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Back in the late-90s, when a dozen or so of us were beating feet away from John and his shipwrecks, it seemed to us that John's main problem was that he believed his own hype. In Biblical terms, "in his own eyes he flatters himself too much to detect or hate his sin." Proverbs 36:2 NIV. Not only can he NOT tell if he's right or wrong, he can't even care. Love, Steve

Thousands. You realize he HAS to be counting people who have fled from him, CES, STFI, TTYL, LOL and whatever other acronyms they've conjured up since then, right? He's counting me. I'm an atheist now. He's probably counting Steve L. He's probably counting Tzaia. He's counting the thanks, and ignoring what happened later. You know, the results. In my view, the inability of TWI offshoots, all taught the same principles at the same time by the same people using the same source material, to cohere on doctrine after leaving TWI is evidence that the task itself is flawed. Either the principles are no good or the source material isn't. (Or both, as I see it). You can't cohere on doctrine after TWI anymore than hundreds of denominations had been able to before TWI. At some point you have to realize there IS no baby in the bathwater.

DWBH: Mind if I go into your post and add some paragraph breaks for easier reading?