T-Bone

Right here is the heart of Mike's belief system. Mike is obviously a wierwille-worshipper. Idolatry - Wikipedia idolatry = the religious worship of idols. excessive or blind adoration, reverence, devotion.

Once again, your writings are unmistakably stupid! according to you but really - - I’m tempted to think it might be some turd of an idea you probably found up wierwille’s a$$ - - let’s break that nonsense down: Mike said: God does the hard part in supplying what is said. What a gross misrepresentation of true worship…If God supplies the words then you’re saying God is a puppeteer . 1Then some Pharisees and teachers of the law came to Jesus from Jerusalem and asked, 2 “Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? They don’t wash their hands before they eat!” 3 Jesus replied, “And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition? 4 For God said, ‘Honor your father and mother’ and ‘Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.’ 5 But you say that if anyone declares that what might have been used to help their father or mother is ‘devoted to God,’ 6 they are not to ‘honor their father or mother’ with it. Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition. 7 You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you: 8 “ ‘These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. 9 They worship me in vain; their teachings are merely human rules.’ ” Matthew 15 NIV wierwille’s idea - - and apparently yours also, is that true worship is the fakery he taught in PFAL. You move your lips, tongue, mouth, etc., but do not think of the words. Expect God to supply the words. How utterly stupid for wierwille to teach that – and you’re doubly stupid for regurgitating it here. Where does the person’s heart fit in??????? Look at Matthew 15:8 - These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me…any 2-bit plagiarist, drunkard, thief pathological liar and sexual predator can honor God wit their lips – wierwille did that most of the time. Mike if you EVER get to finish reading Undertow you ought to suck it up and read Losing the Way: A Memoir of Spiritual Longing, Manipulation, Abuse, and Escape: Skedgell, Kristen: 9780972002196: Amazon.com: Books . And in light of you taking FOREVER to read a book that presents your idol wierwille in an unfavorable light and the fact that you don’t like to read anything but collaterals I recommend you skip ahead to, that I feel is a section that SHOULD be important to you pages 117 to 120. It’s the part where Kristen – working in housekeeping relates an incident when she placed a welcome letter on wierwille’s pillow in the Coachman Suite at Rome City – the note said she would “do anything to make his time more blessed here”. The following night, after the evening teaching, wierwille called Kristen to his suite. He has a glass of Drambuie in one hand and a cigarette in the other – he sits very relaxed – he had taken off his suit coat and tie, the top button of his white shirt was undone, and his shoes were kicked off. He asks her to sit on the bed and they exchange some polite small talk. He then asks her if she really meant what she said in the little welcome note. “Of course,” she says. Then wierwille says “Well, there is one thing you can do for me. I’d like you to take off your clothes. I’d like to show you how to really make love to a man. You know what I’m talking about. You’re of age. Don’t you want me to show you how to have intercourse? How to make love to a man of God!” In the book Kristen says “This is tantamount to a father soliciting sex from his daughter. The betrayal is unthinkable.” Trying to delay or avert wierwille’s advances, Kristen tried asking him how such an act is consistent with The Word. wierwille explains that all things are pure to the pure…it’s a matter of keeping our minds renewed and centered on God…a man of God needs many women to satisfy his overwhelming needs. There is nothing titillating when Kristen describes wierwille sexually molesting her. It’s like reading a police report of a daughter being raped by her own father…the first time I read this part my heart ached in sympathy for Kristen and there was utter revulsion over wierwille’s betrayal…after wierwille molested her, he says to her “It’s the lockbox, honey. You have to keep this in the lockbox of your soul. Many of God’s people wouldn’t understand what we’ve just done.” After you read Kristen’s book “Losing The Way”, feel free to come back to Grease Spot and discuss anything that was too cerebral for you. Besides myself, I’m sure there’s other Grease Spotters here who have been through way corps training and can easily explain the tale of two wierwilles to you – there’s the one who taught the PFAL class - and then there’s the one who lived the life of a predator’s dream…it’s good to be the king. Grease Spotters can find this book explained to Mike on another thread > my post Friday Jan. 7th 2022 Plagiarism on the road to success Mike, did you notice the part in bold red? Do you know what that reminds me of? Jesus’ words in Matthew 15:8 , These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. Mike, get your head out of wierwille’s a$$ ! Schmooze = talk with someone in a lively and friendly way, typically in order to impress or manipulate them...Mike, you ought to be ashamed at your poor choice of words. Where does it say that in the Bible? heart - ahhh there it is again - if we had a trusting and willing heart. Do you mean a trusting and will heart like Kristen had toward wierwille? You can't mean wierwille had a willing heart to obey the Word of God. He was a repeat offender sexual predator. He was an unabashed plagiarist. He talked the walk ("they honor me with their lips") but he didn't walk the talk ("but their hearts are far from me") Your references about God not giving us something bad are the exact same references wierwille used in RTHST, by which he asserted believers do not have to worry about receiving a counterfeit. That’s ironic. wierwille knew how to fake tongues and in PFAL he encourages students to disengage their mind and use the body parts of speech mechanics to speak gibberish. So, you must mean you interpret Jesus’ words as a reference to SIT because wierwille SAID SO. You know nothing except what was up wierwille's a$$.

yes - you did mention it twice in the same post - first and last thing you said. are you doing okay? you're repeating yourself.

don't think I was clear enough in my response to you. Mike, are you 5 years old ?!?!?! Are you stoned ?!?!?! why do you say stupid $hit like that ?!?!?! Mike, I need the Lord Jesus Christ to come to my house right fvcking now and tell me that I should believe you. That's the ONLY way I would believe you. Got it? That's the ONLY way I would believe you.

wow wee wow you STILL believe that horse-$hit ?!?! Mike, you've got some big issues. If wierwille was God's spokesman at the time - and I mean if that was undeniably confirmed by Jesus Christ coming back to earth - just for a few minutes to announce "Mike speaks the truth, wierwille was God's spokesman at the time." then I would absolutely renounce Christianity !!!! And go on the attack of Christianity big time - I will pick up the persecution of the church where Saul of Tarsas left off just before he was converted on the road to Damascus. I swear on my parents' grave!!!!!! why?!?!?! because Jesus Christ coming down to earth - where I see and hear and feel His awesome presence with my own rinky dink sinful body - and He fries my brain cells with the ultimate mind-fvck that the God whom I thought I served for some 69 years of my life is a hypocritical god. He demands I should not commit adultery, that I should not commit murder, that I should not steal or lie....Yet He uses wierwille the greatest hypocrite and wolf in sheep's clothing in all of TWI history to enforce the dpuble standard...naw homey don't play that.

realize you are interpreting Jesus' earthly ministry through the eyes of wierwille's fake ministry to mimic Jesus' ministry. and Jesus Christ words and works authenticated His ministry. The Holy Spirit authenticated the apostles words - both the words & works of Jesus, per what we find in the gospels - and what the apostles shared informally in their preaching and witnessing . I don't understand this comment of yours: "You are just not using your whole brain in thinking this through; only to impede what I am saying." I did a lot more thinking through than you did - I went back and study the Bible especially NT in various translations and in the framework of various systematic theologies to get a better understanding of the Bible in its original languages and cultures. you're telling me your cognitive dissonance along with your fervent adoration of a sin-loving cult-leader like wierwiile is a better method of interpretation? I beg to differ. I rejected that toxic nonsense years ago because it impeded the Holy Spirit working in my life - worshipping wierwille and PFAL obstructed me connecting with my living Lord & Savior Jesus Christ. Go sell nonsense somewhere else ! I'm all stocked up at my house - I have one little isolated hermetically sealed and guarded with atomic powered lasers - like that little rat trap looking box in Ghostbusters - and there is where I store wierwille / PFAL nonsense - only as a reference when I quote from it on Grease Spot - although I could quote it all from my head - and then get challenged by psyco whack job wierwille fans who say I missed stuff.

I’ve noticed similar inconsistencies of his thinking process on various topics - it's apparent when he discusses doctrinal stuff, PFAL / wierwille stuff besides scientific and technical stuff. Offhand, there’s only a few reasons I can think of that would explain his often-irrational theorizing, contradictory analysis as well as the inability to explain or grasp most simple science stuff: 1.Mike is suffering from old age, mental illness or brain injury: Maybe he did have experience in all the science stuff he talks about – but age, mental illness, traumatic head injury may be a factor. I can relate to all 3 in some respects. I’ve started having issues recalling the name of a person I’ve met but haven’t seen in a long time or when drafting a post, mid-sentence I draw a blank for the right word to use. I don’t mean what’s appropriate – but what the damn thing is called. Maybe early waring signs of dementia or aphasia or something – like what Bruce Willis is dealing with. I did have a serious concussion – I was unconscious for a bit - in a truck rollover at work in ’97. But this ‘unable to think of that word’ is a recent development...I started taking Prevagen - hope that helps. On the mental illness factor – I think of the movie based on a true story A Beautiful Mind (2001) - IMDb …but John Nash suffered from schizophrenia which did NOT affect his brilliant mind’s capacity to make foundational contributions to - among other areas - game theory, real algebraic and differential geometry, mathematical analysis of partial differential equations and proposed a new encryption–decryption machine. ( see John Forbes Nash Jr. - Wikipedia ). The impact of his mental illness didn’t seem to affect his mental acuity, logic, interpretation of any data – rather he suffered from paranoia and hallucinations…I’ve had the same problem, but my excuse was LSD and weed – also truth be told I’m no genius – I suck at math and logic – but hallucinations and paranoia did not have a big negative impact on playing the bass….oh and I still have this recurring fear that I am hallucinating I’m not Jack Bruce. Occasionally fans come up to me and say yo dude I thought you died in 2014. **** 2. Mike suffers from some delusional disorder: (see Delusional disorder - Wikipedia ) He may or may not have had some limited experience in some areas he talks about. The biggest telltale symptom I’ve noticed is his strong mistaken beliefs despite superior evidence to the contrary. That applies across the board concerning PFAL, wierwille, the Bible, and theoretical and hard sciences. Hard for amateurs and laymen like me to diagnose someone over cyberspace – but I leave that possibility on the table till proven wrong. **** 3. Mike is a phony on many fronts: I tend to lean more on this reason. When in doubt – I don’t get into trying to judge one’s motivations or ‘game plan’ – so in cyberspace I go on face value – what does their online presence suggest? Phonies are easy to spot if you follow their schtick. I’ve been coming to Grease Spot for 17 years and Mike’s various routines, mutating ideology, ready defense of wierwille / PFAL and modus operandi seem to suggest he is a troll, a phony or someone (or group) who enjoys messing with Grease Spotters. **** 4.It’s a combination of 1,2 and 3. ~ ~ ~ ~ If Mike is reading this post – I hope he can interpret it properly – and for what it’s worth, my intention is to provide him with honest feedback so he can refine his delivery and not get laughed at. I’m not trying to attack him personally. It’s like trying to advise a public speaker who lacks self-awareness. You tell him his fly is open before he walks out to the lectern and embarrasses himself – and he refuses to believe you. Several others tell him. Point to his reflection in the backstage mirror – but he still doesn’t see it or refuses to look. He goes out there – delivers his message while there’s a smattering of chuckles and snickering in the audience. He finally snaps at the audience you people are unreceptive to any of these great truth I share and storms off the stage.

I am no longer receiving email alerts from Grease Spot when someone PMs me. I used to receive them awhile back - not sure of when it stopped - last year? I even check spam folder on gmail and see nothing from Grease Spot in there. anyway, I've gone over my Grease Spot Cafe profile settings on messaging, alerts - I have not changed anything since I joined in 2006. other details: I use a 'dedicated' gmail address; just means I receive email receipts from purchases and autopayments accounts; I check it periodically. I have another gmail address that I use for most communications for personal stuff - friends, etc. If any moderators or Grease Spotters have any ideas or input on the issue I'm having please let me know...either on this thread - or -you can PM me - however, remember I won't know you've sent me a PM until the next time I log onto Grease Spot . let me know if I need to check / change setting(s) in my Grease Spot Cafe message controls. thanks!

I agree. some others might not to them I say don't beat a dead horse

When was the last time you brought a new person to Twig?

You are patently wrong !!!!!!! I think what you’re good at encoding is converting the twisted theology of a megalomaniac-drunken-liar-money-grubbing-plagiarizing-sexual-predator into some kind of obfuscating bull-$hit that you like to push on Grease Spot. Keep your damn mutating toxic folders infested with the inner demons of wierwille to yourself. Without opening a single page of the collaterals I can cite numerous references of wierwille’s fixation and promotion of greed and materialism - because I’ve had that cultic propaganda drilled into my head. Challenging the reader to think bigger for whatever their hearts desired by asking “are you limiting God?” Tempting the reader toward greed and materialism by instructing them to “get clear on what you want in your mind” what do you think - we’re morons? why do you think there was so much disappointment and disillusionment in TWI and why most people only lasted so long - and then left or slowly faded away because wierwille promised so much but his “law of believing” , positive affirmations techniques , and tithing / abundant sharing / law of giving and receiving delivered nothing!

Your point touches upon two of the most powerful and insidious elements of wierwille’s theology: his signature intuition and his tendencies toward Gnosticism. The con is twofold. The harmful and controlling cult-leader appeals to the cult-follower’s desire to mimic the cult-leader - - the subliminal undertone being like a hypnotic melody to ask a “God” who bears a remarkable resemblance to the manageable God promoted by the cult-leader. The tendency toward Gnosticism is in the seeking of special knowledge innocently camouflaged as asking God how to understand and believe in wierwille’s legend of the snow storm. Thus the member of a cult is NOT following THEIR OWN instincts but has learned to walk behind the signature intuition of the cult-leader. To relate how effective this subliminal tactic is - I’ll tell you about my own experience. In my 12 years of cult involvement there were many times my faith was challenged over the veracity of wierwille’s story of God’s voice, being given a mission and authenticated by a snow storm. And I would reflect deeply and ask God to help me overcome my doubt. (Grease Spotters should realize I was already biased for which way to think by that last sentence) Each time I went through such inner turmoil wrestling with my “faith” - there was always a myriad of wierwille-isms flooding my thoughts to remind me to see wierwille as the apostle for my generation: “the adversary will always go after those speaking the truth” “When Judas walked out on Jesus and the disciples it was night. The only alternative to God’s ministry is the darkness of oblivion.” My recalling these wierwille-isms tend to subtly push me in a certain direction. Like the Professional Weight Guesser in the movie The Jerk - he limits the choices one can make The Jerk: the professional weight guesser scene

And the twisted miracle kept on twisting. A maverick metal sculpturist / plagiarist envisioned a cash cow (the classic business jargon version) stole the warming barrel (PFAL book – the older version – now in ashes) and in his portable art studio (altered motorcoach – refurbished by Classic Perversion Conversions) he completely, completely, absolutely completely turned it into a cremation urn…in his decrepit old age the maverick metal sculpturist / plagiarist with a checkered past and chubby from the exceedingly abundantly above moolah coming in, said “let’s twist again like we did last snow storm” and he made mini-urn (aka PFAL Today - - the new version).

did the PFAL book (the older version) make it out okay?

How do you KNOW God was happy or unhappy? Are you God's spokesperson? who put you in charge? why should I believe you? why do you say stuff like this? do you say this stuff to friends, family and where you work?

Jesus breathing on them does not qualify as an excellor session preparation for an excellor session is not an excellor session Jesus talking about spirit or ghost does not qualify as excellor session Jesus speaking of Pentecost and what would come does not qualify as excellor session Jesus making prefatory remarks does not qualify as excellor session. that's ok forget squat. learn why PARTICIPATING IN excellor session is DIFFERENT than a teacher telling students beforehand what to expect in a excellor session

Reminds me of that line in PFAL "I have a jack but I'm not going to give it to you"

okay - so you're saying there aren't any "excellors sessions were spread out in the Gospels." i thought that's what you'd say...I didn't mention that earlier because I thought you wouldn't believe it

Please cite chapter and verse on Excellor sessions in the Gospels - actually copy paste whole section of chapter for context here is handy hyperlink > > > John 16 NIV (biblehub.com) you are smart little atom smasher you should be able to figure out how to navigate the website for chapters wierwille use to say "you show me where it says that in the Bible - I want to read it myself - line by line and word by word." thems dah rules - no "I believe this was a type of excellors session" bull-$hit. show me line by line and word by word in the gospels where it shows this >>>> "Actually, their excellors sessions were spread out in the Gospels."

I think Mike and a few other wierwille fans have got a real problem mischaracterizing Trinitarian doctrine. who would believe in the Trinity the way they describe it. Mike et al use absolute thinking. I'm no theologian. But from what I've studied and the systematic theologies I've read - the Trinity is just one simple label to describe something way beyond our understanding. Biblical scholars use more fine brush strokes and nuances and not the cartoonish broad strokes of fundamentalism wierwille style. Even in Scripture there are details to show a differences in the persons of the Trinity - differences in roles. All flows from the Father to the Son through the Holy Spirit to the believer...jumping into my how-to-explain-things-to-a-10-year-old mode - I will say just like any Father/ Son relationship - God has a Son - so the Son is not the Father the Father is not the Son. Who raised Jesus from the dead? God the Father ! Even in OT there is a hierarchy of deity - look at Psalms the Lord said unto my Lord ...Mike the Trinity is NOT what wierwille said it was!!!

But that is exactly what was promised in PFAL - book and the movie - I can still hear wierwille's envy coming through loud and clear when teaching on John 10:10 when i looked around the community and saw unbelievers with all their abundance - Mike minister to thyself - come out old foul and turd-like spirit of wierwille

Didn’t watch the You Tube yet - but in Googling the words got some other hits - ah so I see it’s some aromatic hemp or reed that may have been used in making anointing oil in Old Testament… uhm you do realize the OT wasn’t addressed to us.

I think I need some...waiting on it to be legal in Texas

After I posted this – especially the part I quoted above – I kept thinking about wierwille’s model of how speaking in tongues works. My mind got stuck in a loop – like a dog chasing its tail – sure it’s fun but I wasn’t making any progress in understanding HOW it works. Then it occurred to me I was wrestling with a theoretical model dreamed up by someone who was prone to take leaps of logic over tall buildings. Look ! Up in the sky…it’s a turd…it’s so plain…it’s just wierwille. Logic is a method of reasoning that involves a series of statements, each of which must be true if the statement before it is true. Thinking of wierwille’s theoretical model of how speaking in tongues works - the abbreviated version being: one employs all the body parts involved in the mechanics of speech except for thinking of what words to say. While mulling over wierwille’s theoretical model, I remembered something – whether it was in PFAL or Intermediate class on TIP – didn’t “the teacher” say something along the lines that you don’t have to think of the words to say because God already knows in advance how you will shape your mouth, position your tongue, etc., so He provides the word that would fit that speech-body-parts configuration…maybe someone remembers what I’m referring to and could correct me and/or cite who said it and in what class. I’m not trying to be a faith-blaster…and only somewhat familiar with New Yorkese…Grease Spot is like a second language to me. Tonto’s friend had studied some speech pathology stuff in college (she’s ex-TWI and was in corps) so I anticipate talking to her soon about the mashup of the mechanics of speech and wierwille’s theory. I believe the references of speaking in tongues in the Bible are historically true. I wish I could go back in time and interview one of the apostles about what it felt like to speak in tongues. I’m putting my funny bone and time-travel paradoxes on ice and simply explaining the reason for my wish – another theory – my own theory: Genuine speaking in tongues involves the Holy Spirit - in some mysterious way – engaging all the body parts used in speech as well as the brain to produce a real language inspired by God. Well…that’s a working theory anyway…I’m thinking that for the person who is genuinely speaking in tongues there might be some unique sensations in the body parts used in speech different from when they speak in their native tongue. *More thoughts and hyperlinks below Have a nice day LoShonta to all and to all LoShonta I am my own grandpa whether in my mind or out of my mind I know not If not me who? If not now when? what do you think his back looked like? I had great enthusiasm for this sports wouldn't you like to go to church with me? PFAL is as PFAL ain't Is muss be my lucky day Mister and Mississippi walk into a bar Sincerity is no guarantee for truth...but that's not why you came to our used car lot, is it? even more thoughts after the wavy gravy things ~ ~ ~ ~ *More thoughts and hyperlinks Thought I’d bring this up here – don’t know why – cuz I know on threads where you-know-who-extrapolates-to-infinity-and-behind, everything gets lost in the Kool-Aid and Awesome Sauce…maybe some atom-smashing-lie-detector-making-bottoms-up-approaching-ABBAABBA-chanting-stop-watch-gazing type person will lick their lips, act real natural, move their hands, fingers, and dial-up modem to start a thread in doctrinal on theories of how genuine speaking in tongues works…or maybe not. List of fallacies - Wikipedia Jumping to Conclusions: When People Decide Based on Insufficient Information – Effectiviology Accepted theories are the best explanations available so far for how the world works. They have been thoroughly tested, are supported by multiple lines of evidence, and have proved useful in generating explanations and opening up new areas for research. However, science is always a work in progress, and even theories change. How? We’ll look at some over-arching theories in physics as examples… From: Even theories change - Understanding Science (berkeley.edu)

Welcome Redrock ! I got a kick out of your first post. I’ll tell you right off the bat you had me at 76 orbits around the sun! I love it! I would have responded last night but after reading the rest of the thread I got stuck in an entertaining fantasy of an astronaut complaining his ‘daily’ commute to and from work takes a year. Fell asleep looking at my phone. Earth spun a little more - and picked up where I left off on wanting to say hi. I look forward to the unique perspective you’ll bring to Grease Spot - - and just so you know - I’ve been around the solar system a time or two. a round of Tang for everyone- on me!