CoolWaters

TYVM=Thank You Very Much

:D-->

The "X-mass and growing up as a wayfer" thread got me to thinking about how different the twi experience was for "the elite" (those at HQ, in corpse and other "leadership") and those favored by "the elite".

I'll never forget the experience of my first Christmas "in". B**** G**** was the branch leader. We were all sitting around on the floor of the branch home singing from the blue book. I asked if the guitarist knew any Christmas carols. OMG!!!!!!!!!!! I was taken into the office for a "mild reproving" to "correct the error of my learning".

I'll also never forget the hell-fire and brimstone "teaching" the branch leader in Anchorage (R*** U******) whipped out on all of us about Christmas and "other devilish influences" in our lives...like D&D. Wasn't I so very surprised to walk into twig one Thanksgiving to see R*ch's fully decorated Christmas tree in the living room?!?! Then that New's Year's Eve his house was full of military WOWs...and they were playing D&D!

From the beginning of my twi experience to the end, it was drilled into my head the Christmas was a pagan ritual to rob "the word" of its "power and glory".

Other things like pictures on our walls had to be "officially acceptable"...knick-knacks could not be "graven images"...books had to be checked out by "older grads" for "devil spirit influence"...jewelry could not in any way appear to be any sort of amulet or charm (the silver charm bracelet from my dad was a no-no...it kept me tied to my "unbeliever, idolotrous" family)...even my high school schedule had to go through a leadership approval process. Everything "normal" in life was suspect.

Yet I am always reading how "normal" life was for many people here...like how Santa came to HQ and RC.

I'm going...HUH?????? What twi were you all in?????

[This message was edited by CoolWaters on January 31, 2004 at 21:06.]

edited

[This message was edited by CoolWaters on January 31, 2004 at 20:37.]

Too cute! TYVM!

Dovey...you have a PT from me.

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Originally posted by George Aar:

Now can anybody tell me, What the hay does Santa Claus have to do with pawnshops? I haven't a clue, though I often wondered...

geo.

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LMAO! Not only do many folks buy presents from pawn shops, but many folks pawn items to get the money for the presents.

The deeper question here, imo, is how did a gift of a dowry translate to a symbol for pawnshops...?!?!? I mean, is there part of this St Nick story that nobody's telling..?!?!? LMAO!

************

Now that I'm a full-blown practitioner of many things pagan, this time of year is so much fun and so full of meaning and power! Yay! :D-->

{{{{{{{{{Watered Garden}}}}}}}}

I am so very glad that you are still with us! And if I was involved in any way with you not getting to a doctor, I humbly apologize.

You said,

quote:

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She complimented me on my "weight loss program" and wouldn't listen when I tried to tell her how bad I felt.

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Oh man! I broke into huge sobs. That is almost identical to what was said and done when the pastor of the offshoot tried to talk me out of taking medication. What he/she said was, "Well maybe this is your believing for how you're going to get all that weight off."

Isn't it great to be out from under such insanity?

*****************

OM,

I wish I had a pill to give you...you know...the red one or the blue one...

quote:

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Originally posted by DATWAY:

Oh I quit!! Sorry CoolWaters I tried to help

_

W__A__Y__Who?_

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:D--> Thanks, DATWAY. And you did, too. I didn't keep my twi books...and I've done everything possible to bury whatever I may have remembered...so being able to point to something "tangible" was too kewl!

OM,

Where in twi books and other material does it say that people should work for free? Or that the use of the words "Christmas" and "creative" are discouraged? Or that women should "meet the needs" of the reverend mr so-and-so? Or anything else that people on this board have put forth about twi?

VPW taught that diabetes and certain other illnesses/diseases are caused by "devil spirits". He taught that believing=receiving and that if one is "right believing" and "in fellowship", then one will "prosper and be in health". He also taught that what one feared, one would experience.

I believed it because I was waybrained. (In other words, I swallowed vpw's version of "the truth" and applied it to my daily life...because I was afraid of "being out in left field" if I did not. THAT, dear OM, is waybrain.)

So when I came across a situation (in this case, a young woman with diabetes) that I was taught was the direct result of "devil spirit" infestation, I pushed vpw's "rememdy" for the situation.

Ta da! Wasn't a big leap after all, was it?

Also, you did not question any of the other posts on this thread.

I would appreciate it if you would step back from your twi defense mode long enough to see just how damned offensive and belittling your attitude is to me.

Just try for one minute to see that what you have basically said to me is that you never experienced what I experienced, and you can't find any written documentation that would specifically encourage me to do something so dumb as to not take medication, so therefore what I did then and said now is/was invalid.

That's the way what you said feels to me. If that was not your intent, I ask that you express to me what your intent was in that post.

Thank you.

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Originally posted by oldiesman:

...and there's nothing in Way doctrine that ever prohibited or discouraged medication.

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Are you serious?

I had so much waybrain that I refused to accept the gift from my parents of a fully paid, 4-year college education because my twig leader said the college was "devilish"...and, as my twig leader explained to me, the credits from such a college would not be transferrable to a better college like (ta da) The Way College of Emporia...where I could "learn the word like it hadn't been known since the 1st Century!"

I had so much waybrain that I dropped out of high school 12 weeks before graduation to get my GED so that I wouldn't be accepted at most colleges...which meant that I would be a "doulos(sp) doer" in getting my "in fellowship" education.

I had so much waybrain that I didn't even bother to ask anybody if anything that twig leader was telling me was even correct.

I had so much waybrain that for 15 years I raised my daughter "like a WOW"...possessing only the belongings that could fit into the trunk of a car, moving every few months "as led by the spirit", working only part-time so that the rest of my time could be devoted to "moving the word over the world", yada yada yada.

I had so much waybrain that I refused to accept very good job offers from companies whose logos had "devilish" symbolism in them...according to my twig leader(s).

I had so much waybrain that I convinced a diabetic woman to "believe god" and stop taking her insulin because a "devil spirt" was the cause of diabetes, not a lack of insulin. (4 1/2 years ago I was diagnosed diabetic...and my twi offshoot pastor convinced me to stop taking my medicine.)

I shouldn't have gotten started...there's a book in there somewhere. :/

If anybody is interested, my gift to others this year is to put some fancy art that I've made in my graphics programs around digital pictures people send me. This way folks can print the pics on their printers and put them in frames or on mattes or whatever they want to do. Makes great personalized gifts!

If anyone is interested, email pics to CoolWatersDesigns@cox.net.

Here are some samples of some of things I can do:

001

002

003

004

:D--> :D--> :D--> :D--> :D-->

quote:

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Originally posted by Tom Strange:

I just tell them it's a religious cult, let their minds wander where they will, and then confirm their fears... only that it's much worse...

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Works for me most often. After Jonestown, Waco, Heaven's Gate, etc., most people "get it" when I say "it's a fundamentalist cult". Some people ask me why I stayed for so long. I look at them and say, "Um, I just told you it's a cult. Get it?" Some people ask how am I sure that I am really "out". I look at them and say, "I'm standing here telling you it's a cult...and I'm not looking over my shoulder for a cult leader to knock me over the head." People think I'm nuts whether they know I was in a cult or not. Just something about me...that I really like...LOL.

LMAO!!!! I still get a good Har Har every time I read that list...but it's not mine. I got it in an email a long time ago. It wasn't credited then, so I couldn't credit it now.

"Private Summer"!!!!!!!!! LMAO!!!!!!!!

Minnie Moments

You all have GOT to go to this site! It saved my brain!

SIGNS THAT YOU MIGHT BE EXPERIENCING MENOPAUSE

* You sell your home heating system at a yard sale. (Hot flashes)

* The person you sleep with complains about snow piling up on the bed. (Nightsweats)

* Your husband jokes that instead of buying a wood stove, he is using you to heat the family room this winter. Rather than just saying you are not amused, you shoot him. (Mood swings)

* You write post-it notes with your kid's names on them. (Memory loss)

* Your husband chirps, "Hi honey, I'm home." and you reply, "Well, if it isn't Ozzie f*cking Nelson". (Irritability)

* The phenobarbital dose that wiped out the Heaven's Gate Cult gives you four hours of decent rest. (Sleeplessness)

* You find Guacamole in your hair after a Mexican dinner. (Fatigue)

* You change your underwear after every sneeze. (Mild incontinence)

* You need Jaws Of Life to help you out of your car after returning home from an Italian restaurant. (Sudden weight gain)

* You ask Jiffy Lube to put you up on a hoist. (Dryness)

* You take a sudden interest in "Wrestlemania". (Female hormone deficiency)

* You're on so much estrogen that you take your Brownie troop on a field trip to Chippendales. (Hormone therapy)

I gotta tell ya...this is the time of life to take all of the pent-up everything you've held onto for all these years and let 'er rip! Harness that "negative" energy and blast the world full in the face with every tirade you've ever wanted to spew. It's so much fun! Then you can look at everybody standing with their mouths agape and say, "Menopause. It's been accepted as a murder defense. Anybody wanna try me?" LMAO!!!!!!!!!

Did you see the movie "Fried Green Tomatoes"? TAWANDA! I especially love the scene where Evelyn (Kathy Bates) has finally found her personal power in the parking lot of the grocery store. A couple of young blond chicky babes steal her parking spot and she's had enough. She rams the perky little chicky babe car in the rear until she's rammed it right out of her parking space! Then she says something like, "You may have perky boobs and good hair, but I've got more insurance than you'll ever know to buy!" (That's not it exactly, but that's the basic message.) It's a wonderful menopause movie. You'll laugh, you'll cry, you'll yell, you'll be in good menopause company.

Use the hot flashes to get people to wait on you and do things for you and to get extra breaks at work. Just swoon a bit and whisper with all your pitiful strength, "Menopause. I'm totally at it's mercy." Tee hee! Nobody knows what to do except for those of us who have been there...and most of us will play along 'cause it's sooooooooooo much fun! LMAO!!!!

Menopause is also the time to get anything around the house and yard fixed. Believe me, your husband (if he loves you and wants to keep you as his wife) will do anything you want as long as he knows he won't have to be in the same room with you when you're "in a mood"...and as long as you've let loose on him a couple of times just to make sure he understands that your hormones are RAGING OUT OF CONTROL AND YOU'VE GOT THE POWER TO FOCUS THAT RAGE!!!!!!! Tee hee. (This works on neighborhood men, too, for those who aren't married or don't have an SO.)

Watch "Divine Secrets of the Ya-Ya Sisterhood" as many times as you want...and then get a couple of other menopausal friends together and adopt a few wild rituals of your own. It's great expression of things we can't find words for...and it keeps the males and the young women in your life on their toes and wary of messing with you too much. I, personally, attended and organized/hosted quite a few Howlings. LMAO!!!!!!

Adopt a lifestyle of casual nudity. You'll always be able to quickly douse yourself in cold water and nobody will want to visit you unannounced. Saves you having to do too much laundry, too. Hehehehe.

You'll find that your sexuality doesn't just bloom, but it explodes into full glory. Vaginal dryness? There's literally thousands of helpful products on the market. Try them out and pick whatever works best for you. (Always test any product (perfume, makeup, lipstick, shampoo, dye, feminine hygiene, whatever) on the inside of your wrist before using it. If you are going to have an allergic reaction of any kind, it will show up there...before you find out in a very painful and embarrassing way.)

Last but not least, this is a time in life when women lose all need for "help", "direction", or anything else associated with the "frailty of femininity". It is the most holy and sacred of all things in our lives. Once past this stage, a woman is accepted as a wise sage that should not be questioned or disrespected in any way...if you've played your cards right. Live it to the utmost! LOL!

(Can anybody tell I had waaaaaaaaaaay too much fun being menopausal? LOL!)

OK, dudes and dudettes, I gotta say here that there is suffering in life with or without being a follower of Jesus. Christianity is simply a belief system that tells one there is purpose to the suffering...which may make suffering more tolerable.

But in becoming more tolerable, suffering may also become expected...or, worse, be held up as "proof" of a special level of favor with divinity...as with the martyrs and the saints glorified throughout history.

That's not a good place to be in life, imo.

Was God's love and Jesus' sacrifice more than the love and sacrifice of a mother who saves the life of a child at the cost of her own?

Even the bible says that God can raise up children out of rocks. The idea that God could never, ever again have the opportunity of having a son like Jesus is not very well thought out...and is even a little ridiculous, imo.

So what does that say to me about the Cross of Christ?

It tells me that the act was symbolic more than fundamental...that this act, this sacrifice, should be taken as a symbol of what a parent will do to help a child...even if it means choosing one child over others...and this is how much the god of the bible loved his children.

Jesus was not, is not, and will not be the only person to be crucified or otherwise put to a horrible death for a calling, a purpose. He was not, is not and will not be the only innocent person to go to death in the place of the guilty.

Which is the point where this question becomes even more defined.

Must one first believe in the "stain of sin" upon all mankind before one can understand the Cross of Christ?

I no longer believe in the "stain of sin". But I do appreciate and understand the symbolism of the Cross of Christ. I am a mother...of course I understand dying for the life of my children!

Sometimes one can get too close to the "facts" and not see the whole purpose.

Ginger, I'm so sorry. I will light candles and watch you and your daughter's souls to the best of my ability.

If you have a chance to look up and you see some birds flying overhead, one of them is me being as near as I possibly can be...and hopefully bring a sweet song for your soul.

Hmmm, let's see...

Rx for diabetes medicine and pain reliever. However, I supplement both with herbs, food management, mild exercise, massage, meditation, visualization, aroma therapy, a long visit to my hottub and naps. ;)--> I was diagnosed diabetic just about 4.5 years ago. With these supplements, my med dosage has dropped to the bare minimum. Yipee!

Of course, when the all-out menopause bitchies hit, I go for the chocolate and salt in the form of hot cocoa and popcorn. It's the only thing that'll help. Trust me. ;)-->

quote:

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Originally posted by WordWolf:

A separate issue I'm not ready to explore is-is it wrong for me to dislike

the other type? They acknowledge the INCREDIBLE price paid for our sins,

which, again, twi was uncomfortable with.

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When you are ready, WordWolf, you might be interested in taking a gander at the movie "Stigmata".

If you can get beyond the corny (imo) Hollywood special effects, the obvious conspiracy theory premise against the Catholic Church, and the twi-ish revulsion at the thought of the dead communicating via the living, then it's a good movie to see if you want to grasp just a part of what being crucified meant to Jesus (as described in the bible). ;)-->

Until that movie, I had not been able to grasp the reality of what Jesus was reported to have experienced. After that movie, however, I was so deeply moved in awe and gratitude that I went outside, found a couple of tiny twigs, twined them together in the shape of a cross, and carried that little cross with me in my hands at all times for several weeks. Held it in my hands when I worked, bathed, slept, everything. I still carry it with me in my purse...and I bring it out for inspiration, comfort and worship.

Symbolism is a very interesting study. The cross was symbol in religion long before Jesus was hung on one.

The ankh, for example, is often considered to be "the original" cross and signifies, in its simplicity, the physical and eternal life. The loop representing the womb, the elongated part a phallic symbol.

Dying to save another is older than Jesus, too, as is the belief in a god-man that rules, protects, gives and takes life, etc.

The basic tenets of christianity are the basic tenets of the majority of religions. Love your brother, love your god(s)/goddess(es), serve with thankfulness and charity, do no harm, be willing to give up your life in such love and service to mankind, etc.

When one considers what universal message all of these things deliver, one must recognize that it must be very important to love one another even to the point of death.

But ya gotta be careful, ya know? I know of some religions that would have one "love" (read "give") to the point of death just because the religion would inherit the property...

Pirate,

Words fail me here. My heart and spirit are with you, your wife, the family left behind. In my way, I will reach out to each of you all.

*************

Kit...the schools have suicide classes??????? Wow! What ages/grade levels, do you know?

*************

Suicide was the "in" thing when I was in high school. I had 9 friends succumb. It was something I got into...and nearly succeeded. Once such a thing is in the mind, it feeds on itself...especially if peers are into it, too. Nothing in particular needs to be "wrong"...but everything in general just adds up a little here, a little there.

Depression and desperation are hard to recognize in this busy world of ours. We've somehow learned to "function" on the outside while we are desperately dysfunctional on the inside.

It's a by-product of a fast-paced, workaholic, produceaholic society, imo. Take time to smell the roses isn't just a nice-nice fad thing to say...it's important!

Believe me...I'm going to talk to my son this evening...check in with him, ya know? He's 17.

The "Cheers" analogy is terrific! GSC is like that a whole lot...in the chummy, hangout style as well as in the drop in after a long absence style.

Hiya Ginger...great post! ;)-->