come around to agree with the Bible on man's self aggrandizement of his own consciousness”
What surveys have YOU conducted and what data have YOU reviewed to come up with that?
I have posted on this before. In 1991 some interesting doors were opened to me at UCSD Cognitive Sciences Department, where I became a member of a club that met weekly for 2 hours, for 7 years.
The purpose of this club was for grad students from all departments to brainstorm their ideas together. The leadership of the club included some of the world's top brain scientists from UCSD, the Salk Institute, and the Scripps Institute.
The club also hosted visits from leading brain scientists from around the world, and I was very lucky to have met them all. I worked many ideas with these people back then, in the 1990s, and have stayed in touch with some of them.
For almost 10 years I have been researching possible deterministic mechanisms for free will in the brain. Free will is a very difficult topic in science. It is also difficult to see much about it in the Bible. I started working on free will, on and off, about 55 years ago.
I have posted on this before. In 1991 some interesting doors were opened to me at UCSD Cognitive Sciences Department, where I became a member of a club that met weekly for 2 hours, for 7 years.
The purpose of this club was for grad students from all departments to brainstorm their ideas together. The leadership of the club included some of the world's top brain scientists from UCSD, the Salk Institute, and the Scripps Institute.
The club also hosted visits from leading brain scientists from around the world, and I was very lucky to have met them all. I worked many ideas with these people back then, in the 1990s, and have stayed in touch with some of them.
For almost 10 years I have been researching possible deterministic mechanisms for free will in the brain. Free will is a very difficult topic in science. It is also difficult to see much about it in the Bible. I started working on free will, on and off, about 55 years ago.
I started working on free will, on and off, about 55 years ago.
You did?
Where do you stand now? Free will or determinism?
I'll tell you I am undecided, but I tend to lean towards determinism. Though, I find the issue fascinating, I haven't thought enough about it to discuss. It's all very complex.
Since when do you teach anybody anything by ramming information down their throat?
I would say that typing out information and posting it, so people can decide for themselves whether they want to read it or not, would be a more civilized way of teaching, than ramming information down their throat would ever be.
I think I will stick to the typing teaching method, and avoid the ramming method.
I would say that typing out information and posting it, so people can decide for themselves whether they want to read it or not, would be a more civilized way of teaching, than ramming information down their throat would ever be.
I think I will stick to the typing teaching method, and avoid the ramming method.
Thanks for the tip.
You need to get the whole concept of teaching out of your head, that's top dog under dog thinking. Sharing information, however, occurs among equals.
I'll tell you I am undecided, but I tend to lean towards determinism. Though, I find the issue fascinating, I haven't thought enough about it to discuss. It's all very complex.
I tried a whole new approach 10 years ago, where I respect determinism 100%, and then work with how much freedom can a deterministic mechanism provide.
That sounds contradictory at first, but I found that determinism can yield some freedoms as well as form some prisons.
A sailboat exhibits a limited directional freedom from wind direction, yet it it all done with deterministic air molecules and the Bernoulli effect.
I am looking for similar mechanisms in the brain that obey determinism, yet also give us some limited freedoms.
I tried a whole new approach 10 years ago, where I respect determinism 100%, and then work with how much freedom can a deterministic mechanism provide.
That sounds contradictory at first, but I found that determinism can yield some freedoms as well as form some prisons.
A sailboat exhibits a limited directional freedom from wind direction, yet it it all done with deterministic air molecules and the Bernoulli effect.
I am looking for similar mechanisms in the brain that obey determinism, yet also give us some limited freedoms.
I have found determinism can help me to be more compassionate.
I'll tell you I am undecided, but I tend to lean towards determinism. Though, I find the issue fascinating, I haven't thought enough about it to discuss. It's all very complex.
BTW, I in my science theory on "limited" free will, I use 3 ideas from PFAL on free will that are in the non-suck category. Just thinking of the Topic Police being ready to pounce.
You need to get the whole concept of teaching out of your head, that's top dog under dog thinking. Sharing information, however, occurs among equals.
I think no matter what thinking I do, most posters here are committed to treating me as much lower than an under dog. There is no way I will be an "equal" here, so why try? I can drop the armor and discuss things at times with one civil person, meanwhile another poster (or 3) will be sneaking up behind me with an overdog attack on my words to the civil person.
" Sharing information, however, occurs among equals" is a nice goal. I can only try to reach it in spurts.
Yes, but I don't get into any Bible stuff. My theory is for science workers.
I use 3 PFAL ideas, though to guide my mechanism searching and fiddling.
One is that you can't control what thoughts occur to your mind (determinism) but you can control which thoughts lodge there.
Another is that it is bad for people to lose control over their mechanics of speech when SIT.
The third is that a natural man can believe Rom 10:9 with his free will, so that means free will is NOT spiritual. If human digestion can be explained by science, then so can human free will. ...in principle, at least.
One of the issues to straighten out is HOW FREE is free will, or what are it's limits. Traditionally way too much freedom has been assumed by free will advocates. I am advocating a minimal, weak form of free will.
I have posted on this before. In 1991 some interesting doors were opened to me at UCSD Cognitive Sciences Department, where I became a member of a club that met weekly for 2 hours, for 7 years.
The purpose of this club was for grad students from all departments to brainstorm their ideas together. The leadership of the club included some of the world's top brain scientists from UCSD, the Salk Institute, and the Scripps Institute.
The club also hosted visits from leading brain scientists from around the world, and I was very lucky to have met them all. I worked many ideas with these people back then, in the 1990s, and have stayed in touch with some of them.
For almost 10 years I have been researching possible deterministic mechanisms for free will in the brain. Free will is a very difficult topic in science. It is also difficult to see much about it in the Bible. I started working on free will, on and off, about 55 years ago.
FYI those were rhetorical questions I asked ,Mike - I don’t ever expect to get a straight answer out of you.
I have found determinism can help me to be more compassionate.
Yes! I totally agree. Free will does not always work, and it can be very weak at times. Lots of factors that we can never see in another person's life.
I see free will like it is a muscle, and often a weak or uncoordinated one.
Yes! I totally agree. Free will does not always work, and it can be very weak at times. Lots of factors that we can never see in another person's life.
I see free will like it is a muscle, and often a weak or uncoordinated one.
How about this: free will and determinism are both correct. Free will from a human point of view. Determinism from an eternal point of view.
BTW, I in my science theory on "limited" free will, I use 3 ideas from PFAL on free will that are in the non-suck category. Just thinking of the Topic Police being ready to pounce.
Well - if YOU say they’re in the non-suck category then I should set up more categories of PFAL suckage
How about this: free will and determinism are both correct. Free will from a human point of view. Determinism from an eternal point of view.
I think the feeling of free will is legitimate, and we can expect others to have it also. But I also think that determinism limits that freedom at times.
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penworks
VPW's statement that the Bible interprets itself is nonsense. The act of interpretation of any text is done by the reader of the text. People interpret what they read. They are the ones who give it me
waysider
And in doing so, he was violating his own "To Whom it is Written" rule.
Charity
What I see in what you wrote Chockfull is that we were meant to have a relationship with the class - you know the one that replaced our relationship with Christ. It was our lord in that it had power,
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Mike
I have posted on this before. In 1991 some interesting doors were opened to me at UCSD Cognitive Sciences Department, where I became a member of a club that met weekly for 2 hours, for 7 years.
The purpose of this club was for grad students from all departments to brainstorm their ideas together. The leadership of the club included some of the world's top brain scientists from UCSD, the Salk Institute, and the Scripps Institute.
The club also hosted visits from leading brain scientists from around the world, and I was very lucky to have met them all. I worked many ideas with these people back then, in the 1990s, and have stayed in touch with some of them.
For almost 10 years I have been researching possible deterministic mechanisms for free will in the brain. Free will is a very difficult topic in science. It is also difficult to see much about it in the Bible. I started working on free will, on and off, about 55 years ago.
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So_crates
This is my impressed look.
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Nathan_Jr
You did?
Where do you stand now? Free will or determinism?
I'll tell you I am undecided, but I tend to lean towards determinism. Though, I find the issue fascinating, I haven't thought enough about it to discuss. It's all very complex.
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Mike
I would say that typing out information and posting it, so people can decide for themselves whether they want to read it or not, would be a more civilized way of teaching, than ramming information down their throat would ever be.
I think I will stick to the typing teaching method, and avoid the ramming method.
Thanks for the tip.
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So_crates
You need to get the whole concept of teaching out of your head, that's top dog under dog thinking. Sharing information, however, occurs among equals.
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Mike
I tried a whole new approach 10 years ago, where I respect determinism 100%, and then work with how much freedom can a deterministic mechanism provide.
That sounds contradictory at first, but I found that determinism can yield some freedoms as well as form some prisons.
A sailboat exhibits a limited directional freedom from wind direction, yet it it all done with deterministic air molecules and the Bernoulli effect.
I am looking for similar mechanisms in the brain that obey determinism, yet also give us some limited freedoms.
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waysider
Shame on you for not letting them know how futile their efforts were, in light of not being able to "go beyond what you're taught".
Edited by waysidermissed a word
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Nathan_Jr
I have found determinism can help me to be more compassionate.
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Mike
BTW, I in my science theory on "limited" free will, I use 3 ideas from PFAL on free will that are in the non-suck category. Just thinking of the Topic Police being ready to pounce.
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Nathan_Jr
Uh-oh
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Nathan_Jr
You do?
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Mike
I think no matter what thinking I do, most posters here are committed to treating me as much lower than an under dog. There is no way I will be an "equal" here, so why try? I can drop the armor and discuss things at times with one civil person, meanwhile another poster (or 3) will be sneaking up behind me with an overdog attack on my words to the civil person.
" Sharing information, however, occurs among equals" is a nice goal. I can only try to reach it in spurts.
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Share on other sites
Mike
Yes, but I don't get into any Bible stuff. My theory is for science workers.
I use 3 PFAL ideas, though to guide my mechanism searching and fiddling.
One is that you can't control what thoughts occur to your mind (determinism) but you can control which thoughts lodge there.
Another is that it is bad for people to lose control over their mechanics of speech when SIT.
The third is that a natural man can believe Rom 10:9 with his free will, so that means free will is NOT spiritual. If human digestion can be explained by science, then so can human free will. ...in principle, at least.
One of the issues to straighten out is HOW FREE is free will, or what are it's limits. Traditionally way too much freedom has been assumed by free will advocates. I am advocating a minimal, weak form of free will.
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T-Bone
FYI those were rhetorical questions I asked ,Mike - I don’t ever expect to get a straight answer out of you.
I don’t ever believe a word you say
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Mike
Yes! I totally agree. Free will does not always work, and it can be very weak at times. Lots of factors that we can never see in another person's life.
I see free will like it is a muscle, and often a weak or uncoordinated one.
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Mike
That is pretty obvious, even though I often do try to give you straight answers.
But as time goes by and more data comes in, the seeds I plant may take root.
In addition to not believing a word I write, you don't really read or understand them all. But as time goes by ...
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So_crates
How about this: free will and determinism are both correct. Free will from a human point of view. Determinism from an eternal point of view.
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So_crates
I doubt it. Fool me once, shame on Saint Vic...
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T-Bone
Well - if YOU say they’re in the non-suck category then I should set up more categories of PFAL suckage
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Mike
I think the feeling of free will is legitimate, and we can expect others to have it also. But I also think that determinism limits that freedom at times.
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T-Bone
Aha! That’s where wrong seed comes from!
get behind me wierwille!
on second thought- get away from my behind
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Nathan_Jr
That's the illusion. We all FEEL like we have free will.
Why don't you start a new topic on this.
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Nathan_Jr
Has anyone ever translated English back into glossolalia? Something I'm working on.
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waysider
It's the same whether it's straight or flipped.
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