Fear is terrible and will cause one to come up fighting. TWI will continue to instill fear and back some into corners with their fear tatics. What I have seen here is much like an ole saying my mom used to say to me, " You back anything in a corner and scare him enough he will come out fighting like a wild tiger."
I believe TWI should be realizing what they are doing to people by the drop in the "high elete" The tigers are coming out of the corner!!!
Today, I would pop that mouth I used to listen too.
It is amazing how often the TWIt's misjudge their own power plays. RR & company They either think we are all so loyal or stupid that we will just roll over when they snap their fingers. Funny, because that was not what vpw taught us. He showed us how to stand up straight and not bow down or back up for anyone or anything. I realized that and have started pushing back legally. They BOD is bleeding red ink & people and they still don't understand that people are striking back in the one place that does make a difference. The wallet. It feels so good to be back out of that corner.
.... they either think we are all so loyal or stupid that we will just roll over when they snap their fingers. Funny, because that was not what vpw taught us.
He showed us how to stand up straight and not bow down or back up for anyone or anything.
Yep -- docvic did that, while snapping his fingers telling us to sit, roll-over, or beg.
I looked up the exWay Rev's number 6 to 10 times before making that first exit phone call.
I was more scared than excited. :unsure:
I still cared what family and friends might think, but knew I had to do it.
I read in a book a few years ago, "Feel the fear and do it anyway."
I felt the fear and did it anyway....alone.... without spouse.
But PRAISE GOD he tiptoed outside a few months later and we are relishing the sweet breezes,
ABSOLUTELY relishing!!!!
And that exWay rev? ...I called him almost everyday for two months...sometimes twice or three times a day. He would tell me, "The latter rain will be greater than the first. You wait and see." He was GREAT, never asked anything in return. And he returned my calls EVERY time. We communicate about once a month or so now.
The first day after my "official" exit (telling TWI leadership), I put on a Good Seed vinyl album. I cried because I didn't have to feel guilty for listening to old Way music!! That's ludicrous!!
We had been given the "directive" to not play any old Way music in fellowships. The "heart" was that it might bring up some "memories" for some folks. (WHAT THE "H" IS WRONG WITH MEMORY!!!! ...fear...Fear....FEAR!!!) It was okay to listen to in private though. (I'd listen to it in private and feel I was a hypocrite. Huh...and I guess I was.....but ain't no more........ at least I'm in process of unlearning the damnable habit. :) )
(Now I understand that certain memories can hurt...dang it. Like all of us, I have my fair share. And sometimes we just aren't able to handle 'em yet. And I understand we learn to move on. I understand that...but I don't think that attitude was the "heart" behind TWI's directive. TWI promotes hiding the past in a closet and pretending that it doesn't exist.....just stuff it in drawer somewhere.....of course, until TWI tells you it is okay now to think about it.)
Let the tears of joy flow my sister...and when you play Good Seed...crank it up!
I love the song "Resurrection"...."Because God resurrected Christ His Son..."
Hey, I doubt you remember this. I was one of the "dancers" in the 10th and we performed in the chapel one Sunday to that song. Came skipping down the aisles! Seems like we had scarves or something with us.
hee
BTW: RRII, are you recently out? If so, enjoy the breezes; they are easier to detect away from those corner walls....and enjoy the extra money. :)
Past the care of what family and friends will think and say.
A thought about friends. I cannot tell you the number of times I'd get phone calls/letters/"infomation" about someone who left the "household." After too many of these and the years ticked by I'd think, "Well, there goes someone else I can't talk to." My heart would sink....one more time. PRAISE GOD, He is making sure I'm renewing some of those lost friendships!!!
And, one reason I wouldn't bring "unbeliever" friends to fellowship during M & A is because I would think, "What if they decide not to stand? Then we can't be friends anymore." I'd start to question this logic but I'd been well trained to turn down the volume of love/reason and turn up the volume of justification. Finally the caged tiger couldn't stand it anymore.
Great mind pic SkipC. Anyone hear..can you post a tiger pic?
GRRRRRR GRRRRRRRRRRRR GRRRRRRRRRR GRRRRRRRRRRRR
Great thread dancing. I won't hoard the posts. I'm just thinking about folks still in who might read this ... and as you stated: "I know it's not for everyone....yet." I understand that; I lurked for 1-1/2 to 2 years before the growl awoke the tiger to action.
The heart is pounding so hard with excitment and fear at the same time.
Finally it's enough to take that first step to get out of the way int.
You've been cheated on, lied to, and wronged long enough.
Past the care of what family and friends will think and say.
It's the place of peace that it's the right thing to do.
Not knowing what lies ahead or what will happen behind you.
It's the first step out of the way and it's fear gripping power.
I know it's not for everyone....yet.
Wow - Dancing !!!!! That's what I felt when I left......Great post!...I think I'm safe in saying that's a fairly apt description of what most people go through right before the moment of escape.
....Bagpipes - you can ramble all you want to - yah ain't in dat lil' kingdom anymo - yah free I tells yah - free !!!!!!
Hi all. Just dropping by---I can definitely relate to your poem, dancing. I remember being SO afraid to finally take the steps to leave--and I had been wanting to leave for a year! It's like being up on one of the really tall diving boards. You work your way up the ladder, get to the top and then look down! :blink:
Then you are not sure if you REAALLLYY want to jump/dive after all. You can even logically conclude that everything will be ok-you know how to swim, there's a lifeguard present, and there's water in the pool--but it still doesn't eliminate the fear. But is is sure exhilarating and freeing when you finally go and do it!
Hard to say goodbye explain this not right for you anymore . I don't ever want to hear one of those tapes again. I could say more but the blank store I got back at supermarket when said don.t believe what you teach anymore say it all. This was offshoot group teaching the same lies , life based on fear. The Bear has left and found the Absent Christ missing for so long. My Heart is at last healed , from the hurt of being alone for so long .and all the time GOD and his son Christ were ready to take me back into the true household and away from all the lies we all be taught for so long
I've been perusing one of my journals the last couple days. I ran across a couple entries that brought this thread to mind. The following are excerpts from entries written 4 months before my official leave from TWI. It's been good to read and remember. So much has changed in my life the past 11 months, since leaving TWI. It humbles me greatly.
I write these excerpts unedited, so I am making myself vulnerable here. Please be gentle if anyone decides to comment. I understand that some never experienced heartfelt love in TWI.
I write these excerpts for anyone still involved with TWI who might be lurking and pondering what to do. God hears your heart; He wants your joy full. LISTEN to what He is working inside of you, and then take some steps. He will never leave you nor forsake you.
One journal excerpt:
"I've been very empty. .... Father, where has my joy gone? ... I remain so empty.... Father, PLEASE pull me up and out. I am beginning to feel desparate. My joy is not full. Is it because I continue to fellowship with TWI where my heart is not? I have no joy God. Where has it gone?...."
A second entry excerpt a few days later:
"I write tonight because of a chapter I just read in A Purpose Driven Life.......
Father, I think this is my problem (or at least part of it). I don't have a body with which to fellowship. .....
TWI is no longer the new dynamic church.
What turned me on at my first fellowship? It was the love of God. I felt so loved. I felt the presence of God. There was a chewy caramel center of God's heart. It was real. It was genuine. It was the life and pulse of that home fellowship.
Remember those relationships? I could be myself. I could be honest. I could let down. I have not experienced that in years. It has been years and years and years and years. No wonder I feel lost.
..Purpose... states: 'In real fellowship people experience authenticity. ....genuine, heart-to-heart, sometimes gut-level sharing. ... They share their hurts, reveal their feelings, confess their failures, disclose their doubts, admit their fears, acknowledge their weaknesses, and ask for help and prayer. ...in some churches instead of an atmosphere of honesty and humility, there is pretending, role-playing, politicking, and superficial politeness between shallow conversation. People wear masks, keep their guard up, and act as if everything is rosey in their lives. These attitudes are the death of real fellowship.'
This describes what I am experiencing. .... I have a gaping hole inside. ... No wonder I grieve. No wonder I feel like someone has died. I have died. My root is withered; but there is still a root.
Father, there has to be an answer. But where do I look? God I desperately need your help to know what to do."
"...I've thought back 25 years ago about what I wanted then. At that time I wanted to serve God by serving people. ..... Has TWI become self serving? What does that mean, self-serving?
...The Synonym Finder lists 'self indulgence, egotism, self interests, self aggrandizement, self seeking' and more. ....Purpose.... defines it "Serve to get others to like us or to be admired, or to achieve our own goals. That is manipulation, not ministry. The whole time we're really thinking about ourselves and how noble and wonderful we are.'
Anyway, at one time I followed my heart. ...... Geez, can I go back that far to find my heart again? To continue to abide with TWI because of duty will not last for me.
Am I being self serving by thinking about leaving? Am I being too critical? Can I start being myself not to please others? Do I even know who I am anymore?
I DON'T KNOW MY PLACE GOD!!! I feel like I will be stuck here forever.
.....Follow my passion? Yet I no longer have passion. Think and listen. What do I have passion about?......"
End journal excerpts.
Since officially leaving 11 months ago, I am finding authenticity again, passion again, my heart again. Is life easy? No. But it is rich; there is substance again. There is joy again. Has there been heartache? Yes; but I no longer have to hide it. I can honestly and openly share it...and it is tenderly cared for. I am alive again...as T-bone wrote in the thread about "Emotional Outbursts."
If your lurking and pondering what to do, take heed to your heart.
Hmmm...that old song by Brian Bliss (?) comes to mind: "Somewhere along the line you lost your heart. Together we will find it and give it a brand new start. Somewhere along the way your heart slipped away like a thief in the night. We will find it. Bring it back to life. Love will make it right." (Or something like that.)
Railroader since I am often called RR on this site - was just curious if I said/did something to offend you (yes I am known for that ). Didn't know how to take the second sentence about RR and company....but I sure as heck am not a TWI person and have not been for over 20 years.
Thanks,
Runner
It is amazing how often the TWIt's misjudge their own power plays. RR & company They either think we are all so loyal or stupid that we will just roll over when they snap their fingers. Funny, because that was not what vpw taught us. He showed us how to stand up straight and not bow down or back up for anyone or anything. I realized that and have started pushing back legally. They BOD is bleeding red ink & people and they still don't understand that people are striking back in the one place that does make a difference. The wallet. It feels so good to be back out of that corner.
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skipC
Hi dancing
Fear is terrible and will cause one to come up fighting. TWI will continue to instill fear and back some into corners with their fear tatics. What I have seen here is much like an ole saying my mom used to say to me, " You back anything in a corner and scare him enough he will come out fighting like a wild tiger."
I believe TWI should be realizing what they are doing to people by the drop in the "high elete" The tigers are coming out of the corner!!!
Today, I would pop that mouth I used to listen too.
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coolchef
skip i would love to have the oppertunity to do that
even though i probably would't
lions and tigers and bears
oh my
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railroader II
It is amazing how often the TWIt's misjudge their own power plays. RR & company They either think we are all so loyal or stupid that we will just roll over when they snap their fingers. Funny, because that was not what vpw taught us. He showed us how to stand up straight and not bow down or back up for anyone or anything. I realized that and have started pushing back legally. They BOD is bleeding red ink & people and they still don't understand that people are striking back in the one place that does make a difference. The wallet. It feels so good to be back out of that corner.
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wwjesuslaughat
"Nobody puts Baby in a corner."
Sorry. High on Nyquil; must sleep now.
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dmiller
Yep -- docvic did that, while snapping his fingers telling us to sit, roll-over, or beg.
(My IMO).
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I Love Bagpipes
Gosh Dancing, you stated that well.
I looked up the exWay Rev's number 6 to 10 times before making that first exit phone call.
I was more scared than excited. :unsure:
I still cared what family and friends might think, but knew I had to do it.
I read in a book a few years ago, "Feel the fear and do it anyway."
I felt the fear and did it anyway....alone.... without spouse.
But PRAISE GOD he tiptoed outside a few months later and we are relishing the sweet breezes,
ABSOLUTELY relishing!!!!
And that exWay rev? ...I called him almost everyday for two months...sometimes twice or three times a day. He would tell me, "The latter rain will be greater than the first. You wait and see." He was GREAT, never asked anything in return. And he returned my calls EVERY time. We communicate about once a month or so now.
The first day after my "official" exit (telling TWI leadership), I put on a Good Seed vinyl album. I cried because I didn't have to feel guilty for listening to old Way music!!
That's ludicrous!!
We had been given the "directive" to not play any old Way music in fellowships. The "heart" was that it might bring up some "memories" for some folks. (WHAT THE "H" IS WRONG WITH MEMORY!!!!
...fear...Fear....FEAR!!!) It was okay to listen to in private though. 
(I'd listen to it in private and feel I was a hypocrite. 
Huh...and I guess I was.....but ain't no more....
.... at least I'm in process of unlearning the damnable habit. :) )
(Now I understand that certain memories can hurt...dang it. Like all of us, I have my fair share. And sometimes we just aren't able to handle 'em yet. And I understand we learn to move on. I understand that...but I don't think that attitude was the "heart" behind TWI's directive. TWI promotes hiding the past in a closet and pretending that it doesn't exist.....just stuff it in drawer somewhere.....of course, until TWI tells you it is okay now to think about it.)
Control...control....control....
And hey...this was less than a year ago.
The breezes are sweet outside!
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GrouchoMarxJr
Bagpipes...I admire your courage and empathize with what you are going through...
Let the tears of joy flow my sister...and when you play Good Seed...crank it up!
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I Love Bagpipes
Hey, I doubt you remember this. I was one of the "dancers" in the 10th and we performed in the chapel one Sunday to that song. Came skipping down the aisles! Seems like we had scarves or something with us.
hee
BTW: RRII, are you recently out? If so, enjoy the breezes; they are easier to detect away from those corner walls....and enjoy the extra money. :)
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I Love Bagpipes
A thought about friends. I cannot tell you the number of times I'd get phone calls/letters/"infomation" about someone who left the "household." After too many of these and the years ticked by I'd think, "Well, there goes someone else I can't talk to." My heart would sink....one more time. PRAISE GOD, He is making sure I'm renewing some of those lost friendships!!!
And, one reason I wouldn't bring "unbeliever" friends to fellowship during M & A is because I would think, "What if they decide not to stand? Then we can't be friends anymore." I'd start to question this logic but I'd been well trained to turn down the volume of love/reason and turn up the volume of justification. Finally the caged tiger couldn't stand it anymore.
Great mind pic SkipC. Anyone hear..can you post a tiger pic?
GRRRRRR GRRRRRRRRRRRR GRRRRRRRRRR GRRRRRRRRRRRR
Great thread dancing. I won't hoard the posts. I'm just thinking about folks still in who might read this ... and as you stated: "I know it's not for everyone....yet." I understand that; I lurked for 1-1/2 to 2 years before the growl awoke the tiger to action.
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T-Bone
Wow - Dancing !!!!! That's what I felt when I left......Great post!...I think I'm safe in saying that's a fairly apt description of what most people go through right before the moment of escape.
....Bagpipes - you can ramble all you want to - yah ain't in dat lil' kingdom anymo - yah free I tells yah - free !!!!!!
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dmiller
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I Love Bagpipes
Thanks dmiller!!! :)
I think of that song...hmm..."Eye of the Tiger"?
Yay-aa T bone!!!
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penguin
Hi all. Just dropping by---I can definitely relate to your poem, dancing. I remember being SO afraid to finally take the steps to leave--and I had been wanting to leave for a year! It's like being up on one of the really tall diving boards. You work your way up the ladder, get to the top and then look down! :blink:
Then you are not sure if you REAALLLYY want to jump/dive after all. You can even logically conclude that everything will be ok-you know how to swim, there's a lifeguard present, and there's water in the pool--but it still doesn't eliminate the fear. But is is sure exhilarating and freeing when you finally go and do it!
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andy Bear
Hard to say goodbye explain this not right for you anymore . I don't ever want to hear one of those tapes again. I could say more but the blank store I got back at supermarket when said don.t believe what you teach anymore say it all. This was offshoot group teaching the same lies , life based on fear. The Bear has left and found the Absent Christ missing for so long. My Heart is at last healed , from the hurt of being alone for so long .and all the time GOD and his son Christ were ready to take me back into the true household and away from all the lies we all be taught for so long
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I Love Bagpipes
I've been perusing one of my journals the last couple days. I ran across a couple entries that brought this thread to mind. The following are excerpts from entries written 4 months before my official leave from TWI. It's been good to read and remember. So much has changed in my life the past 11 months, since leaving TWI. It humbles me greatly.
I write these excerpts unedited, so I am making myself vulnerable here. Please be gentle if anyone decides to comment. I understand that some never experienced heartfelt love in TWI.
I write these excerpts for anyone still involved with TWI who might be lurking and pondering what to do. God hears your heart; He wants your joy full. LISTEN to what He is working inside of you, and then take some steps. He will never leave you nor forsake you.
One journal excerpt:
"I've been very empty. .... Father, where has my joy gone? ... I remain so empty.... Father, PLEASE pull me up and out. I am beginning to feel desparate. My joy is not full. Is it because I continue to fellowship with TWI where my heart is not? I have no joy God. Where has it gone?...."
A second entry excerpt a few days later:
"I write tonight because of a chapter I just read in A Purpose Driven Life.......
Father, I think this is my problem (or at least part of it). I don't have a body with which to fellowship. .....
TWI is no longer the new dynamic church.
What turned me on at my first fellowship? It was the love of God. I felt so loved. I felt the presence of God. There was a chewy caramel center of God's heart. It was real. It was genuine. It was the life and pulse of that home fellowship.
Remember those relationships? I could be myself. I could be honest. I could let down. I have not experienced that in years. It has been years and years and years and years. No wonder I feel lost.
..Purpose... states: 'In real fellowship people experience authenticity. ....genuine, heart-to-heart, sometimes gut-level sharing. ... They share their hurts, reveal their feelings, confess their failures, disclose their doubts, admit their fears, acknowledge their weaknesses, and ask for help and prayer. ...in some churches instead of an atmosphere of honesty and humility, there is pretending, role-playing, politicking, and superficial politeness between shallow conversation. People wear masks, keep their guard up, and act as if everything is rosey in their lives. These attitudes are the death of real fellowship.'
This describes what I am experiencing. .... I have a gaping hole inside. ... No wonder I grieve. No wonder I feel like someone has died. I have died. My root is withered; but there is still a root.
Father, there has to be an answer. But where do I look? God I desperately need your help to know what to do."
Continued on next post......
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I Love Bagpipes
Next post continued:
Another journal excerpt a couple weeks later:
"...I've thought back 25 years ago about what I wanted then. At that time I wanted to serve God by serving people. ..... Has TWI become self serving? What does that mean, self-serving?
...The Synonym Finder lists 'self indulgence, egotism, self interests, self aggrandizement, self seeking' and more. ....Purpose.... defines it "Serve to get others to like us or to be admired, or to achieve our own goals. That is manipulation, not ministry. The whole time we're really thinking about ourselves and how noble and wonderful we are.'
Anyway, at one time I followed my heart. ...... Geez, can I go back that far to find my heart again? To continue to abide with TWI because of duty will not last for me.
Am I being self serving by thinking about leaving? Am I being too critical? Can I start being myself not to please others? Do I even know who I am anymore?
I DON'T KNOW MY PLACE GOD!!! I feel like I will be stuck here forever.
.....Follow my passion? Yet I no longer have passion. Think and listen. What do I have passion about?......"
End journal excerpts.
Since officially leaving 11 months ago, I am finding authenticity again, passion again, my heart again. Is life easy? No. But it is rich; there is substance again. There is joy again. Has there been heartache? Yes; but I no longer have to hide it. I can honestly and openly share it...and it is tenderly cared for. I am alive again...as T-bone wrote in the thread about "Emotional Outbursts."
If your lurking and pondering what to do, take heed to your heart.
Hmmm...that old song by Brian Bliss (?) comes to mind: "Somewhere along the line you lost your heart. Together we will find it and give it a brand new start. Somewhere along the way your heart slipped away like a thief in the night. We will find it. Bring it back to life. Love will make it right." (Or something like that.)
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RumRunner
Railroader since I am often called RR on this site - was just curious if I said/did something to offend you (yes I am known for that ). Didn't know how to take the second sentence about RR and company....but I sure as heck am not a TWI person and have not been for over 20 years.
Thanks,
Runner
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rascal
RR = Rosalie Rivenbark
Company= her toadies
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WhiteDove
Hey Bagpipes if you would like an upgrade on your Good Seed from vinal to CD let me know...
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RumRunner
Thanks for the clarification Rascal
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BikerBabe
Don't believe her Rum, it's really ALL your fault!
Hehehehe .. yep, you know where to find me to give me a kick in the *** for that crack. :) Love ya hon.
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