crystalclearblue

I appreciate this thread. My family and I are deeply concerned about our enviroment and very involved with recycling. Every little bit a person does helps. I think we are supposed to leave the world a better place for our grandchildren.

LOL. A very dear friend of mine works at a Chinese/American restaurant. I'll have to stop by for lunch, order egg foo young and tell her this. She loves groaners, even writes them down so she doesn't forget to tell them to the kids. Thanks Ham!

My sentiment exactly. O to be young again. My friends and I had huge crushes on astronauts after that. When I realized it had been forty years, I sure felt old! (None of us ever did end up marrying astronauts)

I remember this too. Even his old girlfriend who was married and living in another state was treated weirdly when he died. The whole no deviating from your plan thing caused so much fear, it stopped people from living their lives. It went on for years. I remember one woman was publicly praised for continuing to work hard even though she was very pregnant. She was held up as a great example. Then this other woman who was pregnant died in child birth. Afterwards she was ripped to shreds for not resting and taking care of herself better. I wondered if she had been influenced by the public praise the first woman had received, because she had always tried so hard to please. Mixed messages for sure.

I'm not sure, but I think the table eventually was ratted out. I think I remember it being "confronted." Then the numbers went down and there was no longer a need for "over flow" even when there were events.

Thanks, I'm honored.

I remember that table! It was in "overflow."

LOL. Or if you drive from a 250 mile radius to do it at a play back.

As a child I was told to use my "indoor voice" because it was not polite to yell indoors. You certainly did not yell at the dinner table. Yet the oSC had a microphone for yelling purposeS. When I was growing up it was considered bad manners to ask personal questions or not mind your own business. wy leadership was the biggest bunch of busy bodies I ever knew. They had too much time on their hands. "Get a real job" was probably coined with them in mind. I Thes 4:11 And that ye study to be quiet, and to do your own business. And to work with your own hands, as we commanded you.

LOL. Yep. Definately was not pleasant or sress free. So much pressure, and God forbid leadership should sit at your table....

Manners. Hmmm. Now that I think about it, I saw a lot of Way believers become rude about manners. Ripping someone to shreads over a slight mis step with words, or not wiping a table properly etc....All in the name of ettiquette or being decent and in order. Some guy once flipped out and yelled at me because I passed the wrong plate to someone. I had violated ettiquette by doing that. Ironic really. He was more rude and inconsiderate by yelling at me in front of everyone than what I did by passing the wrong plate. I was humiliated at the time, but now I just think he was weird.

Yesterday, Eagle 709 apologized for the way he wrote that post. He got the point and he was sorry. He changed his position. How about giving some understanding towards him? Likewise, we don't know what he has gone through and maybe being harsh to him AFTER he tried to make it right will shut him down when he needs to talk. (I hope he posts more about his Dad, that sounded really cool. A lot of us didn't have a strong parent to draw from.)

She actually was the one who told me about gs cafe. She said she stopped posting a few years ago. That book sounds interesting, I'm going to see if the library has it tomorrow. Thanks for the recommendation.

I've known her for a long time and she was actually a bitter person even before her way experience. The way experience certainly didn't help. I know what you mean about being ashamed-some of the things that went on or that I participated in the way are just too embarrassing to even want to talk about to anyone.

Thanks, that is very thoughtful for you to point that out. She has sought professional help, but it hasn't been very helpful yet because from what she tells me, she doesn't tell them what her issues are. There is a great side to her personality, but the bitterness she carries can be overwhelming at times for those around her. She's lost a lot of friends because of it. It's sad,really. Thanks for your response too. That's cool about your Dad.

Dear Eagle 709. Sometimes people just need to talk. Sometimes it's hard to find people who understand what it was like. Each person is at a different place. There is not one quote or phrase that is a cure all. I think you have to really know someone before prescribing that they "get over it". I do know someone I wish I could say that to. She was hurt by the way. They never should have treated her the way they did. But she does get annoying because it's been almost ten years and I am sick of hearing about it. I'm also sick of hearing her blame her parents, her siblings, coworkers, spouse, me etc... for her life being miserable. She has worn me down because nothing has changed or become even a little better. She even once said that her kids would be permanently traumatized because of her life experiences. She's planning on upseting them with things that happened before they were born and don't have anything to do with. But she's like that. She enjoys feeling sorry for herself and likes holding grudges. But the reason I know this is because I have spent a lot of time with her. But I still haven't told her to just "get over It." Although I'm dangerously close. Point being, sometimes someone does need to be told to "get over it". But i would be very careful about who you say it to. What if they still need some time to talk and sort things out and you scare them off, thus making their recovery take that much longer?

I've been thinking about what Shellon wrote. I'm so sorry you and your kids and family were treated like that. Loss is hard enough in itself. But to have the people closest to you blame you is unthinkable. A therapist once told a friend of mine that she was having irrational thinking, because she was feeling guilty about her husband's death. He had been ill for a long time before he died. After he died she kept going back and forth between thinking maybe she didn't do enough to find a cure or maybe she let him suffer too long while she hoped for a cure. The therapist told her grief brings on irrational thinking. There was nothing she could have done to change the outcome. After she shared this with me, she asked me to help her when she started experiencing irrational thinking again. She would sometimes call in the middle of the night, and all I had to do was remind her how much she loved her husband, how much he loved her and he knew she did everything she could for him. That's all it took for her to get peaceful again. When she would go through this, it was as if she was being tortured. It's now four years later and she is doing very well. She is happy and healthy and even dating. But it took over two years for her to get healed. I honestly believe that if someone had tried to blame her or play that kind of a mind game on her, she would not have survived it. The therapist was right. It's irrational to blame ourselves or someone else for a death. It's part of the cycle of life. God can heal and deliver, I would never want to give up on believing that. I'll believe that until someone takes their last breath. But when it's done, we just have to help each other heal and love each other. No need for a "spiritual" autopsy. Shellon, you seem like a very strong person to have survived all that and to be in contact with the relatives. You probably understand how to really help people the way they truly need to be helped. I think the reason leaders blamed people so much is because they were terrible at their jobs. They had no clue how to minister to people. They liked to tout themselves as being a MOG with us knowing the truth greater than it had ever been known before blah blah blah. They should have known better than anyone how to minister. But for all their ego and holier than thou lectures, the were incompetant and inept. That's why they blamed.

Thanks for the latte. Yum.

How very sad this all is. I did not know their family very well, but I could tell that they really loved each other and seemed very close and happy. I find it interesting that it seems like the Panarello's stayed on good terms with the way. Both ministries are mentioned in the obituary and they are going to help raise the Grandchildren from what his letter said. I'm glad Krystine was not pressured into cutting her parents out of her life. It's nice they can be there for each other. I feel sad for them all that they have had this loss.