shortfuse

I do wonder why they chose the words they chose to pick on. The fantastic vs. wonderful is pretty hilarious. You can be sure FABULOUS would have been turned down.

Funny, had a flash back. Went to HQ for an event and people came back with a new adjective: MAGNIFICENT. You know who was dropping that majestic modifier likea mofo.

I gotta admit though. It was a pretty Mag-friggin-ificent time.

* edited to mask expletives

Hey Shortfuse, I think of it in terms of "jargon." My last few years in TWI I became increasingly aware of jargon and tried to eliminate it in my language. Maybe it was because of my years in Way Pub and seeing people write the same $h1t over and over. Like "wonderful." It was OK to say "wonderful" but "fantastic" was not because it had its roots in "fantasy." [cough, cough] Sticking with the approved language makes the person look good in front of other people. I became very aware of this when we did a fellowship for the younger adults. I saw that they would speak a certain way around us "adults" but act differently with their friends. They were trying to "talk the talk" to BS us. And the funny thing is, most of the other adults bought it. They thought these people were so great because they had "the Word" at such a young age.

To this day, my husband and I laugh and joke over jargon terms like "available," and "it would be great if..." and "that doesn't bless me." I want to shout, "For the love of God, just be a real person! Be YOU!"

As for rosie and the BOD, yes, they are manipulated and controlled by her, and if she can't subdue them to her liking, they're gone. Why do you think she's blazed through more directors in the past 10 years than TWI has even had (outside of them) in the past 60 years?

Yeah, jargon is certainly a big part of what I was thinking of. That's really interesting that Way Pub censored "fantastic". Craiggers pointed out years ago that references to idolatry and paganism are everywhere, citing days of the week, months, etc, certainly in a lot of word origins. Puts a lot off limits if you think about it. I used to cringe when he would say "by Jove", (well, I would cringe on a lot more than that) like, "doesn't he know where 'Jove' comes from?!" Wishing you, no wait scratch that, Believing with you for... a happy birthday... no, I mean... blessed birthday! Sure love ya! Oh, and Merry Christmas!

I wonder if the cliche jargon is just a symptom of the cult or if it is an actual tool. Seems like the latter to me.

A few more Wayfer adjectives I loathe.

Variegated

Multifarious

(Okay, we get it, you have a Thesaurus.)

Adverbs:

Aboundingly

Prevailingly

(Actually, might want to get that Thesaurus back out)

I remember that on more than one occasion I was asked to make a card for leadership for some stupid class or function we had to attend. A bit of writer's block was stumping me on what to write for the inside of the card. My solution: a list of present truth buzz words that I could fashion into a greeting. You know the kind I'm talking about....

"It is with abundantly abundant joy that we, the household of God, stand together this great day on higher ground as we complete the Defeating the Adversary class that you have so lovingly made available to us so that we can be strongly rooted and grounded on God's Word, withstanding the wiles of our opponent."

(If that quote doesn't make some of you ol' TWI2-ers cringe in your chairs, I don't know what will!)

Awesome. Like some kind of Wayspeak Ninja! I did something similar on my way out of the Way Corps.

Oh, just noticed the age of this thread. Seems we deal with a lot of the same crap.

I have a long standing disdain for the cliches in any form. While in the Way I was aware of a great many cliches expressions people seemed to like latching onto - definitions, expressions, turns of phrase. I would habitually stop myself when I found myself speaking in Way jargon and would restate my point in a different, fresh fashion if possible. I was really bothered by RFR's teaching to the corps about communication. I can't remember what it was called (which makes me feel good - so many Way things I wish I could forget), but the point of it was to teach the corps how to write way magazine articles. Among other things, she specifically instructed us to use "familiar" terminiology and word definitions so as to be comforting to the minds of the reader or listener. We were specifically discouraged from using words that were new to describe concepts - stick to the simplest term that works and stick to the familiar definitions and phrases. I disliked it then, but I didn't see it as mechanism of control until later.

What's wrong with cliches, you say? For one thing, THEY"RE BORING! But more to my point, they give you a shortcut to a generalized answer, and get you to stop thinking, stop questioning, stop looking for a better more precise way to describe your thoughts and observations. Way and cultists elsewhere, favor a limited range of cliches with which to address most aspects of life. There are words, thoughts, and ideas they will NEVER get to because the stop at the cliche.

Looking back, I think this is a tool of control, knowingly wielded by Rosalie, LCM, VPW. I don't know about the rest of the current BOD. I think are just as manipulated and mush minded as anybody they try to control. But I think Rosalie gets what she is doing. Doesn't matter. I think cliches are boring at best, sinister tools of control at worst. What do you think?

It seemed to me to be just "helpful tips from an old guy",

LOL! That's exactly what it was! Not a bad thing mind you, but not worth being elevated to more than that.

I acted as a buffer so many times between the directors and the rank n' file!

Felt exactly this way.

My $.02 on the original question without having really digested all the discussion that followed.

My parents used to have mad file cabinets full of way stuff growing up. At some point they had this archive of like every letter VPW had written the Corps or something. I just happened upon it poking around these documents. One made an impression on me, but I haven't seen the hard copy since (this is maybe 20 years ago now). It was a letter from VPW to the Way Corps household, and he was apologizing to the whole corps household in really vague terms for letting them down and hurting their hearts. That's about as specific as I remember but it was like a one page letter to the whole corps. Wierd thing is, I've never heard any of the old timers here validate this story - after all this time, I wonder if I imagined it. (Shrug.)

As for the current BOD, I have suggested that an apology was in order. John Rupp told me he didn't think it was biblical. Did Paul apologize for going to Jerusalem? Are there any examples of men of god asking for forgiveness of their flock?

Just seems like common sense, common decency to me.

Ya know, as age starts taking it's toll, pitching a tent is not quite as easy as it once was. :o

Think there's a pill you can take for that.

Tell me more about the punishment assignments. I didn't know the Mona Vie jokers got punished.

Yup, I was a mini wow that year. We were "believing" to go to California.

Naturally, we went to Wisconsin.

During placements a few years ago the cabinet were blamed for there being VERY little new applicants. I think there were a grand total of four.

These f*ckers are so f*cking clueless. It's not the lack financial compensation keeping people from coming on staff. The word is out. Being on staff SUCKS! Duh! How could you not know that??!!

Gosh, let's flog the cabinet and the field leadership to get more applicants. Ha! What's more, I know for a fact they turned away more than a few of the crazy F*ers who wanted to come on staff in the first place. Dumb mother f*ckers.

Also, it's not cussing if I use an asterisk. F*ckers.

How many top butt kissers do you think are preparing a coup to take over the place?

No take over. They expect to inherit it one day.

I wonder if the current BOT could demand Rozilla to step down.

Hypothetically, yes. Realistically, not a chance.

Does anyone have any speculation on this?

A reorg is supposed to be coming. A more contemporary corporate structure with the executive officers responsible for operations, and a board of directors to whom they are accountable. Rosalie will step out of president role, but retain the helm as chairman of the board. A figure head - guessing Rico or John - will take the president's role. They are the ones who will one day inherit the ministry and they will keep things from changing.

When I was on Staff I never knew about any government programs. We paid a lot out of pocket to have my child due to it being a high risk pregnancy and delivery. I knew I'd never be able to have any more children making squat $.

A local person told me about WIC which was a blessing. My child was unable to be breastfed and the cost of formula is insane. So thankfully, WIC was helpful for that, otherwise we would've had no money whatsoever.

Wait a minute. You were on staff and had to be on WIC?

Thanks for posting your story Balanced. Goes to show that the encouragement to speak up is little more than more mindless drivel designed to help keep the sepulcher whited.

I hear you, but at the same time i think a lot of those encouraging "speaking up" are privately hoping someone actually will. They lack the courage to stand up and hope someone else will do the job. Sadly when someone does speak up, and they are ostrasized, these same people praying for a reformer label the whistle blower a cop out.

All in all, it's a pretty neat trick they have going for them. Not sure if they planned it that way, but it is sure how it works. I know, because I have been the one who trusted (#1) so much that I shunned my own family - thought they were evil and that they would contaminate my walk with God. How far from the truth that was! Then later I began questioning and speaking up myself... and I found out about #2.

Excellent analysis as usual.

I would be reluctant to use the word cult. To me it is too loaded of a term for most contexts (and to be perfectly honest I am still embarrassed by it). I tell people we were very involved in a church we thought was good, but overtime came to realize how legalistic, controlling and abusive it was. We stayed in against our better judgement but eventually severed ties. It has caused me to re-evaluate many, many premises I have held particularly in regards to religion.

I have struggled with the word "cult" in general (although I can think of no better word to describe TWI) because it can be so broadly applied. There are well accepted groups like alcoholics anonymous and denominations like the Catholics (okay Roman Catholics, wayfers) that fit many criteria for the label. Ultimately I decided the label "cult" was not worth using in most cases. Maybe there could be good cults, I don't know. The point for me was that it was an abusive system and that regardless of benefit some may have found there, it was harmful for me and my family. Hence the getting the F out.

I have since met a number of people who have gone through painful separations from unhealthy church involvement. They can relate rather well to our situation but don't consider themselves former cultists.

That was an EPIC FAIL. First big shot at being "in charge". What a mess. That's hilarious though that Hope, AR was a recurring breakdown spot. I thought we'd never get out of that place.

Course, now that I'm thinking about it.. I do remember those trips to the Rock were always an addventure. Shortfuse probably remembers my first trip to the Rock more than I seeing it was with his WOW family. I was a teenager and wouldn't let anyone drive my car, so I drove the whole way (from Texas to Ohio) and took naps while we stopped for lunch/supper. But I was so half asleep the whole time. lol.. Surprised I made it in one piece. And of course one of the cars in our caravan had a water pump go out in the usual breakdown spot of Hope, Arkansas. Birthplace of Clinton! It seemed 3 years in a row cars in the caravan I was with going to the Rock always broke down there. Maybe God was telling us something! ;)

I agree completely. I think she knows exactly what she is doing too.

The others are extremely self-deluded.

Maybe I'm giving Rosie a little too much credit, but I think she knows EXACTLY what she is doing and doesn't give a crap about God - just using that as a veneer as a way to be waited on hand and foot by servants who are paid less than minimum wage, and have $54,000,000.00 at her disposal tax free. Her house is more than comfortable, and all upkeep is handled by the Staff who worship her and will do anything she wants. She has her own little population of brainwashed people willing to do whatever she wants in the name of God. And it's all based on lies and hypocrisy.

Here is why I think this: Rosalie got involved a LONG time back, and she was older than most of those who got involved at that time. VP said that he respected her (which we know he rarely respected women at all.) She sat in the background, learning the con, manipulating and micromanaging the life out of everything. She fed LCM (and probably VP) women who she had helped coerce into sexual servitude - she knew it was wrong. Why did she do it? To curry favor. She laid in wait until LCM's debauchery (which she endorsed by her procurement of women for LCM) finally resulted in a lawsuit, allowing her to step in and take over. It is reported that she is a lesbian in a ministry that vehemently condemns homosexuality - once again a moral conundrum for her, which she seems to ignore. She stated at the beginning of her term as president that BOD positions would not be "lifetime" assignments - and they haven't been EXCEPT FOR HER. Another lie, more hypocrisy.

She has effectively weeded out all those who question her, who try to bring her back to "the Word"... she never had a conscience to sear, in my opinion. She is living high on the fat of the sacrifices of good people trying to do their best for God and she knows exactly what she is doing.

Where else other than a cult in the middle of a cornfield with a veneer of nice Christianity could someone get away with this?

As for her fellow directors, I think they are just as duped as the rest of the fold.

This is a good assessment. I was not aware of the extent of group one until near the end of my time "in". I had felt alone and conflicted in my dissent. I was validated initially upon realizing that seemingly everyone agreed with me in someway - everyone had gripes, serious complaints with The Way, if you talked in confidence. What amazed me was just how many of them that were equally conflicted, and how almost everyone was afraid to speak up. Either rationalized it away as being an "insignificant matter" to be yielded on or waiting for their big opportunity to change things.

I would agree other posters that this is not a Way Corps only phenomenon but it certainly is pronounced there.

It seems tragic that all these people who want change, but are afraid to speak up, are actually in the strongest position to get it by virtue of their majority. But they don't realize it. And so their fear keeps them in check.

I am not many years removed from their ranks. Glad to no longer be counted among them.

Camp #1 - The Majority

From the very time I went in-residence, until my very last day as active way corps, I was aware of something I did not expect to find before going into the way corpse. A river of dissent and dissatisfaction from quite a few of the participants. Now, before I go any further, there were definitely a minority that LOVED all of the control, legalism, laws, structure, others straining at the least aspects of their lives. My hats off to you. I'll get back to you in a minute. The dissenters, from what I could tell vastly out number those who love all things way international.

After every STS, after reading the way magazine, after hearing the latest lectures and edicts handed down from the way corps mornings this group would divide up into sub-groups based on trust and friendship and rip it all apart. Granted, it was excused amongst them because their criticisms had a veneer of "how to fix it." Therefore, their hypocrisy is excused amongst most of them.

Common gripes include, but are not limited to:

• How bad way productions always are
• How scripted and dry the STS always is
• How dry white toast the way magazine always was

And yet, living in utter hypocrisy this group RARELY, if ever speaks up when given the chance. No, when the pressure is turned on to conform they fall in line for one reason or another. Spineless and neutered, they persist in an organization that does not make them happy, nor do they believe in what they do. They cover themselves in cliches like "If there was someplace out there that taught the word I would leave in a minute." Obviously what they really mean is if there is some place that teaches what the way international does I would leave in a minute. This camp is trapped, held against their will even though they hold their own chains in their hands and can drop them at any time.

To this group, that I was once a part, I say - LEAVE NOW! RUN, DO NOT WALK! Life is too short to live in that type of bondage and you know it.

Camp #2 The Dominant Minority:

Then there is the other camp. These are the folks loved by the Directors. The yes men and women. Who walk lock step (or perhaps goose step) with the Directors. They love all that is, mindlessly, simply because it is. This group always considers themselves the examples of righteous living and expects that non-way corpse should emulate their example. Given the chance they will always talk about how wonderful the way international is. To them it the way international is the center of their lives. They constantly regurgitate the present truth and look for any opportunity to steer all conversations to the latest teaching.

Camp #2 sounds innocent enough except they are the zealots of the way corps. They will report the dissenters in a heart beat because they are easily offended, taking any

criticism aimed at the way international as an attack of the adversary. They will sacrifice family, friends - yea, they have NO friends when it comes to "the werd."

They are the dominant minority. To this group I say nothing because you wouldn't be caught dead reading GreaseSpot Cafe because you lack the fortitude to face the reality that you are in a twisted cult that has a criminal past. Just because you masters paid enough money to keep things out of court do not mean the wrongs were not perpetrated. Too many people witness against them and there will come a day where the secrets of men will come to light.

Has anyone else noticed these things? Or other things? I thought the post was worth putting out there to let people see what it's like "in-house."

A couple years ago, I was told that international work represented 80-90% of the ministry work, most of this being in Africa, and most of that in Congo. In this case it was brought up as reason why TWI was dragging it's feet on common sense (in the U.S anyway) tech upgrades. "We don't want to rush into CD's and DVD's; the Africans are still using cassette and VHS. We need to take into consideration the needs of the *whole* ministry."

The last time I talked to some Africans they were desperate for some help - still doing "branches" of hundreds of fellowships and fellowships of 50+ people. No internationals are allowed in the Corps, supposedly because of the war on terror. Personally I think it is because the Way Corps no longer even has the pretense of being an educational institution. Point is, they can't get student visas if they aren't real students! Also, they wanted an outreach program in Africa, but all they had available was Way Disciple. You have to have had the "new" advanced class to be eligible. This disqualified almost everyone there. It was a once in a lifetime trip to come to the "old" Advanced Class. Sorry that one doesn't count anymore. Oh well, I guess there's nothing we can do, eh Jean-Yves? Dumbass. Way to take into consideration the needs of the whole ministry.

Some of us Way Corpse used to "remind" ourselves how MANY believers there were on other Continents, such as Africa. Mind you, we did this when we had no proof how many there actually were / are. Then there were the reminders coming at us from dictator wannabees, like John Rupp, that we haven't had to dodge bullets to get to our Staff jobs but in Africa they have. We have it so much better.

While there is no doubt in my mind that life is easy in America compared to other places, I find it offensive that these scenarios are used to justify ongoing wrongs against people employed by the way international.

TWI saw the success of other hyper-authoritarian sects there such as the JWs, & wanted to cash in

Dead on.

This verse about rebellion is one I learned to use against myself in-residence. (I was of a rebellious age and temperament.) It was followed closely by the Old Testament injunction, "Suffer not a witch to live...". Which is to say my attitude was some how worthy of death. This combination of verses kept me in line when I reached an early "F-this" point in the training.

Thankfully they never fully beat the rebellion out of me. fuc kers

Looking through the corps friend finder forum here, was just wondering how many from my group are even left. I know there's at least a couple. It made me wonder, how many of the corps classes are empty today, that is no one left "standing". I know the "zero corps" and the first corps (if you don't count the honorary members) are vacant. Anyone know of any other abandon way corps classes? Any Permanent Records people past or present out there?

Well, I might be the strange one of the pack..

Well, yeah.

When in-residence we had it drilled into us that we should be willing to "change ANYTHING and EVERYTHING about ourselves" to... fill in the blank - "move the word", "be a good minister of Jesus Christ", whatever. I tried hard to change or repress so many things about myself from my sense of humor to my style of dress to my interests and aspirations. When the scandals with the Craiggers broke in 2000, that woke me up to the kind of people I had been enduring so much inner conflict to please. I started letting my real self come back to the surface. It took another five years before I had gained enough confidence to start fighting back, and three more to get out of TWI with my family intact. About two years out and I am still sorting through the process of being who I really am and want to be, and mapping out what I want out of life and going for it.

Maybe that's why it seemed their modus operandi was never to let anyone know they made a mistake.. At least not publicly to the masses. Since there was once I heard them make a correction at the "noon meal" at HQ, but they weren't going to share that with the rest of the public..

You know one way I heard it told was that the errant statements were left in on purpose, to show the progression of the ministry and how "we change when we learn better." The contradictions should be viewed as historical information, and we should always resolve conflict by siting the most current teaching. The "present truth" is accurate teaching.

I agree it is not changed to avoid admitting mistakes. (One admission after all opens the door to countless other admissions that are in order.) I also think the contradictions are left on purpose to retain a certain ambiguity and deny-ability. Aside from the topics already mentioned - can you lose rewards or can't you? is the judgement for reward and punishment or reward only? Is debt always wrong or is it sometimes acceptable? What is god's view premarital and extramarital sex? Just a few moving targets that come to mind. The answer depends on the time and the teacher. Written and verbal teaching present another gap in consistency.

It is fascinating to hear some of these accounts though of attempts at homogenizing the message behind the scenes.

Learned behavior assumed to be proof of the supernatural.

I've thought it would be interesting to study this by observing and recording the words/phrases heard in manifestations in fellowship. I bet you each language is well under 100 words.

A lot of it seems to be imitations of other languages or other peoples SIT-ing.

Any theories on what speaking in tongues is as twi taught it if it is not the same thing as was done in Acts?

Wow.. Thanks for sharing.. Hehe.. I have had many a meetings with many of old friends still in and many now out but in other churches.. But those in TWI and its offshoots, I always liked how they elevate "THE WORD" above it all.. With phrases like, we shared "the word" with one another, or "the word" was moving and hot, or you need to know "the word", it's the power of "the word" in your mind! I'm mean, are we talking about the living word, Christ, or is it this here black and white printed book?.. I mean, really, it seemed like the black and white words were coming alive and dancing after conversations with them. Kinda creepy

Last TWI encounter I had, well it was a couple of them all at once (after a funeral of a prior believer that had left).. I let the TWIers ask the questions since I didn't want to look like the guy trying to pursuade them against it. If they didn't ask, I wasn't pushing. But they usually bite since they usually are trying to push their beliefs and get you to come back.. So I had this one friend, honest guy, ask me why I left, so the door was open. But wouldn't you know, Mr. I am in charge of this group of TWIers come over and told my friend, "Don't talk to this guy. We need to go.". So I tried to diffuse the guy, telling him this was a free country. That only got him more upset. Course, he got so upset he just walked off angry cause he knew I wasn't backing down and it only made him look more like an ar$e. And continued on explaining why I left and what I saw. Didn't pursuade him to leave, but he agreed he saw the same issues, but the local fellowship was sweeter. Yeah, well, not interested! I saw the "I'm in charge" guy a few more times in following week (meeting of friends of the deceased) and each time, he was sure to stay far away from me.. Acted like I had cooties or something! lol..

This sounds like text book M1ke And3rson.