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  2. TLC

    Wikipedia

    LOL... that link won't last long there.
  3. TLC

    Dispensationalism

    What difference does it make to the topic of dispensationalism? (None whatsoever, as far as I can tell.) In fact, it doesn't appear to me to make much difference most anywhere else either. However, this: ...is another matter altogether. What criteria do you suppose anyone is going to use to think or say what is "profitable writings"? Although, the wealth gospel teachers (and there's a bunch of them nowadays) would surely love that particular translation, and would undoubtedly have a field day with it.
  4. BlueCord

    Wikipedia

    The Way International is a nontrinitarian cult based in New Knoxville, Ohio, with home fellowships located internationally, including Argentina, the Democratic Republic of Congo, Chile, and the UK.[4] Also, try clicking on the link to the homepage.
  5. Mark Sanguinetti

    End times viewpoints

    If we are currently in this long period of time, stated as 1000 years where the devil and his deception has been put in prison. Why would we have wars in these centuries? For example, World War 1 and World War 2. There has also been other dividing and hateful things in the last few centuries. As another example, today in the USA we have legalized bribery of politicians, where the donors want a return on their investment. The bible has a number of verses that are against bribery. With Jesus Christ reigning he would be for the majority of people and for all people. Jesus Christ, is very loving to people. Yes, with much figurative language there is a lessening of knowledge with added complexity. The word of God needs to be simplified to overcome this. You mention one verse, Matthew 24:34 mixed in with a many verse teaching of Jesus Christ covering chapters 23, 24 and 25. In order to understand this one verse the other verses need to be read and analyzed.
  6. Today
  7. JayDee

    Wikipedia

    Seems pretty detailed
  8. BlueCord

    Wikipedia

    I read that someone had "scrubbed" TWI's wiki page. Y'all should take a look at it now.
  9. TLC

    Can salvation be lost?

    Okay, let's see if I have this right. You don't think that salvation is the result of righteousness, you think that righteousness is the result of salvation. And, if salvation can be (or is) is a state of flux (i.e., if salvation can be lost), then righteousness comes or goes right along with it. So, if you think (as you said) that righteousness implies how we live... hmmm.... (thinking...) Well, shoot. Who ever sees themselves righteous all the time? And when that "not righteous" view strikes... better get myself saved (again.) Am I missing something from your perspective on this?
  10. Raf

    Dispensationalism

    At the time of the post you are citing, this forum was in About the Way. As such, The Way's teaching on II Timothy 3:16 may have been relevant to the conversation, even if it is not relevant to the actual truth of the subject. I agree with you: just because Wierwille said it, doesn't make it so.
  11. TrustAndObey

    Dispensationalism

    I'm not so certain I really favor that "translation"... I think it could be understood a couple other ways... According to "Elliot's Commentaary" it reads: Thus, the emphasis, and the point is not as to marking what is "theopneustos", but that whatever is "theopneustos" has a purpose.. The question of what is "theopneustos" is still left open. Another view from Greek, is that there are 2 things noted.. Both are types of "writings" - (graphe), as in "Every God inspired and profitable writings are for doctrine, for reproof, ....." Again, nothing is being labelled as "theopneustos", but whatever is, along with "other" profitable" writings are once again for a reason...
  12. Infoabsorption

    End times viewpoints

    I once believed in the literal view that the millennium mentioned in Rev. is a literal 1000 years and that Christs reign won't begin until he comes down to earth for a literal 1000 years period of time in the new Jerusalem. (By the way, if the new Jerusalem is literal and here on earth the dimensions of it would reach into outer space.) An example of 1000 being used symbolically is Psalm 50:10 For every beast of the forest is mine, and the cattle upon a thousand hills.I see the symbolic 1000 years as in-progress. Christ is now reigning from his heavenly throne with the saints who took possession of the kingdom of heaven at the 70AD resurrection(Daniel 7:22). Everybody knows that Revelation is full of symbolic imagery but then to take certain verses literally(such as the 1000 years) will throw off the original meaning in my opinion. Satan being bound is probably not to be taken literally as well. I believe that it is referring to Satan's dominion over the gentile pagan nations. We get a picture of that dominion being transferred to Christ in Daniel 7:13-14. Israel in the old covenant days was set apart and a light to the deceived pagan gentile nations. After the 70AD destruction of Israel,(Daniel 9:26) the torch light so to speak was transferred to the gentiles in the new covenant. Not that there is no deception whatsoever in the world but Satan no longer holds reign over the gentile nations as he had pre-70AD. Looking at history, Christianity has spread worldwide since 70AD. That doesn't mean there will never be hiccups along the way. I do find it interesting that Israel is now a nation state again. This is speculation but I wonder if we are approaching the time when Satan is released to deceive the gentile nations again at the end of the millennium: http://www.lloyddale.com/papers/A%20Different%20Preterist%20Perspective.pdf My position seems odd to a lot of people but I think it is due to the ultra-literal view of scripture we've been taught since the 1830's. I no longer wrestle with certain scriptures with those nasty little time statements such as Matthew 16:27-28 & James 5:8. I don't have to change the meaning of Greek words such as genea (Matthew 24:34). Certain verses no longer get ignored.
  13. BlueCord

    The Way Biblical Research - New Slogans

    Just take a look, it's in a book... just not the Bible (sung to the Reading Rainbow theme)
  14. BlueCord

    Dianne Maxson

    She was still in when I was on Staff in 2015.
  15. Mark Sanguinetti

    End times viewpoints

    Here is Revelation 20:5 in its context. Revelation 20:1-6 20 Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, having the key to the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. 2 He laid hold of the dragon, that serpent of old, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years; 3 and he cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal on him, so that he should deceive the nations no more till the thousand years were finished. But after these things he must be released for a little while. The Saints Reign with Christ 1000 Years. With this the Devil gets put in prison for 1000 years. Verse 7 calls it prison where the Devil with his demons will be placed during this 1000 year period so that they can not deceive the people of the world. We do have deception now, but my goal is to lessen this deception at least in part. I simply do my best to be truthful during this age which is before the 1000 year reign with Christ on earth. If Jesus Christ literally comes to earth during this 1000 year period and walks and talks I wonder if people will be able to hug him as their friend? 4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years. NKJV
  16. Taxidev

    Can salvation be lost?

    Yes, absolutely. My understanding is when we believe Rom 10:9 we are then righteous, as an instant state of being. However, to maintain righteousness going forward takes effort on our part. I certainly can't live like I used to and think God will look at me as being righteous, that would be ridiculous. But by the same token, as I had noted, He knows we are just humans, far from perfect. So righteousness MUST pertain to our attitude toward life, striving, albeit imperfectly, to live as God would have us live.
  17. Infoabsorption

    End times viewpoints

    Mark, I do believe another resurrection will take place in our future and I agree with you that nobody knows the timing of it. Revelation 20:5 states: " This is the first resurrection". If there is a first resurrection there must be a second. In light of Matthew 16 27-28, Matthew 24:34 states: this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. "Generation" in Matthew 24:34 comes from the Greek "genea". http://biblehub.com/greek/1074.htm If you scroll down to usage # 3, Thayers Greek Lexicon states: the whole multitude of men living at the same time . Scofield was one of the first to try to explain "genea' to mean "race" in his reference bible. Gary Demar's book Last days Madness goes into a great amount of detail explaining this starting on page 183: https://books.google.com/books?id=Tii3ulwqzW0C&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q&f=false
  18. Yesterday
  19. Grace Valerie Claire

    Thirty Years and thirty pieces of silver

    Sky, and OPM!( Other People's Money.)
  20. Grace Valerie Claire

    Thirty Years and thirty pieces of silver

    Way, LMAO!!
  21. skyrider

    The Six Stages of Wierwille's Climb to Power

    Absolutely.........and Amen. Else......we wouldn't have connected all the dots and how wierwille chose to lord over God's heritage RATHER than to lead the faithful TO THE LORD. Thread after thread.......we expose this. Wierwille stole it and ran with it
  22. TLC

    Can salvation be lost?

    What does "it" refer to in your sentence? Righteousness ? (The sentence doesn't actually make much sense to me, so I'm trying to read into it what I think it might mean.) If you're saying that you see righteousness as "our feeble attempt to live as God would have us to live," perhaps it helps illustrate that this is the crux of issue. How (or what) we define (and attain to, or acquire) righteousness casts the basis for our soteriology.
  23. Mark Sanguinetti

    End times viewpoints

    1 Cor 15:20-28 20 But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21 For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. 22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23 But each in his own turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. 24 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. 25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27 For he "has put everything under his feet." Now when it says that "everything" has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. 28 When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all. NIV Acts 1:10-11 10 They were looking intently up into the sky as he was going, when suddenly two men dressed in white stood beside them. 11 "Men of Galilee," they said, "why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven." NIV 1 Thess 4:13-18 13 Brothers, we do not want you to be ignorant about those who fall asleep, or to grieve like the rest of men, who have no hope. 14 We believe that Jesus died and rose again and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in him. 15 According to the Lord's own word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left till the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever. 18 Therefore encourage each other with these words. NIV Have we or anyone that sees, hears and thinks for themselves seen the Lord Jesus come down from heaven with a loud command and the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God? No, this is in the future and we do not know when that will be.
  24. Taxidev

    Can salvation be lost?

    It says in the bible that God knows our frame, that we are not perfect, and that's why He gives us a way out of the messes we get ourselves into. I'm paraphrasing, of course. So I don't see how righteousness could mean moral perfection of any sort. Rather, I see it as our feeble attempt to live as God would have us to live, even though we fall short of it, so that we can end up in heaven. I definitely don't see it as a requirement for being saved (rescued, set free, given a clean slate, bought back) because in Rom 10:9 it says for that we only have to believe, whereas righteousness implies how we live.
  25. TLC

    End times viewpoints

    My "position" (so to speak) is far from weak, and I think you just proved my point. https://www.tms.edu/m/tmsj20d.pdf However, I have no further interest in arguing the issue, nor will I contend with your belief in (and promotion of) preterism (or partial preterism, or whatever else you might care to call it.)
  26. TLC

    Can salvation be lost?

    I recently read (on the Internet, naturally) where righteousness is said to be the "state of moral perfection" that is required by God to enter heaven. And while that might not be the most complete or best definition for it, it doesn't appear to me to be far off. Perhaps if it said that righteousness is the state of moral perfection required for salvation, it'd be right on target. Anybody think otherwise?
  27. Infoabsorption

    End times viewpoints

    If your theological position is weak, phrases like "replacement theology" are used to connote a very negative "feeling" toward an opposing viewpoint so this phrase "replacement theology" sounds anti-Israel or even anti-Semitic. It is your opinion that Amillennialism espouses replacement theology but it is not based on fact. The new covenant is not referring to a physical Israel. Even Paul said that there is " neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus." I am actually pro Israel as a nation state, but they are no different than anybody else spiritually in the new covenant. "What resurrection do these folks think Hymenaeus and Philetus were talking about if not related to the end times?" The "end times" was the end of the Mosaic marriage covenant near 70AD, not the erroneous view that the end times is referring to the end of the church age in our future. Hebrews 1:1-2 states: God, who [a]at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, 2 has in these last days spoken to us by His Son... When was Hebrews written? Paul and the other apostles were in the last days of the old covenant when they wrote the epistles and they knew it. That is why James made this comment in James 5:8: You also be patient. Establish your hearts, for the coming of the Lord [a]is at hand. The phrase "at hand" was used by the King James translators. "At hand" comes from the Greek word " ēngiken ". It literally means "has drawn near" . http://biblehub.com/greek/1448.htm No gray area there. Dispensaionalists have come up with very creative explanations for these time statements. Jesus Christ made a statement about the timing of his coming "in his kingdom" in Matthew 16: 27-28: For the Son of Man is going to come in his Father’s glory with his angels, and then he will reward each person according to what they have done.“Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom.” This statement could not be any clearer. Christ said that some of the disciples would still be living when he comes in his kingdom. Not only that, in verse 27 Christ mentions the "bema" rewards upon entry into heaven. Most Christians don't realize how spiritually significant the events of the end of the old covenant age were. Josephus wrote about a phenomena that occurred in the skies above Judea in 66AD: "O]n the twenty-first day of the month of Artemisius [Jyar], a certain prodigious and incredible phenomenon appeared; I suppose the account of it would seem to be a fable, were it not related by those that saw it, and were not the events that followed it of so considerable a nature as to deserve such signals; for, before sunsetting, chariots and troops of soldiers in their armor were seen running about among the clouds, and surrounding of cities" Josephus Wars 6.5.3 Hymenaeus and Philetus were making those statements about a resurrection sometime between 58-65 AD which was before the destruction of Jerusalem & the temple in 70AD. Daniel 12:2 mentions a resurrection. Daniel is told it would occur when the power of the holy people(Israel) is shattered(Daniel 12:7) That occurred in 70AD. This is NOT a future Israel. Many Christians have a hard time imagining that a resurrection has already occurred. 1 Corinthians 15:22-26 mentions that more than 1 resurrection will occur throughout human history " But each in turn:" The last one will occur in our future at the end of human history which is the great white throne mentioned in Revelation 20 after the millennium(not a literal 1000 years). The resurrection that occurred just before the millennium began near 70AD is when Christ came in his kingdom(some of the disciples were still living) Rev 20:4: And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony about Jesus and because of the word of God. They[a] had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. Paul was beheaded in Rome during the reign of Nero. The insistence of futurists that the events in Revelation are global in scale disregard the meaning of the Greek word "ge". "Ge" is not the same as "kosmos". An example of a global scale from the Bible is Ephesians 1:4: just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world(kosmou) http://biblehub.com/text/ephesians/1-4.htm The Greek word "ge" refers to a region. It also could be translated as "land" which would have been more appropriate than "earth" which is the word that is used in most of Revelation. An example of "ge" translated as "earth" is Revelation 13:11: Then I saw another beast coming up out of the earth(ges), and he had two horns like a lamb and spoke like a dragon. The Greek interlinear of Revelation 13:11 http://biblehub.com/text/revelation/13-11.htm An example of past fulfillment from the Book of Revelation is Rev 6:6: Then I heard what sounded like a voice among the four living creatures, saying, “Two pounds[a] of wheat for a day’s wages,[b] and six pounds[c] of barley for a day’s wages,[d] and do not damage the oil and the wine!” Rev 6:6 is just one example of the conditions within the city of Jerusalem during 70AD siege by the Roman army. This was recorded by Josephus in his book Wars of the Jews book 5, chapter 10 & verse 2: The indication they made use of whether they had any or not was taken from the bodies of these miserable wretches; which, if they were in good case, they supposed they were in no want at all of food; but if they were wasted away, they walked off without searching any further; nor did they think it proper to kill such as these, because they saw they would very soon die of themselves for want of food. Many there were indeed who sold what they had for one measure; it was of wheat, if they were of the richer sort; but of barley, if they were poorer. When these had so done, they shut themselves up in the inmost rooms of their houses, and ate the corn they had gotten; some did it without grinding it, by reason of the extremity of the want they were in, and others baked bread of it, according as necessity and fear dictated to them: a table was no where laid for a distinct meal, but they snatched the bread out of the fire, half-baked, and ate it very hastily. I think it is amazing that both Josephus & John singled out these 2 food items that people had great difficulty obtaining in 70AD. The phrase "do not damage the oil & wine" appears to be a reference to a sacrilegious act by a Zealot faction leader of the revolt named John Levi of Giscala. Josephus records this event in Book 5, chapter 13, verse 6 of Wars: But as for John, when he could no longer plunder the people, he betook himself to sacrilege, and melted down many of the sacred utensils, which had been given to the temple; as also many of those vessels which were necessary for such as ministered about holy things, the caldrons, the dishes, and the tables; nay, he did not abstain from those pouring vessels that were sent them by Augustus and his wife; for the Roman emperors did ever both honor and adorn this temple; whereas this man, who was a Jew, seized upon what were the donations of foreigners, and said to those that were with him, that it was proper for them to use Divine things, while they were fighting for the Divinity, without fear, and that such whose warfare is for the temple should live of the temple; on which account he emptied the vessels of that sacred wine and oil, which the priests kept to be poured on the burnt-offerings, and which lay in the inner court of the temple, and distributed it among the multitude, who, in their anointing themselves and drinking, used [each of them] above an hin of them. And here I cannot but speak my mind, and what the concern I am under dictates to me, and it is this: I suppose, that had the Romans made any longer delay in coming against these villains, that the city would either have been swallowed up by the ground opening upon them, or been overflowed by water, or else been destroyed by such thunder as the country of Sodom perished by, for it had brought forth a generation of men much more atheistical than were those that suffered such punishments; for by their madness it was that all the people came to be destroyed. So one of the creatures in John's vision said "do not harm the oil and wine" and Josephus writes about a Zealot leader who abused the sacred oil & wine used by the priests for their work in the temple.
  28. GeorgeStGeorge

    Name that Flick

    "The distance between insanity and genius is measured only by success." "It's the insurance damage waiver for your beautiful new car. Now, will you need collision coverage?" "Yes. "Fire?" "Probably." "Property destruction?" "Definitely." "Personal Injury?" "I hope not, but accidents do happen." "Well, that takes care of the normal wear-and-tear. Is there any other protection I need?" "I believe you have two things that belong to me!" "What are you talking about?" "The encoder, in the dash of your car...and my wife, in your hotel room!" George
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