Hooray for Cults!

[shortfuse]

One of the most confusing things to sort out and accept is the possibility that you have been involved in a cult. "What about all the good times, good things, good people?" If you start to accept the notion, you tell yourself things like, “I’m just believing a label applied by people and organizations that are threatened by my stand. “

And look at the good that have come from so called cults.

Jesus and his disciples

– accused of being cultists.

Paul and his movement in the book of Acts

– labeled a cult.

“Not bad company,” you tell yourself. Look at some of the groups that founded and settled parts of the United States. The Pilgrims were Puritan Separatists, extremists, in many ways a very cult like group. The Puritan settlements evolved in to very legalistic, intolerant communities far more controlling than The Way. But from these same pilgrims come traditional American ideals like self governance and religious liberty.

Is there really anything wrong with a being in a cult? Who cares about labels anyway? The sects within any religious movement are the core, committed individuals who derive a sense of pride from their sacrifice, loyalty, and discipline. Where would the world be without people truly fanatical for their cause?

So I’m a cultist. :blink: So what?! Talk me out of it.

[GarthP2000]

The Puritan settlements evolved in to very legalistic, intolerant communities far more controlling than The Way. But from these same pilgrims come traditional American ideals like self governance and religious liberty.

Actually, it wasn't the Puritans who endorsed ideals like self governance and religious liberty (unless it benefited them), and there were more to the pilgrims than just the Puritans, as it was the Puritans who took control of the area during the mid-late 1600's where the Plymouth pilgrims first settled.

As to the ideals of self governance and religious liberty, there were a good number of others who came to the colonies who espoused those ideals, and many of them knew that fanaticism (particularly of the religious variety) often went against those very ideals.

Evidently, the American history that we learned in TWI was sorely lacking in many respects, especially when it comes to the topic of religious liberty.

Where would the world be without people truly fanatical for their cause?

Ohhh, we'd be without people like L. Craig Martindale, Osama bin Laden, Charles Manson, the Inquisition, ..... need I continue?

Edited June 28, 2006 by GarthP2000

[johniam]

Here, Here! They don't call it CULTure for nothing.

[shortfuse]

No not the only group that made contributions to self governance, and I'm not a history teacher, but I was thinking of the Mayflower Compact.

[shazdancer]

Where would the world be without people truly fanatical for their cause?

Depends on the cause. TWI's was money, power, and sex. I think we could have carried on fine without them.

Regards,

Shaz

[George Aar]

Yeah, I'm a little lukewarm about touting the virtues of fanatics myself.

Been too many wars, rebellions, and genocide to get too poetic about the likes of Lenin, Hitler, Mussolini, Pol Pot, and such like. Funny how human life becomes so cheap when a cause gets elevated...

[lindyhopper]

I think most religion is cult-like to a degree. It has to do with the control for sure and of course there are always controls in life, but I tend to messure it by what degree personal liberty and freedom are taken away. In that respect I feel TWI is worse than most groups I know of presently.

"Good times, good things and good people" are everywhere, there are also very commited and good intensioned people in every walk of life and those are the ones that contribute the most to the world. The problem with fanatics is the "intense uncritical devotion." In that respect I don't know if you could consider Jesus as a fanatic. It is my observation that while positive things can come out of terrible people, groups, and situations, those that choose to be fiecely commited to good causes have critically thought things through...or they are just sheep.

I don't think it is something anyone can be talked out of. Rather it is a process of going from the "uncritical devotee" to critically looking at our lives and the group we have been involved in piece by piece. As we do that, one notices the liberty and freedom that have been taken away, or coersed away, or that we have freely given up out of fear or ignorance or just plain short sightedness or youthful bliss. All things have the lighter side and we can look at the good in every situation. We can do the same with the bad, but what is the cost of our personal liberty and freedom? For some here and currently in twi it is not much for others it is a great deal. If we are in the category of the lesser, as critical thinkers and compassionate people we must realise that it is not just what we alone have paid but all of us collectively. Weigh the good to the bad with a clear view of how things were and are in twi and I come up with a cost too great to compromise.

[shortfuse]

Thanks for the well considered reply, Lindy.

Part of what I was trying to express is the struggle of identifying with the "c word" - people don't want to say it like they hate to say "cancer". You can rationalize it away for a long time, but when you slow down to consider the validity of it, it can for a time turn your world upside down.

Also, I thought the title of this topic was funny.