Nottawayfer

You and the Mrs. made a BEAUTIFUL baby! Congratulations Pop!!! You will make a wonderful father!

Does anyone remember the exact reason why California broke away from twi in 80's?  Was it because of the abundant sharing issues, was it because of the many firings, the LCM loyalty letter, the adultery, or the plagerism?  

My memory is foggy, and I've been having conversations with someone who lives there and who goes to fellowships with the spinoff group that most went to there, and I'm interested if whether Doug S**d and those who led the departure from twi in california made a stand over the adultery and doctrinal plagerism issues, or was it over them getting fired en masse if they didn't comply with the loyalty letter and the ABS?

Does anyone remember the details of why they all succeeded from twi all at once?

I was in the SF Bay Area from 1990 to 1993. I fellowshipped withe offshoot peeps. They were not part of TWI because of LCM's loyalty letter.

Of course nobody confronted the adultery or plagerism. Most of them are still staunch VPW supporters, particularly D*ug S*ed. I saw him at a fellowship in San Diego after I left TWI for the 2nd time. This was early 2003. He was still singing the glory of the original BOT. It made me sick, but it also made me realize I no longer wanted anything remotely close to TWI.

Acapulco Gold.....they just don't make it like that anymore. I haven't heard that name for a long time. I remember Mexican Red Hair and Maui Wowi too. I hear the stuff out there today can scare the chit out of us older folks.

I never gave thought to who I'd like to hang with, but I thought Nicole Kidman was an interesting one to get her take on the Scientology thing. That makes me think of Penelope Cruz too. I believe she is the reason Tom Cruise divorced Nicole Kidman. He left Mimi Rogers for Nicole when they worked on a movie set. Any woman married or hooked up with Tom Cruise would be interesting to talk to. He's a complete wack job IMHO. But I like his acting.

I'd like to meet:

1. Abraham Lincoln (Politics interest me, and he seems like one of the few admirable politicians of our time.)

2. Will Smith (he's really cool)

3. Jayda Pinkett-Smith (she's even cooler)

4. Christopher Columbus (he must have had a really full and interesting life traveling like he did)

5. Sammy Hagar (he's still a rocker in his 60s. I'm sure he's experienced a lot. plus he seems drunk all the time anyway.)

6. Queen Elizabeth, Henry VIII, or Anne Bolin (their time of history interests me a lot)

LCM doesn't have the drive to start his own thing. Besides, he doesn't have what it takes to get people to follow him. All of the glory he experienced as the MOG was from confused people who thought he was the "right" MOG (not Geer) because VPW passed the mantle to LCM and set him up in the perfect spot. He never would have been able to achieve that on his own. After the big split between the LCM and Geerite followers, LCM made sure that every new grad of PFAL saw the video of VPW passing the mantle to him. I think that speaks VOLUMES about what he was trying to prove.

LCM boasted how he could be the CEO of any corporation. Yet he's held lowly jobs, not even a career. I had a friend in Toledo who saw him working at Home Depot. She had been to his efficiency apartment, and she said his hair looked wild like the scientist on "Back to the Future". She said he had no remorse over his actions, and he truly believes women wanted sex with him. She said he still believe they were consentual sexual affairs. As a minister, he made GRAVE mistakes and used his power in that position to dupe women in to believing it was OK. She seemed to get the impression that he viewed it as bitches in heat coming to him for it. I tried to get her to come to GSC and tell what she talked about, but she didnt' want to. The funny thing is when I was on Staff with her, I thought she was trying to catch his eye.

I believe LCM was responsible for really taking TWI over the CULT ledge with his lunacy, demands, and expectations. VPW wasn't as verbose about his lunacy, but he was even sicker than LCM. When some people here mention that VPW told LCM to loosen up sexually, that is where I believe LCM bought in to the ticket that sexual freedom within the confines of Christianity is OK. It seems there must have been a time that LCM must have questioned it. He obviously gave in to it because he wanted to believe it was OK too. Then he made a specialized doctrine out of it.

For those of you who weren't around when a guy who does cult research ran in to LCM in a social setting came to GSC, it is a a must read. Here's the link: Conversations with Craig Martindale

I'm sure LCM is a shell of a person. He had a lot of potential, but he used it in a really bad way. I believe he's experienceing the karma he deserves. It would be great if he woke up and apologized to all he hurt. I will be very surprised to ever see that happen.

[edited to correct what the guy who ran in to LCM does.]

Notta, maybe this will trigger your memory?

I can think of two possibilities

In Genesis, amongst all the begots there is Enoch who walked with God, thn was no more, because God took him away.

Later, there is Elijah in 2 Kings who went up to heaven in a whirlwind.

I honestly don't remember Abi.

Maybe if someone else has a newer ADAN, then they can compare both of those scenarios to see if there is a difference. The year that this study happened was in 1993, so TWI had made the change to the book some time before that.

Nope. I believe it was the account about someone in the old testament being swept up in to heaven. Did he die or not? I think they changed their tune on that one. I can't remember anymore because it's not the least bit important to me anymore.

I really wanted to shed light on the fact that some things were changed in the Studies for Abundant Living. However, I don't ever remember them announcing the changes. They only announced they were the "New Prevailing Word Edition". I know there were changes in them from the previous ones VPW originally did. I think that constitutes that they knew there were errors in PFAL, but they never come out and tell anyone.

Just like LCM teaching man's original sin was Eve's lesbian encounter with the Devil. He said VPW didn't have it quite right, adn that he improved upon the teaching. LCM also said that's why VPW's teaching man's original sin never took off that well. I don't think it took off too well because it was a very questionable teaching and nobody could try to emulate it themselves because it didnt' make sense. LCM's version was even worse, but he tried everything in the book to prove his point. He even used art painted way back when to prove his point.

We won't say all, but some are.

I used to be in that category myself until I woke up and saw TWI for what it really is.

There are new versions of the Studies in Abundant Living series. The started printing them when I was on Staff back in 2001. There were revisions made. If you get an older version and compare it to a new one, you will find out what the changes are.

I remember sitting in on a study group one time. We were going over the "Are the Dead Alive Now?" book. I had an old version, and everyone else had a newer one. There was one touchy topic which changed the words completely. It caused a huge discussion, and the meeting was ended never to start up again. I wish I could remember what the topic was and what was changed. I don't even own any books anymore. I sold them all to a Wierwille Worshipper on ebay.

This is another link to a PFAL grad site that is moving the word.

http://www.superheartliving.com/

He said that one of his heroes is VPW.

His name is Rick Josey. He is fom North Carolina Anybody knows him?

I found their site awhile back. See this thread and what people found out: Wierwille Worshipper Thread

I ran across this on a google search. Does anyone know who runs this?

Word Over the World Ministries

Forget the name Brown, it was Ernst and Young they hired to audit the finances.

Aren't non-profit organizations required to have their books examined every so often by some kind of authority?

When I was on Staff (1996 to 2001), they had a large auditing firm come to audit their books. I can't remember the name, but I thought it had Brown in it. The name of the outfit was two names.

Anywhoo, they idolized LCM too. L*ui* L*nd shared one day how they got a copy of LCM's book and wanted him to sign it. Why in the world would anyone not involved in TWI want his autograph??? It sounds fishy to me. The group of people which came sat in the dining room for lunch and were announced as guests.

I left TWI in December 2002, and I never knew financial information to be available to anyone in the ministry during my almost 20 years.

I'm always up for trying any new kind of Hefeweizen. I'm from Oregon, and they have McMennamin's all over, which is a microbrew. They have many great beers. Ruby is my favorite.

Hubby and I went to the Big Island of Hawaii last October and went to the Kona Brewing Company. The make pizza dough from the yeast they use for the beer. They have excellent beer choices, and their Captain Cook and Thai Chicken pizzas are tod ie for! I liked their Wailua Wheat the best. I'm not a huge fan of dark beer, so I can't say how it was.

This thread is making my head itch. My last comment is:

KEROSENE????? WTF??????

Sure, we went WOW of our own decisions. We stayed in a cult by our own decision. If you a spoon-fed the bullshirt on a daily basis, you learn to eat it and start believing it yourself. Out of fear for being labeled "non-believing", you will tell others it was the BEST experience of your life. You will tell of the learning you experienced. You will leave out the sordid details of hunger, rape, and terrible living conditions. My WOW year didnt' yield rape, hunger, or terrible living conditions. It was quite the opposite for me. Yet, the morals of those I lived with were deterioriated. I thought God put me there to learn. There was no way I would leave and not finish the program. It was a pride thing. I wanted to have the notch on my belt, and I wanted to have the camadarie with other WOW Vets. No, those weren't such godly reasons. At 19 years old when I first took the class, I don't know that I had much life experience or thoughts of my own. I just thought that doing something for God was noble and admirable.

Fast forward 13 years when I went on Staff. It was considered the highest achievement for an Advanced Class grad to live where the Man of God did every day. It showed you had spiritual balance and integrity in your life. When you get there and you work, you begin to feel you are a slave. Then you spend time with other "privileged" invididuals who feel the same way, and the murmuring is constant. Nobody DARES speak of their feelings to the higher ups. Just the peons talk to vent frustration. Then they vow to never speak of it again and go on living with a fake smile on their face.

What I find is that many were bullshirting their way through the classes, the programs, and their life as a Way Believer. We were told constantly that no other ministry taught the truth. There was no other sweetness you would experience out in the world. You would msee many blessings because you were God's elite. You hear things enough, you semi-believe it yourself, and your promote it like you believe it wholeheartedly to get others to believe it too even though you may not have received the things promised. Then the "truth" got more serious. You would die if you left God's household. If you leave the household, God won't spit in your direction. You hear that enough and you can say you don't believe it, but see where your fear is when you let yourself outside the limitations you've lived under for so many years.

It was all a scam. We are all conned whether we want to admit it or not. It was a good idea, but it doesn't work when there's an underlying lie under it all. And anytime you separate yourself from society (physically or not), you set yourself up. That's my learning lesson, and I'm sticking to it.

some simple math might help, too.

faithful followers tithe 10%, minimum. 32m divided by 100k followers means each tithe comes from an annual income of $3,200 (if I did my math right).

Since it was the early 80s when they were claiming to have 100K followers, I seriously doubt the average wage was even $20K per year. I remember getting $1,300 a month from a receptionist position in 1986. The Branch coordinators were really proud of my believing to be so prosperous. $1,300 a month comes to $15,600 a year.

Those same Branch coordinators borrowed money from me and never paid it back. They tried to tell me I owed rent, food, and electricity for watching their house while they went to Corps Week and ROA. I already had a home where I paid for rent, food, and electricity. And there wasn't any freakin' food in that house. Plus I had a list of chores to complete before they got home. It was really anal stuff like washing their windows. I was considered a faithful follower because I didn't say no. I was told it made me Corps material too. WTF does that mean? Maybe I should have gone in residence. I probably would have left earlier.

I believe Word Wolf is correct. In my WOW year, we had 4 WOW families. We ran 7 classes that year. How many were in each class, I don't remember. How many people actually stayed around after that? Maybe 3, and I'm really allowing for my loss of memory. One lasted for a few years. Nobody else lasted beyond a few months.

Was WOW a success? It was for the many who got laid in the process. I think most of the people who sat in our WOW Branch classes got involved because they were getting laid by a grad. And don't get me started on how many WOWs were boinking each other. My WOW sister boinked two of our 3 WOW brothers. It was pretty disgusting. All that crap about growing 10 years in one was pure bullshirt.

My original WOW family coordinator was a freakin' alcoholic. He yelled and tried to reprove us while he was drunk. I told him I could have stayed home and got the same treatment from my unbelieving dad.

WOW was a huge farce, but it was a huge sales program for VPW. When I think about him welcoming home WOWs at the gazebo, I wonder how he could live with himself. The fact that he sent single men and women together should have been a clue to what was really happening. The 2 drink limit was a joke. I kept my WOW pin, but I don't know why. I'm not proud that I stayed in a year of dysfunction.

That year indoctrinated me thoroughly. It was all those dang classes. Little did I know what the remaining 18 years would yield to my life. Thank God I got out and started living life again.

Uh no.....You might find yourself alone on that one. But that was hella funny!!

If this is directed to me, I do apologize for being perceived as not within the context of the threads purpose. It is actually my desire to get in contact with everyone I have posted in a thread. I met Bob in a specific circumstance some time ago, and to me, that is who he is. If Bob has changed, that is actually not relevant to me in the sense of me talking to him any differently. I feel I am at a point in my life and more specifically at a point in my life with regard to GSC or anywhere on the Internet, that "compartmentalization" is the way to go. If your posting is directed to me, I acknowledge that you do not know me, and I feel that time is the only dependent condition of that knowledge. Please do note that I am referring to knowing me, not "understanding me", the later, is to me, not entirely available.

Link for reference to the concept:

http://changingminds.org/explanations/beha...ntalization.htm

Mchud,

I apolgoze for my comments. They weren't aimed at you. I was only stating my opinion of the individual, and I was wrong to do so on this portion of the forum. I totally forgot my manners, and see what it caused?? I promise I will behave.

[Edited for spelling]

I suggested it already on her website. I've done it a few times actually. They must not be that interested.

FWIW: I think Oprah is a wonderful human being. She thinks of more than herself. That's more than a lot of people in this world can say. She's not perfect, but she really strives to do shows to enrich people's lives. That's better than FOX News.....Let the slinging begin....

Sorry. I was the culprit. I didn't realize I wasn't supposed to give my opinion here, and I will not do it again.

Quite honestly, I'm surprised the whack job didn't spew off about the blind girl who came to the STS faithfully with her black lab seeing eye dog.

This forum is for people who want to reconnect or otherwise find out more about a person's current status. It is not for trashing or otherwise discussing them.

Edited by modchef

I saw many bad marriages in TWI. I also saw many good marriages where it seemed the two seemed compatible and loving toward one another.

I never got any good advice from any leaders in my first disaster called marriage. My ex-husband was a closet drug user. I found out 3 years in to our marriage. We received counseling as such:

Branch Coord: I don't want to hear any of the dirty details. You two need to read "Heirs Together in the Grace of Life" from the Red Book. Then focus on that.

There was no follow-up. It was crap. We really needed to deal with issues, not cover them up with Bible verses and pretend we were honoring each other. My nature is not submissive, so it was especially hard when my "head" was being a screw up.

I don't believe someone is the head of the marriage. I honestly don't care even if the Bible says that a man is to be the head. If two people decide the dynamics of their own relationship and both are happy with that, then that's what really counts.

In my current marriage, we are equals who honor each other's opinion and make decisions together. We are honest with each other too, even if it is uncomfortable. I respect my husband much more when he can feel free to be honest with a situation.

For instance, we had a situation recently where he made a decision on a service for our home. He made a one-year contract with that service which meant we would receive that service every month. I didn't think we needed it once a month even though we get a discount that way. I thought we could have the service 3-4 times a year and I didn't remember us having a one-year contract. My husband said "You might not remember, but I told you about this when I first called about the service. We discussed having a contract back then." Because I know my mind is forgetful, I accept that even though I hate admitting I am becoming forgetful. Some people would say OK and back off instead of making waves and then carry resentment or a grudge about that subject which would cause future arguements.

All those physically and verbally abusive marriages in The Way were disgraceful because it was done in the name of God. That is truly a cult when the religious leaders think they have the authority to say what should happen within another family. It is a sick lie that leaders think they have.