Estimated Prophet

BG was enforcing his copy rights with a passion when I met him, and I think I know why.

He called the plagerism of his books "one terrible and continuing sinful practise" and a "diabolical disgrace."

You can still buy his books.

Go to http://www.ctcoftexas.com/ if you are interseted.

He used to be one of the Royal Canadien Mounted Police in the early 1900's as I recall.

He hunted down real bad guys like in the movies.

Not a man to be trifled with.

I understand VP met him as he was throwing ( phyisically) someone out of his class for falling asleep.

He was not one to tolerate "screwballism"

What I remember most about my day with him was how he cupped his ear and leaned in to hear better the manifestations of the holy spirit,

almost standing on his toes, with such a joy and energy.

He was 90 years old at that time,

but you could see his heart leap when he was hearing the Word of God.

A Man with a Ministry.

I had the honor of dining with Brother Leonard and Sister Evelyn a dozen years ago.

Sister Evelyn told me , with all seriousness, that the problem with The Way began when they let VPW get away with taking notes at B.G.'s class in 1955.

It allowed him to think he could break the rules when he wanted,

and to lean on his flesh rather than the spirit of God.

"[i'm going to spend some time here because I find this an especially vile post]"

WordWolf

You've a right to your opinions everyone.

I suppose if you don't believe in an accounting for disobedience before the righteous judge at the Bema, then you'll need to get your ball bat or sharpen your pen and take matters into your own hands. That's the way of Iniquity and lawlwssness as I see it , but go ahead and have at it.

What justifies your vile words towards me Mr Wordwolf?

How is that different from the motives that justified all the physical and verbal abuse that you are so outraged at CES for inflicting on people?

If you would simply forgive, you could let go of all that baggage.

Sounds like you are still following the letter of Way Corps training rather than the Prince of Peace.

We are all so quick to seize the error and magnify it way beyond proportion.

'John Lynn insulted us because he won't post here"

Outrageous!!!

and who is he that would lay anything to the charge of God's elect?

Evil is as Evil does.

Shall we overcome evil with evil?

or overcome evil with good?

Sin and Death?

Life and Peace?

Your choice.

"Liar and Theif"? or

" Holy and Without Blame"?

One can make a case for either side.

I choose to believe the Word.

and I will reprove rebuke and admonish In season and Out of season when called upon.

( like right at this moment )

I am preacing the power of the Cross.

Foolish to some. ( rationalizing?)

A stumbilng block to others.

But to those who are being saved it is the power of God.

Can anybody hear me? !!

My picture is of a skeleton in a jester's costume. (holding the harp unstrung)

It is a reflection of my my foolish preaching out of a broken and corrupted body.

See Gal 2:20 and I Cor 1-4, Eph 2

The Cross represents the ultimate of cruelty and abuse anyone ever inflicted upon another.

It represents the depravity of the unredeemed soul.

It represents the consequences of evil actions.

It also represents the ultimate expresion of Love,

that our Savior would take that sort of punishment on our behalf,

and then forgive the ones who killed him.

It represents the lamb of God

that takes away the sins of VPW and John Lynn and You and Me...

I suggest you spend some time at the Cross Mr. Wordwolf,

and let its wonder working power soak in.

This is the same truth I spoke to John Lynn,

and he responded in much the same manner as you Mr. WordWolf.

Lets make sure everybody knows all the rotten things that were done.

Really.

Is that the wisdom from above ? Hmmmmm

Now, after 15 years of attacking and being attacked, what has this method amounted to?

And I will fight for you too WordWolf,

just like I will fight for John Lynn,

and for the honor of Jesus Christ whom we like to think we are serving.

God Have Mercy

I'm sorry that you see it that way.

I wonder what the view is like at the Right hand of God.

Hmmm

i think you need to poke around this site a bit. "dr." w was a liar and a thief. it's all here, EP. do some digging, if you really care about "the Truth."

Shields UP !!!

( Hi Sprawled Out )

Dr W was a liar and a thief?

That is what I call a direct evil accusation.

As I said before,

there is a thing called the bondage of corruption that is in the world through Lust.

and there is only one way to escape it.

Jesus.

That is the truth I care about.

In the world, we are all guilty as sin.

In Christ we are cleansed from all impurities.

Sin is the problem.

Jesus is the Solution.

Walk On Sprawled Out

... I have no interest in a religion or god who makes people expendable for the movement of his great Truth.

I'm sorry that's your opinion, Bramble,

but I put it in the category of an implied evil accusation.

Honestly, Bramble,

what's going on in your heart to respond to my post like that?

Do you really believe people are considered "expendable" by the folks at S&T?

Wow.

That's really a hell of a thing to say.

and I suppose you are without sin and never caused anyone pain or distress...

Hmmm

I think you need to open your spiritual eyes and see who is really out to destroy people.

We are in a spiritual battle,

and unfortunately there are casualties,

All I know to do is look to Jesus Christ and to hold on to him as tight as I can.

That is not "dirty"

but actually the Way to healing, wholeness , and purity.

Just gotta say, it seems to me that if a minister devoted his full time career to the work of the ministry--for say, twenty to thirty years!-- teaching the 'greatest known truth since the first century church,' there would be more good fruit to show for it than broken marriages, broken friendships, law suits, internal power plays and weird prophecies and manipulations.

Something basic and important is wrong. IMO, to continue following these leaders is foolish.

I have observed a ton of good fruit over the years.

Great friendships, healed marriages (mine being one) , inspired teachings and prophecies that energize genuine Faith and Love.

John Lynn, in particular, taught me to follow the Lord Jesus,

so that I don't have to be mislead by men.

So that I can have a genuine relationship with Jesus,

"...who picks up the threads of a broken heart

and weaves them together again..."

My Lord Jesus leads me to extend mercy, love, goodness, and wisdom

towards people who have not totally escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

I'm one of those people too.

how did it go, Living Victoriously in Peace?

'Do you want to be frustrated?

Look at others

Do You wnat to be miserable?

Look at yourself

Do you want to have Peace?

Look at Jesus Christ'

and let me add,

while you're looking at Jesus,

he will show you how he looks at others and yourself,

and he will show you how you can serve him in working to heal and restore our hearts.

It is the most wonderful thing.

I recall discussing VPW with John Lynn 15 or so years ago,

and John wanting me to see how much "evil" was involved in the Way.

He didn't think I was seeing it for some reason.

I did, but

I still don't care to focus on that crap.

All that evil is fairly minimal

when compared to the tremendous Truth that was held forth by Dr W.

Likewise John L.

it's the same old story, the same old spiritual battle,

the same " strength for today and bright hope for tomorrow..."

I disagree with you about regrets at the Bema, but if you want to discuss it, we can open a thread

in the Doctrinal forum and not derail this one.

Well I hope you are correct on this one, Word Wolf.

I think the topic would make for a great discission.

Estimated,

I find what was done to Elizabeth Lynn exceptionally grievous and disturbing. It reminds me so much of how chosen "lower rung believers" or those whom had been marked, for whatever reason, were shredded and thrown into the spin cycle by "elders" of TWI, some of which I was a personal witness to back in the day.

...

Look, I don’t want to beat up on you personally, this is not just directed at you, but regarding the practice of personal prophecy, something obviously wasn’t practiced in the holy spirit or in truth and light-spiritually.

...

Who do you wanna be like, Saul or David?

God bless you,

You are always welcome at the bema.

God Bless You too , But Now I See.

That was an excellent post.

We will all be giving an account for our words and actions at the Bema.

and there will be much weeping and knashing of teeth.

I am also not involved in the leadership of S&T,

so I don't take any of your words personally,

but you speak the Truth in Love and I salute you for for that.

I saw the ship heading for troubled waters three years ago,

but never expected it to become this troubled.

I believe they have allowed their passion for holiness and purity

to justify taking harmful actions against their brothers and sisters in Christ.

I believe the goodness of God causes men to repent.

That the Love of God constrains us to do His will.

and that the Wisdom from above works the peacable fruits of righteousness.

All of those elements are needed in the S&T BOD.

They must also eliminate the wisdom that is earthly, sensual and devilish

which lead to contentions and Every Evil Work.

God Have Mercy

EP... I'm guessing you are a "P1" from that quote...

...yes... the stRangers win the world series, mark it down... the rest of you guys can cheer for us as well...

Yep Yep

a P1 from the days of 11 to 2

World Series victory?

stRanger things have happened.

Estimated Prophet, are we talking about the same thing?

Yes and no.

[I think I'm talking about the best case scenarios of prophecy,

and your addressing the worst case, or abuses in prophecy.]

You, of your own free will, choose to go to someone you believe has spiritual insight or prophcey,whatever, to get something confirmed that you think God might be trying to tell you. I have no problem with that. Heck, I've had my cards read before.

Here is problem#1.

Are you then required to obey that person's prophesy, on pain of divorce or mark and avoid? You are expected to make changes A,B and C?

[My personal opinion is that you would be required to take those words to the feet of the Master, and consider them before Him (Jesus). Obeying God in Christ is paramont.

I never like the "permission to fail" that CES extended to prophetic utterance.

But that notion also serves to alert us that the prophecies may be flawed.]

It becomes their business? The business of the elders in your church?

[ that is a sad fact of life !!

I get a flash of Jack Nicolson shoutng "You can't handle the Truth"

whenever I think about really opening up to Christian Counselors.

There are some you can trust, and some that you can't.]

Problem #2.

People who you haven't asked to prophesy for you suddenly pop up with wacky stuff about you that God told them. Your husband, being so full of love and stuff, divorces you because you are wacky, the prophets said so. Obviously their words must be obeyed.

I got a big problem with that. I would call that boundary jumping, people being busybodies.

[ When I see that happening I see Red Flags waving. MOst people will tell you if they have a Word for you and then let you decide if you want to hear it.

And I would say Never Never automatically obey a prophecy without geting alone with God in Christ and being clear with them in your hert of hearts.]

That's personal prophecy? Where the person prophesied about is like in third person ?

God told me to tell you that your wife...

That you would still consider those people church leaders and elders boggles my mind.

[ The gifts and callings of God are without repentance,

and His mercy is rich and everlasting,

and my Lord wants us to receive one another,

even as he has already received us,

into his grace and Glory.

but that does not mean I allow them to run my life,

nor have I folowed their lead that has drifted away from the love of Christ ]

Well, not really. Twenty years in TWI-- I know that people are often expendable for the Work of the Ministry.

[ Not in Christ !!

My Lord would never throw anyone under the bus

God Bless You Bramble ]

Why do you need another person to prophesy for your life? Does your God nor deal with you directly? It has to be through someone else? So instead of trying to hear directly from your God, you go to someone else?

Good question Bramble.

I think we all, at times can let a man's agenda superscede the Lord's agenda.

I know I have.

Sometimes we need a confirmation of exactly what the Almighty God is trying to tell us,

or if we are only hearing a human's speculation.

When you're in a situation that is very pressing,

sometimes a word from above makes a huge difference.

When my cousin was facing surgury, my mother went to visit.

My mother spoke something reassuring to my cousin regarding God,

that was exactly what her pastor ahd told her earlier that day.

My mother,

who wasn't even aware that she was prophecying,

was moved by the spirit of God to speak those words,

which confirmed for my cousin that God would work to bring her healing,

because He said it to her twice in a way that could not be pre-arranged

which energized her faith.

and she came through the surgury successfully.

I don't know if that answers your question,

but experiences like that make me marvel at the Wonders of our God.

I'm sure Mark Sanguinetti was not the only voice of reason they have heard, too bad they didn't harken to it.

Reading Elizabeth's letter smacks of all the tactics used by TWI heavy handed cronies, same fear tactics, same smear campaigns, same mark and avoid of those labeled with spirits. No new thing under the sun. Very sad indeed.

...

Geez, no wonder the whole freakin generation of those stiffnecked children of Israel had to die off before Moses could lead them to the promised land, when will they ever learn?

Great Points.

The Elizabeth Lynn saga is very hard for me to comprehend, but it did happen.

I known of at least one person who received what I consider a genuine revelation

concerning John and Elizabeth before they divorced which was totally unheeded.

It doesn't seem to appear on the prophetic council's report.

Why ?

I have to believe if the B.O.D. will look and see why only the attacks upon Elizabeth were given an audience, then they will see how they are now in a crisis.

I believe that its another case of a man's agenda supersceding the Lord Jesus Christ's agenda.

I pray that my friends will truely hold Jesus as the Head of the Body and allow Him to bring things back into order.

Also.

I believe the Lord Jesus Christ raised up The Sprit and Truth Fellowship Int.

as a blessing for the Next Genration.

For the generation that wasn't subjected to waybrainitis.

I have high hope for this organization and pray it will weather the storm

and achieve all of its potential.

"Jehova Jehova Jehova "

sorry, just some Monty Python humor.

Yes, there can and have been some dog and pony shows with prophecy.

So shall we categorically ban all prophesying?

And there have been misleading and manipulative bible teachings.

Shall we ban teaching from the bible?

fear has ruined more ministries...

Let me just say that over the past twenty or so years as I've endeavored to grow in my faith,

I've been very blessed to have people like John Lynn and John Schoenheit and Mark Graeser

to converse with and consider all the possibilities. Them and tons of other good folks.

My friends at CES have done their best to give sound biblical advice,

and share on their practical experiences. We have all learned as we have grown.

The personal prophecy is no longer promoted as much as it used to be,

likewise Momentous.

When they recognize problems they do address them.

Its a circumspectful walk,

and Paul prayed for Love to abound in all knowledge and jusdgement.

"so that you may approve the things that are excellent,

in order to be sincere and blameless

until the day of Christ" Philippians 1:10 NASB

John Lynn likes to live on the edge you know, and I admire that.

If were to neber open his mouth to prophecy,

then he would never do it wrong.

I much prefer, however, having the freedom to persue the things of God;

than to have remained in Roman Catholocism and adhering the religious status quo.

Here in Dallas it Sunny and in the Seventies.

My boy has already played about a dozen games with his school.

They almost play year round here.

The Rangers report looks very promising.

best pirtching ever.

passionate new manager.

Solid infield.

They've always been able to score runs.

and Sammy Sosa seems to have his head right with baseball,

and hasn't lost any bat speed.

I'm getting excited.

...

So please don't let that stop you from pressing into Him with whom we have to do;

and to flow in the spirit of His Way,

namely Jesus Christ.

Thanks for the advice, but a quick physical walk down one of my roads in life over here, will possibly convince you it's a lot easier and safer to keep preaching behind a keyboard. All that flowing wisdom sounds great, I just wish you were here to help me implement more of it. I keep telling people to expand their comfort zones and come visit but no takers so far...except MrtheEvan from Keeenya!

Thanks for the invitation Bumpy.

I'm sorry I can't be with you,

but the flowing wisdom is always with you as you walk your road.

There is substance to what I'm saying if you're willing to believe it,

because it is based upon the Word of Truth

which is based upon the Integrity of God

which is based upon the Power of God.

Rejoice that we have a Lord whose support and supply are constantly working in your life and in your situation.

Yea and Amen

...

Wouldn't your deity tell you personally, if your spouse or another person in your life was truly evil?

The whole set up looks like an open door to let people manipulate and abuse each other! Where's the safe guards?

Yes Bramble,

that possibility exists.

But I think manipulaters will still manipulate, so we maut always be on guard.

I hold to Dr W.'s idea that Giod will tell you first,

so that a prophetic Word will resonate with what you already know inside.

Prophc y is a gift of God's Grace that he wants us to use

and to use Wisely.

No Estimated Prophet, I wasn`t baiting you. Thank you for giving me the benefit of the doubt.

'''

The example you sighted, I cannot tell out of context which part, or to whom it is referring, that you have an issue with. I cannot say that I agree or disagree with you there....I will have to go back and read in context.

Rascal,

I was referencing. Post 630.

I believe the person who made that post was expressing their honest opinion,

I wouldn't call them a liar, just misguided.

The same poster has made many other valid observations that I agree with,

and I really appreciate the passion and hunger for righteousness that they display.

So just like with my freinds at CES, and with prophecies;

I am grateful that people care enough to speak into my life,

and I consider what they are saying, but I don't always have to agree with it.

I don't doubt , having read your response, that you are sincere in not wanting to bait me.

Its cool.

and I recognize the I am also capable of being wrong at times and "inventing" notions that just aren't true.

My whole point was for us to emphasize the positive and not magnify the negatives.

and keep asking the Father of Lights for wisdom that works the fruits of righteousness.

Peace

Invented bad things to say about people that God loves??? Where? When? Who?

Have you really not noticed Rascal?

I have a strong suspicion that you are baiting me to open a can of worms.

Hmmm

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that your question is sincere,

and will give you this one recent example.

( and ask Pond to forgive me for the disturbance this post will cause)

no one really believes after all hmm? haha just your circle of what you think and who you think you know.

you pick and chose what fits into your agenda clearly like STF.

and the atitude bro the attitude has to go.

love who YOU chose is good enough, and quickly dismiss all others(no not me I could care less what you think)

keep your checking in.. bro.. just in case . hahaha you really believe they are THE most high for God and dare I say ONLY ones who have the truth still dont you?

hmmmm

so I think

' they are the most high for God and the only ones who have the truth'

Nope. Sorry. That is completely not the case.

these comments, in my considered opinion, are based only upon (dare I say)

the invention of a misguided imagination.

thinly veiled as sarcasm.

" some folks look for answers

some folks look for fights

some folks live in tree tops

just looking for their kites...

if a man among you

ain't got no sin upon his hands

let him cast a stone at me for

playing in the band" Robert Hunter

…I'm not trying to be disrespectful or give you a hard time with all this. It's just that at this point – what stands out the most to me is the confusion and harm that's been generated by this personal prophecy stuff. I think this falls into the category of what God says I should shun. I remain unconvinced that it's something from the Holy Spirit. While I agree with the sentiment to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace I would also add that the unity it refers to is FROM the Spirit – it is something originating from God – not legislated by leadership, or at the expense of truth, or agreeing not to disagree. The impression that I get of CES from comments on these threads is the similarity of CES leadership to TWI leadership – where people are expendable, and the role of leadership becomes more a status symbol of achieving super-spirituality, a royal priesthood. Though words may paint up this brand of leadership as a humble position of service - in practice it plays out as a position of power and influence, supported and served by those who rank lower in this hierarchy of human design.

T Bone,

I really appreciate the thought you put into your posts.

Thanks.

You note:

" It's just that at this point – what stands out the most to me is the confusion and harm that's been generated by this personal prophecy stuff. "

I consider that a valid point of view based upon what has been discussed here at the Grease Spot.

From my perspective,

what stands out is the genuine edification, exhortation, and encouragement that occurs when genuine prophecy is manifested.

Bumpy,

Even in Africa with limited access to books and computers,

the spirit of the Living God will work within you to speak a blessing to your neighbor.

Our Almighty God is able to manifest his love and goodness where you are, and I pray that your presence reflects His light and the rhythm of the drums respond in a new and fresh glory to God.

Consider Jesus with the woman at the well in John 4.

" ...ye worship ye know not what..."

but ask Jesus and he will give any and all "living water."

Prophetic utterance is a wellspring of wisdom flowing from the fountain of living waters

Yes there are deceitful influences that cause confusion and harm,

but avoiding prophecy will not put an end to that.

So please don't let that stop you from pressing into Him with whom we have to do;

and to flow in the spirit of His Way,

namely Jesus Christ.

...

I would have to ask – is that the Spirit of God moving you to do so? How do you know? And what do you mean by "check in with Him all the time"?...Alright so - you think you've spotted a false prophecy by noting they're recommending a divorce – what if they recommend someone marry a specific person?...I don't know – there's so many things here that just invite confusion and deception – and don't refer to a biblical standard…some bold assumptions really…

...How is any of this confusion profitable to the church? I know from experience how TWI is just a world of confusion and deception from setting their own standards of truth and practice and it looks to me like the reason for CES being in a mess. You still haven't convinced me that it is the same thing as the prophecy of Bible times. II Peter 1:20 leaves no room for any confusion, assumptions or what have you - when it says, "no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will" - people did not decide on the message or have practice sessions - it did not originate from human effort. But as it says they were "moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God."

...

I think your reference to I Thessalonians 5:20 "do not despise prophetic utterances" may largely fall into the written Word category. The MacArthur Study Bible notes on this verse:

T Bone,

I'm sorry to keep you waiting,

but have been experiencing some technical difficulties the past few days.

Thanks for sharing your insight and research.

I love the scripture , believe me.

I have been accused of 'worshipping the bible'

It is my standard of faith and practice with which I encourage everybody to utilize to recognize right and wrong, good and evil, and to discern the thoughts and intents of the heart.

Perhaps the scholars are correct, and I Thess 5:20 is referencing holy scripture.

I just can't agree with that.

1. Up until Paul wrote those words, there was no scripture yet addressed to The Christian Church.

( except maybe James according to some scholars ) but plenty of prohetic utterance.

2. The First Century Church did not have the abundance of bibles at hand as we enjoy,

and by and large most of the prophetic comunication would likely have been spoken and not read.

Let me also emphasise this:

"Hold Fast to that which is Good."

It seems to me tht many posters, and also Dr J. "s report

have dismissed any and all the good aspects of S&T,

and held fast to the Bad,

and even invented other bad things to say about people whom God Loves,

and for whom Jesus Christ died for,

people who have demonstrated a diligent effort to serve Jesus Christ and glorify God

over a long period of time.

That does not excuse the harm that has been caused by sinful actions.

But the will of God remains clear.

"hold fast to that which is Good"

" whatsoever things are good....think on these things "

" forbearing one another in love, endeavoring to keep the unity of the spirit in the bond of Peace"

Is that so hard to do?

God Have Mercy !

I know one BOD member of S&T in paticular,

who has read these posts and been hurt by what he read.

" kick 'em when they're down" ?!!

not in my bible.

not according to any holy prophet I know.

It's very cool that you referenced Romans 5, T Bone

( and thanks for the kindness and grace that permeates your posts btw)

which demonstrates how we have access with boldness into a righteous and sanctified relationship with the Father and the Son.

Sometimes, while "checking in" with them

one might receive a word of knowledge or wisdom, or discern a spirit;

and be instructed to speak that word to someone else.

What a wonderfully powerful blessing that is.

That is how prophecy is rightly done.

" for he who in this way serves Christ is acceptable to God

approved by men" Romans 14:18

When I said the standards have been relaxed since Deut.

I was not indicating that its ok to sin now-a -days.

I was referring to the fact that we don't stone to death sinful people any more.

Romans 5 again addresses how we have been justified freely.

Thanks for pointing that out.

and even when reading the scripture,

things will get mixed up.

Yet I have found the Truth has a way of making itself known

to those with eyes that see and ears that hear

and hearts that understand.

where is Jesus christ in your life.

Pond,

Thanks for your concern for my relationship with our Lord Jesus Christ.

He is my all in all,

and he is everything to me.

I hope that answers your question.

I love what he Loves and

that includes John Lynn, Mark Graeser, John Schoenheit

and a whole bunch of other good people

who happen to miss the mark at times.

does that bother you?

None of them has ever let me down,

Because I never expected them to hold me up.

I am not disenchanted with S&T Fellowship Int.,

because I was never enchanted with them.

I am not disillsioned,

because I was never under any illusions as to Who my Lord is.

and I am praying for your heart Pond.

That the Prince of Peace will come in ,

and destroy the enmity,

and engage you in genuine and holy fellowship.

Maybe then you will be willing to forgive me for me faults,

even as He has.

You are right.

I am a piece of work,

but I trust the Father is yet able to complete the work He has begun in me.

and in You too.

Sounds like a good time, Tom

lets do it.

Will it bother you if I wear my Jason Varitek

World Series Shirt !!

and tell me,

do you think Sammy Sosa will make the cut?

Yes Sir.

I was born in the Red Sox Nation,

but came to Dallas as WOW in '82 and have been here ever since.

I think the Rangers are shaping up better than ever this year,

and locking in Micheal Young would be the best thing John Boy Daniels has ever done.

…I think there's a big issue with Gregg F's theory – because there is no Scriptural basis for it – and it opens the door for error, confusion, and spiritual deception to sneak in. If a message is truly from God – how can there be error in it? What about the high standard of accountability set forth in the Bible?

Deuteronomy 18:20-22 NASB

20 'But the prophet who speaks a word presumptuously in My name which I have not commanded him to speak, or which he speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet shall die.'

21 "You may say in your heart, 'How will we know the word which the LORD has not spoken?'

22 "When a prophet speaks in the name of the LORD, if the thing does not come about or come true, that is the thing which the LORD has not spoken The prophet has spoken it presumptuously; you shall not be afraid of him.

Now how does the standard of prophecy in the above passage compare to ever-adaptable-flexible-personal prophecy?

II Peter 1:20, 21 NASB

20 But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation,

21 for no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.

Good Feedback T-Bone.

( likewise Joe Pascha and Rascal )

Let me first try to remove Gregg F from the discussion.

My recollection of exactly what he said ten years ago may be sincere,

but is certainly flawed.

I own those words I wrote regarding Acts 21.

Please don't hold him accountable for what I think he might have said.

Thanks.

Being the "Estimated Prophet" , I am one who speculates on what is true

more than establishes the truth.

You are very right, T Bone in demonstrating in Acts 2 how the blame for the crucifixion of Jesus Christ, as well as Paul's arrest, is on the Jews.

Acts 21 is not a great example of a mixed up prophecy, but its the best I can come up with.

:)

I would also like to think that the standards set in Deuteronomy are more relaxed now that we are living in the Age of Grace.

That does not make false prophecy acceptable in any way,

but isn't it a sin to not speak prohetically when the spirit is moving you to do so?

I do believe that holiness is essential.

I used to think it was mostly Believing,

but now I consider holiness more important.

As Peter told Simon the Sorcerer,

we need to get our heart right with God before we can appropriately speak for God

I don't have all the answers,

but I know Him who does and check in with Him all the time.

and by Him I mean God in Christ Jesus my Lord.

There's a Greek word called "Gnosis" which makes an excellent study.

It's an intuitive knowledge.

and it can be very misleading given half a chance,

and has led to the Gnostic Gospels.

I think that to fully walk in the prophetic demands walking in gnosis knowledge,

but with strong support of the scripture and reliable friends in the Faith.

For instance,

Knowing from scripture that the Lord hates divorce,

I have a problem believing a prophecy instructing one to do that.

I do believe that the Lord intends for us to utilize prophecy in the church, and that it is propfitable for all.

I Thessaloniams 5:19-21 NASB

"Do not quench the spirit;

do not despise prophetic utterances.

But exanine everything carefully;

hold fast to that which is good"

An old professor from The Dallas Theological Seminary didn't believe that the power of the holy spirit was available any more.

Then the Lord began to show him a few things.

His name is Jack Deere and he's written some very good books on the subject if you care to read them.

this is his web site www.jackdeere.com

and 'may the Lord give us understanding in all things"