igotout

As I see it, TWI and "Scary Geery Bus Driver" purposely have no open interactive sites like other religious groups do because they have too many skeletons in their closets. Am I right excathedra? Where are their My Spaces, email addresses and "Contact Us info? Busboy doesn't even have a website. What's up with that? IMHO they're trying to cover up their past and present forms of behavior and abuse as well as their house of cards teachings. I can hear it now from certain Geerites I know. " God told me not to go on the Internet and read posts " or "God told me not to communicate with you." Typical dumbell, legalist, idolatrous behavior. Can't blind followers see that certain leaders are taking advantage of them using their hard earned cash to help them coast into a prosperous retirement in the near term future? John R Tampa, FL

House, good score. They made me read a dumb paper I wrote in front of the whole crowd. Then we went back to party central, our little hotel room. We missed MOST of the sessions. After all, we already had the AC and I did not need to repeat it for credit. I think we went to one session, Excathedra, you and I, out of pure guilt. It was like going to mass on Sunday to refresh our souls, or confession. We felt cleansed for a few hours.

No Excathedral. Not you or I. We stayed indoors where there was air conditioning, cigarettes and refills. It was the guy in the 2nd Corps and an Englishman who were pulled over for DUI. But they let the Englishman go and only arrested the elder Corps because he was the driver of the motorcycle while the 9th Corps brother was only the passenger. Later fisticuffs ensued in our AC79 Athens room, remember? I think I operated all nine some of the time that week. I think we wore out the devil spirits. We were too much for them. It was our unique way of Defeating the Adversary.

Will it be a Ball State? I got one of those long black and white pictures around here somewhere of PLAF 77. AC 79 was a lot better (police and drunken arrests notwithstanding) wouldn't youu say Excathedra? I almost had a psychic girlfriend at PALF 77.....but she left me before we met.

Belle, some leaders are just cowards and wimps. They may have acted tough and had license to be abusive, but in reality they had no balls to stand up for what they knew was right. They have what is simply the cult mentality and are too lazy to do anything about it but stay in their boring, lifeless ruts. They are like some spineless corporate executives I know, only with VERY meager salaries. At least the spineless executives bring home the bacon. A less than abundant life indeed ! Thanks God we can breathe fresh air. John R Tampa, FL

Aww, you guys are so kind. :) Really, we are just like you. We all help each other in various ways. I can't begin to list all who have helped us and listened to us with understanding and compassion. Never let anyone make you think you are out of fellowship. We have had awesome fun and fellowship here with great people who have hearts of gold. It is waaay better than some of our years of TWI. Who says you have to sit your butt in a boring little meeting to fellowship with each other? This fellowship is outstanding! And with people from all over the place. We have gained more "spiritual insight and understanding" if you will, from this and other forums, than in all our collective years in TWI. I love how the Internet gives voice to all, no matter who they are. This was absolutely not available in TWI. I suspect it is not still. This fellowship has provided us with incentive to meet some of you in person in the years to come. So now we have to travel places....darn! (Act, we bought a riverfront condo in Oboro, so we'll see you soon.). It's always such a treat to meet someone for the first time whom you have previously only interacted with online. And if any of you are near Central Florida "You are always welcome at our house" John & Hope Picture

Not sure if it was already mentioned but it always seemed to me that one unwritten rule was that any and all religious groups other that TWI were simply wrong if not devilish. This included the likes of Oral Roberts and Billy Graham and any major denomination. And god forbid if you participated with "the competition" by attending services or contributing financially to another religious group. It seemed unwritten that all abundant sharing was to go to TWI 100% and that all other financial giving to any other group or "designer cause" as LCM used to call them, was deemed evil.

Your sentences are not coherent.

I was 21, kicked out at 47. (We didn't leave but were asked to leave by Gilxxs and Mneyhands.) Not one word of thanks for decades of service. It was one of those "don't call us, we'll call you" scenes that were so prevalent. Best part of the whole experience was meeting lovely Hope. First thing we did together was ditch a Corps meeting and went for beer and "other things". It was true love. Next best was meeting many other great people who can be considered true friends. Poo Poo on those in TWI and Geerites who dump you when you are no longer in their little group. This includes the youth groups on My Space who seem to be following the legalistic and close minded footsteps of ther oldie predecessors. We'll be here with open arms when you leave. We understand.

Georgio, Well since you were the first to admit it, I'll follow suit. You teens were not the only ones who had a corner or partying. We always got SMASHED at Corps week and ROA but it was always at our hotel and around the pool at S & W. We came to many a teaching smashed and just hung out in the back or skipped it all. Our first stop when we got to St. Mary's was the local liquor store. I literally had to recuperate from ROA and Corps week when we got home to our normal lives. So much of TWI was a breeding ground for partying and such. My theory is the more legalism and incorrect doctrine you are placed under the more self medication is needed to "escape" the bonds of religiosity. Why is it soooo many of us drank and smoked and went wild including TOP leadership? To keep our sanity and have some fun along the way, I suppose. That does not mean it was right. It was just a part of the underbelly of TWI. Sex too. I knew a few leaders who were simply alchoholics? Another I knew smoked pot at Emporia regularly. The party ended with LCM. In some ways he was right in trying to put an end to it all and make TWI more conservative in our behavior. Problem is he forced it on us and he did not walk the walk himself. The party really ended in my opinion when POP was read and the "Division Bell" was rung. Probably a good thing it happened. PS - One year I remember seeing a couple teen boys at the "cheap beer fest" who were so smashed they could hardly walk. I wonder if one of them was you?? We just laughed. No one said anything. No one did anything. We should have.

After a few ROA's beginning in '74 I began got sick of it. In 1975 we should have all been given a refund. It was no more than a big muddy mess. IMO ROA should have been handled like other large conventions with hotels and convention staff to do the dirty work. There should have been no tent city or muddy parking in cornfields, etc. We began staying in a hotel room year after year (if you were lucky enough to find one.) In that part of Ohio at that time they were all pretty lousy. When we were "strongly encouraged" to go to BOTH Corps week (nicknamed Score Week) and ROA it was too much. We rarley went to both, just a week in the middle of both. VPW was furious at those of us who did that. Then they had the nerve to ask us to take off work and come to Ohio and work for two weeks! I never agreed with that. I rarely worked. I was one of the ones who protested the very idea and simply did not show up for my assigned work duty. Word in Business was more my style. Even then we had to work because we were Corps. Sheesh! I think ROA was more fun for non Corps. We were of "all men most pitied." I look back now and realize the time should have been spent with my real family, the ones they called "Earthly" as in that verse in James 3 about things "Earthly sensual and devilish." If anything I would say ROA was pretty earthly. Ha!

A freind in New York asked me to see if I could locate her.

Copied and pasted that one, Simon. Great! TomStrange I was a porn star but then I graduated.

Why limit yourself to the bible? Its flawed anyway. Nice book which contains some truth. But there is more to life than the damn bible. I encourage you TWI apologist to do somethng....... Set aside all your TWI logic including the holy Piffle books for 6 months. Indeed haul them all to the local dump. Get away from the computer, Greasespot and Internet. (Computers are apain in the arse anyway). Go out and get laid and have some other fun. Make some friends who are not believers. REPORT BACK as to how your life changed during that time.

Oldies, I guess it goes to credibility. Isn't this the same man that told me and a girl riding with him on the motorcoach once (1978) that "there is no more gold left in Fort Knox" and "our country will go down the tubes if the prime interest rate goes above 14%". Yeah, it is. No sources were cited and the distinct impression given to us impressionable youth was "Wow!! Heavy Revy from the Wizard of OZ!!". Remember this was pre-Internet and it was difficult to cross check things in the Ohio cornfields where we lived. Gold Status in USA We just ignored his conspiratorial "revelation" and had another beer and admired the cool coach and chatted with Mrs. about more sane subjects. IMO we were misled at best. But I guess it was our own fault. I'm workin here, not much time for lame debates with the disillusioned.

Maybe there is a "Word of God" that CONTAINS truth but is not the only truth. Don't be so narrow minded. Think outside TWI the box. I love making the following statement loud and clear to my self these days: "The Bible is NOT my only rule of faith and practice." To me that's dangerous territory.

26 years ago fo me, 27 for Hoper. Damn! We ought to have a Corps reunion in Florida before we all croak. Tuttle and I will dream it and gel it. Here I am, thanks Craig for sending me to Florida where I aksed to go by divine revelation as a window washer in areas of concern interest and need. I'm still here. Graduation 1979

Wordwolfe, if you are not a lawyer you ought to be one. You're good. Hey Tom Strange, Remember Bill Hayes's (God rest his soul) famous Christian Motivational Techniques or Mo Tec for short. I abhorred that class because I hated doing stuff in front of a group. But I really enjoyed the Carnagie techniques we were taught. As I recall, Bill was a Dale Carnagie Instructor before he got in TWI. Then guess what he developed with VPW's approval. Mo Tech!! It made us better salesmen indeed. PFAL classes were rollig down the pike as we applied our Carnagie techniques. They work. Another 6th Corps guy taught us a speed reading class, taken from Ms. Evelyn Woods speed reading courses that he was familiar with. I actually liked a lot of those classes better than some boring bible teachings. Sorry, I digress. But then again, my truth needs no defense so .... Phuq you.

No connection, just a foolish waste of Abundant sharing to make that contribution to CAN. As if COS needed TWI's little contribution. I am near Clearwater, FL home of COS Headquarters. Needless to say there has been a lot in print around here about them. Lots can be found on the Internet about them. Basically, you do not mess with them. You will lose. They are powerful and agressive and wealthy. They make TWI look like the Girls Scouts. They appear to be striving for mainstream acceptance but they have a long way to go. They seem like nice people here in the community and have improved lots of buildings they bought which were a mess. Just a little strange to me. Not for me, thanks.

It was not ONLY used in context of witnessing you guys! C'mon. How long were you in TWI? My wife and I heard this stated in many teachings NOT in context of witnessing but in other contexts as well. Also in quite a few of the hundreds of Corps teachings we sat through. Any fool in sales knows that you don't keep hammering a customer who is not interested. Many of our witnessing techniques were taken directly from Dale Carnagie's techniques and changed around to fit our product. The "truth needs no defense" angle was NOT why we didn't waste time on them. Basically it was better to move on to a paying customer. The most common scriptures used to justify it were the ones about "after the 1st and 2nd admonition reject" and "shake the dust off your feet" was how we mentally handled our many sales rejections. Anyway, truth needs no defense was a commonly used phrase throughout the fabric of TWI. Lots of leaders used that phrase in their teachings. Looking back it seemed arrogant. Like we have the real truth and no one else does and we do not need to defend our little comfortable world. Sounds kinda like the Geerites of today.

You nailed it Wordwolf. Dummy, Oldies. Not for the general public indeed...... No way, man. We taught all this stuff in twig and witnessed these plagiarized truths to all including door to door witnessing. The spin was that thanks to VPW's revelation directly from God to Gas pumps, we now have this lost Davinci Code. And Didn't Jerry Jacks arrange to have these books sold door to door way back when? And it was always a bragging point when someone like Bill Grxxn or other hotshot would boast about how they got Walden Books to put one or more of these books in their bookstore. And many a public library had these books on their shelves thanks to ambitious believers, including Oral Roberts University. They were on display PUBLICLY in the living rooms of every twig fellowship across America as we were instructed. How many of us loaned our books to new people to read? The damage control would have been a piece of cake, but they were always bad at damage control. Too much pride at stake it seems. Oh, and btw, Mike is nutty.

Their loss, your gain. You'll see.

Oldies, get real. Had VPW given credit where credit was due from the very beginning, TWI could have possibly been successful instead of the permanent mess it is in now. We all thought he received revelation and researched these concepts on his own. We were led to believe that God showed him these things right from the bible as part of his snowbound promise. We all believed that he thought up and wrote RTHST and other plagiarized works. It was deceptive at best. At worst it was a con-game which was later broken by the power of the Information age. Thank you, Skyrider, for helping us understand "The Great Carjacking Mystery Revealed".

Those staff "teachers" need to get informed themselves. Why waste their time producing, recording and mailing info that is readily available and more aptly taught by saying. Go to www.whatever.com to learn all you need to know about ?? these subjects. In my decades of involvement in TWI I saw that they were awful at dispensing secular information. For example, I remember being encouraged to buy gold as an investment and to shy away from stocks. This was in the late 70's and early 80's for Gods' sake, right before one of the greatest bull markets in history that lasted many years. Just the opposite should have been taught. In more recent years we were given great pearls of wisdom to get out of all debt and even sell your real estate to become debt free if necessary. This was just before the huge rise in real estate prices. Believers lost millions listening to that advice. Some have never recovered financally. I think I'll get my house cleaning, car buying, business etiquette and history lessons elsewhere, thank you very much.

No not a quick get away. I was in no hurry whatsoever. In fact I was quite relaxed. My friend was somewhat anxious, however, if I recall. You might be quite surprised who he was. We had a great afternoon.