DogLover

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vince finnegan was an az z

Seems he still is ... his current "ministry" teaches that people can lose their salvation ...think that doesn't give him and others control over their flock? At least we DID have the assurance of incorruptible seed and not being able to lose your salvation ... until Craig came along, got mad, and said differently. I feel confident taking MY chances with the Almighty God, who made the promise. Okay, off soapbox.

Your welcome. I am gonna get to it soon, just found it a few minutes ago and was wondering if it's well known or not.

I'm very familiar with it .. it was written by Carol Hamby Welch, a friend of mine. She was formerly a regular at GreaseSpot and blogs at other places online ...not in the Way now, not in any offshoot of the Way. It makes for an interesting read.

Or any wonder why the numbers are so embarrassingly low.

How many people graduated from the Corps last year, just out of curiosity?

it makes me sick how many chairs were stringed, how many table settings were lined up, how many rugs were raked

it just disgusts me

preparation for leadership and helping people

oh yeah it's all in the details

friggin jerks

There's an interesting episode of M*A*S*H in which one of the clues they use to figure out that Frank Burns has lost his mind is that he has the condiments all lined up in a row in the Mess Hall ... which was done three times a day at The Way C of E, as I recall ...not to mention the chairs, the plates, etc ...

Then.....wierwille's "spiritual believing race" is deplorable compared to "non-christian types." <_<

LEAD was a joke ... trying to make something spiritual out of camping out and rock climbing and hiking is straining at a gnat while all the shenanigans at the Root locales were like swallowing the camel ... nothing gross intended ....

I've got a confession to make....

On my interim year at hq.....I was assigned to oversee the responsibility of stringing chairs in the BRC. Thus, it was my household duty after supper to oversee each corps group with stringing chairs and setting up top-floor BRC before the next meeting. So, for a couple of weeks.... the supply box would come out and the chairs would be strung in perfect rows.

Well......it didn't take long before I saw this nifty short-cut.

Since these chairs had been placed in, basically, the same position for years......we would shut off the overhead lights and use the 'lover lights' only because then, the carpet showed the indentations more clearly. Voila! No more string was needed.

Seriously.....we had straight rows and BRC set-up accomplished in about 12 minutes. The inrez corps loved me for it.....as we 'outsmarted' the taskmasters and went about our merry way. It was our own little secret.

A secret that, until today.........I don't think I've ever confessed.

.

Priceless! I love it!

Old Skool, You put it very well...lots of people in the Way's leadership mistook kindness for weakness.

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a la prochaine, on Sep 5 2005, 04:24 AM, said:

WW, Yes, I wanted state that very thing you asked...but thought maybe I should let readers make their own conclusions. I find it very 'strange' that she stayed at the 'Y'. If she was such a dear friend,then why did she not stay with VP at his home??? Perhaps they wanted 'privacy'"

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I think I may know the answer to that one ... the house where they lived in Van Wert was quite small for a man, his wife, and at that time, three children ...there would have been no guest room, I suspect. The "Y" where Rhoda Wierwille lived for so many years was right next to their home and would have been quite convenient for guests ... I'm not excusing or refuting anything else that's been said here, but from my one snowy day Way International Historic Tour during my interim year in the Corps, I do have some insight onto this particular question.

Elyse Knox Harmon, mother of Mark, Kris, and Kelly, died on Wednesday, February 15 at her home in Los Angeles, surrounded by family. She was 94 ... best known for her movies during the 1930s such as THE MUMMY'S TOMB. I thought some folks might be interested since NCIS is the #1 scripted show on television.

I know it's been a long time and things have changed since 1983, but at that time, when I was in the interim Corps on staff at HQ, Michael Fort was the one of the kindest, most helpful, most Godly men I had known to that point in my life. It makes me so angry to think that the Forehead and the lesb!an had the nerve to denounce him. Admittedly, they took their toll on that young man ... I read a letter he sent in 1995 to a good friend, former Way clergy telling him he (the man) would be dead in two years ... for the so-called sin of daring to doubt the Trustees' debt teaching and his refusal to move away from an area where he, as an only son, was responsible for care of his aging, homebound mother. When he let me read that letter, it made me very sad to see what Michael f@rt had become at the time ... I'm glad he got to get out and get secular employment. He was a good man who was treated badly ....IMHO.

As I said, that was 1982-85 and things changed. By the way, the "gonna be dead in two years" fellow is alive and well, enjoying his four grandchildren and still teaching the Bible ...

Previous poster mentioned the Twig hopper being wrecked ... never heard that...did that happen because of anger or alcohol or...what?

I was horrified this weekend to hear from a friend about how TJ tried to force a Corps girl, who was married and a good friend of mine, to have oral s*x with him ... her husband was too much of a coward, had too much to lose to stand up for her against TJ, and this led to their eventual divorce....and NOW, Arlene and TJ do marriage counseling...PLEASE!

You know, clinging to this simple truth has been pivotal in my recovery from the negative effects of this bunch of Pharisees.

God is a just God. Do you think when Jesus Christ comes back He is going to say "well done" to leaders who manipulate others for their own gain and their own personal advancement? Do you think He is going to overlook the lust for power and position in their hearts that motivates them? Do you think He will tolerate those that turn a blind eye to the evil functioning in their peers and overseers and do nothing or go along with it to preserve themselves? Do you think the voices of those they have slandered and shunned will not cry out for help? Will He not hear them?

No, He will stand for those that speak out and are persecuted.

Well said! God is a just God and there will be consequences.

waysider......that clip reminds me of the time when all the inresidence corps

in Emporia were instructed to 'hoof-it' about 4 miles to that gun-safety course

in the outskirts of town. I don't think that we whistled that song, though.

We had a similar walk out to probably the same place ... worked in the woods that day, clearing brush and so on ... it was actually fun to be outdoors in the fall, had a neat cookout, and walked back ... seemed like maybe that weekend was the separate Men's and Women's Advances, which were NOT so much fun. By the time I came along (13th Corps), they were not offering the Gun Safety Course.

Amen! Merry Christmas to all!

I went on Facebook and did a search of his name and the page that came up listed him as a "public figure" with an option in the corner to "create page," so I don't think he really has a page ... just as a public figure, people have the option to "like" him ... when I was there, about 21 had. Not I.

"i despised jenkinson and how he made that beautiful ranch so horrible"

Amen to that, Excie! I know someone who is still in the Way who was traumatized by him there, as I was. It took me YEARS to get over the four months I spent there because of his hateful abuse.

This is correct. It's from a sermon by Oral Roberts entitled "The Fourth Man". IMO it's one of Oral's most dynamic teachings ever. If you've never heard it originally done by Oral, you're missing out - try to find a copy.

By comparison, VPW's "Red Thread" sermon isn't James Taylor playing a cover, it's an "American Idol tryout" bad karaoke version of someone trying to imitate James Taylor playing a cover.

Interestingly, VPW played that tape for us when I took the Advanced Class at HQ in 1973. I remember to this day Oral saying, "If you don't bow, you won't burn" over and over in that exposition of the record in Daniel of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego. Very powerful teaching.

True, we can't know everything. Letting go of that idea is one of the first steps, IMO, to compassion.

I do have one question, though. If the Christian life is ONLY as the teacher defined it, how does she describe what makes it "Christian," since other faiths (and atheistis included) say they are about the same things: "about being good, being kind, being loving. It's about living a good life. That's all"

Just curious...this question has mattered to me for a long time....

When someone has asked me the question about what makes Christianity different, I have responded that it is the only belief system (or so-called religion) in which the main person in the religion claims to (and indeed has) risen from the dead. The resurrection is what makes the difference.

The Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse - Recognizing & Escaping Spiritual Manipulation and False Spiritual Authority Within the Church

by David Johnson and Jeff Van Vonderen

I actually would recommend giving this to someone in the Way. It's a story of those two authors fighting that in a startup church, and the scriptures they uncovered, the perspectives they developed, and the truths they learned. It never mentions cults, and certainly doesn't directly target anything in the Way. But for people who respect scripture, it helps you develop a perspective of looking for characteristics described in the Bible. And where someone sees those can be eye opening.

Chockfull,

I've found it very helpful to recommend THE SUBTLE POWER OF SPIRITUAL ABUSE to people who have left TWI, especially recently. Even folks who left a long time ago have also found it helpful. You would swear the two authors had been in The Way, but they were not ... it's just that quite a few churches and ministries have similar sorts of subtle spiritual abuse. This book shows another example that "there is nothing new under the sun," as it says in Ecclesiastes.

Good to hear from you, DWBH ... hope you are doing well...greetings from the Tarheel State!

Twinky,

I remember Pat Lynn telling us (when she and then-husband, John, were Way Corps Coordinators at Emporia) that she had been a member of the Zero Corps...hope that helps answer at least part of your question ... I have never heard anyone else say that they were in that Zero Corps that got dismissed.

Lifted Up,

My condolences to you and your family ...

I agree with Socks ... I first met her in 1973 or 1974 in North Carolina at the East Carolina University Way Home when she had come up from New Bern as a then-new believer, and she looked matronly even then ...

Thanks, Folks, for all the posts ... they are well-put and certainly remind me why Moneyhands and others have not left....so sad for them all ... how much better life would be if they didn't let fear control their lives.