Fco Orostegui

I have these books, I sent them to the US and they have helped me a lot (even though I'm not that good in English)

19 hours ago, Stayed Too Long said:

If your family has been in TWI for almost 40 years, they lived thtough all the lawsuits with LCM, and the plagiarism of VPW. LCM has only been gone for 20 years or so, and they have had ample time to evaluate all that has been going on.  What is your relationship with your family? What do they  think about you leaving TWI? How do you correspond with them? Do you get together with them physically? 
i wouldn’t rush into trying to enlighten them about all you know. Talk to them and see if there are small things they maybe questioning about TWI? This might be a way to introduce light into the situation.

Welcome to the cafe. There plenty of people here willing to help you out.

I get along with my family, I see them quite a lot, but the twi people, some friends stopped talking to me (especially when I let some of them about vpw plagiarism).
When I left Twi my parents thought it was horrible, they got mad at me for a while, especially when the representatives of Twi came to my country to accuse me that I wrote on Facebook that they were a cult (my immaturity error).
I get along well with my family but we don't talk about religion.

19 hours ago, T-Bone said:

Hi Francisco,

It sounds to me like you’ve really done your homework, and now hopefully you can boil all that down to bite-size digestible nuggets of truth and facts. If you can manage English (with or without the help of a translator) you might find useful some threads on Grease Spot for historical, timeline or topic-specific references – to help organize your thoughts and prepare you to help your family.

Recently another newcomer to Grease Spot talked about a similar concern – dating someone who is involved in TWI. One of Grease Spot’s “old timers” (WordWolf) replied to them saying you can’t really understand TWI without trying to understand the founder and its first president victor paul wierwille. Below I have provided a few links to WordWolf’s posts – which in themselves have a bunch more links for you to peruse. I think he does a great job of chronicling all things TWI.

 

I was involved in The Way International for some 12 years – I left the cult in 1986. I went through their missionary program (W.O.W.) and their leadership training program (the way corps). My reasons for leaving are many – and it all was on a “slow simmer” for several years while I was in – but it boiled over in 1986 – all my questions and doubts came to a head. That was when the founding president (wierwille) passed away and the power-struggles of some upper leadership ensued – which made me reevaluate what they taught me and got me to look more into their true nature from a variety of perspectives – which sounds like what you did (checking out books and John Juedes) kudos to you my friend.

From my own experience I’ve found that helping someone else escape a rabbit hole will involve a lot of patience, understanding, empathy, honesty and respect on your part (as one who has already escaped the rabbit hole). I believe it’s important to promote critical thinking. I am still a Christian even after leaving TWI…and sometimes on Grease Spot I like to express the idea that TWI is essentially parasitic – relying on exploiting others – whether it’s plagiarism, twisting Scripture to suit their own agenda and moral depravity or taking advantage of followers in so many ways. Even at its most basic level, TWI is indeed a parasite of lies that NEEDS some truth in order to survive. Check out Jesus Christ exercising critical thinking in Luke 4  to counter the devil’s twisted use of Scripture. We often can help others escape TWI when we point out some obvious difference between a truth and a lie…some obvious difference between some fact and TWI’s fictionalized version of it.

Rather than throw everything all at once at your family – take some time to analyze your own journey out of TWI. What stuff, teachings or experiences caused you to question or doubt? Bottom line is that you really can’t force anyone to see through the religious façade of TWI. But you can point out some chinks in their supposed armor of credibility – like going over the plagiarism or fabrications and embellishments of events (using the details from threads listed below) – hopefully that will lodge some questions and doubts in their minds – which may act like an electrical charge to stimulate the atrophied critical thinking "muscles"…People base their beliefs on what they think is a trusted source. Your task is to offer reasons why TWI should NOT be trusted.

Good luck Francisco - you asked some great questions – and welcome to Grease Spot

Love & peace

T-Bone

== == == ==

These links below may help you investigate further (the links below are to posts that have a bunch more links); also take advantage of the search engine in the top right section of the webpage – just type in a topic and get familiar with how this website is laid out.

understanding TWI by understanding vpw

vpw’s failed promises, plagiarism, timelines and eyewitnesses

more info from eyewitnesses.

== == == 

Sorry I don’t speak your language…btw, I really enjoyed watching Toy Story 3 with my daughter the other day. There’s one scene where they press a factory reset button for too long on the back of Buzz Lightyear and he started talking in Spanish – and fortunately for me the movie had subtitles when he talked – I loved it! They even had the Toy Story theme song “You’ve Got A Friend in Me” in Spanish at the end of the movie. 

end of Toy Story 3 - song "You've Got A Friend in Me" in Spanish

 

Incredible testimony, I will take a look at the links you left, thank you very much for supporting me and answering my questions.

The Toy Story thing was very funny since here in Latin America they give Buzz a Spanish accent in that part of the movie, which is as different as the English accent from the American accent.

On 1/29/2021 at 11:07 AM, Fco Orostegui said:

Hola a todos 

Soy Francisco tengo 32 años y desde que tengo memoria mi familia participa en twi, yo abandoné esta secta hace unos 7 años mas menos cuando me topé con la página de John Juedes, con quien también he podido hablar por teléfono y quien me dirigió a un Centro de Investigaciones Religiosas. 

Desde ese entonces he estado investigando, comprando algunos libros y aprendiendo de twi y del desastre teológico y abusos cometidos por el alto mando. 

Mi pregunta es la siguiente 

Como puedo ayudar a que mi familia abandone esta secta?, llevan casi 40 años envueltos en esto,  obviamente desconocen que es lo que ocurrió con LCM y las demandas, o el plagio de VPW, mi intención es poder sacarlos del culto.  Alguna idea de como empezar? 

I forgot to mention that I am from Chile, South America.

18 hours ago, WordWolf said:

Good evening, Mister Orostegui.

I would be happy to help you- by directing you to more information, and by answering questions and things like that.  Before I start that whole process, I think it's important to know how good your English is.  Are you able to read pages of English text without a translator?  Are you only able to read them with Google Translate or something similar?     I can give you much more help in English than I can in Spanish.    Feel free to contact me privately with a "private message" ("pm").   (You can click on my name, then on the "message" button on my information page to do that.)

 

Just in case none of that was understood.....

Buenas noches, Señor Orostegui.

Puedo ayudarle alegremente.  Puedo dirigirle a más información, y puedo responder preguntas y otras cosas.  Ante todo,  yo creo que es importante saber su nivel de Ingles.   Puede leer paginas de texto en Ingles sin un traductor?  Puede leer Ingles solamente con la ayuda de un programa como Google Translate?  Puedo ayudarle más facilmente y con más informacion en Ingles que en Español (o castellano).   Puede contactarme privadamente con un "mensaje privado" ("pm") cuando quiera.  (Haga un "clic" sobre mi nombre, y luego un clic en "message" en la pagina con mi informacion.)

 

Hola WordWolf, My level of English is not very advanced but I can read and understand (sometimes I help myself with the translator and I am able to distinguish when the translator changes the meaning of the sentences) I greatly appreciate your help with this.

18 hours ago, Stayed Too Long said:

If your family has been in TWI for almost 40 years, they lived thtough all the lawsuits with LCM, and the plagiarism of VPW. LCM has only been gone for 20 years or so, and they have had ample time to evaluate all that has been going on.  What is your relationship with your family? What do they  think about you leaving TWI? How do you correspond with them? Do you get together with them physically? 
i wouldn’t rush into trying to enlighten them about all you know. Talk to them and see if there are small things they maybe questioning about TWI? This might be a way to introduce light into the situation.

Welcome to the cafe. There plenty of people here willing to help you out.

Hello, that they have been 40 years old is a way of saying, they were disconnected from twi from 96-97 until 2012, since there was a problem with the representative of the Country (I think the guy stole some land and money), And as a result of this, many people left for Twi in Chile, but my parents and uncles kept the Twi style, making twigs, that's why they don't know about lcm, they learned something about Chriss Gere's letter, but nothing in detail, the Senior Twi commanders in my country hid a lot of information, so my relatives do not know all these things, nor about the cases of abuse of lcm.
Then in 2012, unfortunately it was me who contacted the Twi people in my country again (believing that I was bringing my family closer to God again), since my parents do not understand they do not have much contact with technology or the internet. As an adult I managed to take the Fundamental Class, when then I started researching vpw and its teachings and came across this whole iceberg of things.

Hola a todos 

Soy Francisco tengo 32 años y desde que tengo memoria mi familia participa en twi, yo abandoné esta secta hace unos 7 años mas menos cuando me topé con la página de John Juedes, con quien también he podido hablar por teléfono y quien me dirigió a un Centro de Investigaciones Religiosas. 

Desde ese entonces he estado investigando, comprando algunos libros y aprendiendo de twi y del desastre teológico y abusos cometidos por el alto mando. 

Mi pregunta es la siguiente 

Como puedo ayudar a que mi familia abandone esta secta?, llevan casi 40 años envueltos en esto,  obviamente desconocen que es lo que ocurrió con LCM y las demandas, o el plagio de VPW, mi intención es poder sacarlos del culto.  Alguna idea de como empezar?