Ham

My words about L****r still stand though, heh heh. Those who could leave that place with a high hand and still stay.. Ptooie. Must really like the position, love to make people miserable.. at least my opinion. I guess they can't leave, but for a different reason.

Belle, Im trying .. in the meantime, I have put back on a few of my conservative clothes, heh heh. "I remember so many times lcm teaching that if you left the household that God wouldn't and couldn't protect you anymore (and we all know what THAT entails). You'd go "spiritually dark":" The interesting thing that happened to me is, I did NOT forget what I learned in TWI. I just found I needed to take out the garbage. No longer am I required to regurgitate it on a bi- or tri-weekly basis. Going spiritually dark is pretty hard to do when you can't see the ditch to begin with. If anything, I slowly started to spiritually wake up. No more justifying or ignoring evil and hateful behavior, in myself or others, thinking "believing" would fix everything. Just throw enough bible verses at it, and it'll go away.. No longer do I find a devil waiting to jump me behind every rock and motive- my God is a lot bigger than that. When God does show me to get on something, I don't try to analyze it to death either. Sometimes I am miserable, or lonely, or things don't work out like I think they should- but I can still smile, and not blame myself for every little failure in life. Cripe- even with the little pains in life, life is still so much better outside of that flea trap.

But it can feel so darn good, heh heh. But I won't disagree.

Smurfette, thanks for the nice thread, no sarcasm or anything intended. I think this stuff may agree partly with what you asked about, but may just end up being what Christ's doctrine is NOT. To me at least, it is NOT some maniacal miserable SOB's (VP Loy and crowd) take on all of love life and the bible. Not so devilishly hard to intreat that twenty plus years of labor in its service still fails to yield the promised results. I feel like I spent the most part of twenty years in a vat of pickle juice, not the gospel- and my skin is just starting to straighten out again. I think Abraham got pretty close to Christ's doctrine- the Lord said "go" and he went. Didn't have everything figured out, but he didn't sit around retemorizing all the verses he could find that mentioned the word "go". Jesus talked about the "works of your father Abraham". Love God and love your neighbor as yourself seems pretty easy to understand, pretty easy to intreat, at least for me. So does "beware of false prophets"- I think that fits more with the idea of loving yourself. Maybe this love God and love your neigbor as youself is where its all at..

Raf.. I think its like a case of the measles that keeps popping up.. Mike, really. I took the time to look through your old posts. No signs, no miracles, no wonders, nothing. "I cleaned out the hospitals at___", nope. I believe GOD- God almighty- unreservedly. I do not believe YOU. If I don't start seeing a few credentials, I MUST assume you are either a devil with a blue dress on, or just a pretender. You simply leave me no choice.

No joke. Try just going on VACATION somewhere. Anywhere not wayworld related- or even to way world BY YOURSELF. Vacations were frowned upon even before I left in the mid nineties. Those poor devils STILL have to travel in numbers, last I heard- no privacy, no personal life. I think it's despicable how they USE your family members to try to keep you "in line". Disgusting. People that can't leave because if they do, they won't see their wife or husband, again. Or the kids, or the relatives, or the supposed friends. The day I would hear Rivenbark get up on a Sunday night service and announce that "people that are not with us on the word are OK, we love them just as much anyway. It is OK if your spouse or relatives dare to have a different opinion" might get me to soften up a little.. But honestly, at this stage in the game it'd probably just be damage control.

Supposedly he's holed up somewhere in the Toledo area (God have mercy on the neighbors) trying to formulate some kind of victory return or something.. "Moggin Hood: Loy in Tights II: The Old Man can't leap like he used to.."

No, not vengeful, just very, very mischevious. You know, three pages of typed up stuff and a message "can't resolve GS cafe". heh heh.

If Pawtucket! was God, He'd have the forums go belly up just at the moment Mike was clicking on the little "submit" box..

No wonder some people want to throw away the book of James.. Really Mike. Pick just one. You have such great "faith"- lets see the works. If I "had it", I'd show it- unless the "results" were laughable, at best.

Good grief. Nice claim. Let's see what it can do. My question is STILL unanswered. What is "coming back to da ACCURATE word.." doing for YOU? 1. I raised _________ from the dead. 2. Signs follwed my "renewed mind" ministry. They were ______________. 3. I did "the works of Jesus Christ" as they are defined in PFAL. They were ______________. 4. I "cleaned out" the hospitals at _______________, and it hit the national news. Any one of these would at least be a start.. "well, I got a brand new car!" would be a SMALL matter. Honestly- you make the claims, lets see the action. Crap or get off of the stinking pot.

Ah, now the light comes.. no wonder they desperately wanted the precious tax exempt status. Wouldn't be a "church" anymore, would it? Or at least it would remain one BIG chink in the armor. I bet all the bones in the closets started rattling.. Perhaps no longer could they "dismiss" people for religious differences. Maybe they'd actually have to pay the staff decent wages for a change. Well, at least their lawyers got something out of it. Probably find a lot better use for close to a million bucks.. and I heard that's about what it cost them. The lawyers are gonna milk that bunch of numbnuts all the way to their graves.. At least they got rid of Loy. Don't think that helped much, they just have to play sneakier. But it did make the decision to leave easier for a lot of folk- at least some good is coming out of it.

I agree- provided you have the resources to do so. I know of a non-twi related case, where it was almost IMPOSSIBLE for said individual to even get a restraining order to stick against said party. And it was UGLY. The personal stuff they had to spill in court just to get the order to stick was, well, I have the highest opinion for this person.. I can see where the A***ns would say "enough is enough"..

Ptooie.

I was born to be a dyed in the wool conservative like my dad- probably his dad before him. But after seeing what kind of crap hides behind religious skirts- and the measures some go to to justify promote, or just plain ignore the hateful, abusive, and often criminal behavior.. Well, I feel like pulling off all of my conservative clothes, joining the communist party, revoking all the churches protections, and letting them be fair game.. good grief. Anybody else feel like this? I think all of this is "ruining" me, heh heh.

The arrogance of da man.. oh well. As if he is the one that's gonna be sitting on the big stool passing out ice cream and lumps of coal.. jeeze. Come to think of it, that is who was at the great white throne in the AOS production- as if he was gonna be the one tossing the "critters" in the lake. Fat chance- probably go the other way around.

Yep.. how all this CONTINUING to feed on the "pure" word is somehow gonna bring us to some kind of spiritual "nirvana" or "orgasm" eludes me. Christs doctrine coming from CHRISTS CHOSEN messenger is about as repugnant. Any second rate crook, con, or hack can somehow, against all odds, by da accuracy of PFAL or something be the man that he thought he should have been. Haven't seen it happen, in my lifetime. Interesting though. Paul, though he supervised murder, after his calling NEVER DID IT AGAIN. He never condoned it, never made excuses for it other than calling himself "the chief of sinners". Apparently, it was enough of an experience to convince him to change. "Victor" Paul, (and Loy included) when they apparently got "da call" threw all self restraint aside and did as they wished, God and conscience be damned. "Messengers for God"? Ha. My assessment, this hardly qualifies as "Christ's" gospel. I think it is a little more complex- "Christ's doctrine" also warns of false prophets and teachers- deceivers. Paints them as black as their rotten souls really are. Have to think a little more and read some more, I guess..

"Well boys, gotta go. Rendevous with da prez tonight ya know. Keep an eye on the fountain.." "OK boss. Here, take a couple shots of demerol, should make it a little more pleasant.."

I always wondered why they kept the second rate security guard around. Can't be because of his in depth spiritual perception and awareness- maybe ole Rose thinks he looks good in the uniform, heh heh..

OK- who turned on the "cuss filter"? heh heh.

I THANK GOD I never got selected to go on staff.. may have hastened my departure out of the ****hole, but the consequences probably would have been a lot worse.

Tough choice for me, I'm sure. Either retire in style, or stick around getting people busted because you're afraid they are gonna pee in the fountain or something.. heh heh. What an idiot.

But what I find unnerving- how people like Li***r and crowd hang on to that as God forsaken as you can get joint. Good grief- he probably has enough "goods" on the bastards to negotiate his departure on his own terms.. what gives with that? Cripe- if I was him, I'd retire in Bermuda or somethin..

I thought that was the whole point of the "burning of da bridges" concept. No turning back- that way, I guess they just throw you in the river when they are done with you. "sorry, we forgot to include swimming lessons.." Of the people that I know that left staff or corps in a unfavorable light, only ONE was given the opportunity to work out the details and leave graciously. And even that was hardly "pleasant". All others were given the Martindalian "bums rush". No job, no friends, no family, no savings, no furniture, no place to live, no food- kids and all- off to the wilds of the world to be jumped by "da enemy" and wild beasts at every turn.. One poor lady here, I had no idea what they did to her.. till long after we left. Add to this, the lunchtime "sharings" where loy or crew gloated about this supposed "victory" by destroying the "devilish and possessed" folks.. to a "captive" audience. An audience who's lives subsisted by living on the few scraps of bread that fell from the trustee's table. Cripe- I think it would have been more humane and civilized to show off the last guys scalp you got, and threatening that you'd be glad to do it again. I heard these kind of rants, and I was hardly involved in the inner circle. What I witnessed was Loy on a GOOD day. If you don't call this "mind control" I would like to hear a better definition. Some of those poor bast***s have NO PLACE to go. Good grief- people are worth far more than that kind of treatment. Apparently not if you are in da vey. I'd treat a dog, or a cat better than that.

Vickles, that got me thinking a little more- why DON'T that pack of numbnuts issue some kind of apology for vicious, destructive doctrine and practice? Mainly- it wasn't a big deal to them to begin with. No big deal to separate families, no big deal to mark and avoid folk on a wild guess, or because they simply disagreed with a stupid notion, no big deal to sit back and let the then pres have at any woman in da kingdom he could catch.. Just "no big deal". Kinda like the Nazis after the war, "duh, we didn't do nuttin wrong, just following orders.." Just their job- see how many they could torture, maim and kill before the dinner bell sounded.. Loy and crowd may not have physically done it, but he said that he and others would if they could. Look at what they did to folks spiritually- quite a few coming out of that organization cannot even believe in a God- now or ever again. All done in the name of the "greatness" of "da word of God". "No big deal" I guess.. No conscience- what they have left must be buried under years of compromise and degredation- along with all the bribes. D.M. STILL sitting pretty in the cabin in da woods. She sure won't talk. I don't know what's keeping the limb guys in line- even they have to know that they already have one foot out the door. I don't think that they have the capacity to come to their senses on their own. At least some of us that stepped back from that hole can see what kind of jerks we were. Stuff I did STILL bothers the crap out of me at times. At least I can sleep at night.