Refiner

Go to 'Doctrinal" bro. Id rather keep this one general and flirt with ExCath in here.

Hey Raf. Start a thread on Dispensationalism in the appropriate forum. I'll respond in there. Id rather it be public. Thanks.

Ex Cath. Youre right. Private topic would be a bit rude of me at this stage. Forgive a newbie. I will hold the discussion about Witless date setting another time with Raf. Or perhaps Raf could start a thread and I'll respond to it publicly and other readers can ignore if they choose. Grizz: I know a fair Whack about Mormonism. Ive been baptized into it (not much of an achievement) when I was researching their beliefs. Im not a believer in anything. Im merely a wandering "Expert" in cultic beliefs and practises. I was writing a book about cult groups which I commenced writing in 1992 and ended on December 31, 2000. During that time I joined dozens of millenial/ expectational/ hysterical movements.

Jason P: Quote: "When they do have a failed prediction (like the Y2K disaster one), they can squirm out of it by saying that their "believing action" (the hoarding and what-have-you before Y2K, for instance) prevented the disaster." I am familiar with the line of reasoning. Its very popular in flying saucer/ "Ascended Master" cults. --> Quote: "TWI has NEVER been wrong about ANYTHING. Any apparent contradictions are therefore problems with your perception, understanding and believing." Yeah. do they burn their old books and alter old texts to fit the new interpretation? A curious mind wants to know. Raf: I think a "private topic" is beyond my capability to start at this moment. I dont see anywhere such a discussion can take place. Please send instructions. Im most willing though.

Raf. The JWitlesses have predicted Armaggedoin innumerable times. 1874, 1878, 1881, 1914, 1918, 1921, 1925 and 1975. We are still here. Their datesetting mechanism revolves around a thing called "Parallel dispensationalism" and moves in 3.5, 7 , 40 and 70 year cycles. I wont bore you with the details here. -->

ExCath , sounds promising. ;)--> (attempts quotation)

TomS: All the posters on that board are "apostates". Which, (I assume) is the equivalent of being a "Greasespot" in Mr Wierwills eyes. Noone there supports the Jehovah Witless "Organization". In the main they are "Violently opposed to the Truth" Im sure you would be welcomed with the same open arms I am being welcomed with here.

Hey ExCath you havent told me if youre a girl or not. No Fair. I told you, now you got to tell me.

Raf. Regarding your points: Quote: "The difference between TWI and JW comes down to pre-existence. JWs teach that Christ existed before his birth as an angel (the archangel Michael, if I'm not mistaken)." Entirely correct. Quote: "TWI teaches that he did not exist at all prior to his birth, except in the foreknowledge of God." How strange. Quote: "Witnesses agree with TWI on the nature of death, but not on eschatology (the order and timing of the "end times)." Ahh well, now theres something that interests me greatly. The Witlesses have an extensive history of date setting and failed expectation. How mant times has "Way" predicted the end. ? I percieve that the recurring term "greasespots" is somehow connected to a failed prediction. Correct?

Raf, that site is totally moderation free. So dont be shocked. They are all ex Jay Dubs. I post there as refiners fire.

Im a bloke. I assumed you were a female. If your not a girl I'll stop feeling attracted. And if youre a female and someone on the board views you as already their property, likewise. I dont want a war with any regular poster. Lol. I live in Oz-traylia

ExCath, you have 9000 posts! You are as bad as me. Mostly, these days, I post here: www.jehovahswitnessonline.com (Admin, please forgive if links are not permitted, and feel free to remove.)

ExCath: I am by no means ignoring you. Im a little overwhelmed at the moment with the degree of response Im getting and am still groping my way thru learning to post. You seem like a nice person. No I think it was "Grizz" asked why Im here. Im not too sure of the answer to that. Mainly I like to look into religious oriented chat rooms, looking for conversation and friends, but most online char forums have lousy formats and I dont even bother posting there. This forum has a format I like, and the people seem interesting. So I hope noone will mind if I hang around a while.

Raf. Many thanks. Point by point: "1. Jesus Christ is not God. He's a man whose existence began at birth. He was unique because he had no human father and was uniquely able to live without sinning."... Hmmm. Well the church I grew up in (JWs) does not recognize the trinity. They consider Jesus secondary to Jehovah (The Father), consequently there is more focus within that church upon the Anger of the Old Testament God than upon the nature of Christ. "2. The dead are not alive now. When someone dies, he ceases to exist until the return of Christ." Same with the Witnesses again. "3. History is divided into "administrations" distinguished by different ways in which God deals with mankind (different rules based on what has been accomplished, the physical location of Jesus Christ, etc). Other denominations who hold to this belief call it "dispensationalism.".... No comment at this stage. "4. The law of believing: "believing = receiving."... No comment at this stage. "5. All believers can and should speak in tongues, interpret and prophesy."... So I see them as similar to Pentecostals in that regard. "6. A pre-tribulation rapture. Christians will not have to go through any of the Great Tribulation."... It appears that THe Way believes in Heavenly existance for members then. The Jehovahs Witnesses are different. Once they got more than 200,000 members of the church they created two seperate classes. One (the 144,000 elite which shares Kingship with Christ in heaven, and the rest (The other 6 million members) who will reside on earth in sexless perfection thruout eternity. Many thanks.

I see. Is the term "The more than abundant life" an insider term. Loaded language so to speak. Likewise the term "Rightly divided truth".? Now if the Mormons ever come into your life and ask you how reading a certain passage of their book makes you feel, simply tell them it makes you feel "peaceful", really "peaceful". You will be immediately accepted. :P-->

Hello. I confess to being totally ignorant about Way International. Now most Churches and cults that Ive been involved with have an identifying belief that they consider marks them out as the "True" church among a sea of "false" churches. Seventh Day Adventists believe the fact that they observe the Saturday Sabbath marks them for eternal life. Jehovahs Witnesses believe that because they knock on doors , acting as 'witnesses' to their faith, they earn salvation in this manner. What key, unique belief does the Way hold that sets it apart as the "truth"? Many Thanks. James