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MarkedAndAvoided

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Posts posted by MarkedAndAvoided

    Was I Wrong In How I Left?

    in About The Way

    Posted

    After I decided to break from TWI, I got several harassing letters and phone calls as well as being ignored and smugged at public places by TWI believers in the town I lived at that time over 11 years ago. On one phone call from a Corps twig coordinator's wife she called and repeatedly kept telling me I was "out of fellowship", banned from any contact, and outside God's protection. I was already shook up enough and my stress level was still high for a while, maybe worse after I left due to the letters in the mail I got telling me I was "led by Satan" "bewitched", and "of the devil". I finally asked the woman to get her husband on the phone and he got on. I told him that if he or his wife ever called me again, I would hang up the phone and regardless of consequences, would personally come down to his apartment and call him out on the street. I also told him (since the Corps grapevine couldn't keep a lockbox for a nickel anyway) that if anyone again treated me impolite or smug me again in public that I would personally force my approach and pound their a**.

    I did see them later but instead of giving me the smug look they all avoided me, which was fine for me, but I was hoping for something more peaceful. I just didn't know how to stop it from coming at me in those days. Did I use the wrong approach? Should I have used more reasoning?

    Marked and Avoided

    Twig Coordinators' Meeting at the ROA

    in About The Way

    Posted

    I had posted on Cherished Child's comment on the Twig Coordinators meeting that she went to and the difference in the one I witnessed in 1992 that I attended. They are definitely two separate events, and that does not surprise me that LCM would pull this more than one time. Martindale in 1992 chewed out a WOW African American guy that had an armband then, saying "I AM IN CHARGE HERE!", and the guy just turned and walked out of the tent with Martindale ridiculing him all the way out. No profanity then and the guy did not rip his armband off where we saw anything, (though I am sure he ripped it off later). Larry Panarello was the one to chase him, and out of curiosity, I slipped out the back of the tent to chase Panarello to see what was happening. The WOW guy went back and reported to his fellowship, mostly black, what had happened, and they all decided to leave. The WOW armbands came off not just one but several of them. Since there were more WOWs in that fellowship, they all took them off. It was peaceful, but I could pretty much tell they were telling Panarello to take a hike.

    Cherished Child's one gives a later time period, as the WOW program was canceled some years later after 1992, this guy ripped his armband off in front of everyone including Martindale, and John Reynolds chased him down.

    Really, it doesn't at all surprise me this happened twice at two different times with different events and people. Consider Martindale's ability to learn from his own previous mistakes...

    Marked and Avoided

    • Upvote 1

    CES Name Change

    in About The Way

    Posted

    I can sympathize with Cherished Child's story of the WOW and twig coordinator meeting run by LCM. He pulled that same stunt on another guy in front of us all at the 1992 Rock. I was apprentice Corps then and kept my mounth shut, but his treatment of people made me second-guess my involvement in the Corps. He was the leader and I didn't want to end up like him.

    At the Advanced Class special I was reprimanded for being late to a teaching at the WOW Auditorium. Of course, they did not seem to think that helping move a roommate of mine onto International grounds all night mattered and that I slept in a couple of hours. And no one would have noticed if it had not been for a snitching Corps sister that I had sponsored throughout her Corps years. I third-guessed my involvement in the Corps and then had doubts about the ministry. Then a believer employer ripped me off of a paycheck, he was my fellowship coordinator, so I did not go to his fellowship. He and others in the area black-balled me, falsly told Corps HQ that I was dropping from the Corps and spread that rumor causing some people to call International asking for their sponsorship money back. I had to write and advise them I hadn't dropped but they would be the first to know if I didn't show up. (That didn't go well).

    I then decided after going broke supporting the ministry and being black-balled for nothing, being reamed for nothing, to leave and chuck the whole ministry. I wrote a letter to the area coordinator who later announced it to the area Corps and I was marked and avoided.

    It took me about six months before I got over the feeling God was going to punish me.

    Marked and Avoided

    CES Name Change

    in About The Way

    Posted

    I have some involvement in CES and some in CFF. I don't have any in CBC. Just for the record, while I was with CFF there was a clique, so to speak, of higher echelon believers you had to please. They did not force anything on anybody but some of them did quite frankly try to take over independent fellowships. CES is different. I have spoken with John Lynn, Mark Graeser, and John Schoenheit off and on since 1988 while I was still in the Way. They never once pressured anything or asked anything. They were pretty up front and honest. Sometimes too honest. Nothing behind your back. I learned to trust them. My wife and I are kind of looking forward to some fellowshipping with them. We plan to look into it after the New Year. I am sure they have their opinions and doctrines like everybody else. The difference was the lack of smugness, the lack of legalism, and the free will to be called upon or left alone. It is unfair to put CES on the same level as TWI. CES has them beat hands down. And I am not even trying to promote them. I am sure there are even churches out there just like CES that are quite refreshing.

    Marked and Avoided

    forgiving

    in About The Way

    Posted

    It is tough to forgive and forget. Because Christ died for me unconditionally, my sins were forgiven. I can learn to forgive and I can't go back on it once I do. Forgetting is harder. Then again, keeping one eye open against someone if they strike again may be a good idea. This is a tough issue and I need more Bible.

    Marked and Avoided

    Elizabeth Paga

    in Family, Friends, and other loved ones

    Posted

    My grandmother, Liz Paga, whose 103rd birthday would have been December 11th. She took me in to her home farm after I returned from the war in Vietnam 31 years ago after I had no place else to go. I remember her dearly and always will. I was not there when she died and I have grieved about that ever since.

    I love and miss you every day, Grandma.

    Marked and Avoided

    Is TWI a Good Ambassador for Jesus Christ?

    in About The Way

    Posted

    These were all great responses and I agree with every one of them. I did in fact notice several people turning away from Christianity after they had been in it. I privately hope they return to Christianity but not to the Way. I believe Roy's statement that they are in fact, more representative of the devil than God or Jesus Christ because of the hard-heartedness and resentment they have just for leaving. It is such childness coming from such men and women of stature, that they are in fact, not the professionals they set out to be. They must be left to their own conscience and integrity.

    Marked and Avoided

    Stupid Way Stories

    in About The Way

    Posted

    quote:
    Originally posted by diazbro:

    Al Poole said:

    ________________________________________________

    During TWI I was told to avoid people who were

    indigent or who couldn't "believe enough for

    the PFAL donation". In contrast I've seen churches of like 200 people do more work for people and the surrounding community than TWI has in its entire history. In my experience TWI never helped anyone without the expectation that they would sign up for PFAL and in turn recruit others. And TWI holds its local community in total contempt.

    ________________________________________________

    I completely agree with diazbro. I never in my life saw so much lack of compassion than this ministry. It was the poorest witness for Christ I had ever seen. The Satanic church knew better in recruiting people by showing more compassion than that. Satanists are lying, but at least they put on the show of compassion to make themselves look legitimate.

    I never saw the ruthlessness of such a ministry come to bear fruit than in the treatment of VPW's wife, who gave them half the land to operate and 60 years of her life. Harve Platig and the rest of the board know what has been done and they must see the monstrous and completely ungodly decisions they have made and done.

    The ruthlessness, the evil, and the torment they inflict on others in the name of God. They do not light a candle as ambassadors to Christ, and the way they are now, God would not want them using His name in their actions.

    Marked and Avoided

    [This message was edited by MarkedAndAvoided on December 14, 2003 at 18:47.]

    Stupid Way Stories

    in About The Way

    Posted

    The stupidest stuff...possessed VCRs, anal retentive hosting of the tables, anal retentive etiquette (that I dare not call Christian Etiquette), Corps brothers and sisters ratting on each other for minor matters that would not be a matter outside the Way...the list can go on...

    Marked and Avoided

    Did VPW Teach LCM on Legalism and Sexual Abuse?

    in About The Way

    Posted

    Shaz:

    That pretty much explains everything I suspected about the Corps. I was in for a year and before that was allowed to attend some of the classes the Corps took, kind of like auditing a course, or in this case, the Corps. It was fun for me the outsider at the time, but I remember academic classes were lacking and it was mostly about doing work for the farm and the ministry, mainly menial jobs. When I became an "insider", I was shocked at the low level of heart involved, the reproof and abuse, (correction was abuse and not handled in a loving way), shocked at the elitist attitude of the leaders, shocked at brothers and sisters in the Corps reporting mild infractions on each other, and watched as the hard-heartedness was taught to me and others. I became an abusive fellowship coordinator in my area. I began with 15 people and lost them all. After leaving TWI, I apologized to all of them. I was surprised and very moved when all 15 forgave me, the women and men shaking my hand and giving me hugs. I couldn't bear what I had done to these people. I had a lot of grief over what I had done. I feel better today about it because of them. Simply put, the followers were better leaders than I. It is an example I will remember for the rest of my life.

    Marked and Avoided

    11-11-03 Veterans Day

    in Greasespot Holidays, Holydays and Heydays

    Posted

    Thanks for the post. I'd like to remember my buddies who died in the 73rd Signal Battalion in April '72 in Camh Ranh Bay, South Vietnam. It is hard to forget them and I don't think I ever will. It sure is healing to know people out there care enough for them to have such an extensive thread. God Bless You All.

    Steve

    Marked and Avoided

    BG Leonard's book "foundations"/Plagiarism

    in About The Way

    Posted

    When I told other people about Wierwille's Christian Family and Sex class which I did not like and had to pay for in order to get into the Advanced Class and the Corps, I referred to Maggie Muggins as Maggie Morgasm and Johnny Jump-UP as Johnny Hard-Up. Was I crossing the lines of plagiarism? Was that my crime? I wondered that as several Bless Patrol asked me to leave the grounds in 1993.

    Marked and Avoided

    abuse in twi

    in Getting help for cult dysfunction

    Posted

    E* H*ny was a guy who loaned his wife to Martindale and he admitted it in public, to my absolute shock. That was bad enough. To learn he whacked people in the head in the Corps really gets my blood boiling. I never liked the guy due to his elitist and pompous attitude to begin with. He never hurt me personally, but I really don't want him in my neighborhood just for the mere temptation of going over for a visit. I'm glad most people don't know who he is.

    Marked and Avoided

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