Ham

Perhaps good, but we found them to be the exception. The previous limb guy at least acted nice, but my impresstion would stab you in the back if given half a chance. The one before did his level best to get anything female in bed besides his wife. The one before laughed about people giving so much money.. The one before.. and before.. and before.. but it eventually went back to Ralph D., and he was indeed a saint.

And it was from: corps. The best, the greatest, the most highly qualified.. AFTER Loy apparently "weeded out" the "bad cookies". Believing fixes anything I guess. The bone in question was one of such a nature that the doc said, if you continue to use it, it may NEVER heal. Guess who's house did not get cleaned and slaved over? And they were FURIOUS.

This happened.

"If you act nice, we'll LET you come back" heh heh heh.

"But the food was good" heh heh.

I remember meetings.. it's almost like it was all a bad dream, heh heh. Loy would scream at us on the tape, and the "leader" would take up and scream for an hour and a half more just because we "made" poor old Loy HAVE to scream.. I wonder if anybody else remembers anything like this, heh heh.

"Anybody that stayed around the thing for twenty some years must have seen some good"... The key point, I think, is SOME. You train a dumb animal by giving him SOME good. One key is keep him hungry enough to give you his undivided attention. Boy, did it work.. Why I hung around that dang-hole for twenty some years trying to get a few crumbs eludes me. Like I said, I don't claim to be smart. But that's OK- most other people aren't either. Didn't wake up one morning and say, "gee. I'd sure like to waste over twenty years of my adult life in a *** **** stinking cult". Crumbs, crumbs.. "crummy" might be more accurate.. what did I hang around for? Old Loys crumbs- "new light"- good grief. He even took credit for solving "the riddle of the spinx". How "magnanimous" of him. Cripe, I read that stuff in Witness of the Stars years before he unearthed this "treasure". Weakly rehashing of old worn out smelling to the highest of heavens of materials. Shoulda been buried long ago. I hung around to hear old doc teach "four crucified" for the fiftieth and sixtieth time. I hung around to listen to a "leader" who's claim to fame was being able to eat three times a day, and avoid mixing his bread and vegetables- would offer pearls of wisdom from "the word" - "I brush my teeth so that the bacteria cannot attack them" with a stupid smile on his face.. and I am NOT making this up. This was the limb guy.. now may be in charge of a whole region. He did one thing for me though, I started asking myself a few serious questions. Like, "who in their right mind would trust their life to this guy?" "Cancer is a devil spirit". Worked that one over enough already. And yes, I saw sick people get AVOIDED. "Debt is SIN". whoo boy. "Gotta give us 15+ percent" Arrrgh. Requirement to show up regularly to Sunday night services. "We scream and abuse the HELL out of you because we really care"- gads, the bastards should have screamed at themselves. And this did not originate with Loy. Ole doc got on this "tough love accountability" thing. "Just renew (make to blindly obey regardless of all logic, common sense, and besides what the word says to begin with anyway) your mind". "Trust me, that'll fix EVERYTHING". Not spoken, but absolutely IMPLIED. Three hour "loving" reproof sessions because we had given to the point that we had nothing left to give. And the bastards wanted more.. Arcane protocol that was only known about in the days of Methuselah. Arm not healing fast enough as they think it should? YOU ARE NOT BELIEVING. Forget, or IGNORE what the real doctor in the situation is saying. Doc says don't move it for six weeks? Well, we know better.. besides, we have a house we need you to clean for us. All this is the tip of the iceberg. Some stuff I'll probably never talk about. If somebody missed this stuff, their head must be firmly planted.. in the sand. I'll be kind. Or it was a real miracle. If you think this is just gossip- I just don't know what more to say. Yep- makes me feel REALLY dumb. What was I thinking? I can tell you. "Things got to be getting better- it was good, once, I remember what it was like". I could put up with it, I was the "positive" believer. They had the damn saddle GLUED on me. I honestly could not make myself think people could be that cold, that evil. Thought "believing" would fix it.. make it all go away. My God, I would've been better off watching Three Stooges reruns eighteen hours a day. I'm not screaming though- I'm laughing my foot off. Just one of those "funny" days..

Well, it is still a free country, heh heh.

Well.. some people keep the same workhorse twenty years or so.. That's what I was, a horse. The saddle wasn't too heavy, made me look pretty distinctive.. and I could perform, at least somewhat. Plus I got to look like all the other horses.. Slowly they started tightening the damn thing- and I didn't have a clue of what was really going on. Then came the bit and other restraints. "Smart" people can be really DUMB. Call me stupid- no argument from me, at least.. Ignore things=believing is a good topic. I was trained not to confess negatives. Sure, the "sacred writings" said we were supposed to confess the positives of the word, but in a practical sense, it was extended to not talking or thinking "evil" of someone who did not deserve our trust. Somehow, if we ignored the problems and said the magic words, all would be fine and dandy. I have consequences from some of this stuff I am not willing to share, just don't have the stomach to go back over it again. Probably never "get over it"- and my experiences were not the worst, just AVERAGE. Won't get that stinking saddle on me again.

Yep.. we sure are a bunch of analytical nuts, aren't we, heh heh. What a wide variety of people, different experiences. From what I have read from your posts Galen, your experiences were not that vastly different-just told them when to "shove it" when you had to- or knew better. Personally, a lot of times I did not know any better than to go ahead and do what I was told. I saw folks labelled as possessed for not carrying out dumb instructions to the letter. I imagine they tried hanging that label on you too at times, whether you knew it or not. You must have been "full of spurts" when you refused to toss out stuff written by "copouts".

But to say the world is better without him I may have gone a little too far.. I know some of vic's kids. They are wonderful folks. Kind of like my kids. Athletic, nimble, smart- people that look at me wonder where they get it all from, heh heh.

But anyway.. it does kind of fit in the topic of the thread. I ignored some REAL crap in the guise of "believing". Yep, I had my suspicions about some of the junk that was going on, but refused to let myself think "negative". All doubts were to be avoided- don't want negative results you know. I think we were taught to equate trust in men and men's "ministries" with trust in God. "Owe your stinking life to my ministry" ptooie.

"and that point alone made my experience more pleasant than others." You could call that the understatement of the year.. I hold no hostility towards you- just trying to figure this thing out. Personally, after I was in a year or so, I wondered why they would treat ANYBODY nicely, at least on a consistent basis. With a whole family, maybe there is strength in numbers- some MOG trying to rape one of your family, and I would imagine there would be hell for him to pay. Others did not have the same "luxury". My impression, and it is that only that, not even an opinion- having never seen some of the real bad stuff, it is almost unbelievable for you. Like finding out your best friend is some kind of monster. Maybe you had good leadership. And I would bet they absorbed the crap for you- crap you never saw- barring what I read about your brief corps experience. They did the same for me too, but only sometimes. I can see your point, but I see Rascal's too. Why is your experience so vastly different than that of the vast majority here? And they are not making the stuff up- I've witnessed enough of it myself. It's almost like you two are from two different planets. Your planet "way" was a place of good, lightness, and joy- others, it was a nightmare they couldn't wake up from until they left, or were booted out. Mine was somewhere in between the two. As far a VP and Loy are concerned- I did not personally know either of them- but learning what they did to my sisters, I think the world would have been better off without them. Both of the bastards betrayed us, betrayed us all.

One of my kids has a cat, and has to keep the thing shut to keep it from what I affectionately call "trolling for treasures".

I never changed a roll of it in my life. I keep trying- hard as I try- they just refuse to cooperate and change into something more useful, like gold bullion.

OK.. a couple of years ago I was walking behind the local pizzaria here- lo and behold, I beheld twenty gallon drums of banana puree. At that time, I think all they made was pizza, and the best in a hundred mile radius at that. Just makes me wonder- were they palming off "counterfiet" pizza to the poor unhuddled masses here?

Groucho, sadly, some who have lost the "fight" find themselves patiently waiting for the "return", of the plumber. Alas, no more sorrow, no more joy. The only thing that remains is a constant urge, and hopping on one foot, along with a confident assurance that all will be as it should be, in the end.

Yep.. I find myself beating off dozens of ladies all the time too.. heh heh. What suprises me, still no votes for "absolutely ludicrous". I can only hope..

I thought a little more about it.. if we had "just plain ludicrous", it could kind of be some sort of internet "purgatory" where we send certain posters that are just not plain "nice". I of course would be the forum moderator, heh heh.

Heh heh heh. Well.. what can I say to that.. One of the very FEW times I saw Ophrah on TV- maybe twice- she was arguing vehemently that the roll MUST be posistioned so as to allow the paper to unroll out the back down the wall.. Might be a nice lady, but that was enough for me, heh heh.

You should be VERY thankful I'm not in charge of the world, heh heh.

Still seems to, even to this day.. Makes me wonder why if it did not work the first time around, or sixtieth, somebody would still want to go back and try it all over again. I heard the same stupid stories too. I asked for verification- "well, we don't advertise that stuff because then people wouldn't come to get da verd, they'd just want healing" or some such nonsense. I remember the "black arts" exhibit at my first advanced class though. Most of that stuff was just such a scam- and obviously, at that. It made me wonder how anybody could even consider that it was due to the work of debils or some such nonsense. After a while, anything that they couldn't figure out was labelled as possessed or something..

Ludicrous can be a good thing though. There is an exit on I75 close to Detroit- has a big sign, "Big Beaver Road". If I ever come accross real money someday, I would seriously consider the proposition of generously paying to have a fifty foot statue of a big beaver constructed there where you could see it from the highway.. That should say about all you want to know about me, heh heh.

Heh heh. SOME things would be nice, can't have everything else you know..

Bob, they'd probably just be inviting some real trouble installing one of the automatic jobs- only real "spiritually lazy" people would need it you know.. Besides, they'd probably have to go in debt to be able to purchase the thing.