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Soooo...He used ONE verse from the Amplified Bible, HALF a chapter from the New English Bible and required PFAL '77 students to get some version from the 1800's that has a name so unremarkable you can't remember what it's called or where you store it. Yep, the guy was a bona fide Bible scholar, a genuine research technician if ever I've met one.

From that point of view I agree and that makes sense. Christians are to be ambassadors for Christ and physically represent him in a flesh and blood world. My disagreement came about with the statement "the word of God takes the place of the absent Christ" - that's the issue at hand. That statemtent indicates that Christ is absent in the lives of believers and that void is filled by reading the word or something...

BTW, it's a little embarrassing that we've gone over David, Bath-shebah and Uriah as much as we have, and you STILL maintain the same errors over the accounts.

The difference is, Mike, all of the people you mentioned actually CONFESSED their sins and God was faithful to forgive. Wierwille hid his sins, justified them with scripture, and used the congregation as his sexual playground. But you are ok with that, which basically equates to a tacit agreement that wierwille was ok to have sex with young women from the congregation.

And that is the crux of it - nowhere in the Bible does it say anything takes Christ's place and no place ever is he referred to as absent - which carries the connotation of missing, lacking, not at an expected place, etc.

But it’s obvious we are worlds apart on what we each mean when we say it’s important to get more of God’s Word into our lives. You obviously equate PFAL with God’s Word and the way to get more of that in your life is to review PFAL. But to end my post on a friendlier note - I would be more than happy to give TWI a good recommendation of you - since I honestly think you are very committed to keeping wierwille’s legacy alive. peace out

This is literally the stated premise of one of the foundational class sessions. (Please don't ask me to dig out my syllabus to give a reference, I just ate breakfast.)

You don't wnat to discuss it because the truth is too ugly. wierwille is held to a higher standard because he was a leader in the church. Once you take that job then your behavior is to eximplify and overflow Christs fullness and love. I don't quite see that with ole vic and his sexual predations where he counseled his victims to just keep it the adulterous affair in the lockbox so they didn't cause anyone else to stumble. And he stole intellectual property, was a drunk...and so on. That's not just looking at someone's old nature that's bringing to light what the way international has spent millions to hide. Theres a difference. I find it amusing though that the greatest believer since the apostle paul, victor wierwille, the man who was second to none according to himself, the man that God almighty chose to bring hidden light to our day and time....the greatest man of God to walk the earth darn near since Jesus Christ....I find it amusing that you hold him to such a low standard when it comes to sin. He was the greatest unless his sinful ways are exposed and then well...ahh...it's just his old man nature. When leadership in the Church sin and sin against the congregation they should confess the sins publicly to the congregation and come clean to the point of using their old sins to help relate to people struggling with the same problems....but your idol never did that...yeah that would actually be wierwille being the man he knew to be. He knew he was wrong and did nothing about it until he regretted it on his deathbed.

I think, every once in a while, it benefits the new people to see Mike. After all, they can see us, all having gotten on with our lives without vpw, twi, etc. Without Mike, there's no concrete example of what happens when you just put vpw and pfal in your brain and nothing else. Instead of being able to have an intelligent conversation with us about any of hundreds of topics, all Mike can do is his geek show- talk around things for pages and pages and claim he doesn't have time to post one clear paragraph, hint he knows something special but won't show anyone the special candy until they get in the van, etc. If nothing else, Mike's posts are very uplifting. After all, even the most wounded posters here can arrive, trying to understand how to rebuild their life in a healthy manner. Then they can see that their situation could be a lot worse- they could be forever doubling-down on the imaginary specialness of vpw, the imaginary specialness of pfal, the imaginary specialness of twi....... They've already come so far, and so, they can see they have indeed begun their recovery without having hit rock bottom. After all, rock bottom's here and posting!

Well, for me at least, I have dissected almost every major TWI doctrine both Biblically and historically. I've found that some things with TWI stand - I mean it can't all be based on lies although a little leaven leavens the entire lump. I have tossed a lot of TWI doctrines because they simply aren't true. Christians should tithe, law of believing, administrations, etc. I am a more comitted Christian than I have ever been but that's because my faith is in Christ and God Almighty and not a 501-c3 with a self appointed MOGFODAT. Also would like to say that tossing the fundamentalist glasses I used to wear helped immensely - that and understand how the Bible came into existance. And let me say this - MIKE - I HAVE gone through PFAL and wierwilles other writings with a fine tooth comb. They all fail on several factors that have been discussed on GSC ad nauseum.