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By and Large


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I've used and heard the phrase "by and large" for years, and known what I meant by it but didn't know, until today, exactly where it came from. Now I, socks, know and felt it would be good to pass this valuable information on so that you too can know if you don't.


(Please rate this post:

U = Useful

UU = Unuseful

PU = Pretty useful

PUU = Pretty unuseful

Thank you.)

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Per request of Dooj,

I = interesting

PI = Pretty interesting

PUI = Pretty uninteresting

RefreshRefresh :)

Now that's interesting, something I pressRefreshed put "refresh" in - wonder what did that?

I'm fine, DWBH. How are you? Refresh :) Hey - it did it again - it's when I pull down the smiley guys (should we call them "persons of smile"? ) and I hit the window. But if they don't show when I post this, this won't make any sense. Which might be perfectly normal. We'll have to see.

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I dunno BW - it just occured to me, I was about to say "by and large" and I realized I had no idea why anything would be or could be "by" and "large" at the same time. So I looked it up. Frankly I don't say by and large that often, and I doubt I'll start. Maybe I should. Dunno. :blink: :biglaugh: :blink: :doh:

I can't seem to get the word refresh to show up again, hitting the Persons of Smile Icon Selection Dropdown Menu. Weird.

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Refresh - fresh again. Yes!

Request. Quest again.

Repair - ?

Redundant - ?

If something was dundant, I'd think once would be enough. But there it is, redundant. Oddly, when I searched a little advert thingie came up with a link to Amazon.com and said "looking for dunant?" and linked me somewhere. There's no such thing as "dunant' apprently,but there was a Henri Dunant, who founded the Red Cross. That was a relief, I got scared thinking that someone MIGHT be looking for something called "dunant". Just doesn't sound right.

Regurgitate -

gurgitate v.i. bubble. gurgitation, n. ebullition.

Ebullitions is a cool word. I'd give that a "PU", right there.

Calvin seems frozen in space there. Not sure what happened. I'm not jumping any less on this end. I'll have to check, thanks dooj!


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As a merchant mariner, one who has sailed the salty sea, I find this thread refreshing and very informative. Thanks Socks! I can see how this phrase would not be very readily recognized because of the fact that "commercial sail" has gone by the wayside to to "steam, diesels and such". But, I offer you all this poem which is somewhat of a de-rail of this thread. But, since we are talking "nautical" here, I just wanted to add my own contribution to the literary world when it comes to nautical things. And so, I give you, an "Ode To The Black Gang", by Kevin C. Nye. "By and large", I'd say that this poem represents the "Black Gang" quite well

Ode To The Black Gang

By Kevin Nye

In days of old when knights were bold and engines weren’t invented, on wooden ships were men of iron, whose skills were un-prec-e-dented.

They hauled up the sails and climbed up the lines, and like monkeys they raced to and fro. They harnessed the wind or just very light breezes in order to make the ship go…

They were strong they were smart, they were tough they were brave, and could do things that most wouldn’t dare try. They worked all day long and on watch at all hours in conditions that would make landlubbers cry…

But along came steam engines and diesels and such, and the deckhand’s job was curtailed…

The sails were now gone and they suffered a demotion because they no longer dealt with propulsion.

Now a new breed of sailor had come on the scene, and they were called

En-gin-eers. To

the muscle bound deckhands these folks

were real odd ‘cause they tinkered and worked down below. These peculiar new sailors they spoke of strange things that were hard for the deckhands to know: There’s propulsion, refrigeration, lubrication and cooling, hydraulics, electricity and more! As far as sewage goes, sometimes it overflows, which the Wiper and Junior deplore..

“Check the CAPACS, pump the bilge’s, and blow-w-w those main engines down!” Replace the zinc’s and unplug the sinks so the dishwasher can finish “Right now!”

There’s governors and red gears, and check valves and steam, and Amots and gauges galore…

And swing valves and ball valves and butterfly and globe valves, and twenty five thousand things more!

And they’re all in a state of constant consumption, fluctuation, deterioration and that…We’ve harnessed these elements to do a great bidding, and they need to be watched and maintained..

There’s gear pumps and feed pumps, and Nylocks and roll pins, and settlers and day tanks and such..

“Let’s find a solution to that crankcase dilution or we’ll blow out those ex-plo-sion doors!”

These things are not known to most of the crew, so they gave us a few different names:

The “Weird Basement Savages”, the “Blackgang”, the “Snipes”, but go ahead and just make up some more!

So I submit to you (the one that is readin’), that these are the things you should know: There’s more to these ships than steering, car parking, “tying up”, and “letting go”….

We Blackgang, we Snipes, we Weird Basement Savages, (us folks with the boiler suits on), keep the whole thing together (in fair or foul weather) as our ships keep on “sailing” along…

Author’s note:

I wrote this poem because an Ordinary Seaman, was mouthing off in the crew mess about how “you engine guys don’t have to know a goddamned thing at all to work on a ship” So, I wrote this poem and posted it in the crew mess of the Kennicott, which ....ed him off but good.

Edited by Jonny Lingo
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I guess the sugar sludge at the bottom of Calvin's cereal bowl thinned out, but a new day has brought him back to life! His gif's are giffing now!

Wonderful news, WhiteDove, thanks! Give that bad boy a PI and a PU. I have used that phrase for years. Usually when asked how I'm doing. "Fair to middling" seems to work well. Operational, fully functional. Workin'.

Now I have noticed a tendency in some people, folks let's call them. They ask how I'm doing and I say "oh, pretty good, how about - " and they quickly say "just pretty good?" or something like that. These aren't Wayfers, mind you. Average folks who in many cases would be doing well to be doing pretty good themselves, by my eye.

It's as if you were to say "not bad" and the response is "oh...not good?" Who'd ever thought saying hello could be so complicated?

It's an odd way to start a conversation, needling. Usually these conversations don't go well, either because they have nothing to really say or I take the conversation to places it was never intended. But if it was intended to be simple it would have started simple. So, don't start nothin', they won't be nothin', y'know? :biglaugh: But some people bring their whole attic and garage with them wherever they go, so a simple "good morning" can turn into something murky and mildly threatening in the response you get. "Really? Is it...?"....that's just weird to me.

I like "fair to middling". It sounds friendly, by and large.

Edited by socks
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