VPW put his name to all the collaterals, whether or not anyone else contributed to them. It's his name on all the books. No-one else has attribution.
Ps 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, And give thanks unto thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: For thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.
Or, in the MikeBible:
Mike will worship towards the VPW auditorium, and give thanks unto VPW's name for his {???} and for his "truth": For Mike has magnified VPW's word above all VPW's name.
And that's not idolizing VPW?
In Mike's mind it's not, because he beleeves the collaterals and PFAL are theopneustos. He beleeves Jesus will be holding a copy of PFAL at his return and that God knows this in His foreknowledge. It all goes back to 1942 and 1998.
It's simple math. What victor paul wierwille wrote is the word of God. This is Mike's beleef.
VPW put his name to all the collaterals, whether or not anyone else contributed to them. It's his name on all the books. No-one else has attribution.
Ps 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, And give thanks unto thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: For thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.
Or, in the MikeBible:
Mike will worship towards the VPW auditorium, and give thanks unto VPW's name for his {???} and for his "truth": For Mike has magnified VPW's word above all VPW's name.
And that's not idolizing VPW?
My short response is "You got me wrong."
I wish he was the man he knew to be.
The collaterals are different. They help me and others to read the Bible.
*/*/*/*
I really want to get to your long, more challenging post, but am putting it off to when I have more time. All of my immediate family is 3,000 miles away, so tomorrow and Christmas day I will have lots of time.
I banged out a response for today's post as I was getting ready for work.
*/*/*/*
You wrote a description of someone idolizing VPW .
That which you wrote, if adjusted for accurate application to me, would not idolizing VPW.
/*/*/*/*/*
When you want to beat to the plagiarism bush, then all the content in the collaterals originates elsewhere, and not from VPW.
Beating the plagiarism bush means exposing VPW’s sin of stealing the good teachings of others. Those poor hard working ministers of light were robbed by the evil VPW. That is the sentiment pumped. And this promotes the idea that he is untrustworthy. The greater the plagiarism sin (on top of others) can be portrayed to be, the greater “evil personified” he is.
THEN, change the scene.
When you want to discredit ME by labeling me a VPW idolator, I protest and say my focus is the collaterals.
All of sudden those poor unfortunate writers of all the collaterals’ contents contents are forgotten, and they are besmirched, because the “evil personified” guy’s NAME IS ON THEM. The name of VPW on all those otherwise good writings seeps into them and makes them evil.
I don’t buy it.
The contents of the collaterals are good.
(or at least debatable in a few places)
One of the most skillful thinkers I know, predisposed to find dangerous, damaging error in the collaterals, could find NONE.He said TWICE that if I disciplined my life to the collaterals and nothing else (except the Bible they point to), then I would do well in life. This was a modern Gamaliel who said this; your chief Whistle-Blower who said this.
I've often wondered about this. Why wasn't the 7th THE Man of God the man he knew to be? What are his cop outs?
Was it his cup overflowing with fear? Was it a lack of power? Was it spiritual weakness? Was it spiritual stupidity? Was it a black heart? Was it a lack of beleeving? Was it wrong beleef? Was it wrong seed? Did he not know how (H-O-W) to order his steps? Did he not know how (H-O-W) to walk?
Why stand on the shoulders of and imitate such a man?
One of the most skillful thinkers I know, predisposed to find dangerous, damaging error in the collaterals, could find NONE.He said TWICE that if I disciplined my life to the collaterals and nothing else (except the Bible they point to), then I would do well in life. This was a modern Gamaliel who said this; your chief Whistle-Blower who said this.
Did he tell you that before or after he blew the whistle?
In the spirit of the Provisional Peace Treaty just penned with OldSchool
Mike, you aren't used to civil disagreement. There is no enmity between me and you...I have no emotion attached to my posts, especially hate or anger or unforgiveness or whatever else.
One of the most skillful thinkers I know, predisposed to find dangerous, damaging error in the collaterals, could find NONE
That won't impress anyone here unless you can get them to come to GSC and talk openly about the material. Otherwise, these efforts make you happy and you are satisfied with them...it's sad you can't see the errors in all of vpws books --- I mean the way international knows there were a multitude of errors or they wouldn't have spent the last 40 years or so whitewashing wierwille's works. So, you are happy with this rationalisation then so be it...be happy. Your not gonna turn anyone here back to pflap. All your doing is giving readers multiple reasons to run for the hills and for that I applaud you.
That won't impress anyone here unless you can get them to come to GSC and talk openly about the material. Otherwise, these efforts make you happy and you are satisfied with them...it's sad you can't see the errors in all of vpws books --- I mean the way international knows there were a multitude of errors or they wouldn't have spent the last 40 years or so whitewashing wierwille's works. So, you are happy with this rationalisation then so be it...be happy. Your not gonna turn anyone here back to pflap. All your doing is giving readers multiple reasons to run for the hills and for that I applaud you.
Can you please give me me one or two examples of this "multitude" of errors TWI have whitewashed?
I have my original set of collaterals to compare the newer collaterals with. I intended to do this with the new editions that came out in 2000 and that I got with the new PFAL-T. My intent is to see if TWI made any errors in their changing things.
Can you please give me me one or two examples of this "multitude" of errors TWI have whitewashed?
wouldnt matter if I did...you wouldnt care anyway...if you want to see for yourself get out any really old version of the collaterals or whatever and compare them to the new. Plus wierwille's theology was loaded with occultism and error and that had been documented here forever and a day and thos lies/errors are still present...no thanks, Im still not accepting homework assignments.
So he was trying to keep his splinter group, based on PLAF, going.
These were private phone calls. No publicity value to his group.
I did not get the impression he was trying to recruit me to join his group.
That DID happen with a private phone call with another great researcher. He tried to shmooze me to joining his research team when he realized he could not talk me out of highly respecting the collaterals. He overtly tried to recruit me as adding balance to his team. I declined.
wouldnt matter if I did...you wouldnt care anyway...if you want to see for yourself get out any really old version of the collaterals or whatever and compare them to the new. Plus wierwille's theology was loaded with occultism and error and that had been docuNo mented here forever and a day and thos lies/errors are still present...no thanks, Im still not accepting homework assignments.
No. I really do care! I care enough to plan to do the arduous work of comparing, but you could save me MUCH of that work.
Also, I'd want to call you on putting your money where your mouth is. If there really were a MULTITUDE of changes, surely you can remember ONE, and it would be no effort to tell me. You have told me this tale THREE TIMES now so surely you have a simple single solitary piece of evidence to back you up.
Actually, I would like to see the whole multitude of changes. Is there any way you can pass on this desire to your x-wife? Is she still in TWI? If so, that would be a BIG bonus.
I want to see the evidence that TWI changed a multitude of things in the collaterals to white wash their plagiarism guilt.
These were private phone calls. No publicity value to his group.
I did not get the impression he was trying to recruit me to join his group.
So you think if his group was based on PLAF he was going to run the class down.
Second, just because you don't get the impression they're trying to recruit you, doesn't mean they aren't. They're trying to get people to take more classes. More money for them. They're always trying to recruit. Look at you here with PLAF.
24 minutes ago, Mike said:
That DID happen with a private phone call with another great researcher. He tried to shmooze me to joining his research team when he realized he could not talk me out of highly respecting the collaterals. He overtly tried to recruit me as adding balance to his team. I declined.
Doesn't matter if it was public or private. His agenda was to keep his splinter group, based on PLAF, going. That means having as few drop outs as possible.
My short response is "You got me wrong."
I wish he was the man he knew to be.
The collaterals are different. They help me and others to read the Bible.
*/*/*/*
I really want to get to your long, more challenging post, but am putting it off to when I have more time. All of my immediate family is 3,000 miles away, so tomorrow and Christmas day I will have lots of time.
I banged out a response for today's post as I was getting ready for work.
*/*/*/*
You wrote a description of someone idolizing VPW .
That which you wrote, if adjusted for accurate application to me, would not idolizing VPW.
/*/*/*/*/*
When you want to beat to the plagiarism bush, then all the content in the collaterals originates elsewhere, and not from VPW.
Beating the plagiarism bush means exposing VPW’s sin of stealing the good teachings of others. Those poor hard working ministers of light were robbed by the evil VPW. That is the sentiment pumped. And this promotes the idea that he is untrustworthy. The greater the plagiarism sin (on top of others) can be portrayed to be, the greater “evil personified” he is.
THEN, change the scene.
When you want to discredit ME by labeling me a VPW idolator, I protest and say my focus is the collaterals.
All of sudden those poor unfortunate writers of all the collaterals’ contents contents are forgotten, and they are besmirched, because the “evil personified” guy’s NAME IS ON THEM. The name of VPW on all those otherwise good writings seeps into them and makes them evil.
I don’t buy it.
The contents of the collaterals are good.
(or at least debatable in a few places)
One of the most skillful thinkers I know, predisposed to find dangerous, damaging error in the collaterals, could find NONE.He said TWICE that if I disciplined my life to the collaterals and nothing else (except the Bible they point to), then I would do well in life. This was a modern Gamaliel who said this; your chief Whistle-Blower who said this.
Idolater is such a harsh term.
Would you be more comfortable with being a VPW bobblehead? I mean in a figurative sense of course.
Now when you say “the collaterals” what specifically are you referring to? I mean we had a cool conversation I remember about the “why division” chapter in the green book. That chapter specifically seems real delusional. Maybe you mean something else though?
Over used a camera analogy? That takes pictures off arseholes victim blaming?
4 Crucified or The Day JC Died?
What do YOU mean by “collaterals” that you can discipline your life to like a moral code?
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outandabout
I copied the emotion graph and wanted to comment on how it made me aware of the wide range of emotions we as humans are capable of. A little off topic but looking at it reminds me that we were taught
WordWolf
It's also interesting to see what happened and what did NOT happen. We all know that vpw never went to his congregation and confessed his sins against them. That would have been required after havi
chockfull
I think when VPW taught that sincerity is no guarantee for the truth that is what they call a “Freudian slip”.
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Nathan_Jr
In Mike's mind it's not, because he beleeves the collaterals and PFAL are theopneustos. He beleeves Jesus will be holding a copy of PFAL at his return and that God knows this in His foreknowledge. It all goes back to 1942 and 1998.
It's simple math. What victor paul wierwille wrote is the word of God. This is Mike's beleef.
So it seems to me. I could be wrong.
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Mike
My short response is "You got me wrong."
I wish he was the man he knew to be.
The collaterals are different. They help me and others to read the Bible.
*/*/*/*
I really want to get to your long, more challenging post, but am putting it off to when I have more time. All of my immediate family is 3,000 miles away, so tomorrow and Christmas day I will have lots of time.
I banged out a response for today's post as I was getting ready for work.
*/*/*/*
You wrote a description of someone idolizing VPW .
That which you wrote, if adjusted for accurate application to me, would not idolizing VPW.
/*/*/*/*/*
When you want to beat to the plagiarism bush, then all the content in the collaterals originates elsewhere, and not from VPW.
Beating the plagiarism bush means exposing VPW’s sin of stealing the good teachings of others. Those poor hard working ministers of light were robbed by the evil VPW. That is the sentiment pumped. And this promotes the idea that he is untrustworthy. The greater the plagiarism sin (on top of others) can be portrayed to be, the greater “evil personified” he is.
THEN, change the scene.
When you want to discredit ME by labeling me a VPW idolator, I protest and say my focus is the collaterals.
All of sudden those poor unfortunate writers of all the collaterals’ contents contents are forgotten, and they are besmirched, because the “evil personified” guy’s NAME IS ON THEM. The name of VPW on all those otherwise good writings seeps into them and makes them evil.
I don’t buy it.
The contents of the collaterals are good.
(or at least debatable in a few places)
One of the most skillful thinkers I know, predisposed to find dangerous, damaging error in the collaterals, could find NONE. He said TWICE that if I disciplined my life to the collaterals and nothing else (except the Bible they point to), then I would do well in life. This was a modern Gamaliel who said this; your chief Whistle-Blower who said this.
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Twinky
Mike, I didn't say that AT ALL.
Learn to read.
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So_crates
Thanks for confirming your major thrust is to start your own ministry. This ministry wouldn't happen to have a motorcoach, would it?
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Nathan_Jr
I've often wondered about this. Why wasn't the 7th THE Man of God the man he knew to be? What are his cop outs?
Was it his cup overflowing with fear? Was it a lack of power? Was it spiritual weakness? Was it spiritual stupidity? Was it a black heart? Was it a lack of beleeving? Was it wrong beleef? Was it wrong seed? Did he not know how (H-O-W) to order his steps? Did he not know how (H-O-W) to walk?
Why stand on the shoulders of and imitate such a man?
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So_crates
No, they help you and others get indoctrinated with Saint Vic's warped version of the bible, known as The Word.
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waysider
You might want to acquaint yourself with some more skillful thinkers.
I'm just sayin'.
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waysider
I think the answer is obvious. He didn't attend enough excellor sessions and, thus, never got his fluency beyond "Lo Shanta...".
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So_crates
Did he tell you that before or after he blew the whistle?
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OldSkool
What? You mean you wish he was a man. He wasnt a man but a drunken, plagaraising, predator who preyed on vulnerable young ladies in his own flock...
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Mike
LONG after. Around 2006.
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OldSkool
Mike, you aren't used to civil disagreement. There is no enmity between me and you...I have no emotion attached to my posts, especially hate or anger or unforgiveness or whatever else.
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OldSkool
That won't impress anyone here unless you can get them to come to GSC and talk openly about the material. Otherwise, these efforts make you happy and you are satisfied with them...it's sad you can't see the errors in all of vpws books --- I mean the way international knows there were a multitude of errors or they wouldn't have spent the last 40 years or so whitewashing wierwille's works. So, you are happy with this rationalisation then so be it...be happy. Your not gonna turn anyone here back to pflap. All your doing is giving readers multiple reasons to run for the hills and for that I applaud you.
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Mike
Do you mean more thinkers who are skillful?
Or do you mean thinkers who are more skillful?
I try to acquaint myself with both, but I would not mind another name for consideration.
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So_crates
So he was trying to keep his splinter group, based on PLAF, going.
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Mike
Can you please give me me one or two examples of this "multitude" of errors TWI have whitewashed?
I have my original set of collaterals to compare the newer collaterals with. I intended to do this with the new editions that came out in 2000 and that I got with the new PFAL-T. My intent is to see if TWI made any errors in their changing things.
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OldSkool
wouldnt matter if I did...you wouldnt care anyway...if you want to see for yourself get out any really old version of the collaterals or whatever and compare them to the new. Plus wierwille's theology was loaded with occultism and error and that had been documented here forever and a day and thos lies/errors are still present...no thanks, Im still not accepting homework assignments.
Edited by OldSkoolLink to comment
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Mike
These were private phone calls. No publicity value to his group.
I did not get the impression he was trying to recruit me to join his group.
That DID happen with a private phone call with another great researcher. He tried to shmooze me to joining his research team when he realized he could not talk me out of highly respecting the collaterals. He overtly tried to recruit me as adding balance to his team. I declined.
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OldSkool
1942 promise at the top of the list...twi knows it was a snowjob.
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Mike
No. I really do care! I care enough to plan to do the arduous work of comparing, but you could save me MUCH of that work.
Also, I'd want to call you on putting your money where your mouth is. If there really were a MULTITUDE of changes, surely you can remember ONE, and it would be no effort to tell me. You have told me this tale THREE TIMES now so surely you have a simple single solitary piece of evidence to back you up.
Actually, I would like to see the whole multitude of changes. Is there any way you can pass on this desire to your x-wife? Is she still in TWI? If so, that would be a BIG bonus.
I want to see the evidence that TWI changed a multitude of things in the collaterals to white wash their plagiarism guilt.
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OldSkool
I know exactly what you are doing and Im not playing along. Work it yourself so it has meaning to you.
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OldSkool
here ya go...
https://web.archive.org/web/20030713171917/http://www.livingepistlessociety.org/10Blue2.htm
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So_crates
So you think if his group was based on PLAF he was going to run the class down.
Second, just because you don't get the impression they're trying to recruit you, doesn't mean they aren't. They're trying to get people to take more classes. More money for them. They're always trying to recruit. Look at you here with PLAF.
Doesn't matter if it was public or private. His agenda was to keep his splinter group, based on PLAF, going. That means having as few drop outs as possible.
Edited by So_cratesLink to comment
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chockfull
Idolater is such a harsh term.
Would you be more comfortable with being a VPW bobblehead? I mean in a figurative sense of course.
Now when you say “the collaterals” what specifically are you referring to? I mean we had a cool conversation I remember about the “why division” chapter in the green book. That chapter specifically seems real delusional. Maybe you mean something else though?
Over used a camera analogy? That takes pictures off arseholes victim blaming?
4 Crucified or The Day JC Died?
What do YOU mean by “collaterals” that you can discipline your life to like a moral code?
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