No, Shell, it makes a lot of sense. These days, schools teach kids the basics, reading, writing, arthrimatic, etc., but they DO NOT teach children how to THINK for themselves.
ooos - this was posted by me (Abigail) not Sushi. See, Paw, ya can change the forums, but some things never change - lol
In this case, whether they 'taught her how to think' or not is really irrelevent, as it doesn't take that much thinking to realize that there is something wrong with what she did. I'm sorry, but she can't use the 'I didn't realize what I was doing 'cuz I wasn't larned nuthin' at skool' excuse to get off. :wacko:
I get abi's point, but have to agree with the gentlemen and that was my point when I read the article; I've been following this for a long time.
I just get sick of defendants using anything and everything they can grasp in order to get out of what they are accountable for.
I totally know that childhood is horrible for some and it does indeed carry over into adulthood and really bad choices get made due to the lack of alot of basic core values in the most formative years.
What I want, in cases like this, is for someone to stand up and say "yes I did what you alledge I did. I admit it and I am so very sorry. I'm ready to accept the consequences"
The end, no more, it's over. Be honest and do what has to be done to pay the debt.
Before this young woman was accepted into the armed forces I assume she had to do some psych eval's. Granted they probably weren't top of the line testings.
And given that we are a mess of ex-cult people, we can understand the influence her boyfriend/father of her baby eventually, had on her.
My first born daughter made a decision that was very stupid once and when I spoke with the folks that were making the decisions one of them said 'we understand she lost her father recently, so we're willing to let this pass'
She had indeed lost her father. But long long long before that she was taught the basic manners and behaviors of functioning in our society, regardless of what befalls us in the process of application.
I agree with what all of you said as well. I was simply commenting on the counselor's statement. Yes, as adults we are accountable for our actions, and should be. I was never disputing that.
I agree with what all of you said as well. I was simply commenting on the counselor's statement. Yes, as adults we are accountable for our actions, and should be. I was never disputing that.
Yes, I understood what you were commenting on. And your point is very true.
This is the young woman who is on trial now for the part she played in the prisoner abuse at Abu Ghraib prison.
Abuse??? What abuse??? The inmates of that locale were terrorists. Suppose (for a moment) that Americans were there as prisoners, and these bozos were in charge.
I'm betting you would see much worse photos if that were the case.
A dog leash on a naked man's neck is NOTHING compared to the beheading of a human being.
This trial will be used by the left to demoralize the military and the nation to further undermine our will to see it through in Iraq.
She will be tried in a vacuum. There will be little or no attention paid to the demeanor, behavior or background of the prisoners, which could shed light on the need to "break" them by any means.
I believe the psychological duress of sexual humiliation was employed as a substitute for physical duress. The interrogators probably felt it was more merciful, and possibly more effective too. Whether Abu Ghraib prisoners murdered innocent Iraqis for Saddam, or innocent lives for Al Qaida, they will never know the punishment they truly deserve. It is incumbent upon our military to extract any strategic information they might possess, and by any means necessary.
As it turned out, the interrogations, and the "softening up" process, were carried out by unqualified people who had no or insufficient training. Even so, there was probably more method to the madness than meets the eye. They knew what they were dealing with. Regardless, the inadequacy of Lynndie England and her comrades may partly be the result of turning the armed services into some kind of entitlement program for those near the bottom of society, among them Lynndie.
Nobody wants to defend the indefensible, nor should they, but I hope someone will speak up for whole truth before the trial concludes, and not just the feel-good, civilian condemnation of a few frustrated prison guards and interrogators.
Guilty of one count of conspiracy, four counts of maltreating detainees and one count of committing an indecent act. She was acquitted on a second conspiracy count.
She's looking at a possible nine years in prison, basically for holding a leash, pointing at genitals and being unlucky enough to be caught on camera doing it.
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Sushi
No, Shell, it makes a lot of sense. These days, schools teach kids the basics, reading, writing, arthrimatic, etc., but they DO NOT teach children how to THINK for themselves.
ooos - this was posted by me (Abigail) not Sushi. See, Paw, ya can change the forums, but some things never change - lol
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GarthP2000
Abigail,
In this case, whether they 'taught her how to think' or not is really irrelevent, as it doesn't take that much thinking to realize that there is something wrong with what she did. I'm sorry, but she can't use the 'I didn't realize what I was doing 'cuz I wasn't larned nuthin' at skool' excuse to get off. :wacko:
WHOO HOO! My first post here. :D
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wingnut
I would think her basic problems are of morality and not public schooling. :blink:
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Shellon
I get abi's point, but have to agree with the gentlemen and that was my point when I read the article; I've been following this for a long time.
I just get sick of defendants using anything and everything they can grasp in order to get out of what they are accountable for.
I totally know that childhood is horrible for some and it does indeed carry over into adulthood and really bad choices get made due to the lack of alot of basic core values in the most formative years.
What I want, in cases like this, is for someone to stand up and say "yes I did what you alledge I did. I admit it and I am so very sorry. I'm ready to accept the consequences"
The end, no more, it's over. Be honest and do what has to be done to pay the debt.
Before this young woman was accepted into the armed forces I assume she had to do some psych eval's. Granted they probably weren't top of the line testings.
And given that we are a mess of ex-cult people, we can understand the influence her boyfriend/father of her baby eventually, had on her.
My first born daughter made a decision that was very stupid once and when I spoke with the folks that were making the decisions one of them said 'we understand she lost her father recently, so we're willing to let this pass'
She had indeed lost her father. But long long long before that she was taught the basic manners and behaviors of functioning in our society, regardless of what befalls us in the process of application.
Using her dad's death was an excuse.
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Abigail
I agree with what all of you said as well. I was simply commenting on the counselor's statement. Yes, as adults we are accountable for our actions, and should be. I was never disputing that.
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Shellon
Yes, I understood what you were commenting on. And your point is very true.
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wingnut
Dang Shell! What ya want lawyers to go broke???
I would love to see a lawyer tell their client: "hey you did it, let's go for mercy"
I guy can dream can't he? :unsure:
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Shellon
lol wingie.
In another life I'd have been a litigator.
Beraduca
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Allan
She looks like a lesbian
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GarthP2000
Way to go Allan! Yet More 'Heavenly Wisdom' that heals and delivers --- NOT!!
:wacko:
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dmiller
Abuse??? What abuse??? The inmates of that locale were terrorists. Suppose (for a moment) that Americans were there as prisoners, and these bozos were in charge.
I'm betting you would see much worse photos if that were the case.
A dog leash on a naked man's neck is NOTHING compared to the beheading of a human being.
Now that's abuse.
David
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satori001
This trial will be used by the left to demoralize the military and the nation to further undermine our will to see it through in Iraq.
She will be tried in a vacuum. There will be little or no attention paid to the demeanor, behavior or background of the prisoners, which could shed light on the need to "break" them by any means.
I believe the psychological duress of sexual humiliation was employed as a substitute for physical duress. The interrogators probably felt it was more merciful, and possibly more effective too. Whether Abu Ghraib prisoners murdered innocent Iraqis for Saddam, or innocent lives for Al Qaida, they will never know the punishment they truly deserve. It is incumbent upon our military to extract any strategic information they might possess, and by any means necessary.
As it turned out, the interrogations, and the "softening up" process, were carried out by unqualified people who had no or insufficient training. Even so, there was probably more method to the madness than meets the eye. They knew what they were dealing with. Regardless, the inadequacy of Lynndie England and her comrades may partly be the result of turning the armed services into some kind of entitlement program for those near the bottom of society, among them Lynndie.
Nobody wants to defend the indefensible, nor should they, but I hope someone will speak up for whole truth before the trial concludes, and not just the feel-good, civilian condemnation of a few frustrated prison guards and interrogators.
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Pirate1974
Guilty of one count of conspiracy, four counts of maltreating detainees and one count of committing an indecent act. She was acquitted on a second conspiracy count.
She's looking at a possible nine years in prison, basically for holding a leash, pointing at genitals and being unlucky enough to be caught on camera doing it.
I guess all the goats have been scaped now.
The system works. :wacko:
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Pirate1974
Three years in prison and no evidence that she ever laid so much as one finger on a prisoner.
Justice is served.
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