hampshire73

I checked "Other" for why I left, but I thought about checking "Voluntarily - bored." I ended up with "Other" because "bored" didn't really express how I felt. I was depressed and exhausted. My then-husband and I were going through some marital and financial problems, and we were expecting our second child. One night we just decided to skip twig, just once. The next thing we knew, it had been a long time. This was shortly after we had returned from ROA 86 and I seem to remember something about PoP, but I wasn't paying a whole lot of attention because my own immediate issues were so overwhelming. Anyway, when we realized we had missed a lot of meetings, we tried to go back and our twig wasn't meeting any more. Just about everybody in our area had left TWI. We still saw some of them, but we just didn't talk about TWI. I think the others assumed we knew what was going on, but we didn't. It wasn't until just a few years ago that I found GSC and discovered the rest of the puzzle pieces.

For what I did after leaving TWI, I checked "Didn't do anything for a long time." Eventually, I did most of the things listed. Briefly tried to rejoin, moved out of the area (concurrent with going through a divorce), was seriously depressed, got counseling, tried a different Christian religious organization, raised a couple of wonderful children, went back to school, got a decent job, and life is pretty good now.

I remember being sent (I think our whole branch went) to Maine to go door to door campaigning for Gahagan. It was just for one day. We were told not to let people know we were from out of state. I thought that was pretty ridiculous. It was the first time many of us (myself included) had even been to Maine. What were we supposed to say when people asked where we were from? All I remember about that awfully long day was that I didn't feel well. My stomach was upset. I handed out the literature and tried to avoid answering questions because I didn't want to lie to anyone.

I still don't like politics.

my favorite hitching times.

my destination was Bluefield WV. from some place near to Princeton.

It was a rather long route.

I'm standing on route.. whatever it was.

Tht school van/bus passed.

then I got ride about seven or so miles..

I am standing at the road. The bus passes again.. no problem for the bus. It goes on its way..

so I get a ride for about 7 miles or so.

then.. the bus. and I converge at the third spot..

the driver.. is awe-stricken.

"are you Jesus?"

LOL, Ham!

What really caught my eye was your mention of Bluefield and Princeton. I was in both just a couple of weeks ago, for the funeral of the last relative I had in that area. Small world!

Hi, Socks!

I haven't been here for a while, but I'm so glad the Cafe is still open! I don't mind admitting that I am a Christian. I was Lutheran before TWI, and eventually became Episcopalian after TWI.

Mstar, I'm sorry to hear about your experience of being thrown out of a church for having been in TWI. I was working as office manager for a non-denominational church several years ago, and I got into a discussion with the pastor one day about cults. I was kind of surprised to find out that he knew of TWI and felt that it was a dangerous cult. This was before I knew what I know now about the bad things that had happened. (I had simply drifted away around 1986 and had no idea until I found GSC that there had been a mass exodus, M & A's, sexual abuse, plagiarism, etc.) My personal experience had mostly been good, and I shared that with him. He was as surprised by my positive attitude about it as I was about his negative attitude. We had a good discussion that day, never brought up the subject again, and I was not asked to leave or made to feel unwelcome in any way. After reading about your experience, I realize that mine is probably not typical.

Anyway, I accept Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior, and I believe that makes me Christian.

Although I haven't spent a lot of time on here after my first few weeks of involvement, I will be sad to see the Greasespot Cafe close. I stumbled across it by chance years after leaving TWI and not knowing a lot about what happened. Being able to visit the forums has been both eye-opening and healing for me, and I'll always be grateful for that.

A couple of people have mentioned a Facebook GSC page. I'll have to look into that.

Pawtucket, thanks for everything! I hope we'll be able to keep in touch.

And then someone got the idea to ratchet up this marvelous time waster [maybe from the same article…dunno…it's been so long ago] – it escalated into "revelation witnessing". Incredible! Now we had even more pressure...pretend like we're water dowsing for dummies [hey, everything after its own kind - it's in the Class fool!] . A bunch of us would circle up, close our eyes and quietly speak in puns to ourselves – and then one of the guys in my group [Jack] said "I see a man wearing a belt buckle with the name Bill on it". Odd – that night Jack [or the rest of us] never did run into anyone named Bill or wearing a belt buckle with the name Bill on it. But I bet he was nearby! To use a Get Smart line – "missed it by that much".

Wow! I don't remember "revelation witnessing" -- I wonder if that was after my time. I haven't read this whole thread yet, and in fact, I started at the end and have been reading the posts in reverse order, but when I saw this, T-Bone, I just had to jump in and say something...

I remember "going witnessing" with the twig, and later with my WOW family, and I was always uncomfortable with the way we did it -- it was so contrived. A friend of mine from college used to call it "witlessing." So many times when I was in a mall or going door-to-door, I couldn't think of anything to say except to invite people to twig and try to explain what that was. I felt like a fraud even though I was trying to do what I thought was right.

The only positive experiences I had with witnessing were when I just went about my life, trying to serve God, caring about people, and just generally trying to be a good person. Sometimes, there would be a natural opening in the conversation, that is, the other person would say or ask something that related to God, the Bible, or some aspect of life that I understood to be connected with spirituality. When that happened, I would say a quick silent prayer for the right thing to say, and then say what I thought or felt. It didn't always involve a direct mention of TWI or PFAL, but it always glorified God. And of course, this was not "forced 'witnessing'" but the real thing, IMO. It doesn't happen just because leadership schedules it!

Depends, if we are talking ice cream.... chocolate moose tracks :)

Yes!! :D I chose chocolate because that's my basic favorite, but I discovered moose tracks about a year ago, and now when I get ice cream, that's what I get. Kroger has one called "extreme moose tracks," which is extra rich chocolate ice cream with the moose tracks -- heavenly! Food Lion has chocolate moose tracks, which I get sometimes, but the chocolate ice cream in it is not as good as the "extreme."

I feel like running out now to get some!

But I probably won't because I'm trying to lose weight. :(

I find the correlation between college age, chocolate and my choice interesting.

Me, too! I was looking at the shape of the frequency distributions. Looks like most of the people who have answered this poll so far have the same answers that I have.

I'm on Facebook and I like it. I went back to graduate school when my youngest child went off to college. In my second year at Virginia Tech, I was in a class on campus when a young man shot a lot of people and then himself. My children urged me to get on Facebook so they could keep tabs on me better. Of course, I get to keep tabs on them better too!

Since then, I have added as friends several relatives (most of my college-age nieces and cousins), and lately, some folks I went to high school with (35+ years ago) and even a few former wayfers. I have a pretty busy life and don't spend a lot of time on it, and I either decline or ignore invitations to add applications that appear to me to threaten my privacy. But overall, I have found it a good way to keep in touch with people who are geographically far away. I can see how it would be a problem if you posted too personal information or accepted as friends people you don't really know.

Thanks, Dot! I'll look there.

I'd like to find a friend, Fran Luby, that I haven't seen or talked to since around 1980, I think. We went to the same college back in the 70s and I've made several attempts to find her through the alumni directory over the years. She was originally from Connecticut, we met in college in Massachusetts, and I think she went into the Way Corps at some point. I have no idea what her last name might be now, or whether she is in or out.

I want to echo thanks to Kristen and Pawtucket for speaking about this. It takes bravery to deal with experiences like this, and even more to go public.

The Way International and Victor Paul Wierwille published in 1979 by The Moody Bible Institute of Chicago, written by J.L. Williams, ISBN 0-8024-9233-9. It's a little paperback of 159 pages including cult info references, notes, bibliography etc. I first found it in a used bookstore in Fort Wayne, Indiana in 1986. It helped me get out of The Way and understand some major issues, and although some of the theological points discussed are not ones I necessarily agreed with, the writer helped open my eyes to some things.

penworks, I find it ironic that VPW used to proudly point out Rhoda's qualifications because she went to Moody Bible Institute.

One thing I'll say, my Sundays were a lot less stressful after I jumped ship:) On something totally different, I'm glad that I took the Foundational class, because I got to keep the red binder. People who never heard of TWI don't believe me until I show it that book. Their reactions are a real hoot! Zey may hav von der battle, but I got der book! Ha!

The binder's red now? :o Back when I took the Foundational Class, it was white with green print.

I don't know. I don't have cable or satellite or any of that because I only watch one show (Numb3rs) and I don't even catch that every week. But I do remember years ago when cable first became an option, they were calling it "pay TV" and the point of it was that commercials would not dominate the programming. The viewers are already paying directly for the privilege of watching, so there would be no need to get companies to sponsor programs. The closest thing I've seen to this actually working this way is in public television, where once or twice a year they have a telethon and you send in a donation to help pay for the programs you enjoy watching.

I guess it comes down to the lure of money. Cable companies probably don't want to turn down money offered to them by these entities, who must now be directly purchasing airtime instead of "sponsoring" actual programming. Maybe the cable company puts these paid things on at times when they think most people aren't watching, and they keep the actual programming on what they consider "prime time." That cuts down on the number of people who might complain about it.

The church I most recently (and not all that recently, cause it freaked me out) had these guys who would always get up and hang around the edge of the room when the pastor or his wife would pray... couldn't figure out what they were for.... them and the ladies who would get up at the same time holding blankets.

Turns out they were the catchers for the people who would be slain in the spirit... Blankets were so they wouldn't get cold in the spirit, I guess.

A relative of mine was pastor of a church that sounds like that. I heard that the blankets were to cover women who were slain in the spirit so men couldn't look up their dresses. They also would cover you up when you were sitting down if they thought your skirt was too short. I never attended his church, but that's what I was told.

Here's the Wiki entry:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caminito_del_Rey

George, thanks for the link with the answers. I'm not surprised that people have died walking on that thing in its deteriorated state.

David, do you think TWI knew about this place? I wonder if they would have taken LEAD groups there if they had known about it... You know, a real challenge to believe God... <_<

I think my blood pressure went up watching that.

RR, I'm wondering too who put that walkway up and how did they do it?

I want to thank you all for your input. Sadly, as several of you have pointed out, it was probably because that was money that would not be going into ABS. (Just another instance of TWI telling people how to spend their money.)

But if it's not a matter of overindulgence or addiction, I can't see the harm in it. Obviously, it would be very bad if someone gambled with money that was needed for necessities for their family, and the same goes for spending it on any other obsession such as drugs, alcohol, or even overeating. (Or more shoes and clothes than you can wear...)

But the act of gambling itself does not seem to be addressed in the Bible, which according to VPW, was to be "our only rule of faith and practice," while other things that he indulged in are addressed very clearly.

One more observation -- I once met a believer (back in the 70s) who told me he was a professional gambler. He said that he had earned $20,000 the previous year (which was a very nice income at the time), but it had cost him $100,000 to net the $20,000. He was upset that the IRS would not accept his business expenses (bets placed or lottery tickets purchased) and expected him to pay tax on the full amount.

Yes, I do read and study the Bible on my own. This is not the reason why we are considering finding a church in the area... Our reasons are more about finding a group of people who we can spend time with in person who also love God and ascribe to the same basic belief system that we do.

Also, we are looking forward to starting a family one day. Since both of us were involved in some sort of religious upbringing we would like to have our child be a part of a church growing up as well. Some of my best memories as a small child were when we would visit my grandmother and I would get to go to Sunday School at her church (I was raised in twi for the most part... but before my family got involved, we went to a normal church.)

So, the whole studying the Bible part doesn't really fit for me personally... I know that is why a lot of people go to church, (and it was the reason why I stayed with twi as long as I did) but it is not the reason I am looking now.... Hope that makes sense...

JJ, those were the reasons I started looking for a church back then, so it makes perfect sense to me. At that time, I already had children and I wanted them to experience being part of a fellowship of believers (aka, church) when they were growing up. Besides, I needed other Christians to interact with.

The denomination I joined is the Episcopal Church. (I've mentioned it in the other thread.) I've found it to be diverse and welcoming, and there are no doors closed to me as a woman. That is not the case in the non-denominational church I mentioned in an earlier post. Watered Garden, I know what you mean!

I'm not in your area of the country, but in view of some of the other posts, I feel I can make a suggestion.

I was raised Lutheran and I was married to a man who was raised RC. Together, we joined the Episcopal Church. He's long gone, but I'm still in it and I like it. As was suggested in another thread, visit a lot of churches, ask a lot of questions, and you'll find one that's right for you.

Happy shopping!

The basic thing i got from twi was that gambling is wrong because there is no increase. in order to 'win' at gambling, the other must lose. i have found that this increases selfishness. i believe our Godly nature is to care about others, seek to help and increase others, but gambling exercises selfishness, where a person practices not caring about others, caring only for their own 'win' (which i believe is a true loss).

Thanks for posting, Kit. I can understand it from the point of view of selfishness, but it still bothers me that so much emphasis was put on the evils of gambling, which is not mentioned specifically in the Bible, yet other things that were very selfish and hurtful that are specifically mentioned were being practiced by the person who was supposed to be our father in the Word.

Isn't it possible to play an occasional game just for fun? Where do we draw the line between harmless fun and gambling? A penny a point seems to me to be more of a way of keeping score in the game than what I think of as gambling. However, if a person indulges in playing excessively (like several hours a day, several days a week), I can see that those pennies would add up to a substantial sum and the time commitment would be sufficient to take the person away from important things like caring relationships, etc. Doesn't the Bible say "all things in moderation"?

I'm thinking about what you said about the lack of increase. I had forgotten, but I remember hearing that sometime back in the 70s. (Thanks for reminding me.) But as I think about it, is that really an explanation? Even when we exchange our labor for a paycheck, there is no increase in the amount of money in existence -- it is just shifted from one party to another. If we factor in the element of uncertainty, well, I've had the unfortunate experience of working for a company that eventually went under. Sometimes my paychecks bounced. I know there's a difference between that and gambling, but the distinction is starting to blur for me.

Anyway, it sounds like you're doing a good thing in the casino.

I didn't go to church right away after leaving TWI, but I still read the Bible on my own and tried to instill basic Christian values in my children. We visited a couple of churches with non-TWI friends, but I didn't start really looking for a church to join until 1991, about 5 years after leaving TWI. I had a list of churches that I wanted to check out, and I started with the one across the street. I immediately felt at home. It was not the same denomination I was raised in but the service was very similar, and the people were friendly. Some of them reminded me of people I'd known in my childhood church.

What really got me to go there the second time, though, was that the minister came to visit me after my first visit. We talked about doctrine, including the trinity. I was so used to being berated by non-TWI Christians about that issue, but he didn't do that. He told me that he believed in the trinity, but he knew it wasn't spelled out in the Bible, and therefore I was not required to accept it. I still intended to check out the other churches on my list, but around that time, I met my second husband who just happened to be planning to visit that church because a friend of his had told him about it. The rest is history.

After a few years, we moved to another state and stayed with the same denomination, although I worked for a couple of years at a non-denominational church in the area. I have felt welcome and respected at both places, but the non-denominational church is more into requiring members to adhere to the pastor's interpretation of the scriptures. Most of the time I agree with him, but sometimes I don't. I find that I'm more comfortable with being a member of the denominational church and visiting the non-denominational one occasionally.

Also, I agree with what Watered Garden said. Although I didn't end up visiting a LOT of churches before deciding on one, I did read all the information about the denomination's doctrine and I talked with the minister about all kinds of issues before becoming a member.

What was he thinking? That can't have been comfortable.

:lol:

I don't watch much TV. Maybe I would if there were shows like these.

Then again, maybe not. When I do watch TV, I tend to stay away from reality shows.

RottieGrrrl, thanks for posting this. I liked the picture of you and Nico.

I had a large black & white mixed breed dog who was very sweet, got along with everyone including cats, but he passed away in January. I really miss Rolly, especially when I go for walks.

I have a good friend who has a Labrador retriever and a chihuahua. Of the two, the Lab is the friendlier one. But she has a collection of designer bags to carry her chihuahua around in. "It takes all kinds to make a world..."