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Good Move Belle...would be frustrating argument. OM can't give you ANY example of VeePee doing anything altruistic. Doesn't exist. Same with loy-boy. If you can't see that they were both in it for the money and the sex you are blind. But, OM will give example after example of altruistic behavior (that can be refuted by anyone with 2 licks of common sense) until he wears you down on it. Not worth the effort...

Oldies said, "Just look at the context and environment. You were in a serious training program. Designed to weed out the unsure feeble minded." The Marine Corps or an Ivy League school is a serious training program. Way corpse training is an INDOCTRINATION - training others to carry out the evil edicts of those above them who are in it for the CONTROL over others and the FINANCIAL GAIN of stealing money from others in the name of God.

Oldies, Probably anyone here (except you and the twit enforcement lurkers would do just about anything to put the organization out of business. Why? Not so much from hatred for the organization but for the future protection of people from sexual predators, bondage, and false teaching...among many other reasons. Yes, if it were that easy (putting $100 in the kitty) to do a class action suite I'm sure many, including myself, would do so. I am offended that you mock (in a way) those who have strong negative feelings toward an organization who has robbed them of their money, destroyed many families, and harmed many individuals.

Another way is to find a good investigative reporter from an major newspaper and let them loose on a good 'ol fashion series about the organization...do I hear a pulitzer in the making??? Anybody know one???

Of course, in due time it will destroy itself; but as some have said, the "leadership" will retire to the Caymans and laugh (until they got tired of each other and no one to boss around and abuse). But, in reality, the way to speed it up is to do three things: 1. Class action lawsuit to recoup any and all "abundant sharing" - could very possibly work, but if not would seriously expose the financial end of things. 2. Get the government involved. IRS and Department of Labor to start. Seriously challenge their non-profit status. I assure you that if the government looked even just below the surface there would be strong evidence of rackettering, conspiracy, tax fraud and many other interesting things. My only fear in this approach is the reaction of twi - would they go the 'kool aid' route? or the branch davidian route? 3. Continue to offer help, advice, and support to innies and "just outies" to show that greasespot (and the rest of the world for that matter) is filled with love and that your relationship with God grows tremendously after you are released from bondage. And that the real truth does not reside with twi, but rather in a person's own relationship with God...and that truth lies in many places outside twi...but NOT there. There is nothing I would like more than to speed up twi's demise. But, in the process I want those held accountable who operate this scam and destroy lives. I want jail time and I want all the money back for those who have been hurt.

Today is the big "whoop-dee-doo" anniversary celebration at hq. There's also been rumors of a "big announcement today." It hit me last night as I was driving into Philly for a show - could HE, the MOGFART, be coming back? After all, its been 5 years. What if, 5 years ago, he made a deal with rosie and donna and the bot that he would go, but that he insisted on coming back to power in 5 years after all his failures blew over. And if they wouldn't agree to this he would blow the whistle on the whole thing and they would all go to jail. Very plausible...but downright scary. Other indicators that it may be possible - why else would donna stay at hq and not divorce him? Why would he put such a lame person (and a woman no less) in charge while he was on "sabbatical." There is stong evidence that they have continued to subsidize him.

The interesting innie website, In Our Own Way" was poofed after a very short time of activity. Why? Perhaps because greasespotters found it and engaged in CIVIL discourse with the participants and asked some hard questions like, "Where's the Money?" and "Where's the discipling?" Or, it was all a setup to monitor other innies activities and they found a few ninnies to hammer (poor chaps!).

Sami, I am glad that you have had such a good experience. However, I would question whether it is private property and whether permission is required. This property is owned by a "church" and is a non-profit. I'm not a lawyer...but I yearn for the day when I am in Ohio or Gunnison when I can "test the waters" and have some goon tell me to get off the property. The lawsuit would be monumental, especially if if the goon was carrying a weapon.

Now that is spooky. Looks like the Proboard weenies are (ex?) wayfers. Could it be they are real wayfers and the innie site was a hoax to try to nab other innies that check it out??? Hmmmm...any other theories? They can't be innies - they work the internet seriously and probably don't have window washing experience. Looks like they both are from the UK also...

Yeah, looks like someone (twi?) shut him down...darn it, I was having fun over there. I was civil but asking some tough questions. I bet this will bring on an anti-internet tirade this Sunday.

I understand there is going to be a "big" announcement as part of the anniversary celebration. Anyone have any knowledge of this? What an oxymoron - disciples going to HQ to clean toilets, etc. Somd discipling! Would be VERY interested in learning what is up with the anniversary celebration and the incoming way corpse...please keep me posted.

Oldies, Happens all the time in my part of the woods...except not by Mormand, by real Christians. You witness through your actions.

Oldies, You witness for God in how you live. And for reaching out to others, not to get 5 minutes of someone's time to spek the word, but to help them. If that means mowing their lawn, so be it (in our area christian men cut firewood for ANYONE who needs it). Once you build a RELATIONSHIP with someone and they inquire about what makes you who you are you can then witness to them verbally; having already done so through your actions. That is why TWIt membership is so low - they do not exhibit Christ-like behavior when in public and they are arrogant to others...and they sure have no skills in building relationships.

Oldiesman...perhaps your cat may not need to listen to this but many do...and do you? The Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse is a phenomenal book that should be required reading for every standing member of twi. As a "research" ministry I would think that it would be required reading...oh, that's right, you only research the way WE tell you to "research." Could you imagine the grief if a BC or LC saw that book on your coffee table!

The bottom line is that it is a CULT and the $100 is just another revenue stream...just like the advanced class specials, books, etc. It is a revenue stream - nothing more, nothing less. Considering the amount of revenue gained by the way through ABS they should have been paying us to take the classes. I'll ask again, as I have 1,000 times - WHERE HAS ALL THE MONEY GONE? Not to needy causes or people, not to missions, not to anything other than the deep bank accounts of the leadership.

Jeez Mark...get a grip on your hatred for our President. Just as with Temple's foreign destination Americans are welcome everywhere on this list and the foreign list. Well, as a conservative I was a bit uncomfortable in Boston last year.

Mark, Not true...I've been to all the listed countries except 1 in the last 2 years - all have welcomed me as an American. As an aside, Beijing is the most exciting, vibrant place to go these days.

Bliss, Wasn't meaning to be funny, just trying to understand. I know what you mean about family, we still have family in, and its not easy. TC

Bliss, I gotta ask..."why are you spending one more day in? What are you waiting for? I may have missed some level of explanation, but I am curious why you are dragging this out. Please take this with compassion but - Get on with your life...get out now. respectfully, TC

Should I be? Not sure what it is but if it is a cult I don't want any part of it!

I agree with Miller above me here...but, If you ask them anything ask them - WHERE HAS ALL THE ABUNDANT SHARING MONEY GONE OVER THE YEARS? Have them name one person with large medical bills, someone suddenly laid off from their job, or anyone in need that the der wey has helped - anyone other that the MOGFOT and associates. They can name no one - guarantee it. Also, ask them, if this is a "biblical research outfit," why is it you don't follow common research practices, and why are people not allowed to read anything other than the same old way crap. Why aren't you allowed to read other theological materials (as part of research)? Get to the fundamentals - money and the fact that they are the farthest thing from a research institute that there possibly could be.

Nothing, absolutely nothing.

We have been out for almost 7 years now and have a FANTASTIC relationship with God. Yes, we lost friends, but we have learned so much since then that has supported our decision to leave. One of the (many) reasons why we left was that we could not continue, in good conscience, to tithe to a corrupt organization. Think about it...I wrote a check this morning and tithed $1,600...with GREAT JOY. For one thing, I know that our church will use part or all of that money to help others in our church who are sick or needy. I know because when we needed help, without asking, the church gave us money - a lot - and with NO strings attached. I know that part of the money will be used to continue to build our library so that people can build their own relationship with God. I know that part of the money will be used to help missions around the world bring people to Jesus Christ - even if it is not our church. MOST churches are excellent stewards of God's money. How much have you ever received from the way in your time of need? Believe me, your relationship with God will grow infinitely stronger beginning the moment you leave the bondage, corruption and control.

Mike, Please stop referring to Wierwille as Dr. His degree is bogus...as are his teachings. Shows a total disrespect for those of us who earned our advanced degrees. Thank you