Ron G.

All that goes on in a persons mind before committing suicide, I don't know. But I was listening to the Dennis Prager podcast one day and the topic was suicide... Dennis said something that stuck with me "suicide is selfish and narcissistic". It impressed upon me that no matter how hurt, desperate, depressed or insane a person may be because of relations with others, they still share in a level of responsibility for their own thoughts and actions.

For Dennis Prager (whoever he is) to make such a blanket statement leads me to think he's pretty self absorbed and narcissistic to presume such a thing.

I think maybe Dennis Prager (whoever he is) is someone to avoid in ones daily listening regimen.

So you say you have this...uh... problem. You don't know what to do and you're too embarrassed to talk to anyone. Well, don't despair. Just click on the link below!

In the mid 80's, or so, when still in Florida, I overheard someone saying that WOW originally stood for "Weirwille Owens Weirwille"...as in "the Wierwille Owens Weirwille program" or "ambassadors for wierwille Owens Weirwille" etc. I have no idea how true that might be, I don't know anything about Harry W. or Owens....they passed on long before I came along, but I heard it again a couple of years later in Texas from a different source. I haven't even thought about it in years and years, but this thread reminded me.

Could there be any validity to that? If so, does it mean anything? It seemed like it was intended to be "top secret info" not for the unwashed masses. Anyway, what difference would it make?

Just curious.

Edited to mention that little stuff like that occasionally trickling in caused me to maintain a healthy cynicism throughout my entire tenure with TWI.

First time in 1987 in Universal City, Texas...

T. W*ll*nb*rg: G'nite, Ron. See you next week!

Ron: Oh, you're going to the Sports Page Lounge next Tuesday to watch me play darts? (I'd decided I'd had enough and was done with it and joined the local darts team)

T.W.: Huh?

Ron: Never mind....bye.

T.W.: Bye

Second time 1996 in Oxley, Arkansas (on the phone from Little Rock)...

M*nte H*bb*s, Arkansas LC: I understand from Rev. Pl*t*g that you have problems with obeying and you left California without his permission.

Ron: Yeah.....and? (HP and I had that conversation earlier and it was kind of unpleasant as I reminded him that I was 47 years old and could and would do as I damn well pleased as long as it didn't violate any state, local or federal laws or regulations and punctuated the conversation with the same thing Bride of JC said in her post on this thread)

MH: I need you to take the Way Magazine and read every article faithfully and subscribe to the SNS tapes and listen to them faithfully while working the collaterals, the PFAL book and Rev. Martindale's "Rise and Expansion" book over the next six months and move down here to Little Rock where you can be near people and move the word.

Ron: Yeah.....and?

MH: Then call me and we'll discuss you coming back.

Ron: gotcha....bye.

MH: Bye

Six months later, I was still living here and had done nothing of what I'd been told. MH, however, had gone in residence in a federal penitentiary and so I figured since he was probably only allowed one phone call, I'd spare him the trouble of it being wasted on me.

See how nice I am?

Also he does say Antartica has been cooler ... but then he says MODELS show there will be more warming. Models can show anything, but they are pretty to look at.

Yeah, a model can show anything and make it appear desirable or believable. That's what models do.

Just be very careful when you tell them they can keep what they're showing.

That's a great story Rottiegrrl, but like you said, it's been around for a while.

The reason is, it's based on a TRUE story.

In actuality it wasn't a guy named Sulio. It was Pete Sanchez from Idalou, Texas.

As everyone knows, Pete Sanchez from Idalou, Texas ALWAYS wore an very old and beat up cowboy hat. It was his trademark.

When in the courtyard at the Vatican, Pete's boss kept asking everyone who that was on the balcony, as he was so far away, he couldn't see well.

Finally, one spectator who understood Pete's boss' English replied, "I don't know WHO that guy with the funny hat is, but the one standing next to him is Pete Sanchez from Idalou, Texas."

But then you probably know Pete Sanchez from Idalou, Texas...everyone does.

Agreed.

I was brought into the Way by a WOW twig that made such a profound impression that we subsequently went WOW in '81. Most I knew were most assuredly the real deal.

I remember going to ROA that following year and seeing ol' VP struttin' around in his WOW vet regalia and wondering silently to myself "When did he ever do this shi t?"

Of course, I would never DARE voice such heresy aloud, at that time (and probably still shouldn't), as the common perception was that he did it every day of his life 24/7 and we WOW's were mere shadows compared to his great superhuman feats of spiritual derring do.

Believe it or not, the scientists are now saying we are facing global cooling. I kid you not. I first saw this in the international press about a month ago. Naturally, the US press didn't cover it much. I remember in the article from last month that it said that the scientists are now admitting "that the planet might be more resilient than they first thought."

In fact, for the last 7 years, the earth has been cooling. Combine that with the relatively recent discovery that the lead scientist at NASA who provides most of the fodder for the global warming nuts has been secretly funded by George Soros and all of a sudden, there appears to be a small conspiracy going on with a hoard of lemmings unknowingly supporting it.

Just google "global cooling" and you'll get a number of articles. Here's one on weather.com.

http://climate.weather.com/blog/9_15153.html

and an article from Investors Business Daily

http://ibdeditorial.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=287279412587175

I'm not saying that it is time to stock up on winter coats but it will be interesting to see how long the US press will bury this story.

After listening to RD's podcast, seeing the comment about being "out of fellowship" in another thread and now this...I may not sleep for a week.

It's like deja vu all over again (as ol' Yogi Berra used to say).

I think there's probably at least a hundred little websites like this one run by old denial ridden exway folks. I seem to run across one every time I try to google somebody I once knew. I'm not sure it'll ever end. I was in the chatroom a while back and someone mentioned the number of myspace users who revere the memory of the good doctor...mostly kids and twentysomethings. I went and looked and, sure enough, there they were.

It's truly scarey.

I used to say the main thing I learned in TWI was to never trust a preacher with a boner. Now I have to add to that, never underestimate one, either.

...told they were *out-of-fellowship*,...

GAWD dmiller...I haven't heard or even THOUGHT that expression in well over a decade.

I'm gonna have nightmares, now.

Thanks Paw and Ralph.

This is a very articulate rendering of what happened. It's quite a contrast to the "Galatian's tapes" (I think that's what they were called...not sure now) that LCM spewed forth about 17 or so years ago and is well timed and very appropriate for bringing closure and healing to a lot of folks.

Kudos to you both!

I think we may have found a solution to your yard problem. Just hire someone to clean up the yard, then borrow or rent a roto tiller and make a garden. You'll save LOTS on groceries in the long run and you'll get much higher quality produce.

Of course you'll still have to provide your own bags, boxes and containers.

It works for me.

It's hard to answer your question. Not enough information.

How big is the yard?

Is it Brush? Scrub? Sage grass? Saplings...about what diameter? Tall grass? Sumac?

Maybe you handle it with a push mower or a kid with a machete or you need to hire somebody with a brush hog. There's no way to tell without a little more info.

<B>I think father-son clashes are not unusual...we have them here in our house. </B> I have to coach son on how to deal with dad sometimes. But I think He was intended to be his father as much as you his mother.

I think it sounds like Mom and Dad may need to figure things out, but if you figure all this out and then just announce to dad--where does that put you in regards to dad...

Actually, father and adolescent son clashes are normal and actually healthy, despite anything we may have heard in TWI. A boy has to "test the waters" for adulthood and develop his own autonomy in his growth to manhood.

It's just part of growing up. To deny the boy this interaction with his father would do a great disservice to the boy and set him up for failure in later life.

Money shmuny---that stuff should not be an influence. Deferred gratification is one of the great strengtheners...read "Emotional Intelligence" by whatshisname.

talk soon

I couldn't agree more, WW!!!!!

I remember going off to college in 1966. In 1967 a friend handed me a sugar cube and it was delicious, but the next thing I remember was seeing John Travolta dancing around in a white suit and people were wearing white shoes.

I'll check you link to see what I missed.

Happy Earth Day one and all!

Today is Earth Day when the eco-theocrats and gaia worshippers engage in their annual circle jerk.

Celebrate!

Put on some Aqua Net, then hop in your SUV with the A/C turned all the way up (you can always wear some fur if it's a bit cool for that) and drive to the nearest plastic bonfire and maybe enjoy some barbecued eagle.

I'll be cutting some wood today as as my Earth Day celebration just won't be right without the smell of freshly cut timber and two-stroke exhaust.

Be sure to wear your "The world is my urinal" tshirt!

Both of my boys have dyslexia...

Anyway, my friends don’t really believe in “learning disabilities”. I actually prefer the term learning difference because my boys are plenty intelligent enough...

In the harsh light of morning (and coffee) I see that I got off on a tangent in my previous post. Although I still think it's valid, I should add that your spark of intution in the above quote tells ME....very loudly...that you are vastly more qualified to teach your children than those who "don't believe in learning disabilities".

This is just my opinion, but I see, all too often, where intelligence is commonly measured by the childs ability to conform to societies norms, when, in fact, brilliance and genius are found in the flaws to that conformity.

That's just my take on this and your mileage may vary (as they say).

Edited to remind you that our prayers are with you, but you should already know that.

This is a tough call. Offhand I would suggest you let the other people tutor Isaac without actually living with them.

I have a friend named Susan who is a retired high school math teacher. Due to my inability to do things with a mathematical precision (anything beyond fingers and toes and I'm lost) I agreed to let Susan tutor Andrew for his homeschooling in math. Twice a week she would come and pick Andrew up and keep him for about 3 hours. It didn't cost anything...I just gave her husband, John, written permission to come thru my land and hunt on an adjoining property that's landlocked.

It all worked out very well as by the end of the year, Andrew was doing college level calculus at age 13.

As sort of an experiment, last year he enrolled in the public school and is now at the top of his class.

What I'm saying here is I understand your concern and how Isaac would benefit from the outside instruction as did Andrew. What I don't exactly understand is WHY it's necessary for him to actually live there. Even the public school doesn't keep him there 24/7, as much as I'm sure they'd love to.

Since it's just about summer, you have some time to mull this over. I think it needs to be seriously considered befor a final decision is made.

Remember, there's a lot more to schooling than "readin' writin' and 'rithmetic". There are things that only YOU, as the parent can provide in the atmosphere of your own family. Your son is NOT chattel property of society at large nor is he to be a subset of a "village".

He's YOUR son.

Once again, WHY must he live there? What is the purpose of this? Does this "former high school teacher and stickler for good education" have some agenda beyond teaching Isaac basic academics? I'd be a little (maybe more than a little) suspect, knowing the guy's been trained in the public school model of education. I don't know how steeped he is in it, but maybe you should find out.

Here is an excerpt from an essay entitled "The Public School Nightmare: Why fix a system designed to destroy individual thought?" I recently read by John Taylor Gatto...

"The structure of American schooling, 20th century style, began in 1806 when Napoleon's amateur soldiers beat the professional soldiers of Prussia at the battle of Jena. When your business is selling soldiers, losing a battle like that is serious. Almost immediately afterwards a German philosopher named Fichte delivered his famous "Address to the German Nation" which became one of the most influential documents in modern history. In effect he told the Prussian people that the party was over, that the nation would have to shape up through a new Utopian institution of forced schooling in which everyone would learn to take orders.

So the world got compulsion schooling at the end of a state bayonet for the first time in human history; modern forced schooling started in Prussia in 1819 with a clear vision of what centralized schools could deliver:

1.Obedient soldiers to the army;

2.Obedient workers to the mines;

3.Well subordinated civil servants to government;

4.Well subordinated clerks to industry"

5.Citizens who thought alike about major issues. "

To see the end results of this in the United States today, just flip on your teevee and watch the news.

I may be overstating all this or maybe I'm missing or misunderstanding something (it is very late and I'm very tired), but it's something to consider and I'd be VERY wary of allowing my son to be raised by another under the guise of education.

I felt a little shake and I heard dogs start barking.

Is that place shown on your map anywhere along the New Madrid fault?

That's always a concern here in the Ozarks. We record about 1000 very minor tremors each year.

Sounds like a description of the Singing Ladies of the Way.

Aw Shifra :( I was going to come back in here and say that, but you beat me to it.

HARRUMPH!

This is one of those things that pops up in the email from time to time and it came to me from a good friend. Some here might find this interesting. It's not relevant to VPW's plagiarism and I didn't want to derail that thread with it.

I know there are a number of writers, artists and musicians here who could be affected if such a thing would, could or should occur.

http://www.sellyourtvconceptnow.com/orphan.html

Mind Your Business

You Will Lose All The Rights to Your Own Art

Mark Simon

As you know, I usually handle the subjects in my articles with a sense of humor. That is not the case this month. I find nothing funny about the new Orphan Works legislation that is before Congress.

In fact, it ....ES ME OFF!

As an artist, you have to read this article or you could lose everything you’ve ever created!

An Orphaned Work is any creative work of art where the artist or copyright owner has released their copyright, whether on purpose, by passage of time or by lack of proper registration. Like when parents give up their child to be an orphan, you can give up ownership in your creative work to be an orphan for others to use without your permission.

If you don’t like to read long articles, you will miss incredibly important information that will affect the rest of your career as an artist. You should at least skip to the end to find the link for a fantastic interview with the Illustrators Partnership about how you are about to lose ownership of your own artwork.

Currently, you don’t have to register your artwork to own the copyright. You own a copyright as soon as you create something. International law also supports this. Right now, registration allows you to sue for damages, in addition to fair value.

What makes me so MAD about this new legislation is that it legalized THEFT! The only people who benefit from this are those who want to make use of our creative works without paying for them, or from large companies who will run the new private copyright registries.

These registries are companies that you would be forced to pay to register every single image, photo, sketch or creative work.

It is currently against international law to coerce people to register their work for copyright because there are so many inherent problems with it. But because big business, like Bill Gates, can push through laws in the United States, our country is about to break with the rest of the world, again, and take your rights away.

With the tens of millions of photos and pieces of artwork created each year, the bounty for forcing everyone to pay a registration fee would be enormous. We lose our rights and our creations, and someone else makes money at our expense.

This includes every sketch, painting, photo, sculpture, drawing, video, song and every other type of creative endeavor.

All of it is at risk!

If the Orphan Works legislation passes, you and I and all creatives will lose virtually all the rights to not only our future work but to everything we’ve created over the past 34 years unless we register it with the new, untested and privately run (by the friends and cronies of the U.S. government) registries. Even then, there is no guarantee that someone wishing to steal your personal creations won’t successfully call your work an orphan work, and then legally use it for free.

In short, if Congress passes this law, YOU WILL LOSE THE RIGHT TO MAKE MONEY FROM YOUR OWN CREATIONS!

Check the above link for more info.

I have a question.

At the time of the LEAD accident, I was in Florida and quite active in TWI. I attended ALL the meetings, ate the cookies, drank the coffee and read all my Way mags and Grapevines faithfully.

How come I didn't know any of this stuff until I wandered into this thread the other night?

Both the local Baptist Church and the local Methodist Church both publish lists of people who need prayer and/or concern for whatever reason. Such an accident occuring within one of those churches would have been widely known so people who cared could pray, visit the hurt and comfort the injured.

Obviously, those churches are much more spiritually in tune with God's Heart, Word and Will than TWI ever could have been.

When will the TWI apologists and sycophants recognize this?

I generally don't pay much attention to these discussions, but last night at about 10:30 or 11, I wandered into this thread.

I finally finished at about 3AM. This is the most interesting, telling and compelling thing I've read at the GSC or at Waydale.

It made me realize just how much on the periphery of TWI I was.

The first thing is, no matter HOW you slice it, responsibility goes straight to the feet of the BOT. Even that poor guy who walked in front of the semi...what the hell was the point of making all those people HITCH HIKE across from Kansas to New Mexico. The guy, probably with little or no sleep...hitch hiking with his wife...probably a little dazed or "out of it"...well, I can easily see it happening.

Why? Because the powers that be were too damned cheap or whatever to provide transportation. Yes, the BOT is culpable.

Even the most rigorous wilderness survival training doesn't require the participant to hitch hike across the country with $10 they can't spend and a sack lunch just to get there...that's totally insane.

I do believe, now, that when Jesus Christ returns that He WILL be holding a copy of the orange book (borrowing from another thread), for our benefit, anyway, and proceed to shove it up the authors foot, demanding "How DARE you misrepresent Me this way and use it to hurt and abuse those who wanted nothing more than to be faithful to Me?".

And Rochelle will be on the front row!

Thanks for the thread HCW. I really respect you and your bravery, compassion and candor. The whole thing was very enlightening and appalling.

If the cats won't train, I'd consider cat hide furniture.

I replied to your poll with "not sure", however I did a Google looking for something later and discovered Amazon was the only place, anywhere, that it was available. The Google was a search to see if such a thing I was looking for even existed...and there it was on Amazon.

Armed with the knowledge that Amazon sells stuff besides books, I checked on a few other items I buy regularly via internet/mail order and discovered I can get lot's of things I order regularly...and the prices are very much in line, if not better.

So change my vote.