ljn698

ain't he the one who says TWI doesn't hold back anything

from their followers,but rather gives them all a "soup-to-nuts"

accounting of everything that goes on

or am i nuts to fall for that ol' soup?

o well

The one overarching question I had from first hearing of the "POP" paper till when I finally left WayWorld (about 3 years later) was "What the hell IS wrong?".

We constantly heard how screwed up the BOT was and all the Corps and various and sundry leaders and how "spiritually" we were just all F-ed up, but specifics were damned scarce. All we ever got was a whole lotta vague. We were all "off the WURD" and Geer doubted if we'd ever get right again. BUT WHAT EXACTLY WAS WRONG? We were just supposed to know.

this pretty much was exactly what me and

i guess alot of us other "joe believers"

thought at the time

there's some heavy duty bad things comin' down the pike

we can't tell you any details

but watch out

ok if you say so!

from what i see on these forums

that's one thing that hasn't changed

in twi...ever.

obviously you havent been to a way fellowship since martindale was kicked out...

so now it's kicked out

when i first found Waydale the line

they were feeding 'em was that he resigned.

how long did it take (among those still in) to replace

"resigned" with the more ignominious KICKED OUT?

we could call this thread

"get rich quick in the God racket"

ya know it wasn't uncommon for

some limb and territory coordinators to

refer to themselves (jokingly of course)

as "Cult leaders"

even some corp grads who weren't

coordinating much more than a twig

did the same thing

if there's one thing i learned

during my tenure as a "dedicated follower"

(just 'cause i couldn't be a "member")

it's that it's better not to follow anybody

but rather make up your own mind

i thought these guys got in trouble for doing the internut thing

about this whole chair stringing nonsense

it seemed that people would go through hours of grief

about this stuff

only to have people move the chairs

to make themselves comfortabe

in the meetings anyway

one time, on a WOW year

i was assisting people who were doing this

and it took them so long to plan and execute

the chair stringing

that i was forced to leave them all to it

due to the fact that i had to get to sleep by midnite

for all the talk of redeeming the time

and what not

when it came to petty crap like this

what a bunch of shizz-nozz

ok all you guys who demanded

or even still demand

that these things be done

if any of you are out there

defend your position

make your case

convince me that GOD almighty

really cares about where

your chair is in some meeting

go ahead

don't be bashful

I know i'm not the only one who

asks this

here's your big chance to put it in writing

go on...set all us

Philistines straight once and for all

ya know sumpin,

this whole adversary's gonna get you thing

probably would have carried a little more weight

had it been advanced by people who

did NOT wake up an entire WAYCORP class at 3:00 AM

and demand their signitures on a LOYALTY OATH

under pain of immediate expulsion

or

people who were NOT so easily recognizable as

DO as I SAY NOT as I DO types in general

or maybe people who DID NOT immediately

change the subject or worse yet

blow people off outright when one of those

"uncomfortable questions" was asked

you know, one of those soup to nuts things

and a whole lotta other stuff

that hundreds of other folks have related

over the years since

therefore, fretting about the loss of God's protection

just for not being a dedicated TWI follower anymore

seemed like worrying over nothing to me.

however I certainly admire the guts

that some of you guys had

and still have

after sticking with TWI for so long and

then getting kicked out for some

petty reason or another

to pick up and start anew

in a whole new atmosphere

where almost nobody has ever even heard of TWI

and even fewer people

consider them anything more than

a blip on the GODSTUFF radar.

sorry, loss of eternal rewards is the answer . . . .loss of eternal rewards. All of this life will be forgotten. for the joy set before us, we suffer, or something.

this post reminds me of something said by one of the way leaders

during a teaching one time

whenever IDOLOTRY occurs in christian circles

two symptoms occur

one is that the manifestations of holy spirit are ignored or mis-taught and misused

the other is that the HOPE of Christ's return is replaced with JUDGEMENT

throughout my time in TWI, that second one about the hope being replaced with judgement

kept getting more and more apparent as the years went by

but then see what happens to you if you even suggest that the cause of this legalistic judgement

might be idolotry.

just an idea

looks like most of the folks here who answered are in the same demographic as me

but why wasn't "followed pretty girl in" one of the choices for how to join?

of course if vpw was still alive and kickin, the vast majority of the off shoot starters,

and even some of the folks on this post-fest would not DARE to seperate themselves

from twi.

just an observation please don't take it as a personal slight anyone.

every religion seems to have a story like this so-called "snowy gas pumps story" don't they?

of the people who are under the impression that the whole thing was just a cock and bull story

(which of course can neither be proven nor disproved)

how many folks think Moses made up the burning bush story?

or Joseph Smith made up the Angel Moroni story?

or any of the fantastic things cooked up by L. Ron Hubbard?

i could go on but you get the idea

the point of this is what difference does it make whether people believe the snowy gas pump story or not?

and to answer the question of the thread, given everything that has been discussed about this topic so far,

my leanings are toward the hallucination notion.

one time, a person asked me if our "people" celebrated Christmas

i said hell we celebrate every day!

Ah, the campfire! The campfire, the campfire.

How much human history has been set in motion around the campfire? Wars. Love. Schemers. Plotters. Steelworkers. Cooks. Arsonists. People who love smoky wood.., Ah!

Ahhhh, yes. I can remember it now, as if it were yesterday. The summer school class of 1975 at Way HQ, sitting in The Way Woods around a roaring campfire, all eyes fixated upon the flames. Relaxing, relaxing, relaxing, upon our earthen seats. A time when all defenses were down -- a time when, after a busy day of school we would gather and sit (oh, no, S.I.T!) and wait for doctor to arrive upon his golf cart. Then we would sit and listen to him speak from his heart, into hearts that were helpless and open.

Ahhhh, yes. The tender times around campfires...

Makes me want to break out in song, it does!

25 years ago

they spoke out and

they broke out

of recession

and oppression

and together they toked

and they folked out

with guitars

around the BONFIRE

just singin' and clappin'

Man, what the hell happened?

Yes some were spell bound

some were hell bound

some they fell down

and some got back up

and fought back 'gainst the meltdown

and their kids were hippy chicks

all hypocrites

because fashon is smashing the true meaning of it.....

1) Your similar experiences witnessing.

ok i'm going back to 1984-85 a WOW year for me.

if I witnessed to someone and they were not receptive IT WAS MY FAULT

if I witnessed to someone and they were receptive but didn't come to twig IT WAS MY FAULT

if I witnessed to someone and they were receptive, and came to twig, but didn't take PFAL IT WAS MY FAULT

if I witnessed to someone and they looked a bit too scruffy for SOME PEOPLE's taste, IT WOULD BE MY FAULT if

the so-called scruffy witnessee ever did anything bad to the blessed ministry

or at least this is the kind of thing that seemed to be heaped upon my head the whole time and so

after a short while of this, it seemed that i should just lay low, and gut out the whole rest of the year

I know, shame on ME

2) Your now current view as to what you expect to see & who you now hold forth GOD''s Word to out of nothing more or less than God's love.

these days... when people i hang with bring up God stuff, i usually listen more than i talk, that way, I learn more

and I stay out of trouble

the thing about "holding forth God's word" (meaning witnessing on behalf of some church group or another) is, people can instinctively (and instantly) tell when whatever someone else says to them comes from some narrow or one-dimensional viewpoint and naturally, they're turned off by it.

it has been said "before you give an opinion on a subject, make sure the person you're giving it to wants it"

if this adage doesn't apply to witnessing I don't know what does.

"the ministry is a nut magnet" (thus saith the LORD)

seriously though

i feel ya here

I lost track of how many times i Spoke the Word (or such as i knew)

to some poor soul, down on his luck, most of whom were the most

receptive to what TWI had to offer, only to be sharply rebuked by

some high bottom co-ordinator or another for my too much focusing on

what one of those co-ordinators called "lower life".

oh well life goes on

Since this man was even referred to as "The Word in the Flesh" ...

wowee you mean Jesus Himself ran the thing?

but seriously though

all the stuff on the list would be nice for any organization or fellowship (if you'll pardon the expression)

throw in something about hanging on to your (ahem) "green stuff" ***

rather than advising the faithful to "dig deep" all the time

***as we collect our love offering, please be aware of the fact that Pastor Creditfo' A. Dollar is allergic to the sound of silver! <--- just a joke!

ooooooooooooh ohhhhhhhhhhh

I forgot

How about NOT doing things that need to be covered up in the foist place?

aha? aha?

There's nothing GSers like better than a long, ugly TWI tale...

Gasp! Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

"God will open the windows of heaven the moment you lay your tithe at 'the apostle's feet'."

translation= God will open up the windows of heaven the moment your check clears

nyuk nyuk nyuk nyuk

only kidding

i'm surprised no one has yet replied to this post

that renewed mind is (at least to some) the same as the washed brain

yuk yuk just foolin

i understand that newlife

it's as though all the youthful enthusiasm got used up by twi or something

upon going bye-bye from twi it sure woulda been nice to get a

refund of all that enthusiasm.

i'd even take that over the abs money!

oh well life goes on anyway

so many tales of conniving confidence artistry.

I should talk. for all i know there's posters and lurkers here who only remember me, if at all, as one of those halfway-house assholes who was never COMMITTED enough to do God stuff.

be that as it may, one thing is certain, people learn alot more from example than they do from precept.

I couldn't begin to list all the run-ins I had with some people who had this whole superiority/holier-than-thou/

healthier-than-thou kinda trip going on.

one example comes to mind of this one person who was really into physical fitness and thought I should be too

(talk about a lost cause)

one day he decided to join the local ymca, and use their gym stuff. ok good for him.

couple of months later he gets a job at a local fancy gymnasium, as a trainer.

at this point he now takes on the role of salesman for the fancy gym, trying to extoll the virtues of physical fitness to everybody he comes in contact with, including me.

of course, now (circumstances having changed) at this juncture, the $10 per month ymca gym membership

ain't good enough anymore. NOW it's best to join the gym he works at for several hundred ducks for 6 months or so.

anyway the point of this is that the deeper someone got into TWI, the more of a conniving confidence arteest

they seemed to become.

i relate this story, not to disparage the fitness guy, but to illustrate the kind of thing that otherwise good people would resort to when trying to get along in Wayworld.

I'm certain, that had I been placed in a similar curcumstance, I would be no less of a conniver

the great thing about no longer being in an organization like TWI, we don't have to put up with that kind of sheesh-ka-bob anymore, from either direction.

comeback I HATE that word!!!

it's RETURN!!!

(now i need a picture of rosalie rivenbark in full make up yuk yuk!!)

sorry if reference is lost on some of the younger crowd!!!

1983 the year i joined

couldn't have been any happier at the time

whole family thought i was loopy but other than that a pretty good time

missed out on sound out 84

kicked myself for years after about it

but went to advanced pfal class in summer of 1984

remember motorcycle club coming through to visit

right after advanced class rock of ages 84

then wow year

thought i was going to die <--figure of speech

anyway interesting story about wow year. got sent out with 3 other people

2 boys 2 girls typical wow situation

for myself going wow was my ticket out of living

with my parents for the next 15 years

like my younger brother ended up doing

(which ended up being a smart move for him after all

because today he's a college grad and fairly well off

and i'm posting on computer forums about the old days)

so i loved the getting away from home part

big time as we used to say

however my wow brother he had kind of a hard time

getting along with our two wow sisters

right off the bat there was talk of sending him off the wow field

which i thought was not the right thing to do

because after all he didn't do any of the three

"unforgivable" sins of the wow field

namely violence, abuse of drugs, or an homosexual act.

really the only thing that seemed to be wrong with him was

that he wasn't getting along with the two girls

me he didn't bother and anyway any small differences

should fall away by virtue of the fact that we were

all in the same boat and we were supposed to be a team

right? apparently not.

so anyway not one month into the year we get a visit from

the limb staffer who's charged with coordinating all the

wow families in our state who immediately recommended

that my wow brother be kicked off the field due to

devil spirit possession.

i tried to stick up for him by saying look maybe there is

some problems but he has alot of potential

but this limb staff individual wouldn't hear of it saying to me

in no uncertain terms, "so what? what good is potential

if the guy doesn't live up to it?"

making like i was talking out of turn

i knew at that point i better shut up and not say

"so is God so weak that he can't help out my wow

brother on the field as He has done for so many others

who came before us?"

next thing you know they'd be kicking me off the wow field

and that is something which at the time would have meant

defeat, failure, shame!

little did i know that all of those things would haunt me for the

remainder of the wow year anyway because of so many

compromises that i felt had to be made in the interest of

nothing more than staying on the wow field

and why did i do this you may ask? what drove me to such

a pathetic state of mind where staying on the wow field

meant more to me than standing up for a principle

regardless of what happened?

well the answer is simple i did it all to impress some girl

shame on me!

now i have a blue wow pin and the girl married some

other guy anyway

so remember stand up for the right

because everything you're afraid of will happen anyway

if you don't!

sheesh!

ya know dr weirwille was the only person i ever heard of to define

apostle as one who brings new light to his generation and added

it may be old light but it is new to the generation to which he brings

it.

everybody else seems to say an apostle is someone who is sent by

God to do something

but anyway whenever dr w. did a teaching and the subject came up

he always called himself the teacher and he was always saying how

he didn't want to put himself up on the same level as Paul or Peter

in the bible (at least publicly anyway)

but notice how his unquestioned definition kind of forced us followers

to see him as an actual apostle

pretty slick huh?

i like and appreciate your posts too

one of the reasons i read posts on this and other sites

is to learn about whatever became of people i remember from TWI days

it used to be said of LCM that he could be heading up a fortune 500 company

if he wasn't the Prez of TWI

from what you said so far it doesn't exactly sound like he'll be washing his feet in the blood of the wicked anytime soon

oh well!