teachmevp

19 hours ago, waysider said:

The whole "to you/for you" thing is contrived. The cannon does not reflect the chronology of when the various books were written.

But they do indeed. Read what is for you and don't eat off another's table that isn't for you. Paul was striving to know the Savior and know him intimately not as the lowly Nazarene...not as Israel’s Messiah...not as the man from Galilee...not as simply another great teacher...not as simply a prophet, but to know him in the power of his resurrection and in the fellowship of his suffering. Paul wanted the Savior’s life to be manifest in his own life. Take in God’s Word that you might be transformed by that Word. You must take part in the ingestion and absorption of his word rightly divided. Transformation God’s responsibility. The ingestion and absorption of divine viewpoint the believer’s responsibility. Religion is fill with lots of people who would rather beg God to fix their suffering circumstances rather than to thank God for his enabling grace that is sufficient for every suffering saint, that energizing power. Paul’s great desire was to know the Savior in his resurrection power because that same power that raised Jesus from among the dead was operating or energizing in Paul and it’s energizing in you. Ephesians 1:17-20

21 hours ago, T-Bone said:

I beg to differ – sorry to rain on your “sensational parade” – if you’re referring to when the Bible was completed and NOT to the esoteric philosophical nonsense of vp’s “the word” - you might want to look into the probable dates of when the New Testament documents were written…there’s Hebrews, James, books of Peter, epistles of John, Jude, and Revelation that according to most scholars were written after Paul’s letters.

 

dating when the books of the Bible were written

 

Those writing are not for you. This is the age of grace buddy. Those are for the Israelites after the body of the Savior is lifted off the earth. Will they not need instruction about what's going on before they face Jacob's trouble, the seven years of tribulation they must go through?

1 hour ago, T-Bone said:

I have a different take on that; Yes, he always had great concern for Israel but he also knew he was an apostle to the Gentiles (Galatians 2:8); As a case in point, perhaps a sort of convergence of goals may be seen in Paul’s mission to Jerusalem. I think Paul was committed to completing this critical relief mission - delivering donations from the Gentile churches to the poor in the Jerusalem church. It would mean a lot to strengthening unity in the church as a whole – the Gentile churches helping out the Jerusalem church.

 

 

I could be wrong but I really don’t think he had the “wrong goals” since in this particular case he said his mission to Jerusalem was part of the ministry he received from the Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 20:24), and he was purposed in the spirit to go there (Acts 19:21) and even bound in the spirit on his way (Acts 20:22). Perhaps another way to look at the warnings he received before going there was that it was God’s way of giving him a heads-up so he wouldn’t get blindsided.

 

 

Contrary to how “old Doc” taught it in PFAL, I believe the account of Paul going to Jerusalem shows his courage and commitment to see his God-given mission through no matter what the cost was to him personally – that must have been very inspirational and motivating to other Christians. That’s why I think he earned the right to pen such bold and challenging epistles – having the gravitas…the battlefield experience behind his voice…not like some armchair warrior…speaking of which - like I said  I think “old Doc” got that…and a whole lot of other things wrong too.

 

 

Well said. But the fact that Paul finished what God wanted him to say was from prison. It was from there God's Word to us was completed. 

On December 20, 2016 at 5:33 PM, TLC said:

Appears to me that's rather presumptuous.  What makes you so sure that he didn't receive the vast majority, if not all, the revelation of the gospel given to him while he was in the Arabian desert (Mt. Sinai ?) before he ever started preaching a word of it? 

Paul had the wrong goals and keep wanting to go to the Israelites. That program was put on hold. So God imprisoned Paul so to speak and his word was finally complete out of a prison.  

Achieving God’s goals for our ambassadorship is learning to distinguish his goal, from his desire. It is a critical distinction, because it can spell the difference between success and failure. His goal is any specific result reflecting his purposes for our ambassadorship, that does not depend on people or circumstances beyond our ability. The only person who can block his goal or render it uncertain or impossible is us, and if we adopt the attitude of cooperation with his goals, his goal can be reached. His desire is any specific result that depends on the cooperation of other people or the success of events or favorable circumstances we cannot control. 

When Paul’s ministry to the Gentiles was getting underway before God’s Word was complete...was send a handkerchief in order for God through his power from on high to jump into action and perform a miraculous sign for the sick. (Acts 19:11-12) Do you believe that someone could send you a handkerchief and with that handkerchief you're just automatically going to be healed of all manner of sickness and disease? God certainly worked that way in that day. But, Paul himself, revealed a change that was to take place as the ascended Savior let Paul know that change would be coming. 1 Corinthians 13:8, these were  signed gifts; the ability to proclaim God’s message prior to the completion of God’s Word through the supernatural empowerment of God’s power from on high.

1 Corinthians 13:9, it would have been impossible for the prophets of that day, those proclaiming the truth of God before the completed Word of God to reveal all the knowledge of God that would be contained in that completed Word of God. Paul’s epistles were to be passed from assembly to assembly, but keep in mind, he’d only completed 3 letters up to the point of what he’s telling us right here. All the written word the saints had up to that time, pertaining to the dispensation of grace was Galatians and the two letters to the saints at Thessalonica. Paul kept getting more revelations from the ascended Savior on what to tell us and the way God’s working with us today. 

1 Corinthians 13:10, when that which was to be finished comes to completion, there would be no need for the sign gifts to remain in operation. What was unfinished at that time? Paul’s writings to the Body of the Savior of this age!2 Corinthians 12:7-10, notice the change in operation that was beginning to take place in this new, previously undisclosed dispensation. What revelations? The revealing of the secret that God had been keeping where we Gentiles are concerned in light of Israel’s program being placed on the shelf for a time; the revelations concerning the change in program relative to the new dispensation God was ushering in.

2 Timothy 4:19-20, Trophimus have I left at Miletum SICK. No handkerchief, no anointing with oil, no laying on of hands, no naming it and claiming it, no power of a positive confession, no seed faith sowing, no prayer of faith prayer meeting mentioned whatsoever, just the truth resident in Ephesians 3:20 in light of God’s change of operation in connection with his new program and the dispensation of the grace of God. We can now trust the truth of Romans 8:28.

Deep six the science.

Yeah, you do that.

The lady who wrote that book Leaving the Way. I used to go to her twig back in 1981 in Cheyenne Wyoming. One night a limb dude taught at that lade's house, I remember he said something like that God put a straw into the universe and blew into it like a ballon. Let's keep science than, here is the beginning of the universe.

You're asking about science. In that vein, nothing you're talking about has a shred of evidence to support it. Science need not account for it because there is no "it" to account for.

I got to agree with you, deep six the science. I like your help with me with a jig saw puzzle, I'm trying to work on my criterial thinking, and you know I really need to work on my criterial thinking. I got this much of the puzzle.

Genesis 1:1 shouldn’t have happened. The bible assumes that the great usurper exits and never questions that assumption. The earth flooded out proves the great usurper is not an unfounded assumption. The beginning of the universe is in Genesis 1:1. Darkness was upon the earth, it appears the earth is in some kind of black substance. The great usurper and those who helped him out are on the earth, but would they be willing to explore this black substance? This black substance is so dark, the great usurper can’t see his hand in front of his face. Now the earth, the opposite of the created order is ‘nothing,’ (water). But to the ancients, the opposite of the created order was something much worse than ‘nothing’ (chaos). 


God just sat for awhile looking at this new black substance structure from his throne room, letting the great usurper sweet it out. As the great usurper sat in this black substance board out of his mind, all of a sudden a wind (invisible force) from God swept over the water. Now God is a spirit being, meaning his body is composed of a substance called spirit. God also has a unique kind of life within that body composed of that substance called spirit, but the life God has within himself produces some kind of light (His glory). It was this glory that used to be the light to the earth, but God couldn’t control it, his glory just shines. As God sat in his throne room, out of nowhere he said, “Let there be light.” 


Now, somehow from God’s throne room he was able to focus his glory into a beam and bounced that beam of glory off of a prism of some kind. The glory beam from the other side of that prism went into that black substance structure, yet that black substance structure contained that glory. So as the great usurper and follow usurpers sat on the earth, as the earth turned, they spend time in that glory and then spend time in that black substance. Time, this is something else unique about this black substance structure, an hour is an hour, something the usurper's never experienced.

Maybe it didn't. :o/>

I remember hearing something in TWI about the attack on the bloodline. I trying to show this great usurper first attack before the tree of knowledge of good and bad.

Science can ignore any hypothesis for which there is no testable evidence. Genesis as science has not been ignored. It's been utterly refuted and discredited.

I'm starting to see that point of view, interesting. But on the other hand, Genesis shouldn't have happen. Here is a little more of what I'm trying to say.

Now the earth, the opposite of the created order is ‘nothing,’ (water). But to the ancients, the opposite of the created order was something much worse than ‘nothing’ (chaos). 
God just sat for awhile looking at this new black substance structure from his throne room, letting the great usurper sweet it out. As the great usurper sat in this black substance board out of his mind, all of a sudden a wind (invisible force) from God swept over the water.

Can these gift ministries be use for preparing people for the judgement seat of Christ, but with a right attitude. Seems I saw in TWI was a kind of work thing going on, earn a reward or loose a reward?

Genesis 1:1 shouldn’t have happened. The bible assumes that the great usurper exits and never questions that assumption. The earth flooded out proves the great usurper is not an unfounded assumption. The beginning of the universe is in Genesis 1:1. Darkness was upon the earth, it appears the earth is in some kind of black substance. The great usurper and those who helped him out are on the earth, but would they be willing to explore this black substance? This black substance is so dark, the great usurper can’t see his hand in front of his face.

The bible never sets out to prove there is a God. It assumes that God exists and never questions that assumption. Can science ignore the assumptions within Genesis?

Not every blessing has to be the direct result of a "gift ministry."

Trying to pigeonhole everything into one's pet theory is a good way to really

sail off into left field- and was/is common in twi.

I once heard someone on an STS tape teaching on his cutesy concept of

"Recover, Resist, Rejoice."

He began to read and expound.

"*reading* 'Be sober, be vigilant' *expounding* That's like recovering."

Uh, no it isn't-and it shouldn't have to be unless you're forcing

EVERYTHING to fit into your framework,

subordinating the communication of God Almighty to your religious construct.

So the gift is to the building up of the overall body of Christ, when someone is doing these gift ministries. Pigeonhole, is it like that dude in Acts, who wanted to buy what Paul was doing?

Looks to me like there's more in your post that could be expounded upon.

Furthermore, I suspect that what you're talking about here is one of the biggest failures of "rightly dividing the word of truth" that TWI, its offshoots, as well as many others continue to make.

(Though, I'm not sure why you posted it in this thread, or exactly how you're specifically relating it to defining the gift ministries.

I don't know why I posted that Acts, but there is a truth in there about attitude. Please help me out with this thought. So this Ananiasa in Acts chapter 5, could that attitude have killed him. In Acts chapter 5, they owe that seven years (Jacobs trouble) under the law contract. My bad attitude killed my relationship with the person who started this thread. Twinky was showing me the last Adam, the best truth their is. What gift ministry did WordWolf do, I received a gift through his wisdom. Waysider could link all this together. But how are we gifted by Waysider's gift ministries?

The gift ministries, who receives the gift? Could I have been gifted by God through TLC being a apostle about my attitude?

Can we do these gift ministries without knowing we are doing them? I mean, TLC was a apostle in a way, I know now God was talking to me through TLC about my attitude?

Looks to me like there's more in your post that could be expounded upon.

Furthermore, I suspect that what you're talking about here is one of the biggest failures of "rightly dividing the word of truth" that TWI, its offshoots, as well as many others continue to make.

(Though, I'm not sure why you posted it in this thread, or exactly how you're specifically relating it to defining the gift ministries.

I understand these gift ministries are for preparing people for the judgment seat of Christ. If so, could an apostle come alone and correct, not doctrine but attitudes. This is just a thought, but God could use an apostle to correct a group of people's attitude. What I mean is could this “I am of Apollos” and “I am of Peter” be about peoples attitudes?

It used to bother me that I couldn't figure out the meaning of

song. Not anymore. Nope.

I think about this sometimes when I'm sitting in the station. When casting our vote, that It is absolutely vital that we put on the breastplate of righteousness, so that we can resist the persistent accusation of the enemy, they never give up trying to get us down and keep us down by hurling one false accusation after another.

What does any of this even mean?

(In plain English, please.)

Our enemies are actively involved in trying to distract us by peppering our mind with their thoughts and ideas. 
They are always hurling their fiery darts of fear, doubt, and worry in our direction, but the only time they can hit us is when we let our shield of faith down. A shield deflects, it keeps the darts of the enemy away from our mind, the shield moves with the attack.

I do enjoy when a topic detours into a more interesting, unforeseen topic. But there is just too much here, I'd need you to narrow down what you want to discuss.

I was going to post a few links. Coming from TWI where emotion is to be ignored folks have the "plastic cult face", there are interesting topics to discuss i.e. Does morality come from reason or emotion? What purpose do emotions serve and how should we respond to them?

And yes, I can imagine getting married based on "doctrinally governed intellect" . . .bleh . . .

It is also interesting about this armor can play a part in casting ones vote. The two dangerous edges of the enemies broadsword are discouragement and doubt. With the helmet of salvation firmly on, we see ourselves for who we really are, and when our faith in God’s omnipotence and care is strong, it is impossible for the enemy to break through our shield of faith and land an attack.

1913? The year my father was born. Are you referring to the establishment of the federal income tax and the IRS, teach?

That is when the USA was sold down the river, the Federal Reserve started printing our money. The income tax money pays for the debt that the USA owes the Federal Reserve for printing our money.

There's a WHOLE LOT of malarkey in teach's last comment... but the quote I included above takes the cake.

That "logic" (it's not really logic, it's more like irrational rationale) is complete nonsense.

People almost always make decisions based on emotion, especially major life decisions.

Can you imagine, in our culture, deciding on whom to marry based on "doctrinally governed intellect?" Whatever the hell that is...

Apart from trusting Jesus Christ as Savior, human righteousness comes from self-interest-motivation, it is self-glorifying, and while it may be of earthly benefit, that will not cut it when it comes to meeting the demands of God’s perfect justice.

There's a WHOLE LOT of malarkey in teach's last comment... but the quote I included above takes the cake.

That "logic" (it's not really logic, it's more like irrational rationale) is complete nonsense.

People almost always make decisions based on emotion, especially major life decisions.

Can you imagine, in our culture, deciding on whom to marry based on "doctrinally governed intellect?" Whatever the hell that is...

One serving of self, leads to another serving of self. Words spoken in haste, lead to other words spoken in haste. Harmful words to further harmful words. We serve the moral choice of good and bad rather than our Savior, as we serve self, rather than the Body of saints to whom we are as equally and intimately joined, as we are joined to our Savior.

I'm not sure where "suffering" came from in this discussion. My understanding is that from TWI's viewpoint "suffering" would be un-Biblical.

Maybe you mean something broader, but I don't want to speculate.

Most of Paul’s pain and suffering came from making the right decisions.

Religion is filled with lots of people who would rather beg God to fix their suffering circumstances, rather than to thank God for his enabling grace that is sufficient for every suffering saint, that energizing power. Paul’s great desire was to know Christ in his resurrection power, because that same power that raised Christ from among the dead was operating or energizing in Paul and it’s energizing in us.

Emotion can lead us down the path, and will oftentimes, most likely lead us down the wrong path, when emotion becomes the governor of our intellect, rather than the doctrinally governed intellect becoming the ruler of our emotions, emotion should never be the fuel, we should never be emotionally driven, but doctrinally driven. 


Each of us struggles with an inner sense of right and wrong, and the difficulty we face in doing the right thing, in light of the inclination that all of us had to do that which we deemed to be wrong. We cannot say that only believers struggle with the moral choice of good and bad, because disobeying our conscience is coming short, in our mind, as to what we know to be the right thing to do, that’s the moral choice of good and bad working in opposition to the conscience to have a person go in a direction contrary to that inner sense of right and wrong, that’s common to all humankind.