Bob, you and Dottie both know so much about what really went on behind the scenes in The Way International.
How many times, how many times, did Dottie and you have to patch people up after they were devastated by being used and abused by top leadership clergymen, by LCM, and by VPW? Doesn't it upset you?
How many hours have you put into counseling these poor people over the years? How many rear-ends have you covered for in order to attempt to save "God's Ministry?" Aren't you sick of saving someone else's skin when they repeatedly refuse to change?
How many times have you had to lie to cover up messes other people made and left for you to deal with? How many times have you had to clean up problems your "buddies" handed over to you after screwing people up? Doesn't it make you sick?
How many times have you had to gut your own conscience in order to carry out directives from the BOT/BOD? Have you done it so many times now there is nothing left?
How long are you going to take licking someone elses boots and playing fetch for people who would toss you away like so much trash?
You could do more for God by leaving and exposing that organization for what it is.
Or is dealing with all the collateral damage part of the price you pay for acceptance and security?
Originally posted by Catcup (parts left out to shorten):
Bob, you and Dottie both know so much about what really went on behind the scenes in The Way International.
How many times, how many times, did Dottie and you have to patch people up after they were devastated by being used and abused by top leadership clergymen, by LCM, and by VPW? Doesn't it upset you?
How many times have you had to lie to cover up messes other people made and left for you to deal with?
How many times have you had to gut your own conscience in order to carry out directives from the BOT/BOD? Have you done it so many times now there is nothing left?
Or is dealing with all the collateral damage part of the price you pay for acceptance and security?
Very well put, Catcup! Bob & Dottie have sold their souls to the devil of TWI. I just hope that Bob will do at least one good thing before he leaves the state. He is responsible for my ex havig no contact with his family and my ex says that unless his family apologizes to Bob that he will continue having no contact with them.
It tears him up and he is so lonely and so hurt. he would like nothig better than to be reconciled with his family but tries his damndest to hide that part of him because it shows weakness. All Bob would have to do is tell him that he should give his family another chance, let bygones be bygones - contact his parents and sisters and he would do it. But if Bob keeps his mouth shut, my ex will continue to be lonely, bitter, depressed and unhappy. It's just not fair and it's not right that Bob has taken his family from him. It's not right that my ex blindly obeys Bob; but Bob could put him back on the right path if he only had a heart.
Today is his birthday, Bob. Wouldn't a call from you telling him to contact his family be the best birthday present? To him it would. It would free him up to contact them without shame and with a clear conscience.
Do you think your ex still feels like a failure because of rotten treatment from J*net M and others? It can motivate someone to do everything and anything they can to prove they are not weak. Gotta prove you are perfect after all. I wish I could scream to any innies out there that they need to talk to their families regardless of what any twit leader.... told them. I lost so much time trying to be good twiggie--I missed my siblings growing up. I am just now forming real relationships with them--20 years later
Smurfette, I think all the abuse he's taken from people in TWI has contributed to his adamancy to hide any weakness. Janet wasn't the only one to falsely accuse him of things and she sure wasn't the only one to tell him how incompetent, useless and weak he is. Rico, Ed, Matthew ....there are many, many people with blood on their hands regarding his self-esteem (and many other broken people).
I think, too, it's been 8 years since he's spoken with anyone in his family and he may be ashamed to be the one to initiate contact, but he shouldn't be. They would welcome him with open arms and they didn't continue hoping and praying for him back in their lives just so they could tell him "I told ya so."
Bob's the only one who can fix this, though. My ex is hinging everything on his family apologizing to Bob, but all Bob has to say is that he doesn't need an apology and that he thinks my ex should reconcile with his family. He has to make it clear and not some off the cuff half whispered comment.
Hopefully, Bob still has a shred of humanity and a few logically working brain cells left in him.
Bob - you once told us we were "foolish" and bewitched like the Galatians for not paying off our mortgage and becoming debt free. Oh, you were just soooo ingnorant of these matters, especially in our situation.
You reprimanded us for contacting our friend Bob Vigxxola, when he was cast out of TWI on his ear and was not to have any contact with anyone in the household. I'm glad we got to tell him we love him and care about him before you interferred.
You told me "in all your 30 years as a leader in TWI you never once saw even a hint of sexual impropriety in TWI among top leaders".
You told us that "Toots" was ousted from the household because she lied about her illness and made the whole thing up. She later died from that illness. We never even had a chance to say goodbye to her.
I forgive you. But you are screwed up in my opinion.
Well, I don't see old Bob replying to any of this...
S'matter Bob, nothing to say?
I supose it easier for you to simply write off the Grease Spot Cafe as a bunch of "possessed" copouts who are spewing forth trash? Of course, when you do that, you can avoid having to deal with homest questions and honest confrontation.
Isn't it funny how twi leaders are only confortable dealing with people that are inside their closed little system? Only after the indoctrination process is well under way and waybrain is dominating a persons thoughts, will people like moneyhands and others be willing to deal with confrontation...S'matter Bob...do you feel at a disadvantage having to deal with people who are not under your thumb? Who don't see things the same way that you do? Who are not intimidated by your big mouth and nasty attitude? People who you cannot "punish" by ostrasizing them?
When many of the other old time twi leaders walked away...you continued to spit suck and compromise...is the money and prestige that good?
Then again, since the Moneyhands know so much about things Rosie would never want exposed, perhaps she does provide their salary with a little extra padding...
Also, TWI interrupted the natural socialization process for many young adults, who came to TWI just when they were beginning to learn how to deal with adult situations, and socially interact with and as adults in an adult world. TWI perverted that process, and unfortunately left many people socially crippled and unable to understand how how to interact in the real world. This can negatively affect them in their jobs and in their family, marital, and social relationships.
Hey, Catcup, this is from the "Finger" thread of CW. The Moneyhands have been in TWI over half their lives and were fresh out of college when they got involved. Bob had been working two jobs at the time, so you KNOW the appeal of not having to do so much work HAD to be there. They got a free ride with TWI and figured out how to make it into a great meal ticket for life.
But, I was wondering more about Dottie. She's supposedly got a degree with some kind of emphasis on therapy, right? They went to New Knoxville shortly after college, so she doesn't have any practical "real world" experience and any "practice" she's done has obviously been with the desired outcome of people keeping their mouths shut and protecting TWI's leaders and the Moneyhands paycheck. Given how long she's been involved with TWI and covering for all the sins of the leaders, do you think she has a totally warped sense of what's right and what's wrong?
She flat out lied to the whole branch at our meetings about the lawsuits and then looked a couple in the eye in a personal one on one meeting and said that she had no prior knowledge of any of the sexual abuse.....actually, she and Bob lied.
Given how long she's been involved with TWI and covering for all the sins of the leaders, do you think she has a totally warped sense of what's right and what's wrong?
Probably couldn't get a real job having so many skeletons in the closet..
But, I was wondering more about Dottie. She's supposedly got a degree with some kind of emphasis on therapy, right? They went to New Knoxville shortly after college, so she doesn't have any practical "real world" experience
Actually, Dottie did not get her Master's degree in counseling until she was on staff at TWI ... she did not get it in North Carolina ... she got it in Ohio or Indiana while on Staff..many years after she graduated from college, she went back to get it. I think I remember hearing that the Trustees et al. encouraged her to get it so that she WOULD be able to counsel believers ... and they certainly managed to give her an adequate supply.
Then she definitely has NO REAL WORLD EXPERIENCE. All she knows is how to cover foot for the abusers and evil-doers. She must be pretty darn good at shovelling those skeletons back into the closet on a regular basis.
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Ham
I would only hope that this does not fall on deaf ears, Belle.
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TheSongRemainsTheSame
Belle,
I have many letters hand written along the lines you just CYBER SPACED!!!
I have copies those I sent out .
Sadly I have no copies reply.
I can only quote Mr. H>>>
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TheSongRemainsTheSame
Whoops, I do have a reply that just entered my memory and I became~~~
Main Entry: treach·er·ous
Pronunciation: 'tre-ch&-r&s, 'trech-r&s
Function: adjective
Date: 14th century
1 : characterized by or manifesting treachery : PERFIDIOUS
2 a : likely to betray trust : UNRELIABLE b : providing insecure footing or support c : marked by hidden dangers, hazards, or perils
synonym see FAITHLESS
- treach·er·ous·ly adverb
- treach·er·ous·ness noun
Pronunciation Key
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I used to have a thread here regarding
"Letters That Speak Volumes"
...and the wind blows...
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Belle
Thanks Mr. H and Song. I hope the same thing.
:)--> I hope there is at least one shred of humanity left in the man.
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CoolWaters
I'll add my prayers to the one true God that He will work in this 'Reverend's' life and lead this man into a true relationship with Him.
It's the only way this 'Reverend' is ever going to break up the fallow ground of his hard heart.
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Catcup
Bob, you and Dottie both know so much about what really went on behind the scenes in The Way International.
How many times, how many times, did Dottie and you have to patch people up after they were devastated by being used and abused by top leadership clergymen, by LCM, and by VPW? Doesn't it upset you?
How many hours have you put into counseling these poor people over the years? How many rear-ends have you covered for in order to attempt to save "God's Ministry?" Aren't you sick of saving someone else's skin when they repeatedly refuse to change?
How many times have you had to lie to cover up messes other people made and left for you to deal with? How many times have you had to clean up problems your "buddies" handed over to you after screwing people up? Doesn't it make you sick?
How many times have you had to gut your own conscience in order to carry out directives from the BOT/BOD? Have you done it so many times now there is nothing left?
How long are you going to take licking someone elses boots and playing fetch for people who would toss you away like so much trash?
You could do more for God by leaving and exposing that organization for what it is.
Or is dealing with all the collateral damage part of the price you pay for acceptance and security?
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Belle
Very well put, Catcup! Bob & Dottie have sold their souls to the devil of TWI. I just hope that Bob will do at least one good thing before he leaves the state. He is responsible for my ex havig no contact with his family and my ex says that unless his family apologizes to Bob that he will continue having no contact with them.
It tears him up and he is so lonely and so hurt. he would like nothig better than to be reconciled with his family but tries his damndest to hide that part of him because it shows weakness. All Bob would have to do is tell him that he should give his family another chance, let bygones be bygones - contact his parents and sisters and he would do it. But if Bob keeps his mouth shut, my ex will continue to be lonely, bitter, depressed and unhappy. It's just not fair and it's not right that Bob has taken his family from him. It's not right that my ex blindly obeys Bob; but Bob could put him back on the right path if he only had a heart.
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Catcup
That is the million dollar question.
You still got one, Bob? Or was it one of the casualties of the war you wage against God's people?
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Belle
Today is his birthday, Bob. Wouldn't a call from you telling him to contact his family be the best birthday present? To him it would. It would free him up to contact them without shame and with a clear conscience.
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smurfette
Belle,
Do you think your ex still feels like a failure because of rotten treatment from J*net M and others? It can motivate someone to do everything and anything they can to prove they are not weak. Gotta prove you are perfect after all. I wish I could scream to any innies out there that they need to talk to their families regardless of what any twit leader.... told them. I lost so much time trying to be good twiggie--I missed my siblings growing up. I am just now forming real relationships with them--20 years later
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Belle
Smurfette, I think all the abuse he's taken from people in TWI has contributed to his adamancy to hide any weakness. Janet wasn't the only one to falsely accuse him of things and she sure wasn't the only one to tell him how incompetent, useless and weak he is. Rico, Ed, Matthew ....there are many, many people with blood on their hands regarding his self-esteem (and many other broken people).
I think, too, it's been 8 years since he's spoken with anyone in his family and he may be ashamed to be the one to initiate contact, but he shouldn't be. They would welcome him with open arms and they didn't continue hoping and praying for him back in their lives just so they could tell him "I told ya so."
Bob's the only one who can fix this, though. My ex is hinging everything on his family apologizing to Bob, but all Bob has to say is that he doesn't need an apology and that he thinks my ex should reconcile with his family. He has to make it clear and not some off the cuff half whispered comment.
Hopefully, Bob still has a shred of humanity and a few logically working brain cells left in him.
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Belle
Hey Bob!
-->
I have his parents information if you need it.
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igotout
Bob - you once told us we were "foolish" and bewitched like the Galatians for not paying off our mortgage and becoming debt free. Oh, you were just soooo ingnorant of these matters, especially in our situation.
You reprimanded us for contacting our friend Bob Vigxxola, when he was cast out of TWI on his ear and was not to have any contact with anyone in the household. I'm glad we got to tell him we love him and care about him before you interferred.
You told me "in all your 30 years as a leader in TWI you never once saw even a hint of sexual impropriety in TWI among top leaders".
You told us that "Toots" was ousted from the household because she lied about her illness and made the whole thing up. She later died from that illness. We never even had a chance to say goodbye to her.
I forgive you. But you are screwed up in my opinion.
John Richeson
Tampa, FL
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Catcup
I'm sure Dotty has mopped up plenty of the collateral damage.
And you rousted a deathly ill woman from the fellowship because you believe she wasn't telling you the truth?
...never mind.
Have you no shame?
If you sleep well at night, it's because you have no conscience.
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ToadFriend
Catcup,
Please check your private topics.
Thanks,
TF
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GrouchoMarxJr
Well, I don't see old Bob replying to any of this...
S'matter Bob, nothing to say?
I supose it easier for you to simply write off the Grease Spot Cafe as a bunch of "possessed" copouts who are spewing forth trash? Of course, when you do that, you can avoid having to deal with homest questions and honest confrontation.
Isn't it funny how twi leaders are only confortable dealing with people that are inside their closed little system? Only after the indoctrination process is well under way and waybrain is dominating a persons thoughts, will people like moneyhands and others be willing to deal with confrontation...S'matter Bob...do you feel at a disadvantage having to deal with people who are not under your thumb? Who don't see things the same way that you do? Who are not intimidated by your big mouth and nasty attitude? People who you cannot "punish" by ostrasizing them?
When many of the other old time twi leaders walked away...you continued to spit suck and compromise...is the money and prestige that good?
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Catcup
Makes you wonder.
What on earth could they possibly be paying you to put up with it?
Personally, I think Bob himself is mentally imprisoned and voluntarily chained inside TWI's closed theology and power structure.
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Catcup
Then again, since the Moneyhands know so much about things Rosie would never want exposed, perhaps she does provide their salary with a little extra padding...
Quiets the acoustics, dontcha know...
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Belle
Hey, Catcup, this is from the "Finger" thread of CW. The Moneyhands have been in TWI over half their lives and were fresh out of college when they got involved. Bob had been working two jobs at the time, so you KNOW the appeal of not having to do so much work HAD to be there. They got a free ride with TWI and figured out how to make it into a great meal ticket for life.
But, I was wondering more about Dottie. She's supposedly got a degree with some kind of emphasis on therapy, right? They went to New Knoxville shortly after college, so she doesn't have any practical "real world" experience and any "practice" she's done has obviously been with the desired outcome of people keeping their mouths shut and protecting TWI's leaders and the Moneyhands paycheck. Given how long she's been involved with TWI and covering for all the sins of the leaders, do you think she has a totally warped sense of what's right and what's wrong?
She flat out lied to the whole branch at our meetings about the lawsuits and then looked a couple in the eye in a personal one on one meeting and said that she had no prior knowledge of any of the sexual abuse.....actually, she and Bob lied.
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Ham
Probably couldn't get a real job having so many skeletons in the closet..
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ToadFriend
Actually, Dottie did not get her Master's degree in counseling until she was on staff at TWI ... she did not get it in North Carolina ... she got it in Ohio or Indiana while on Staff..many years after she graduated from college, she went back to get it. I think I remember hearing that the Trustees et al. encouraged her to get it so that she WOULD be able to counsel believers ... and they certainly managed to give her an adequate supply.
TF
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Belle
Thanks!
Then she definitely has NO REAL WORLD EXPERIENCE. All she knows is how to cover foot for the abusers and evil-doers. She must be pretty darn good at shovelling those skeletons back into the closet on a regular basis.
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Ham
Only problem is after a while, you run out of closets.
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CoolWaters
Well...yes...but then there's always the cemetary areas...
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