dabobbada

I want the auditorium. It would be a great theatre, I'd do plays in there, such as; Dr. Jackel and L.C. Hyde Okie Homie,... er, Oklahoma But I especially love Shakespeare, and would love to do some of his plays; King Leer Much Ado About Nothing The Comedy of Errors Romeo & 10,000 Juliets The Merry(?) Wives of Wierwille The Merchant of Venality A Midsummer Night's Scam Hammin'it Macbull The Tempest in a Teapot The Taming of the Screw Two Gentlemen of Bologna :D--> :D--> :D--> :D--> :D--> Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen [This message was edited by dabobbada on January 21, 2004 at 13:31.]

Now, now, good ol' docvic always said any two bee..leavehers could make a go of it being as they was all like minded on the wurd. Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Here is the link to the bubble universe article I was talking about. I can't get the linker to work, but here is the addy; http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99994250 WTF? typed it in the message box and it autolinked? Anyway, there it is. Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Mister Mosh, A while back, thare was a discussion here about buying a telescope. Either someone linked an amatuer astronomy site or I went looking for telescopes in a search. This really good amatuer site had a lot of links and one highlighted link was to this new bubble theory. I'll see if I can find it. :D--> Actually on the blood thing. As I recall it, the soul life is in the blood which written plainly in the bible and I still believe it is true. The point of contention is VP's claim the man contributes the soul life to the baby. I don't recall him specifically saying the sperm had blood as it sounds you are saying here. Another thing was VP saying the soul life intered with the first breath. So another question would be; If the soul life is contributed at conception,how come it isn't manifested until the first breath 9 mnoths later? :D--> Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Dan, That is a weird one about His flesh. Though gross, if you look at it from their viewpoint, there is a certain logic of godly self healing. But why bother to self heal while still remaining up there with those nails in your body. Just calll in the 12,000 angels, clean some clocks and get down. The perfect body could be eternally self healing but when peirced by those nails, the body was no longer in perfect condition. Just be alert and stay prepared to duck when them ricocheting debils come zinging by now. :D--> Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Bob, I had no idea you were under that much hassle. Thank you again and again, for staying. I didn't let the Barbmeister bother me, I just stayed out of her way. There was plenty to do, like I said, door to door didn't bother me at all so they could not fault me there. The place Roger and I got had a large living room area so Barb had us run several classes there. That was fun, a nice break from witnessing. All in all, it was a good year. Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

There is a new bubble theory of the universe going around amoung the stargazers. They say the universe would be much smaller that we think it is. When we think we are looking at the farthest galaxies, we may actually be looking at reflections from inside, boucing off the bubble walls. The reason for this thinking is based on the microwaves bouncing around the universe from the big bang. Instead of being uniform in nature and coming from one direction, they are highly irratic bouncing around from all over the place in different intensities. As if they were bouncing around in a bubble. They did not in the article I saw, estimate the size of the bubble or give an idea of what it was made. Nor of course did they speculate what may be outside the bubble. Makes you go hmmmmmmmmmmmm, :D--> Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

(Blush) Aw... shucks guys, it tweren't nothin' no bullheaded, contrary, stubborn ol' country boy wouldn't do. :D--> :D--> :D--> Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Huuss, wahh, uusss, waaa, Arnold Skywalker, it is your destiny! :D--> :D--> :D--> Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Dear Linda, I don't normally judge people much at all, I'm a laid back live and let live type of guy. The ones I do judge are the extremists of both sides. Though generally a conservative in most ways, I reserve the right to be liberal when I damn well please too. It seems the extreme left lately is in a worse tither than a white supremacist locked and naked in a black gay dwarf bar. If Hubby O' Hillary was despised by the far right, then Dubya is twice over the Spawn O' Satan to the far left and they are so agitated that they are spouting more and more extreme things because of this agitation. (Just as the far right did under Hubby O') I have been seeing this in the politics and tacks area the last few months. Both far left and right are almost in a killing frenzy for each other. If there were 100 laws when I was growing up in the fifties, it seems there are now 10,000. Some of it is good but a great deal of it is PC victimization to almost comical exageration and it comes from liberals and lawyers for the most part. The liberals are at least trying to be compassionate, but the lawyers are mostly looking at the trial dollars. Both tend to want extreme penalties for those who they consider guilty. (I'm talking the extremists here.) This is what occured to me as I was looking at the PC persecution of the Oakman for something he'd already acknowledged as stupid. Most everybody took it in good humor with the essence for which it was ment. A radical extremist is never happy unless the world is made over into his own vision of Utopia, whether they be far left or far right. :D--> :D--> :D--> Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Rascal married her white knight, that is truly sweet. :)--> :)--> :)--> Good stories all. ;)--> :)--> (We were all kind'a nuts. :D--> :D--> ) Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Why do I get the feeling that whether it is a crime or not depends on whether you are a liberal or not. :D--> Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Thanks for your compliment also Valerie, I've always been that nice sensitve guy the girls always say they want to marry..... :D--> My dad was basically a blue collar man raised in the 19th century attitudes of self control, personal responsibilty, honor and integrity, showing due respect to our elders, women, people in general, and positions of authority. He raised us that way too, it is too bad that seems mostly lost today. Phil is oldies, he had excellent friendships with some high leaders and has close ones still in though he has been out at least 10 years. I don't want to say too much because he might not want it revealed, but he as you see, likes much of what he was taught and is a big believer in being responsible for your actions. I think he carries it a bit too far, but I still think he is an all around good guy. I thought you were the most clean cut, wholesome, all american apple pie girl there. You and Linda Molyneau too, and you were both total knockouts. All the rest of the girls were in their party and hippy stages of life. Remember when Barb told us the girls had to start wearing bras and the guys had to cut their hair and shave? (in Texas in '74, even the bikerbabes wore bras.) :D-->:D-->:D--> Here is my story about my own personal Barbabuse. Kinda long but pretty funny, at least I think so. (Actually, this should be in the wild, weird and stupid thread.) My problem with Wowgrupe Oberfuhrer Barbarian Greystapo started around October after a Friday night wow meeting in your house. She held me back afterwards and told me word had gotten back to her that I wasn't witnessing enough and she told me that if I didn't come back by 10:00 pm Saturday night with 10 names of people interested in fellowship, she was going to kick me off the field. First some background for those who don't know the '74 wow year. 21 wow branches of 7 wow twigs each were sent out after the ROA. The Amarillo, Texas branch had 29 wows with 10 cars, one of them my old beat up blue Ford. Interim corpsperson Barbara G was the Wowgrupe Oberfuhrer. I use the term Wowgrupe Oberfuhrer because that tended to be her character and attitude. I always thought she would make a great Marine. :D--> When we left HQ, JoAnn C. was riding with Barb G. and Barb's van broke down. JoAnn had enough money to cover the repairs and they finally caught up with us after we all were in Amarillo. She named the twigs after the 7 church epistles, ours was Ephesians. That night Barb did a quick run around of Amarillo and then took a city map and divided it into 7 wow twig areas. The whole southeast quarter of the city was given to Ephesians because there weren't many public places to witness in.Each wow family was to stay in it's own area for witnessing. As it turned out, we had four places; one hotel, a grocery, a gas station turned teenage game room, and a bowling alley. A couple weeks after arrival, we had to send one of the Ephesians girls home and Barb sent JoAnn to my twig to take her place. I thought it odd Barb would send JoAnn, but it quickly became obvious she was smitten of Roger, the coordinator. Somehow, I was smitten of her and Roger liked JoAnn but had no personal interest in her. (Nice mess. eh?) JoAnn and Lin B., the other Eph. girl wow, both thought of themselves and acted as loose goose inner city black chicks in white skins. I was a rather conservative bible type which they both detested. We bumped heads a lot and poor Roger was stuck in the middle. The fact that I did the whole family finances and owned the only working car made things worse. They got away with a lot (including my car) because we had agreed to a democratic one person, one vote decision making process with Roger having the tiebreaker when necessary. As it turned out, the hotel wasn't really a place to witness, and the grocery kicked us out real quick. That left us with the kiddy pinball room and the bowling alley. The kids ignored us and the bowling alley was very noisy. I've always been partially deaf and couldn't hear even a third of anything said. I never liked walking up to someone doing something and cold witnessing to them anyway. This is what led up to the meeting with Wowgrupe Oberfuhrer Barb Greystapo and her ultimatum. After telling Roger and the girls about the 10 names or leave warning, the Ephesian girls were beside themselves with glee. They knew I was on my way out of their lives. Saturday was the family day off and I had to go witnessing. The whole family voted against me using my own car to do so because they needed to do family things. (The final vote was binding and we'd all agreed to it. Of course the girls knew not having the car would impede my witnessing too.) Roger suggested I go to the wondermall for access to the most people. (it was the day off so I wasn't limited to our territory.) So I walked several miles to the wondermall, witnessing all the way. I witnessed all day there until they closed and then I witnessed as I walked back home. I didn't get one name even though I witnessed like crazy and had several fascinating witnesses including one with some young Mormons. At 10:00 pm I was allowed to use my car to go see the Barbmeister. I told her of all I had done and braced myself for the verbal assault I expected to get. Barb was silent for several minutes and then told me she had called HQ about my problem. She was told she didn't have the authority to boot me unless I was actively fighting the ministry and it was my decision to stay or leave. After another pause, she told me she had gotten several reports from wows who had seen me at the mall witnessing. (By Saturday morning, about all the wows had heard about my situation, probably JoAnn and Lin again. At the mall, all the wows who saw me wished me sucess.:)--> ) She said again she could not boot me but emphasized she would be really pleased if I left on my own and she wanted my answer in the morning after another wow meeting at her house. When I returned home and gave my report, the girls were crestfallen and begged me to leave. The next morning, I told Roger my promise had been to God and to a lesser extent to VP,... Barb had nothing to do with it. I was staying. At the wow meeting, Barb announced HQ had decided to give door to door witnessing a try and this was how we were going to spend the rest of the year witnessing. A collective groan filled the room but I smiled. ( I had sold Kirby Vacuum Cleaners for a while and didn't mind door to door.) Afterwards, I told Barb my decision, she didn't like it but couldn't do anything about it. So that is how Wowgrupe Oberfuhrer Barb Greystapo came to dislike me. :D-->:D-->:D--> The rest of the year went well with me and I had many wonderful and Godly experiences. Signs and wonders, miracles and a lot of learning. :D--> ;)--> Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen [This message was edited by dabobbada on January 11, 2004 at 6:53.] [This message was edited by dabobbada on January 11, 2004 at 7:07.]

Shaz and Ex, I was saying pretty much what you are. Different things taught at different levels within the structure. In the early days, to the outer circle, the husband was to love the wife as his queen and as the Proverbs 31 woman she could be. Had it been the absolute lord of the house it became later, Iwould not have spent all those years there. Maybe I was lucky to kive in good areas with good leaders, but I did not see much of men oppressing women until the '90s. Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

I can't recall Don W being ordained by TWI or not. I do remember at a rock in the mid eighties, say '84 to '89, Don got up and in a sense was validating himself as a trustee. He said he was with VP once when he was about 10 years old. VP was visiting one of those men who had inspired him in his early years. (Rufus Mosley, Starr Daily, B.G.Leonard, etc., I don't recall.) This person felt inspired to minister to Don and then ordained him into the Christian ministry at that time according to Don's story. I believe it is probably true, I've heard of things like that before. Interestingly, VP always wanted Don to join him in TWI but Don resisted and remained a school principal until VP offered him the Emporia Campus. I think that was a huge mistake for Don. Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Ex, As I recall, you left early on, mid or late '70s. Though TWI taught the husband as head, he was also to love his wife as Christ did the church. It was a mellower time with a lot more love in the ministry. As time went on, we got caught up in the works of the ministry and the love receded. This led eventually to the legalism and micro-managed absolute control of everthing in the '90s which were The Loy'd Craig's ultimate Nirvana. The first focus of any such total dictatorship is always the family. More generally, in any group of 100 marriages, you will have many types of male to female interactions. Men will vary from dictators to wife beaters, and leaders to co-workers, submitters. and wussies. Culture, including religion have tremendous infuences on how these interrelationships work. TWI taught the outer masses one thing, the corps another, and the initiated ones a third. And that changed and became harder of heart as time progressed. It ended in HitLoy's Glorious Micro-managed Third Reich. Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Sorry oldies, I don't know where it is at. I beleive it was at the old Greasespot and I don't think it exists anymore. Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

oldiesman, You know that we communicated for a time and I am your friend and that I know where you are coming from in relationship to TWI. You are right pertaining to the women who voluntarily engaged in sexual acvtivity and abortion. There were plenty who wished to sleep with a MOG, and there were plenty who had an abortion so it wouldn't interfere with doing 'the word.' There were also plenty who got abortions because they didn't feel they were ready to deal with parenting at the time too. I have the privilege of having been with WayDale early on and both GSC's since then plus a few other sites. I've read a multitude of abuse stories by as many women over these near five years. At first, I blew them off as disgruntled folks seeking revenge. I also considered them responsible and accountable for their own actions too. But when you read hundreds of stories by different women and they are all basically the same three or four stories, then you've got to know they all can't be lying. I felt sick enough to throw up when I realized several of them were women I knew. When it is an anonymus person, it is easy to dismiss it as BS. However, when it is someone you know and you know what kind of person they are and their character, it takes on a whole new meaning. It is difficult for any abused woman to tell her story here. She is exposing things deep and horrible from the most painful and private parts of her soul. When she does this she is forced in a way to relive the degradation all over again. And worst of all, once she has put it up on the net, she knows there are those who will rip her to shreads saying she is a liar or that it was her own fault. It is like being raped all over again. That is why many don't post the details or won't post at all. I figure for everyone who has said their stories, there are 15 or 30 who can't or won't put themselves thru all the virtual stonings they always seem to get. You knew Valerie, have you read her full story? (I think it was on GSC 1) Where she talks about who she was, where she came from, then tells of her corps years and details what VP did to her. Or her "pressured" marriage to a total wife abusing jerk. Or how he messed with her head so much she went out and did a number of unseemly things for a while. Fortunately, she got her head together and staightened herself out. That in itself is an incredible story. I wish she would put it in the MY Story forum, but that is a personal decision only she can make. Oldiesman, I know you and some family have had nothing but good associations with several of the highest ups in TWI, so also did many of us. So also did many including LindaZ and several others who were on staff for years at HQ. However I have seen from the postings where folks spoke of the inner circle of spiritually manure ....er, spiritually mature that TWI was really The Waybylon Mystery Religion for our day and time. Remember the Babylon book? It showed how they made an outward show of religion to pacify the masses and then had the secret mystery religion of licentiousness for the initiated enlightened ones. It seems VP plagarized that one to. Now mind you, I do believe VP was a true believer. The thing was, if VP truly believed you could stretch grace and forgiveness so far that it was ok to have sex with anyone, why didn't he preach it to the masses. That would have been intellectually honest anyway. But he knew most people wouldn't buy it and would walk away if they heard it. So to keep them near for his purposes, he taught a more standard form of Bible to the spiritually immature and the deep things of the "great freedom we have in Christ" to those he chose worthy to be the initiated ones of the inner circle. It is not only intellectually dishonest but there is plenty of evidence to show that he had the predatory instincts down on how to choose many of his victims from those who already had problems in that area. Sadly, predators and molelesters are good at portraying themselves as good and upstanding citizens while doing evil things. As I have said, VP was a true believer. He beleived what he taught to the masses, and he believed even more what he taught to the spiritually manure inner circle. If that had contradictions between the mature and the immature, then that was what was necessary to keep the immature close in enough until they too might believe big enough to join the initiated ones. oldiesman, I am going to tell you a story I've never told anyone, but I know it will affect you. I am not doing this to hurt you but I hope it will help you see more broadly. Again, I am sorry if this hurts you. It was told me by a long time friend, who had also been a roommate of mine. Very dear and close, if anyone knew his heart, it was me. about 1990 or so, we were talking about the events of the last few years in the ministry. We had several such conversations over several visits including more after this incident. I was trying to make sense of the fog years and he had come right out of corps to work at HQ for those several years. We talked of a number of things and I'd asked about the rumors of adultry at HQ. He reply there had been some going on and at fairly high levels. I guess someone pushed an effort to clear the air, the guilty parties were supposed to confess their sins to theis spouses. I asked if he knew some names here and he said he didn't because it was supposed to remain private. however he was standing with Wanda Weirwille one night when Don came up with one of the OFC secretaries and admited to Wanda that the secretary had been his mistress of several years. I was in shock and made him repeat the story and swear to it's truthfulness which he did. I mulled it over several years and didn't know what to make of it until WayDale and GSC. My friend had nothing to gain and could have lost a lot by telling me that story. I believe him about it. The Way was a beautiful apple with a rotten core. I beleive Don was a good man who fell into his dad's way of thinking as was corrupted into the rotten things at the center. I do not know what route VP took to get to where he did. I can guess it went like so many others did as such is a common curse to humanity. My guess is VP started out with good intentions to love and serve God. Somewhere at some point one of two things happened. Either he got off on a tangent about grace and forgiveness, or he got caught up in an affair with some woman. If you carry grace and forgiveness too far, you can excuse any evil work. If you get into an affair and like it too much, you will start to find excuses why it wasn't so bad. then you find the bible verses that make it downright forgivable, then absolutely walking in the freedom of Christ, by golly. Onetime, about the late winter of '73 I think, I was at HQ, about 6 rows back as was my wont, and VP was teaching about how we weren't under the law, but grace. In the middle, he went into one of his sidestory tangents, as he was wont to do. He had been talking about how the Israelites were under the law. then he said how the patriachs were under no law but their own personal ones. He laid out an example of how in the time before the law, if a man wanted to sleep with all the women in the village, it was ok, there being no law, thus no sin. He then said in a joking way that the husbands of those women just might not be real pleased about it. It would be a sin to them, but it wouldn't be a sin for that man. It was a good example of sin counciousness and freedom from the same. Little did I realize then how closely that described him and the way he operated. interestingly those words also judge him and find him guilty. Though VP claimed he didn't consider it a sin, he caused many to live in the guilt and degradation of sin conciousness. He knew from Romans you are not to cause others to sin, but did it anyway. And he taught others in the inner circle to do the same. Sorry oldies, but it is the truth. Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Andrea, That was both very Godly and very funny. Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

oldiesman... :D--> :D--> :D--> Yeah, now I know who you are, good to see you again. :)--> :)--> I loved Meg's Manta, that was a nice little car. It was a bummer to see it all torn up afterward and it was God's intervention somehow that kept you not only alive, but basically unhurt. Good ol' Blue, the rusty '63 Ford. Everyone thought it would be the first onr to expire on the WOW field. It was the last one to have any problems, and once Roger got his car going again, it seems we loaned ol' Blue out to several families in need at times. It was an honor to have saved yerazs. (Do you remember the red white and blue steering wheel? :D--> ) (How about the gas tank heldon by a tow chain? :D--> :D--> Talk about an ultimate wowmobile!? ) Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

oldiesman, The pictures I was refering to are the ones she posted in the Every Picture Tells a Story forum. Were you an Amarillo '74 WOW? Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Valerie, You may not remember me, but we were on the wow field together in Amarillo. I am Bob Hansen and I was in the Ephesians twig with Roger Stark and Jo Ann Clark. I didn't get to know you very well because the oberfuhrer Barb Grey chose me to be her personal enemy, so it wasn't a good idea to go to her place. I read where you said how poorly she treated and used you too. It didn't really surprise me. I always remembered you as the wholesome clean-cut all american middle class girl. What VP did to you, what the corps, and your corps husband did to you made my blood boil. The crap you went thru saddened me immensely. Your testemonies were what absolutely locked out any last vestiges of doubts about VP and the perversities in TWI. I was impressed with your accounting of your military service. You go girl. I am glad you have found a good life and husband and that it is well with you. Thanks for the pictures of the wow year. It was good to see bob Wyda and Phil and the others. That was quite a wierd year but God made it a good one in spite of Barbera Greystapo. May God's peace be upon you all your days. Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Now herb, You aught to know it isn't that hard, just take a shovel and break up about two square feet of earth. Then use a hoe to pound it into smaller pieces. Then take shovel to the center of the plot, shove it in all the way to the top of the blade and push it to the side so you have a little crack in the soil. Then pour a handful of fertilizer in there and close it back up again. Then flip the shovel handle and poke a 6 inch hole 2 inches from the fertilized spot and insert a weiner. (Oscar Mayer works best here) Gently cover the dog with dirt and water about a Del Monte spinach cans worth. It takes about 75 days to the harvest and will continue until the first frost. Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Lightside, About three years back, I was talking to a woman who had been at HQ in the late 80's thru the 90's. We were discussing TWI and got to talking about the times of VP's final days. She mentioned she had befriended a lady who was a cousin of the Wierwille family, who it happens was the last person to see VP alive. During this visit, VP expressed his concern or frustration that he just couldn't figure out what sin he had done in his life that allowed a cancer spirit in to do this to him. I have said before that VP was a true believer in his doctrine. I am talking about how he carried the blood of Jesus and grace so far that if you did not consider sex abuse a sin, it was not a sin. Even if it had to be hidden from those lesser believers who were not spiritually manure ..er,.. mature enough to believe that high. On his deathbed, while searching for some sin he might have done that allowed devils in his life, he did not consider his sex perversions as a possible source. It is amazing how he forgot all the verses about what a leader should be to qualify for his position. Or the ones which say shall we sin that grace may abound, God forbid. How about the ones that say that he who causes his brother to sin is worse than an infidel. Remember all the times VP would exort with all the passion and frustration he could muster; "People, if you could only see the greatness of the freedom you have in Christ." with the implication of how it would so change your life. Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen

Oh My God, we forgot all about the oil; "Le Parfum du Skunque" that was rubbed into Kraigensteins head. :D--> :D--> :D--> Slightly more seriously, I've never seen any evidence of the passing of the skunk pelt to the new president. Giving the Presidency to RosyLie was not done publicly and no mention was made of any ceremonies bestowing any honors other than the presidency to her. I remember a couple times, VP saying in his later years, if he had a chance to do it all over again, he'd give the presidency to someone else. Let them take care of the physical side so he could concentrate on the spiritual side of the ministry. So if Rosy is the physical head but not the spiritual head, then who is? Has anyone heard of the tranfer of the skunk pelt or an anointing in oil du skunque? If not, then who is left? Way II much fun for one man. love ya, Bob Hansen