Being part of the mass exodus in 86, I'm far removed from attempting to validate my beliefs, or those things previously taught, I no longer believe. For those, recently leaving the ministry, well, I suppose they will go through many of the same grueling hours, questioning, how they ever came to the place they are, today.
Each and every one of us, have a path to follow, guided by God. I've placed my trust in that certain truth.
For myself, I believe each individual has their fellowship with God. He will continue to teach and enlighten each one of us.
Debating what we believe and no longer believe and using scripture to make our point, seems futile.
Lemme think a minute (I'm kinda brain dead right now...having spent the better part of today running my head through buzz saws...hehehehe)...
If you don't work, you don't eat.
Taking care of one another is second only to loving God.
Fulfilling the Law is the same thing as doing away with the Law.
If you really believe something, it will happen.
SIT is the proof of being born again.
OK...these are probably too easy...but that's my list.
Now, can you guess if I learned each one from the bible or from twi?
Just do a list (by going up to the upper right hand corner over where you type in your reply and click on the thing that has 1___ 2___ 3___ and the program will guide you through doing a list) and put your guess for each item next to its corresponding number.
Being part of the mass exodus in 86, I'm far removed from attempting to validate my beliefs, or those things previously taught, I no longer believe. For those, recently leaving the ministry, well, I suppose they will go through many of the same grueling hours, questioning, how they ever came to the place they are, today.
Each and every one of us, have a path to follow, guided by God. I've placed my trust in that certain truth.
For myself, I believe each individual has their fellowship with God. He will continue to teach and enlighten each one of us.
Debating what we believe and no longer believe and using scripture to make our point, seems futile.
This isn't a debate. This is a game...for fun...tyvm...
Welcome mkeon, J....sounds like you have a pretty good handle on things.
The only thing that I would take issue with in your post is that simply because you personally find something to be futile, it doesn`t necessarily mean that there isn`t significant benefit for another.
Sometimes it is important for some of us to evalute what we believe in light of where we learned it as to it`s validity.
Some times when one has been deeply hurt by a self proclaimed representative of God through the mishandling and misapplying of scriptures...it becomes necessary to dissect our belief systems in order to not feel very angry and betrayed by God.
Sometimes when we continue to asssume that something is *truth* without question....it can still have adverse consequences in our lives.
Anyway, some reasons why a topic of this type would be found of interest to people.
A represenative of God's Word? Mishandling of God's word?...I plead guilty. I suppose I can't say every single one of us laid claim to being God's representative.
All of us were stewing in the same pot. None less guilty than the other in the mishandling of God's Word.
Individually, I bear the same responsibility as any in leadership positions in The Way.
Individually, God will work with each one of us.
One thing I'm certain, I've yet to ever meet a group of people having more passion for God, than people in the Way Ministry. That passion, directed to the intimate fellowship with the Father, yields greater truths than attempting to validate what we believe to be true. After all these years, I find myself saying, " Wow, I just don't know." Then, I ask God to direct my path, show me. Each one of us, will recieve our answers to truth as God reveals them to us. For me, it's God and me, no one else can show me.
One thing I'm certain, I've yet to ever meet a group of people having more passion for God, than people in the Way Ministry.
OK...my guess is that you learned this one via twi, not via the bible.
(As a side note...it would be helpful if you would pay attention to what people post concerning topics/purposes of threads...and look around to see if there are threads with discussions already going concerning what you want to talk about. Not chewing you out...just noticed that a couple of times or so it seems like your posts were for another thread.)
I know it's your first day...that's why I was nice about it.
Anybody around here can tell you that I'm not too worried about my threads getting off topic...I just like to mess with people about it. (Yes...I have a different sense of humor.) And I do try to herd people back on topic if the off topic subject/feel of posts gets too far gone.
Anyway...
The one thing I always hope whenever I start a topic is that we can think outside of our regular box. Open discussion is one of the best ways to accomplish that...so you're not really off topic with me...unless, of course, well...I can't think of anything right now...but those who know me will tell you I'll think of something sooner or later. LOL
And oh...
You are doing pretty good! See you tonight in chat? (I tend to prefer Flash Chat...but if most people are in Live Chat I'll pop in there awhile until more people are in Flash Chat...and I forget I have to log out of Live Chat...so I may appear to be there but not really be there...)
One thing I'm certain, I've yet to ever meet a group of people having more passion for God, than people in the Way Ministry.
Hello.
I recommend getting out a bit more.
When I was in college, I ran into a number of zealots all connected
with their various groups, all "having a passion for God."
I considered them all deficient in knowledge, but, if anything,
they had more passion.
That passion, directed to the intimate fellowship with the Father, yields greater truths than attempting to validate what we believe to be true.
Asking God and seeking intimacy with Him, I'd agree, yields better
results than just trying an intellectual approach.
I disagree that emotion has to be "directed" for that.
After all these years, I find myself saying, " Wow, I just don't know." Then, I ask God to direct my path, show me. Each one of us, will recieve our answers to truth as God reveals them to us. For me, it's God and me, no one else can show me.
Wow, is everything I say going to be disected, picked apart, analyzed and critiqued?...better get out my lexicon, dictionary, concordance...and my kevlar vest
Wow, is everything I say going to be disected, picked apart, analyzed and critiqued?...better get out my lexicon, dictionary, concordance...and my kevlar vest
Yeah...pretty much...until we get used to ya or you say something else. Hehehehe.
I think maybe it's because we didn't get to do such a thing in twi...
Seems like an issue of everyone being "right" here. Familiar territory for those from The Way
I don't remember saying anything about young or old people. I loved the passion for God I witnessed from those I met, in The Way, young and old. It was a generalized statement. I've met others, outside of The Way, with that same passion. I've never been connected with another large group of people since. So, I can't comment on having another experiece as when I associated with TWI. It was just a simple statement.
I've never participated in any message boards. I found this forum yesterday. I thought it might be a great place to meet up with old friends.
I have no interest in debating fact or fiction.
That's fine, then don't (if you don't want to)... there are others here that hold that same view/position... but that doesn't necessarily mean that what you post won't be responded to, dissected or acknowledged... that's just the way it works here maybe moreso than other places because, you see, we were all in a cult. One that has affected each of us in different ways and one that each of us still carry around some sort of baggage from our time there (some small little waist pouches-some large trunks with wheels).
So have some fun (or not) and enjoy yourself (or not). Get out of it or put into it whatever you choose.
BTW... are you by any chance related to any other posters that come to this board?
Gosh, CW! I can't do it. I did spend a couple of years investigating mainstream churches, but nothing really stuck. All my Bible background was TWI. I was raised RC, but left the RC church at 18 or so.
Things I learned of value prior to TWI were pretty much from my family and not tied to Bibe verses, though they may well be in there.
Anyway, two lists.
Clutter on the top of your fridge brings devil spirits into your home
A leader's suggestion is tanatamount to a command
Small children under age three need to be spanked alot to teach them instant obedience
Lack of abundant sharing can make your kids get sick
Don't make a mess and leave it for others to clean.
CW: I had a sociology prof who would try to manipulate class discussion. For instance,she would start talking about homosexuality and then become pushy about getting input from us students. And...NOBODY said anything. So she accuses us of being docile and reluctantly moves on to the next topic.
The reason nobody took the bait, er..I mean...the reason nobody said anything is because she made it obvious that anybody who offered an opinion she disagreed with was walking into an ambush. Same on this thread. Sorry, but you need to be a bit more subtle, I guess.
CW: I had a sociology prof who would try to manipulate class discussion. For instance,she would start talking about homosexuality and then become pushy about getting input from us students. And...NOBODY said anything. So she accuses us of being docile and reluctantly moves on to the next topic.
The reason nobody took the bait, er..I mean...the reason nobody said anything is because she made it obvious that anybody who offered an opinion she disagreed with was walking into an ambush. Same on this thread. Sorry, but you need to be a bit more subtle, I guess.
True.
It has been this way since even the previous Greasespot cafe back on Ez-boards. Begin discussing doctrine and soon you do get ambushed.
The reason nobody took the bait, er..I mean...the reason nobody said anything is because she made it obvious that anybody who offered an opinion she disagreed with was walking into an ambush.
Really???
gee that must be why everything I posted I learned in TWI
I think the only ambushing going on around here is the people crying ambush to derail the thread
Please explain. If you think I did this to ambush, I'd like to know that I'm doing such a thing...because I really don't know that I am doing such a thing.
My purpose for starting this thread is clearly stated in my first post. I specifically and clearly said, "Without getting into long, sideways arguments like buzz saws about moats and beams n things..." And I have not gotten into such arguments and things in this thread.
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Belle
Not sure I get it. Can you give us an example?
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mckeanj
Being part of the mass exodus in 86, I'm far removed from attempting to validate my beliefs, or those things previously taught, I no longer believe. For those, recently leaving the ministry, well, I suppose they will go through many of the same grueling hours, questioning, how they ever came to the place they are, today.
Each and every one of us, have a path to follow, guided by God. I've placed my trust in that certain truth.
For myself, I believe each individual has their fellowship with God. He will continue to teach and enlighten each one of us.
Debating what we believe and no longer believe and using scripture to make our point, seems futile.
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CoolWaters
I knew somebody was gonna make me go first...
Sigh...
OK...
Lemme think a minute (I'm kinda brain dead right now...having spent the better part of today running my head through buzz saws...hehehehe)...
OK...these are probably too easy...but that's my list.
Now, can you guess if I learned each one from the bible or from twi?
Just do a list (by going up to the upper right hand corner over where you type in your reply and click on the thing that has 1___ 2___ 3___ and the program will guide you through doing a list) and put your guess for each item next to its corresponding number.
This isn't a debate. This is a game...for fun...tyvm...
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rascal
Welcome mkeon, J....sounds like you have a pretty good handle on things.
The only thing that I would take issue with in your post is that simply because you personally find something to be futile, it doesn`t necessarily mean that there isn`t significant benefit for another.
Sometimes it is important for some of us to evalute what we believe in light of where we learned it as to it`s validity.
Some times when one has been deeply hurt by a self proclaimed representative of God through the mishandling and misapplying of scriptures...it becomes necessary to dissect our belief systems in order to not feel very angry and betrayed by God.
Sometimes when we continue to asssume that something is *truth* without question....it can still have adverse consequences in our lives.
Anyway, some reasons why a topic of this type would be found of interest to people.
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mckeanj
A represenative of God's Word? Mishandling of God's word?...I plead guilty. I suppose I can't say every single one of us laid claim to being God's representative.
All of us were stewing in the same pot. None less guilty than the other in the mishandling of God's Word.
Individually, I bear the same responsibility as any in leadership positions in The Way.
Individually, God will work with each one of us.
One thing I'm certain, I've yet to ever meet a group of people having more passion for God, than people in the Way Ministry. That passion, directed to the intimate fellowship with the Father, yields greater truths than attempting to validate what we believe to be true. After all these years, I find myself saying, " Wow, I just don't know." Then, I ask God to direct my path, show me. Each one of us, will recieve our answers to truth as God reveals them to us. For me, it's God and me, no one else can show me.
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CoolWaters
OK...my guess is that you learned this one via twi, not via the bible.
(As a side note...it would be helpful if you would pay attention to what people post concerning topics/purposes of threads...and look around to see if there are threads with discussions already going concerning what you want to talk about. Not chewing you out...just noticed that a couple of times or so it seems like your posts were for another thread.)
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mckeanj
Hey, this is my first day. For someone as computer stoopid as I am, I think I'm doing pretty darned good.
Live Chat is more up my alley. Attempting to find my way around this maze, is almost more than I fathom.
More than anything I'm hoping to chat, meet up with old friends, I used to know.
Anyway,I'll do my best to stay on topic.
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CoolWaters
I know it's your first day...that's why I was nice about it.
Anybody around here can tell you that I'm not too worried about my threads getting off topic...I just like to mess with people about it. (Yes...I have a different sense of humor.) And I do try to herd people back on topic if the off topic subject/feel of posts gets too far gone.
Anyway...
The one thing I always hope whenever I start a topic is that we can think outside of our regular box. Open discussion is one of the best ways to accomplish that...so you're not really off topic with me...unless, of course, well...I can't think of anything right now...but those who know me will tell you I'll think of something sooner or later. LOL
And oh...
You are doing pretty good! See you tonight in chat? (I tend to prefer Flash Chat...but if most people are in Live Chat I'll pop in there awhile until more people are in Flash Chat...and I forget I have to log out of Live Chat...so I may appear to be there but not really be there...)
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WordWolf
Hello.
I recommend getting out a bit more.
When I was in college, I ran into a number of zealots all connected
with their various groups, all "having a passion for God."
I considered them all deficient in knowledge, but, if anything,
they had more passion.
Asking God and seeking intimacy with Him, I'd agree, yields betterresults than just trying an intellectual approach.
I disagree that emotion has to be "directed" for that.
I'd agree with all this.
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mckeanj
Wow, is everything I say going to be disected, picked apart, analyzed and critiqued?...better get out my lexicon, dictionary, concordance...and my kevlar vest
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CoolWaters
Yeah...pretty much...until we get used to ya or you say something else. Hehehehe.
I think maybe it's because we didn't get to do such a thing in twi...
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WordWolf
Depends on what you say, the time availability of the posters,
and what mood they're in when you're posting.
That's the same all over cyberspace, actually.
If you're new in cyberspace, I'd direct you HERE.
What prompted me to reply, actually was the assertion that
the young folks who joined twi had the MOST passion for God of all the people
out there.
In reality, those who joined during the Jesus People movement were recruited
out of a BUNCH of young people with a zeal for God. Other groups saw them
join, as well. Further, young people in GENERAL can seem very excitable regarding
the things of God. Just take a look at ANY group of Christians where young people
are present. I've seen a number, and ALL of them had kids with
"a passion for God". You can walk into any of them locally, or- heck, it's the
information age- you can check online even, and not even leave your chair.
But I did agree with about 1/2 what you said,
you didn't like that?
Disagreement is not only ALLOWED here, but EXPECTED.
Compared to the old "thinking is forbidden" twi, I consider this an improvement.
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mckeanj
Seems like an issue of everyone being "right" here. Familiar territory for those from The Way
I don't remember saying anything about young or old people. I loved the passion for God I witnessed from those I met, in The Way, young and old. It was a generalized statement. I've met others, outside of The Way, with that same passion. I've never been connected with another large group of people since. So, I can't comment on having another experiece as when I associated with TWI. It was just a simple statement.
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WordWolf
Actually, a lot of us have learned a lot here over the years.
Some of what was learned was factual, some of it was conceptual, insight
or ideological.
Have you been participating in messageboards elsewhere where people
had zero interest in either being factual, correct, or "right" in some way?
I've been on a number of boards, and-so far-that's been true of none
of them.
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mckeanj
I've never participated in any message boards. I found this forum yesterday. I thought it might be a great place to meet up with old friends.
I have no interest in debating fact or fiction.
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Tom Strange
That's fine, then don't (if you don't want to)... there are others here that hold that same view/position... but that doesn't necessarily mean that what you post won't be responded to, dissected or acknowledged... that's just the way it works here maybe moreso than other places because, you see, we were all in a cult. One that has affected each of us in different ways and one that each of us still carry around some sort of baggage from our time there (some small little waist pouches-some large trunks with wheels).
So have some fun (or not) and enjoy yourself (or not). Get out of it or put into it whatever you choose.
BTW... are you by any chance related to any other posters that come to this board?
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mckeanj
Maybe a kissing cousin or two on here. I'm new so, I've yet to meet up with them. Possibly, you could direct me to them
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templelady
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Bramble
Gosh, CW! I can't do it. I did spend a couple of years investigating mainstream churches, but nothing really stuck. All my Bible background was TWI. I was raised RC, but left the RC church at 18 or so.
Things I learned of value prior to TWI were pretty much from my family and not tied to Bibe verses, though they may well be in there.
Anyway, two lists.
Clutter on the top of your fridge brings devil spirits into your home
A leader's suggestion is tanatamount to a command
Small children under age three need to be spanked alot to teach them instant obedience
Lack of abundant sharing can make your kids get sick
Don't make a mess and leave it for others to clean.
Don't lie.
Work hard.
Take care of each other.
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Galen
"Walking is a process of falling and catching yourself before your nose hits the ground."
"Your secure when not moving, but your growing when you move out. You may make mistakes, but God will catch you."
"God conferred to man, man transferred to Satan"
The Bible interprets itself:
1. In the verse,
a. where it is written,
b. or must be interpreted by it's Biblical usage,
c. must be in harmony with that verse, and all other scripture relating to that subject.
d. Scripture build-up
2. In the context
a. just keep reading.
3. Used before.
Biblical truths we must adhere to:
1. Get to whom correct,
2. A difficult verse must be understood in light of the clear verses,
3. Application is always with respect to whom it is written to.
Seven steps to Biblical accuracy:
1. each individual word must be understood,
2. each word must fit together in the verse,
3. the verse must fit with the immediate context,
4. the immediate context must fit within the remote context,
5. the context must be understood is light of to whom it is written,
6. as well as Orientalism, customs, and mannerisms.
7. and all known 'figures of speech'.
The Old Testament is not "addressed to us", but it is "for our learning".
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johniam
CW: I had a sociology prof who would try to manipulate class discussion. For instance,she would start talking about homosexuality and then become pushy about getting input from us students. And...NOBODY said anything. So she accuses us of being docile and reluctantly moves on to the next topic.
The reason nobody took the bait, er..I mean...the reason nobody said anything is because she made it obvious that anybody who offered an opinion she disagreed with was walking into an ambush. Same on this thread. Sorry, but you need to be a bit more subtle, I guess.
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Galen
True.
It has been this way since even the previous Greasespot cafe back on Ez-boards. Begin discussing doctrine and soon you do get ambushed.
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templelady
Really???
gee that must be why everything I posted I learned in TWI
I think the only ambushing going on around here is the people crying ambush to derail the thread
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CoolWaters
Hmmm...ambush...from me?
Please explain. If you think I did this to ambush, I'd like to know that I'm doing such a thing...because I really don't know that I am doing such a thing.
My purpose for starting this thread is clearly stated in my first post. I specifically and clearly said, "Without getting into long, sideways arguments like buzz saws about moats and beams n things..." And I have not gotten into such arguments and things in this thread.
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