Oh hell yeah, how to put the $ value on all this stuff......yikes.
The biggest, for me would be personal loss such as the loss of my husband, his family, my family's respect, my eldest daughter's education, a dream or 30.
Oh, man... if I started tallying the cost of all the classes, subscriptions, travel, obligatory moves, and lost pay for delaying my upward career mobility for 20 years... holy crap it would just be too scary to contemplate.
classes, advances, ROA's, gifts and abundant sharing for 10+ years--$$Alot$
poor financial decisions based on way thinking---$ a ton $
therapy and other things to clear my mind----$ a truckload $
loss of income and decades in delay of professional development--- $ a freakin sh!tload $
Plus Im probably forgetting a bunch of things....
1.5 mil is probably not that far off
which makes me wonder..
why in god's name wouldn't an organization WANT someone to succeed in life along these lines..
if you think about it.. it cost THEM likely @200K in abs per individual, in the long run..
it cost the organization itself countless professional ties.. along the lines of thousands..
in the long run, it cost the organization credibility. In a big way. I have had to explain more than several times how affiliation with a "religious organization" crowded out time for professional development, college.. grad school.. etc etc..
there was a REMOTE possibility that the group would turn into something legitimate.. into what it purported to be.. but it never happened.
at the entrance interview I had to the four year university they asked.. "how come you wait so long?" "ever hear of da way?" "why yes.. I have.."
I know someone at this university whose remote form of "involvement" cost them more than me.. all I can say is, I think the person didn't see what was coming.. didn't have a clue.. nor should he have..
I think that's where they heard something about the organization..
I think the money thing is overdone and irrelevant, but I am personally biased on this because suring my deprogramming they (deprogrammers) tried to shave that down my throat with a lot of other stuff. They tried to add up every penny I spent, gave, would have made, etc etc, and it didn't make much impression on me. Again it is only my personal view, but I think the personal losses such as Shell has mentioned ( and BTW Kristen Skedgell as well) were much more devastating.
why in god's name wouldn't an organization WANT someone to succeed in life along these lines..
if you think about it.. it cost THEM likely @200K in abs per individual, in the long run..
The attrition rate is extremely high in any MLM, be it Amway, Shaklee or TWI.
Wierwille knew that. That's why he pushed so hard for fresh recruits.
I think he looked at what Donnie F. did with witnessing and undershepharding and thought he had struck gold.
He wasn't interested in building long term relationships, despite the appearance to the contrary one might get from looking at the Corps program. He was interested in creating a dedicated sales force that could replace converts faster than they dropped off. For quite some time, his plan was vastly successful. After he died, the whole thing started to unravel because there were very few who actually understood that the whole thing was really a big scam.
Had the upper leaders put their heads together, they might have come to grips with the reality of what they were involved in and created a successful business plan. Instead, they all tried to put a spiritual, Godly spin on an organization that was really nothing more than a well-oiled money machine.
edit
I don't think he was too overly concerned about the longevity of his scheme.
As long as it lasted long enough to buy him a cushy lifestyle, that was long enough for him.
think the money thing is overdone and irrelevant, but I am personally biased on this because suring my deprogramming they (deprogrammers) tried to shave that down my throat with a lot of other stuff. They tried to add up every penny I spent, gave, would have made, etc etc, and it didn't make much impression on me. Again it is only my personal view, but I think the personal losses such as Shell has mentioned ( and BTW Kristen Skedgell as well) were much more devastating.
Im not complaining or carrying around any anger about it--just answering the question. I think 1.5 mil is a fairly accurate assessment. To me its just $--I could be better off but I fine and arent cryin about it..... Im certainly glad that I didnt have to "pay" what others paid --with life and limb or serious abuse..
Ham is right. It is/was an extremely shortsighted organization. I gave alot of what I had but due to their system when I was in, I never had much. If they had encouraged personal development or had even a minute amount of graciousness ( yea right) people may have stuck around for much longer or until their retirement years when they'd have some real money to give to an organization
I think he looked at what Donnie F. did with witnessing and undershepharding and thought he had struck gold.
yep.. and I would go further.. he would have had the "hippies" in airports and bus stations selling flowers.. except for the embarassment that would ensue. Likely they would have done it.. Instead.. he brought them to hq, and had them try out a business suit and briefcase..
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Bolshevik
When you include lost investment opportunities, lack of career development, education avoidance, destruction of professional networks etc etc etc etc.
It's gotta be in the millions for a lot of folks.
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waysider
$59.50
Take it or take a hike.
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Bolshevik
$59.50?
did you include inflation and interest?
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Ham
about 1.5 million by conservative estimates..
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mstar1
classes, advances, ROA's, gifts and abundant sharing for 10+ years--$$Alot$
poor financial decisions based on way thinking---$ a ton $
therapy and other things to clear my mind----$ a truckload $
loss of income and decades in delay of professional development--- $ a freakin sh!tload $
Plus Im probably forgetting a bunch of things....
1.5 mil is probably not that far off
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bowtwi
That kind of math gives me a headache, but I can tell you it cost me my marriage. I can't put a price on that.
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Shellon
Oh hell yeah, how to put the $ value on all this stuff......yikes.
The biggest, for me would be personal loss such as the loss of my husband, his family, my family's respect, my eldest daughter's education, a dream or 30.
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TheHighWay
Oh, man... if I started tallying the cost of all the classes, subscriptions, travel, obligatory moves, and lost pay for delaying my upward career mobility for 20 years... holy crap it would just be too scary to contemplate.
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Ham
which makes me wonder..
why in god's name wouldn't an organization WANT someone to succeed in life along these lines..
if you think about it.. it cost THEM likely @200K in abs per individual, in the long run..
it cost the organization itself countless professional ties.. along the lines of thousands..
in the long run, it cost the organization credibility. In a big way. I have had to explain more than several times how affiliation with a "religious organization" crowded out time for professional development, college.. grad school.. etc etc..
there was a REMOTE possibility that the group would turn into something legitimate.. into what it purported to be.. but it never happened.
at the entrance interview I had to the four year university they asked.. "how come you wait so long?" "ever hear of da way?" "why yes.. I have.."
I know someone at this university whose remote form of "involvement" cost them more than me.. all I can say is, I think the person didn't see what was coming.. didn't have a clue.. nor should he have..
I think that's where they heard something about the organization..
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Ham
and they didn't have the foresight to think ahead ten, fifteen, twenty years..
so instead of really developing the organization..
these (insert your favourite non politically correct slur here)..
hit us up for "spare change" and lunch money..
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Lifted Up
I think the money thing is overdone and irrelevant, but I am personally biased on this because suring my deprogramming they (deprogrammers) tried to shave that down my throat with a lot of other stuff. They tried to add up every penny I spent, gave, would have made, etc etc, and it didn't make much impression on me. Again it is only my personal view, but I think the personal losses such as Shell has mentioned ( and BTW Kristen Skedgell as well) were much more devastating.
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Ham
I agree. But the question was in terms of dollars and cents..
I would view loss of professional development as more personal. Though it might have a large bearing on the money.
I think the money itself is a symptom of the larger problem..
just because the money issue is a symptom.. I don't think it's entirely irrelevant..
maybe its more like a twisted family of sorts..
they never wanted the "kids" to really grow up..
I know some of those who went for a degree.. especially after receiving the *wonder training* and graduated from the corps, were sharply criticized..
"they" were VERY disappointed, working corps assignments around something as "trivial" as a college education..
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waysider
The attrition rate is extremely high in any MLM, be it Amway, Shaklee or TWI.
Wierwille knew that. That's why he pushed so hard for fresh recruits.
I think he looked at what Donnie F. did with witnessing and undershepharding and thought he had struck gold.
He wasn't interested in building long term relationships, despite the appearance to the contrary one might get from looking at the Corps program. He was interested in creating a dedicated sales force that could replace converts faster than they dropped off. For quite some time, his plan was vastly successful. After he died, the whole thing started to unravel because there were very few who actually understood that the whole thing was really a big scam.
Had the upper leaders put their heads together, they might have come to grips with the reality of what they were involved in and created a successful business plan. Instead, they all tried to put a spiritual, Godly spin on an organization that was really nothing more than a well-oiled money machine.
edit
I don't think he was too overly concerned about the longevity of his scheme.
As long as it lasted long enough to buy him a cushy lifestyle, that was long enough for him.
Edited by waysiderLink to comment
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mstar1
Im not complaining or carrying around any anger about it--just answering the question. I think 1.5 mil is a fairly accurate assessment. To me its just $--I could be better off but I fine and arent cryin about it..... Im certainly glad that I didnt have to "pay" what others paid --with life and limb or serious abuse..
Ham is right. It is/was an extremely shortsighted organization. I gave alot of what I had but due to their system when I was in, I never had much. If they had encouraged personal development or had even a minute amount of graciousness ( yea right) people may have stuck around for much longer or until their retirement years when they'd have some real money to give to an organization
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Ham
yep.. and I would go further.. he would have had the "hippies" in airports and bus stations selling flowers.. except for the embarassment that would ensue. Likely they would have done it.. Instead.. he brought them to hq, and had them try out a business suit and briefcase..
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