Out There

I've hiked through areas with Grizzly bears along the trail, I've gone through villages were there were Banditos with pistolos, I've had black bear try to take fish off my hook, I've almost been run over by Yak trains, yet I have never carried a revolver or bear spray into the woods. I remember both trips to tinnie there were revolvers present. why?

My farside calendar the other day had a guy whistling while working in hell. The caption had the devil saying "We just aren't getting through to that guy" There are good times to be had anywhere and under almost any circumstances. I don't take away from the good times I had at Tinnie. I do condemm the way they ran the program though. their idea was the same as tearing down the old waste places of Isaiah but they didn't realize that not everyone had evil in their heart and needed to be torn down. they found wrong with everyone in both groups I was in and tried to tell everyone else what their problem was. My first year the whole group was rounded up and a face melting was instore for everyone "DON'T EVER LET YOUR MIND ENTERTAIN A DEVIL SPIRIT!" A wonderful 11th corps brother refused to do a rappell or something so immediately he had to be possessed. I felt terrible for him. I knew there was no devil spirit in him. he just decided that rappelling was something he didn't want to do with his life at that moment. Inside I was laughing my A$$ off at the stupidity of the ....ed off BLEAD person. His wild ravings did nothing more but than to prove how much spiritual savy he really had (Zippo, Nunno, pffft.) The wilderness is a tremendous place for someone to learn and to get quiet and have fellowship with God, but without the meekness, that was exhibited by many of the BLEAD staffers, it made it hard for many.

I do not place the blame for the suicide of the 11th corps woman at the feet of the BLEAD program or the staffers. I knew her very well and she suffered terribly from the accident and medical science was unable to help her. Had she lived today perhaps help would have been there for her. I don't know if she left the corps or was thrown out but I do know the pain she suffered after the accident caused her to be depressed and depression in the way for any reason was surely a sign of possession.SHe always came off as tough as nails the first year in residence and after the accident she seemed sometimes even more standoffish. I got to know her when we were at HQ together one of the last blocks our final year. I was surprised at what a warm hearted individual she really was. Her loss was great to me. If she were alive today I know I would be counting her amongst my dearest friends.

SO Dooj. don't think I am at all discounting the great things that being at BLEAD did for you and any other person. I call fault to the program and how they ran it, both from a safety standpoint and from a spiritual standpoint. You had novices out looking for ways to reprove intermediates and better

THis thread could have been subtitled = 'The Good, The Bad and the Ugly' . BLEAD has many fond memories for people and many horrors for others. I don't think that any other 14 days in the corps had as big an impact on people's lives as these. I had some very good times out there and I had some horrors. No matter how you look at it though you will find that the TWI was negligent in the protection they provided the participants of the program. I think that the liability waivers that they provided to anyone who suffered any kind of injury after the fact was a little underhanded and today the idea of having to sign one under duress would probably get some attention from the legal community. (Here sign this and I'm sure you'll get to graduate from the corps)

Todays litigious spociety would never stand for the way people were put into harms way bv having them hitchhike 36 hours or the way someone 60 years old would be expected to perform to a standard set by a 20 year old. the older I get the more I can see the difference in what people are capable of. Tomorrow I have a 25 year old female client. I'm going to have to really push to give her a satisfying experience (on the rocks). Boy. life can be hard as we found at BLEAD but it can also be very satisfying.

Thank you all. I feel very blessed today. Good Life Good family, Good friends. Good climbs and it's way past midnight and I'm still not a grease spot

I wanted to be a full time professional rock climber - Hey, thats what I am now. I guess we can be what we want to be

Mr. Lindner - there are two great threads you should read. they are both at the top of the page of the about the way area and both are pinned. Perhaps a little enlightenment is coming your way. By the way, I prayed for you today

Skip Wood was there when I went down for the first time. He requested that I come down early my first year in Res because I was a guide and a member of the American Alpine Club. We were talking about me getting away from the group for a few days so He and I could climb a few things he wanted to go up and also talk about the program. Just before I went all the .... hit the fan concerning VPW's dog which I understand Skip shot so skip was fast tracked out of there and we never did get together - bummer. He was a Rainier guide and I really wanted to do a few climbs with him. Ellen Wood did come up on our group and taught about foods which was really nice. David Dewald was my leader that first tine there and did a great job. It was my last year in-res that the giant butthole rose up out of the ground and tried to swallow us up.. So I do think some folks were great down there but some needed to have thier heads screwed on a little better.

I was reproved very harshly my final year because I told Kevin that he shouldadd to his climbing rack some equipment that was standard for climbing but he did not know anything about. I was told I was too prideful when it came to knowing about climbing gear (huh?)

Jonny, thanks for the tip on Steve Armstrong. I will definately look him up

I am goiung to start playing Banjo again after a 25 year break from it. My style was clawhammer. Anybody know any good websites to help me start again. I haven't even picked up an instrument in 25 years

Gladtobeout I was a rockjock then and still am (I am a professional Rock Climber for a living - All I do is rock and Ice Climbing to feed my family) . I was a certified guide before I went into the corps. I mentioned to Kevin Smyth some safety problems I saw and suddenly I was blasted for being full of pride. I had a good time there but I hated how the staff ran things. To tell you what a rock jock I am I competed in the World Cup 10 years after I went to BLEAD (came in 60th and I ranked 30th in the US). So it wasn't being a rock jock that gave you a good evaluiation it was your ability to be a rock jock and really suck up.

Is anyone having a Michigan Hot Dog Roast this year? We should figure out how to do an annual get together

My prayers for the family. And for all the hearts he touched. Looking forward to Christ's return

I have been admiring Micheal as a climber for a long time. I was hoping that someday I would have gotten the chance to climb with him. I never saw such stamina before and graceful climbing. He will be remembered for the contribution he made to the climbing community and for the person he was. Please know Nandon, You have my sympathies and my prayers

Chassy my prayers are going up for you. take heart in remembering the return that is coming

Free - you are always in my prayers. I wish I could take all your troubles away for just one day so you could bring your batteries back to full.

There is a book that i've been reading that really has been helping me. It's called "you got to keep dancing" It's written by a climber who took a bad fall and now is living with chronic pain. I can really relate to him.

We love you and are always looking forward to the best for you and your three little ones.

BLEAD was a psuedo-christian Outward Bound program that was operated in the mountains near Tinnie New Mexico. The Corps had to hitch hike from various locations to the outback town of Tinnie in a specified amount of time or they were sent back the moment they arrived and then hitched back to the locations then had to come up with the money to go again.

Safety went out the window at BLEAD and never did I ever see a group come back without someone having been injured in some way.

WHen you went you backpacked, Rock Climbed, went out on a dou (You and God. as opposed to a solo that they did at outward bound). hiked to the top of some peaks. while some interim corps people exercised all the muscle they had over you. It was a fun but very dangerous experience. Usually youe evaluation at the end focused on what they thought were the negatives you had in your life and it was one of the most humiliating moments anyony in the corps was subjected to (unless you were a pretty, sexy woman who was on the willing to give it up list).

If BLEAD were operating today it would be shut down in a heart beat because of their dangerous practices. They never should have been allowed to operate.

WOW Eagle, I don't think it sounds anything like me

Gosh, this thread could take on a serious tone to it. Too bad because whenever I see a game of Boys vs. girl brewing I always hope it turns into a game of shirts and skins

How about so nuts he's like a caveman.

If I said so wishy washy he's like a watered garden I bet you'd say "well, that wouldn't make sense"

Wait my phones ringing

Lets just call him a blooming idiot

(Sorry, I don't know whjat I'm saying today - lots of pain meds)

WG- Please don't soil my good name. WHy don't you say something like "so stupid, only a way guy could do it" I'm 'Out There', I have met KS before and having any association name or otherwise with him gives me the creeps.

Boy Jonny. I wish I could say that that kind of thing happened to me every night, sometimes with two or three young Italian American girls and sometimes a few swedes thrown in. Not only that but while I was walking a few female security officers stopped me and wanted to whip out there handcuffs and give me a demonstration of how they worked.

But I can't

You were cool though for turning it down. I give you my thumbs up.

Dooj - I'm asking also Please Please. I am growing Romas this year for the first time in about 28 years. I love pasta and good sauces

I can imagine what it was like for those kids in some ways as my first days in the corps I wondered when in the hell horizontal hour was. I also remember the disappointment when our long awaited saturday became a work day which really meant stooping down and picking up rocks. No child should ever have had to go through what kids went through at the way vatican. Pope Bob and his host of Archbishops had their heads wedged way up their butts.

I am turning 50 years old a week from today. I am also an epileptic. I have Grand Mol Seizures now an average of once a week. I am thankful that I never had this problem when I was in the way because surely I would have been marked as a possessed corps person (The worst kind of possessed person). Emotionally dealing with this is hard enough but to have someone say your possessed with a devil spirit would have probably broken my heart at the time. I've learned how to deal with my sickness over the past 18 years and what I can do and what I can't. but that poor child, what he went through is unforgivable. Pope Bob if you are reading this - You are a pompious, self righteous, self serving, Idiot who never should have been allowed to go near any of Gods children. You were a wolf in sheeps clothing. You disgust me.

Dear Dipsy or shall I more properly and politically correctly utter "Temple Lady" The collective intelligence of any one community has proven never to increase the baseline of intelligence more than the highest sum of it's average. In other words. I'm getting BORGed with all our proper pronunciation of the ostrich's actions.

Now what are we talking about??

What was they said on Seinfeld -- It looks like dry heaves with legs

WrdsandWrks - You are very sweet.