Not a lot wrong with the ideas themselves BUT gawdamightee were they twisted for self-serving ends.
Yes, we were bought with a price but TWIT was NOT the one who paid it...DOH!
If I sacrifice myself, I do the choosing of the where,what,when, and to whom. Else it is NOT self-sacrifice, it is bondage and slavery. Thought we were Christ's freemen and we determined our bondsmanship to HIM, not some man-made org.
Now, we may choose to put our service to work IN some man-made org. but not to the end that we no longer have any say. In that case, time to find a worthier place to put our service in use... as so many have found, through much travail, sad to say...
quote: Thought we were Christ's freemen and we determined our bondsmanship to HIM, not some man-made org.
I believed this my whole life. The only problem is that when I was a committed Wayfer, I was told twi was God's ministry and by serving in it I was serving God. That was a big fat lie. That was a way to get people to work for free.
Thank God He looks on the heart, and He knows why I did what I did. Hopefully there was something beneficial in it all. I just don't see it yet, especially the 5 years I spent on staff..... -->
Yeah, I remember when a guy teaching on stage at hq upset me when he was talking about a situation that had him down....and he said to himself the *You are carpes so and so...your life is not your own* your not allowed to wallow in pity* ...anyway...it bothered me to hear that once you were corpes...your life was technically not your own.
I exited twi many years ago.....and have been distancing myself from them ever since. :D-->
But......in the rare moment that one of those lines (twisted to mirror twi's self-interests) enters my mind, I uproot it like a dandelion. And, for me.....I remind myself that twi's indoctrination STARTED in pfal.
Remember....just write The Teacher.
What a crock of arrogance!!! What a sleight of hand trick used by vpw.
So many of those one-liners were TWEAKED ever-so-slightly to give a jaded message. Having encountered MANY wholesome Christian bible study groups in the past few years, I more clearly see how they contrast with twi's distortion of truth.
I chucked ALL my corps notes in the trash many years ago........and have been LIVING FINE without them. :D--> :P--> :D-->
Thank God He looks on the heart, and He knows why I did what I did. Hopefully there was something beneficial in it all. I just don't see it yet, especially the 5 years I spent on staff.....
Let brotherly love continue. Do not neglect to show hospitality to strangers, for thereby some have entertained angels unawares. (Hebrews 13:1&2)
All service done with God's love is serving God it is not exclusive of or dependent on an organization
This idea came from Vic's doulos teachings. Vic was very misleading about this concept.
In the O.T. (in which God encourages/commands slavery, buying and selling people, jew or non-jew) the rule, as taught by Vic, was "I love my master, I will not leave." He is then branded and is slave for the rest of his life.
What Vic left out was:
a) The 7 years was for jew slaves only, if you were a heathen, you were a slave for life (just because Mommy and Daddy couldn't afford to put food on the table so they sold you).
b) If a jew slave was married at purchase time, when the 7 years were up, he could take his wife with him.
c) If the jew slave had children while a slave, the children were the property of the owner.
d) At the end of 7 years, if children were born during this time, required that the mother remain slave.
So, a jew slave with children, at the end of 7 years had the option to leave his wife and family and be free, or be a slave the rest of his life and remain with his family. Nice choice!
Also, in the O.T., slaves were considered property ("for he is his money"). The owner was pretty much free to do with them as he pleased, without penalty. They had about the same rights as live-stock.
And if you honestly look at the corpse program, you may see that this is how it was run. The corpse were the property of TWI, to do with what they wanted, including dumping them on the side of the road as rubbish.
One would think that the idea of treating another human being as property should have died out by now, having it's roots in barbarism. I guess not.
Sounds like prime training for people to fall victim of the Stockholm Syndrome. Jesus died to make us free, didn't he? Why did we let them imprison us? (rhetorically)
Another phrase we used to hear all the time was, "what else do we have to do with our life that's better?"
Yes, I was of that same mind as you...I thought it was because he loved his master, that the slave wanted to stay. It was always taught to me that the reason the slave would stay is because his master treated him with such love, care and respect for the slave that the slave was almost better off staying with him.
Sheeeshhh, now that I write that I see how WRONG that thinking really is. No matter what, a slave is a slave. Your choices are no longer your own.
And I used to think this was about the greatest thing anyone could do...to give themselves up for such a cause.
quote:"you have been bought with a price, and you are not your own".
I agree Chwester, yet I do not believe that God ever intended for us to give up our 'wills' because of this purchase.
There was supposed to be greater freedom because of the purchase, not more control, oppression, restraint, limitation and domination.
Being bought with a price to me means that God saw that we were in pretty rough shape...under the rulership of other powers ~ the true meaning of slavery (don't mean to get all sparituuuuual here). So the loving father saw His children in this state, redeemed His children and said...now...go play and be free.
That's the way I would like to think of it. :D-->
Why would God sacrifice His only Son other than for us to have more freedom and joy than we could possibly fathom. It makes no sense to me otherwise.
Recommended Posts
alfakat
Not a lot wrong with the ideas themselves BUT gawdamightee were they twisted for self-serving ends.
Yes, we were bought with a price but TWIT was NOT the one who paid it...DOH!
If I sacrifice myself, I do the choosing of the where,what,when, and to whom. Else it is NOT self-sacrifice, it is bondage and slavery. Thought we were Christ's freemen and we determined our bondsmanship to HIM, not some man-made org.
Now, we may choose to put our service to work IN some man-made org. but not to the end that we no longer have any say. In that case, time to find a worthier place to put our service in use... as so many have found, through much travail, sad to say...
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Nottawayfer
I believed this my whole life. The only problem is that when I was a committed Wayfer, I was told twi was God's ministry and by serving in it I was serving God. That was a big fat lie. That was a way to get people to work for free.
Thank God He looks on the heart, and He knows why I did what I did. Hopefully there was something beneficial in it all. I just don't see it yet, especially the 5 years I spent on staff.....
-->
Link to comment
Share on other sites
rascal
Yeah, I remember when a guy teaching on stage at hq upset me when he was talking about a situation that had him down....and he said to himself the *You are carpes so and so...your life is not your own* your not allowed to wallow in pity* ...anyway...it bothered me to hear that once you were corpes...your life was technically not your own.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
skyrider
I exited twi many years ago.....and have been distancing myself from them ever since.
:D-->
But......in the rare moment that one of those lines (twisted to mirror twi's self-interests) enters my mind, I uproot it like a dandelion. And, for me.....I remind myself that twi's indoctrination STARTED in pfal.
Remember....just write The Teacher.
What a crock of arrogance!!! What a sleight of hand trick used by vpw.
So many of those one-liners were TWEAKED ever-so-slightly to give a jaded message. Having encountered MANY wholesome Christian bible study groups in the past few years, I more clearly see how they contrast with twi's distortion of truth.
I chucked ALL my corps notes in the trash many years ago........and have been LIVING FINE without them.
:D--> 
:P--> 
:D-->
skyrider
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WhiteDove
Quote: posted by Wafer Not
Thank God He looks on the heart, and He knows why I did what I did. Hopefully there was something beneficial in it all. I just don't see it yet, especially the 5 years I spent on staff.....
Let brotherly love continue. Do not neglect to show hospitality to strangers, for thereby some have entertained angels unawares. (Hebrews 13:1&2)
All service done with God's love is serving God it is not exclusive of or dependent on an organization
Link to comment
Share on other sites
TheSongRemainsTheSame
I know more of The Word Of God than you do. Therefore I know more about you than you know about yourself.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
JustThinking
It is so good to be out! My life is my own again.
Thanks to everyone here for being on GS to talk with about all of the good, bad, funny and not-so-funny parts of life as a TWIt.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
frank123lol
Your life is not your own,youserve the ministry to the greater good what a bunch of####
Link to comment
Share on other sites
JustThinking
Resistance is...
Oops, wrong message board. ;-)
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bob
I've been thinking about this lately.
This idea came from Vic's doulos teachings. Vic was very misleading about this concept.
In the O.T. (in which God encourages/commands slavery, buying and selling people, jew or non-jew) the rule, as taught by Vic, was "I love my master, I will not leave." He is then branded and is slave for the rest of his life.
What Vic left out was:
a) The 7 years was for jew slaves only, if you were a heathen, you were a slave for life (just because Mommy and Daddy couldn't afford to put food on the table so they sold you).
b) If a jew slave was married at purchase time, when the 7 years were up, he could take his wife with him.
c) If the jew slave had children while a slave, the children were the property of the owner.
d) At the end of 7 years, if children were born during this time, required that the mother remain slave.
So, a jew slave with children, at the end of 7 years had the option to leave his wife and family and be free, or be a slave the rest of his life and remain with his family. Nice choice!
Also, in the O.T., slaves were considered property ("for he is his money"). The owner was pretty much free to do with them as he pleased, without penalty. They had about the same rights as live-stock.
And if you honestly look at the corpse program, you may see that this is how it was run. The corpse were the property of TWI, to do with what they wanted, including dumping them on the side of the road as rubbish.
One would think that the idea of treating another human being as property should have died out by now, having it's roots in barbarism. I guess not.
See Exodus 21.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Belle
Sounds like prime training for people to fall victim of the Stockholm Syndrome. Jesus died to make us free, didn't he? Why did we let them imprison us? (rhetorically)
Another phrase we used to hear all the time was, "what else do we have to do with our life that's better?"
Link to comment
Share on other sites
excathedra
this thread made me cry
thanks
Link to comment
Share on other sites
JustThinking
Why didn't they just say "We own you?" It would have been more honest.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bob
Sorry Ex
Link to comment
Share on other sites
grasshopper
jew slave?
hey bob,
[fill in the blanks]
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bob
Yes?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bob
Is there a problem?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
excathedra
is there something wrong with saying "jew" ? serious question. is that what seems wrong grasshopper ?
--
bob, that flipped me out about the slave's choice in staying. i always thought it was because he loved his master so much
--
regarding the topic, when it comes to the wrong kind of sex and control, you definitely end up feeling like property or a thing
Link to comment
Share on other sites
ex70sHouston
"My life is not my own"
"Self Sacrifice is the passion of all great men"
These are great sayings and can be true.
That is unit my wife gets hold of them.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
A la prochaine
Bob,
Thank you for that revealing information.
Exxie,
Yes, I was of that same mind as you...I thought it was because he loved his master, that the slave wanted to stay. It was always taught to me that the reason the slave would stay is because his master treated him with such love, care and respect for the slave that the slave was almost better off staying with him.
Sheeeshhh, now that I write that I see how WRONG that thinking really is. No matter what, a slave is a slave. Your choices are no longer your own.
And I used to think this was about the greatest thing anyone could do...to give themselves up for such a cause.
OHMYGAWD, OHMYGAWD, OHMYGAWD, OHMYGAWD, OHMYGAWD!!!
--> 
--> 
--> 
--> 
--> 
-->
Link to comment
Share on other sites
excathedra
i KNOW a la
Link to comment
Share on other sites
chwester
The Bible makes if pretty clear that "you have been bought with a price, and you are not your own".
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bob
Another endorsement of slavery?
I highly doubt that means turning your life over to another person/group.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
A la prochaine
Chwester,
I agree Chwester, yet I do not believe that God ever intended for us to give up our 'wills' because of this purchase.
There was supposed to be greater freedom because of the purchase, not more control, oppression, restraint, limitation and domination.
Being bought with a price to me means that God saw that we were in pretty rough shape...under the rulership of other powers ~ the true meaning of slavery (don't mean to get all sparituuuuual here). So the loving father saw His children in this state, redeemed His children and said...now...go play and be free.
That's the way I would like to think of it.
:D-->
Why would God sacrifice His only Son other than for us to have more freedom and joy than we could possibly fathom. It makes no sense to me otherwise.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.