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skyrider last won the day on March 17

skyrider had the most liked content!

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About skyrider

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    Do I have kids or did I read it in a thread?
  1. Love-bombing........to get you to twig. Need to take pfal........before he/she could "date" you. Must be corps.............before he/she would marry you.
  2. Lately, here at Greasespot..........we've discussed quite a bit about retirement issues in regards to that Revival and Restoration group. Not only did twi's BOD keep moving the goal posts on what it meant to receive 1) emeritus status versus 2) retired status........rivenbark wanted (requested) to assign them to writing articles or work projects in their retirement years. In effect, she wanted to keep them at her beck and call for more twi-servitude. Martindale, on the other hand, was ousted from office and stripped of his corps/clergy titles........and receives a lifetime $65,000 pension. What gives? What is behind this incredible double standard? Couldn't this 65k-pension more aptly be described as a nondisclosure agreement.........hush-money? I mean, from everything we know and have seen from twi......it wasn't like martindale and twi penned a forward-looking pension plan when he took office in 1982. Hell no. This abrupt "pension agreement" was solidified under the auspices of legal counsel (in August 2000) days before his ousting. What gave martindale leverage of such an agreement? Threats to expose ....Rosalie's background and sexual proclivities? Threats to expose ....Wierwille's plagiarism, predation and debauchery? Threats to expose ....Twi's unethical financial practices and secret holdings? Or, call an impromptu corps meeting.....and tell the corps how they're being exploited? All of the above......... Whatever it was......martindale slithered out of headquarters in the dead of night. All questions regarding L. Craig Martindale were deemed anathema.......no one was allowed to ask. Not staffers. Not corps. Anyone who did ask was immediately confronted. [To find out who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.] So, today.......martindale collects his cult-pension (65K) and social security benefits (15k-17k?) to the tune of say $82,000 per year. Does he get other perks?.........secret credit card, travel perks, access to Camp Gunnison, healthcare plan, etc.?? Not too shabby.......for a guy who was ousted under a cloud of suspicion and sexual predation, eh? ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Open your homes, Open your refrigerators
  3. Thanks WW...........yes, that succinctly is the gist of my question. After reading thru these replies..........I tend to think that many of these corps grads presumed that they'd "run out the clock with service to twi" and then, receive recognition and respect from the BOD and retire to the sidelines. But as the years quickly passed, the board of directors kept moving the goal posts as noted in Melody Ann Carter's Facebook post: .... "We had asked for years to retire from The Way Corps when Kevin was 60 – but alas, a new policy came out after my letter to the BODs in 2007, stating that you could not even request to go Emeritus until you were 65. WOW!! Yet another policy!!! So when the top leadership last year decided that they were going to change the Emeritus status to Retired status – they wanted to get those that were retired to sign up for things like writing articles, or doing certain projects…etc…. many said – retired means retired. Stop micromanaging me!" .... Note: It seems apparently clear that these corps grads knew there were structural/doctrinal issues and dismal failures ABOUNDING IN TWI.......but after decades of service to twi, they wanted to "run out the clock" and be recognized for their dedication. Sure, it was wrong on so many levels......compromising spiritual/moral integrity and all that, but in the end they just wanted to "save face" for all the years of servitude to twi. So, the BOD moved the goal posts---- 1) Emeritus status to 2) Retired status.......then from Retired status to "we still have some projects and things that we want you to do." Year after year, as corps grads were nearing "retirement" their frustrations and ire were mounting. I would surmise that there were many private conversations and emails going back and forth from say 2008-2016........when 12 corps grad couples sent that August 2016 letter to Rosalie and directors and signing their names below. THEN......Rosalie refused to meet with them as a group. On her terms, at headquarters......... she would meet with each couple individually. But then, to them......they'd seen that rodeo many, many times before and viewed it as a trap. After 16 years of her dismal "leadership".......they wanted HER gone. The months ticked by. And, in January 2017 she installed JYDL as the new president and she slipped into the vice prez seat right beside him. If this was a chess match, THAT was checkmate! She would whisper in JYDL's ear daily......and STILL controlled all the power levers at headquarters. The corps grads mounted their forces with MORE opposition.......and thus, the March 2017 letter. This letter was the culmination of years of frustration. Now, the gloves were off!! Notice ....ALL the structural and doctrinal issues that are addressed. Notice ....the direct attack on Rosalie's "evil fruit" Notice ....the pointing out of dismal numbers and classes Notice ....LOTS more corps grads signed this March 2017 letter
  4. Why can't corps retire from twi with dignity.......and emeritus status? Well........imo, the BOD are so far from agapeo love that they are beset with paranoia. To them.......they cannot allow the moynihans, and others, to retire WITH STATUS and ACCESS to twi-followers. The pyramid structure just doesn't allow much room at the top......let alone, opening the door for scores of corps grads to retire with emeritus status. Thus..........The Purge. In controlling power, one has to keep the plebs in submission. Think Scientology. Think North Korea. Purging select individuals sends a powerful message.......if you don't tow the line, you too will be purged. For those who've been indoctrinated that *rewards are attained by staying faithful to and in the household*....ie. the way international....it is a clear and present danger to not cross THAT line. The invisible fence.......*rewards are attained by staying faithful to and in the household*........keeps the dogs in their backyard.
  5. After the lawyers got involved in those lawsuits regarding sexual predation, which prompted martindale's ouster........I was under the impression that rivenbark had to dial back lots of the manipulation and exploitation of its followers. From those of you still in at the time......wasn't twi reprimanded to stop the "salary-based-on-needs-basis" doctrine because it was ILLEGAL? And further, that twi needed to pay overtime for those who worked more than 46 hours per week? Plus, twi could NOT regulate someone on staff who wanted to have a second job to supplement their income.....and that's why John Linder is a real estate agent when he's not brandishing his 9mm Glock handgun as head bodyguard at the way international. So, my question................Why can't corps retire from twi with dignity? Sure, it's a sleazy, indoctrinating cult and all........but what's the point in kicking people "in the groin" when they simply want a little respect and dignity? Are the board of directors so jaded and sadistic that they can't extend some respect to those who'd worked to promote their product for some 40 years? ........for those who used their OWN money to move from state to state, and job to job, to help run hundreds and hundreds (thousands?) of meetings, and classes? Of course, many of us remember wierwille boasted that "......we don't retire in The Way" as he heaped praise on Dorothy and Rhoda, but they were FULL-TIME staff and had trailer units on grounds. Did they ever move year after year, and slave to pay the bills.....and eat cereal for supper before rushing off to teach the next twig fellowship? NO......they did not. It is absolutely mind-blowing to see the hardness of heart from Rosalie, Jean-Yves, JohnR, and BillyG. !!! When I go back and re-read that Revival and Restoration thread.....that August 2016 letter and follow-up letter from Melody Ann Carter, they were requesting "respect and dignity" for all their years of service. They wanted emeritus status for decades of fighting for twi in the trenches of life. Sure, they were peeved that old Rosalie wouldn't address their concerns or moderate her stance on several doctrine issues......namely, that debt-doctrine. But more than that.........they DID NOT want to jump thru any more hoops. Why couldn't they retire with dignity........and sit a spell? Bottom Line..............moynihans, horneys, forts, others wanted some R-E-S-P-E-C-T. (Sing it Aretha Franklin........) What is so glaringly repugnant is that..................Rosalie NEVER served on-the-field after she graduated from Family Corps. Hypocrisy much? Jean-Yves NEVER served on-the-field after he graduated from the 16th Corps. Hypocrisy much?
  6. Why so Low?

    You're a good lad, T-Bone.........phases come and go.
  7. Commune of Enablers

    chockfull........yeah, a mixture of people and problematic corps recruits. You know, everything begins and ends with leadership. I sometimes remind myself that the Old Testament gives vivid illustrations and documentation of the kings of old. When a king did right in the sight of God........the people flourished. When a king did evil in the sight of God.......the kingdom went into bondage. Even though God blessed many of us, individually, in spite of twi and its leadership.........it succumbed to bondage. The legalistic mandates, the trappings of man-made policies and the skewering of scripture took its toll. Those who had the means, and wits, to exit early.......did. In fact, looking back......I often found that the most independent and strong-minded people left FIRST. They did not allow themselves to be cornered.......socially, psychologically or doctrinally. So often, those who were Area Coordinators during in-residence........EXITED. Within two years after my 9th corps graduation..........I would safely estimate that about 60-70 of those 9th corps were gone. Just like the assembling of that way orchestra........so much talent...........then, a couple of years later...........poof, its gone. .
  8. Commune of Enablers

    A Tale of Two Citadels The citadel of good-hearted Christians was the one that strengthened and fortified the bonds of love, giving and support in the early days of twi. They believed in serving God and their fellow man with kindness and genuine concern. And, daily meditation in the Scriptures along with wholesome living were their guiding light. You found them serving at hq in the kitchen, on grounds and sometimes in the offices. Men and women like Milford and Betty Bowen, George and Bernita Jess or J. Fred Wilson. The citadel of the opportunists, yes-men and the cunning. Wierwille, commander-of-the-corps-sycophants, found solace and narcissistic pleasure in this citadel. The implementation of the corps program gave wierwille escalating power.....as this training was based on strict obedience to leadership, not scriptures. Obedience was the alpha and omega of the corps indoctrination program. It was a cunning move of deception within the ranks.......one that removed and displaced the "Christian element" from headquarters proper and filtered out on the field. The *way tree* was its marketing but the true reality was one of building a power base of control over others. Long gone was............A Mighty Fortress is Our God.
  9. When the mask came off

    Thomas........I'm sure that DWBH, socks, and penworks could give you a detailed accounting of these questions better than I can, but I'll take a swing at it. Why didn't wierwille have way builders build dormitories at hq? ................When the Executive Office Building (EOB) was built in 1969/1970.....upon early construction, it WAS slotted as a dormitory. That's why there are separate men's and women's shower rooms in the lower level of that building. The bedrooms were upstairs. BUT......midway thru construction, twi was growing at a significant pace and the "dormitory" was redirected as an office building for the growing staff: walter cummins' office, legal, finance, outreach and later, computer services that took over the west side of the building. Trailer park for staff residences? .............. Many of the early staff lived off-grounds and commuted from nearby towns. Again, I'm sure that DWBH, socks, and penworks could give lots of specifics on this.......but solid-down-to-earth staff like Hearnes, Bowens, Skapuras, Shroyers, Gluckins, Raths, Wilsons, and lots of others lived in the surrounding towns. There were staff residence homes/units near the BRC for the top-tier loyals........Howard Allen home, Ermal/Dorothy's unit, George/Bernita Jess' unit and the "original" corps unit which housed like six men on one side and six women on the other. BUT......when the 4th corps were inbound for in-residence, wierwille sent out a directive for them to secure housing via a trailer unit (??) placed out back that would be accommodated with electrical and plumbing services. Socks made reference to this at one time. Purchasing Emporia Campus and Rome City Campus? ........... Twi came to a major decision point when the 6th corps registration numbers came in: 325 people wanted to enter the corps indoctrination program. That was a figure that more than quadrupled the 5th corps number of 75. There was NO way that twi was prepared to have 325 in-residence corps at the way international: not enough classrooms or break-out rooms , cafeteria space, or workload where staff was already doing this work. This was 1974, heading into 1975. Thus, the purchase of the emporia campus ushered in a whole new scale of "work projects" as well as ample classrooms and dormitories. Twi put up the 147-acre property to leverage the purchase. The Rome City campus was for Family Corps.....as it was mainly "under one roof" and allowed for corps and children ample space.
  10. Commune of Enablers

    All of this was policy-driven....... One of the driving policies of the Corps Program: To become a great leader you must be an obedient follower (paraphrased). Obedience to leadership (....i.e. spiritual marine corps....) was tantamount to one's learning how to obey God's voice, holy spirit within. If you couldn't "listen, remember and obey" the corps leaders, how could you possibly be entrusted when God spoke revelation to you and have the discipline to obey His instructions? Every campus had its structure of obedience rules. The Indiana campus corps were instructed to always have a wooden spoon in their back pocket......to remind the kids, any one who needed reproof, who held authority. At LEAD, the final report of one's "spiritual test in the wilderness" was wholly scripted from the corps policy of "obedience." The underlying fault lines of the corps training.........were mapped by a skewering of the scriptures. Wierwille's incompetence was NOT the problem: his agenda and policy-driven mandates underscored the cumulative effect of hardened, inept corps grads that were later placed in leadership positions. Everything wrong that was instituted in the corps program personified the pathologies of victor paul wierwille. The rise and fall of twi........was greatly hastened by the corps program.
  11. Cat Woman

    Yep.......Mike's narration was scrubbed and replaced with Don Wierwille's voice-over. Standard modus operandi of twi.......
  12. Commune of Enablers

    Waysider............LOL. Yeah, I get the sarcasm.......but as we both know, those communes, to survive and thrive, were NOT indoctrination centers.
  13. Commune of Enablers

    Commune of Enablers............ Needed housing for the commune.........add trashy trailer houses in back forty acres Set up kitchen and "dining room" in basement of the teaching center..........lol Have gatherings and Saturday night gigs.....on the black top by wierwille home Funky lighted "dove"........on the red barn to symbolize holy spirit given Leader states most spiritual spots on grounds: #1) BRC, #2) Way Woods Bark wood structure is known as "House of His Healing Presence" Teaching Doctrine.......confess sin at end of day, then start anew You are righteous now.......no matter how much sexual predation is involved Wierwille dies..............and the cult movement is scattered to the wind.
  14. Commune of Enablers

    It takes a Commune of Enablers..........to build a cult. Nearly every one of these "New Religious Movements," variants of old ones, starts with one common ingredient: Communal Living. Isolated from the general public Own set of systems and standards Incestuous in-breeding of doctrine....and next generation Cauldron of Indoctrination......in communal campfire Only when "patriarch" dies off......does it slowly burn out Everything about wierwille/twi history.....show us how he step-by-step built his commune-concept. Classes were NOT enough.......wierwille taught, basically, 10 classes per year from 1958-1966 (averaging 20-25 students per class = 1,800 - 2,250 grads). What happened to all those people? Well, obviously.......nearly 80% or more never committed themselves to wierwille's movement. The class information was NOT enough to sway a majority........but it did sway a few to join wierwille. Plus, we know that contention arose in the Troy/Piqua area in 1960.......when believers were in major disagreement to move twi's headquarters to the Wierwille Homestead, because they did not trust veepee and harry to keep ministry finances separate from the farm business. The first exodus from wierwille...............1960. Scratching for a foothold, and leverage.....financially, socially and spiritually......wierwille moved back to the 147-acre farm. He needed his brother Harry's financial backing: Enabler #1. And, with Ermal and Dorothy Owens' strong support, wierwille gained Enabler #2 and Enabler #3. Ermal had background experience in construction and practical management; Dorothy was a retired school teacher and played the organ. Howard and Emogene Allen, from Kentucky, were instrumental as well. Working in a lumberyard, Howard was around the building trades......so when it came time to build the BRC, Howard was johnny-pound-the-nails. And, Emogene found her place in the overseeing twi's bookstore. Classes were NOT enough.........so twi ran Summer Camps. Summer Camps were NOT enough........so twi started Way Homes. Way Homes were NOT enough.......so twi started the Way Corps Program. See, you've got to have people ensconced (positioned and "secured") in a situation for a longer duration of time to indoctrinate them. Not just classes, or summer camps, or way homes.......but an isolated program that embodies a set of circumstances and structure to mold thinking processes. It has to embody peers ruling over peers to maximize affect [Lord of the Flies]....not just old farts in authoritarian positions. A corps program.....where elder corps "rule" and groom the younger corps. A program structured as such where area, branch and twig coordinators mentor the "apprentice" corps........and yet, all are in a system of structured selectiveness. Where classes are in-house teachings.....of which, many classes taught by these elder corps. Campus after campus.....with unique variables.....but ALL are communes. The concept of communes has a sordid history. No, I don't pretend to have done a massive study on this......but c'mon, it is SO BLATANTLY OBVIOUS. Communes in 1848.............1848. The Way International was a commune of enablers. Harry...........was his business, and personal life, on the up-and-up? Ermal..........how much spiritual savvy does it take to rubber-stamp a cult leader? Dorothy.......she never figured out the difference between education and indoctrination? Howard.......was wierwille's greatest enablers. What does that tell you? Emogene.....got her little fiefdom in twi's bookstore to wield her contempt over others. Self-appointed authoritative leader ---> ...communal living ---> ...utopian doctrine ---> ...sexual intercourse was spiritual ---> ....it ministers to the young people facing sexual starvation ---> ....and most favored virgin females of the community were reserved for cult leader. Nothing new under the sun................... .
  15. Untoward Secrecy

    Okay, okay........I know. Looks like I've got too much time on my hands............but, I was searching deeper into that Horowitz article Burned-over District ---> Oneida Community ---> John Humphrey Noyes ........ "In the fall of 1832, Noyes left Andover to enter the Yale Theological Seminary so that he could devote more time to Bible study. In addition to attending daily lectures, practicing his preaching technique, and engaging in Biblical study......" ........"Perfectionist leader[edit] The idea of Perfectionism, that it was possible to be free of sin in this lifetime, caused his friends to think him unbalanced, and he began to be called a heretic by his own professors. From the moment of his conversion, Noyes maintained that because he had surrendered his will to God, everything he chose to do was perfect because his choices “came from a perfect heart”.[6] His theory centered on the idea that the fact that man had an independent will was because of God and that this independent will came from God, therefore rendering it divine. The only way to control mankind’s will was with spiritual direction. Noyes proclaimed that "it was impossible for the Church to compel man to obey the law of God, and to send him to eternal damnation for his failure to do so." ........"The Oneida community’s utopian philosophy focused on the individual relationship to God; it was intended to be a sort of “kingdom of God on earth.” The second focus of the community was sexual morality." ........"Intercourse was spiritual; masturbation and the practice of intercourse without intention to propagate was shameful and wasteful. Noyes' theory of male continence consisted of analyzing sexual intercourse, recognizing in it two distinct acts, the social and the propagative. Noyes believed this to be practical and believed that a man should be content with avoiding the pleasure except when procreation is a desired result. Noyes believed sex limited to traditional Christian marriage practices left most young people facing sexual starvation from puberty (which according to Noyes was 14) to the age of marriage (which was about 24). Noyes' solution was that the young men in the community would practice with the women of the community who had already gone through menopause, until they were able to control their ejaculation. Only Noyes and a few other men had the skills and self-control necessary to participate in sexual intercourse with the young women of the community. Sexual intercourse was communal, it was based on consent, and all sexual unions were documented and regulated. Sexual intercourse was spiritual, and the pairing of man and woman for sexual intercourse in the community had to be approved by a committee, although most of the virgin females of the community were reserved for Noyes." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Self-appointed authoritative leader ---> ...communal living ---> ...utopian doctrine ---> ...sexual intercourse was spiritual ---> ....it ministers to the young people facing sexual starvation ---> ....and most favored virgin females of the community were reserved for cult leader. Untoward Secrecy...........INDEED.