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  1. 6 points
    How presumptuous of "them." "Our days are too precious to squander on the negatives." "Thank God, Paul did not spend time engaging in word battles about concerns that were decades old." First of all, they have NO idea how I (we) have spent our days (years) since exiting twi. Some here, left around 1987......others of us in the 1990s, and some left around 2008. Ten years, twenty years, thirty years..........they have NO clue as to what we've done to rebuild our lives, help our families, ministered to others, and helped our communities. THEY LIVE IN A BOX..... a box that wierwille built. They think that "living the Word" is regurgitating stolen pfal material at every meeting and doing those deadpan manifestations. They have accepted wierwille's deceptive lies........WITHOUT a thorough, critical examination of them from a-z. And yet, they scoff at those of us who do. Of course, they balk at our time spent here at GSC........ we've called them out for their hypocrisy, arrogance and manner of life. Some of them have spent 45-50 years in a cult ....... and refuse to come clean. So, they hide. They hide by mocking our "word battles." They hide by staying in the shadows. They hide by silence. So now....... they attempt to re-build (cough, cough) ANOTHER cult in the image of the mother cult. Same structure, same centralization, same teachings, same manifestations, etc...... only this time it will be genuine. LOL. What's that Einstein meaning of insanity? Doing the SAME THING over and over expecting different results. Moneyhands, Forts, Horneys......... ALL ex-corpse coordinators who were in charge of the clone factories, ie the corps "training." Sheesh. What a damn, pathetic ploy it was..... and they played right into it. If they had an ounce of critical thinking, then they'd realize that we are speaking the truth here at GSC. They have wasted DECADES trying to mimic the wizard behind the curtain......and smirk at those of us who've engaged in real, honest discussions to undo the burdens and set the captives free. How presumptuous of them to define how I spend my time. Heck, after this post......I will spend the rest of my day doing other things!! They know not of what they speak. And notice, that only that certain "designators" of THEIR group will respond to your questions. What a pathetic, defensive response to your questions. They will not engage, because it amplifies THEIR decades of cult-servitude that does not, and did not, honor God. That's why they put up a shield of defense. Maybe they'll figure it out some day.......or maybe they won't.
  2. 6 points
    Was idly thinking this evening about the internet, perhaps triggered by the disclosures about Facebook. Had the internet been around when many posters here became enmeshed with TWI - they would have checked it out first. Had the net been widely available when I got enmeshed - again, I'd've checked it out first. Today's potential victims, likely mostly young people, have great opportunity to check TWI out first. Maybe they went along to a couple of fellowships with their mates, but decided to check out the organization before they got more involved. Well, well! When I was (in my ignorance) planning to crawl back to TWI, I googled them and the first site up was - GreaseSpot Cafe! And so it still may be, for random people googling TWI, depending on how they phrase their enquiry. BUT, at least with Google, there's lots of other potential or similar sites listed, both after the main site and at the bottom of the first page. TWI's own boring, very static, site appears high in the list - closely followed by a few anti-TWI sites. We who have been here for a long time know how much GSC has helped us, and most of us remain so that we can help others too. What we can't know is how many people have encountered GSC, had a quick look, and zoomed off the other way. They've never been "helped" by having to de-tox here, because they never got "toxed" in the first place. Good for them, I say!
  3. 5 points
    Hey, Moynihan............... If wierwille had lived longer........maybe we would have seen him led away in handcuffs (like Harvey Weinstein).
  4. 5 points
    Regarding cognitive dissonance - while in the process of extricating myself from TWI in 1988, I experienced a strange process going on in my mind. I was starting to think original thoughts - thoughts that were contrary to my TWI programmed thoughts. Sometimes I would hear Craig yelling against my thoughts, yelling things I had heard at mealtimes in residence. So I did the thing with the line down the middle of the page. Left side - my thought, right side - TWI rebuttal. Back and forth, back and forth. Like having two brains. As time went by, my own thoughts predominated and the yelling rebuttals receded. Many years later, my brain belongs to me. And TWI is a distant far off strange thing I was in....... the farther back in time it gets, the stranger it seems.
  5. 5 points
    An interesting thing about The Way International is its symbiotic arrangement - where you have two different lifestyles mingling and interacting by the members of the group: 1. There is the Christian lifestyle where one professes a belief in Jesus Christ and follows a religion based on His life and teachings. 2. A destructive cult (please refer to the subcategory of “destructive cult” on Wikipedia) follows a certain agenda to the benefit of the cult leaders and to the detriment of the followers. The destructive cult is also parasitic when paired with a religion. It uses and feeds off the life and energy of the religion...the religion is a means to an end and not the end itself. This symbiotic arrangement is invisible, of course - and often it depends on the individual as far as which one of the two lifestyles…eclipses…dominates…overrides the other. == == == == Folks are usually not attracted to a destructive cult. In my case with TWI, I was attracted to what they said I could learn about Jesus Christ and increasing the power of God in my life – so I enrolled in the PFAL class. If you stick around for a while and aspire to achieve any personal goals or some level of service – I believe you will come to many crossroads in your journey. These crossroads are like an intersection – where the Christian lifestyle and the destructive cult “meet” - where a crucial decision has to be made. Do you take the direction of a Christ-centered-faith or do you follow TWI’s direction which only furthers their agenda? == == == == There are always moral dilemmas in life – and I think the decisions we make and the actions we take reveals so much about our character…and keep in mind how this all plays out on an individual basis and in different ways. I could be torn between wanting to give $100 to someone I know who really needs it – or give that to The Way International who reminds me that is part of my abundant sharing and putting God first. I knew lots of good honest folks when I was in TWI. But I also came across some real a$$holes too. And I don’t mean folks with an irksome personality. I mean folks who were really into lording it over others, of using “for the sake of God’s ministry” as a cloak for excusing their dishonesty in business practices (I was burned a time or two) - where "doing the right thing" to resolve an offense or right a wrong really just amounts to sweeping it under the carpet so as not to give the ministry a bad name.. ...it's applying a fresh coat of white paint to the sepulcher of hypocrisy. == == == == You said “But I have read and heard accounts of others about how controlling and mentally devastating it can be. Just look at what many of you have shared here on GSC.” Yeah, I think that’s the voices of the good honest folks who left TWI. The type of so called Christians who rip others off, who are self-serving as in Matthew 18 and in II Peter 2 do NOT post at Grease Spot… I don’t think it’s a matter of “It takes learning. But if that learning isn't correct, and one has nothing to compare it to except even more incorrect doctrine” as you have stated – I believe it is simpler and deeper than that. It’s really about the type of person you are to begin with. Do you have the moral fiber to do what is right no matter the circumstances, or what your shrinking pocketbook or “evil overlord” is telling you to do? You said: “That was what my feeble attempt was of bringing up Paul. He actually believed he was doing the right thing.” I think Paul was an honest man – even before his conversion – he once said before a religious council he had lived his whole life in good conscience see Acts 23 though he was "before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief" I Timothy 1:13 With religious zeal to spare Philippians 3:6 ...after his conversion he then made decisions based on his Christ-centered-faith. Paul of course did not have the New Testament documents to give him explicit directions on how to live the Christian life; but he did have the living Christ in his heart to first help him re-interpret the Old Testament documents in light of Jesus Christ being its fulfillment...and later inspiring him to write some of the New Testament documents as well. Perhaps if we go by a simple idea – that actions speak louder than words (even the words of the Bible, that some folks like to use to obfuscate the issues) – then what folks actually do reveals a whole lot more about their character – you said: “give them a chance to prove they have had a change of heart and mind” – they’ve had their chance for a long time now - I think the proof is in the pudding.
  6. 5 points
    Started in London in response to fears of locals in Brixton about knife crime. Has since widely expanded, both in remit and location. There are around 300 groups in Britain, some in Trinidad, some in Australia - in fact, in 7 countries including 3 teams in the USA (Chico, California; Bangor and Portland, Maine). In my city, we get heaps of people rushing up to hug us and to thank us for looking out for them. Homeless people know we don't judge, but offer kind words, a hot drink, and blankets etc in cold weather. Sometimes, homeless people tell us about someone (not usually a homeless person) whom they've noticed huddled in a doorway or alley, that they are concerned about. Parents are thankful we get their very drunk kids home safely. Security staff throw drunks out but then call us to ensure the drunks are warm and safe. Our universities have gained a good reputation as being in a safe city. The homosexual community welcomes us and some of them love to talk - they often have had horrendous times in churches. And EVERYONE knows we are volunteers - and volunteer CHRISTIANS. Our actions are a much better way of witnessing than door knocking!!!
  7. 4 points
    The title may sound crazy but it’s true. At the time I was introduced to TWI I was in to drugs and alcohol. I was using speed to wake up in the morning and downers chased with whiskey to sleep at night. I grew up in church but I saw no power there. It was more of a social gathering. I was only 23 but the drugs and alcohol were beginning to affect my heart’s rhythm. I knew I needed God in my life but didn’t know where to look. Then there was a knock on my apartment door. There stood two WOW ambassadors who had just moved into my apartment complex. I went to Twig a few times but my roommate and I had a disagreement and we both moved out. I moved back home but eventually was contacted by a Corps member and invited to twig run by MW. MW to me was an amazing teacher. We would go so deep into the Word. This was the first time I’d ever heard anything about Greek words. We talked much about SIT. I wanted that so much and never had to wait until the end of PFAL class. I wanted to go in the Way Corps. I wanted to learn and serve with my whole heart, so to get there I went WOW to Chicago in 79/80. And here is where TWI saved my life. It got me away from all the friends and influences in my life that were killing me and gave me the time to become solidly implanted in the Word. I went in residence with the 12th Corps at Emporia. I loved the experiences and have many good memories of the times with my brothers and sisters. I was assigned was a WOW family coordinator in the Oklahoma City area 81/82. I had no idea of the pain and depression that was coming my way. The first member of my WOW family left the field within two months. Another left 3 months after that. We never ran one PFAL class. I was so beat up than when a member of our twig took an interest to me I fell to the temptation. About the time to return for final year she came up pregnant. I would not go back. It wasn’t right in my heart and mind to do this to someone. I stayed in OKC and eventually married her. We had a beautiful little girl and a son 3 years later. Sadly we divorced not long after he was born. God does have a plan for our lives. There story behind how my present wife and I reconnected is good example of that, but that is a story for a later time. But she had 3 kids and I had my 2 when we married and now we have them and their spouses and 10 grandkids. Most of my kids are involved with missions work, solid in the Word of God. I have been abundantly blessed. I am happy I missed the LCM years at the helm of TWI. I know so many were hurt so badly. Even when I was in the Corps I heard accusations about sexual promiscuity from the leadership although I never witnessed anything. I suppose I was too busy working on the lawnmowers or guarding VPW’s airplane to see any of that. I was an unremarkable Schmoo that helped put money in VPW’s bank account, but to this day I would not want anything I experienced to be any different. The Lord through TWI saved my life , put my feet solidly in the Word of God to the point I have an earned Masters of Divinity, have been a college age pastor and now continue actively in ministry to older folks. This is something I’ve wanted to talk about for 40 years. It has taken the invention of the internet to allow it to happen.
  8. 4 points
    The splinter groups will continue to market the wierwille mystique and his legacy..........to bring notoriety to their doorstep and money to their coffers. Wierwille was a showman and a storyteller. He trafficked in deception and exploiting others thru the subtle power of spiritual abuse. He traveled up and down the highways searching for the new shtick that would arrest the public's curiosity and attention.......wherein, he could run full-throttle with his narcissism. From retreats to seminars to camps farthest out, wierwille was intently looking for a pyramid of his own making. The youth had the time, and zeal, to make things happen. And, when the youth leaders [Way West / Way East] surged forward with throngs of people, wierwille walked into those meetings and power-grabbed their movements for himself. The revisionist history that accompanied his "God-ordained greatness" was a slick ploy to build this mystique of "the man of God." Yet, in reality.......Wierwille's legacy is one of stealing, exploiting, and destroying others for his own opportunity. Splinter groups need to keep the wierwille-mystique in place........thus, they will not abandon him, nor will they come to GSC and step into the area of open discussions on the matter. Mystique only plays well in shades of grey.......not in open sunlight.
  9. 4 points
    I ( personally ) have found 'believing' to work. It's actually believing IN believing...and then taking up the necessary 'works' to hook up to your faith. As a side note, my wife and I were told ( by leadership in the R&R movement ) that when we left the way our kids would grow up to be homos. 20 years later we have 7 grand children
  10. 4 points
    Mr I'm-the-super-believer wierwille was supposed to be Par Excellence for the so-called "law" of believing, the "law" that has failed so many people, so many times. Supposedly, his believing was the Top Tier on the planet, so it should have been a piece of cake for him to believe for more years. Instead, he died too young. In his final hours, he was STILL the captive of his own teaching- he was literally trying to figure out what was blocking his ability to believe for his own healing. Even as death approached, he wouldn't, or couldn't, be honest with himself. You don't have a "prison" of your own making, in your mind. You do, however, have a "prison" that HE made. Step outside of it. The entire "Word-Faith" thing has shown to be toxic. When people suffer, the "Word-Faith" people are REQUIRED to blame them, kicking a man when he's down. Miserable comforters blaming those suffering are as old as the book of Job. They were wrong then and they're wrong now.
  11. 4 points
    "And if you ever want to talk, if you every want to do anything, we're here." In other words, YOU come to us. We are not going to find you (and apologise). No, Jacque. YOU come here, you apologise. You will get a lot of flack. But you might find a little forgiveness or compassion, too, IF if if you are humble enough. You will need to LISTEN and not to (pretend to) preach.
  12. 4 points
    What I think is so amazing is how these people thought it was okay not only to expel people (at will) from various programs, but to order them out of the state or the town. And the victims complied! This, to people who may have given up good jobs, sold property at a loss, moved hundreds of miles (if not to say, moved from another country), disrupted children's education, etc - probably having become alienated from their family and friends who would form a support group - and it's okay to tell people who have demonstrated so significantly their commitment to the cause, that they've gotta be out of town in a few hours. Talk about a power imbalance - "leadership" exercised unfettered "rights" and the victims were so bullied and weakened that they were unable to resist. All because they were being "obedient to God." Grr! It's easy to see to whom such leadership had demonstrated so significantly their commitment - to the one who steals, kills and destroys. God might have a few things to say to such bullies about obedience and meekness.
  13. 4 points
    Hi Greasespotters! Allow me to clue you in on a FACT: dictor Paul couldn’t write his way through high school! At his very best, he was capable of writing at an 8th grade level. Remember all those times he talked about his older sisters Sevilla and Lydia, “reading him the riot act” about his horrible school performance?? He bragged about it all the time in a blatant attempt to cover-up the FACT that he was flunking out of high school by the 9th grade. As a matter of fact, the principal had considered not allowing him to return for 10th grade unless his parents could control his behavior. Ya see, dic was known as the town bully, the NK Biff of Back To The Future fame. Everybody else was Marty McFly! He would speed through town on his motorcycle doing tricks and making lots of noise, intimidating pedestrians and being an all around annoying idiot. Sevilla and Lydia were often credited with “straightening me [dictor] out”, thereby preparing him for his earth shatteringly scholarly and revelatory career as the “greatest MOG since The Apostle Paul”! Dic pulled himself together enough to graduate with a low C grade average, and with a lengthy letter of excuses from Dr. Kunst, the local minister at the Evangelical and Reformed Church in NK (and graduate of Lakeland himself), and lots of $$ from papa Adolph, dic managed to slip his way into the world renowned Lakeland Mission House College in Sheboygan, WI! There, he invented the hook shot in basketball, never played professional basketball, secretly married his hometown sweetheart, and barged his way through Mission House like John Blutarski did through Faber College in Animal House! LOL! ALL the early books “written” by dic prior to JCING were transcribed from teachings dic gave on Sunday nights, church study nights in Van Wert, “Spiritual 40 Club” events, and Chimes Hour Youth Caravan broadcasts. ALL OF THEM! I mentioned that dic at his most eloquent with a pen, rose to an average 8th grade level, so writing anything coherent, credible, and scholarly, was absolutely out of the question. So, the great teacher recorded everything he taught and would have Rhoda, then eventually, Donna Randall, Bernita Jess, and Peter J. Wade, along with David Anderson, to transcribe every teaching dic wanted included in his “package” of plagiarized platitudes and “research”. So, once J.E. Stiles, the real author of RTHST, led him into tongues, and dic bought Stiles’ book, “Receiving The Holy Spirit”, and used it to teach his new research on the “gift of tongues”, dic got on a roll. J.E. made it easy. He had already written the book! The next step was taking B.G.’s “The Gifts of the Spirit” class up in Canada. Dictor took it the first time by himself, alone, basically barging his way into the opening session late, while BG was playing his violin before starting. Vic got home and immediately started teaching Dottie, Donnie, Karen, Mal and Jan George, and a few others. Then, the next summer, dic dragged Dotsie and Donnie with him to Canada and they took the class. That was the last time Vic credited BG with ANYTHING in TWI. BG had a big syllabus with tons of scripture references and his definitions of the 9 “gifts”, “keys to walking in the spirit”, the various names of devil spirits, “current” and in the Bible with every single bible record used in dic’s Advanced Class along with the teaching notes Dotsie, and Donnie took. Many parts of that syllabus became the syllabus for “Interpretation of Toungues and Prophecy” (TIP, & INT class) and The Advanced class, plagiarized literally verbatim. Dic was teaching his own “Power For Abundant Living” classes now. Mimeographed limited syllabi and 3 hour sessions. As he was used to since Chimes Hour Youth Caravan, he had everything recorded, and then Rhoda would transcribe all the tapes. Then, she and Dotsie, and Karen would edit for spelling and coherence, and dictor would determine the content. Later, as people with greater technical and intellectual abilities came along, (Donna Randall, Peter Wade, Walter Cummins, David Anderson, Bernita Jess, Ken Klug, John Somerville, Bishop Pillai, Lamsa) more textual and MS evidence was brought to the fore and given the thumbs up or down by dic. Again, everything recorded and transcribed! This is how the orange book, the blue book, the green book, and the PFAL book itself were written. When I first took the class, there were no books! There was the syllabus, Christians Should Be Propsperous in booklet form, Are The Dead Alive Now (also softback), Studies in Human Suffering (on the Book of Job) and 56 separate little pamphlets called “the collaterals”, which were eventually compiled into the first three volumes of the “Studies In Abundant Living” volumes, blue, green, and orange. During my first in-Rez year with the 4th corpse, dic held numerous research nights in the BRC with corpse and the research dept staff, which at that time was Walter Cummins, Donna Randall, Bernita Jess, and dictor as the head cheese and chief revelatory, to work on the final edition of the new JCING. Everybody was allowed to offer their thoughts, opinions, scriptural references, questions, counterpoints. They lasted 3-4 hours with a 1/2 hr break in the middle. They were really fun. But, the final writing was done as it had always been done since Van Wert. That’s why people notice the big difference in all the published works AFTER JCING. JCOP was the first book that was NOT based solely on transcripts of dic’s teachings. As a matter of fact, the body of the contents as well as the vast majority of it were NOT contributed by dictor at all! I can honestly say that the only thing dictor wrote in that book was the dedication! LOL! That’s enough for now. I know there’s a thread somewhere in which Penworks and I basically describe dictor’s “research” and “writing” techniques and prowess. Can’t remember the name of it, or when it was. But, IIRC, it pretty much covers the entire process of “writing” piffle and TWIt books. It might also be called “The Way: Living in Lies”! Or, “How To Plagiarize Your Way To Financial Independence: Building A Fundamentalist Cult”. LOL!................peace y’all!
  14. 4 points
    Hi Taxidev! You posted this: “As I indicated earlier, I have no idea what it's like to live through this level of atrocities. I just pray that you can all become peaceful about it, whether you actually forgive them or not. At least to have peace in yourselves.” Why TY Taxidev. Don’t pray for my peace! In the words of a dear old friend of mine from the 4th Corpse who is no longer living, “I got Peace like a river! Like a river baby!” You sound like one of the 2 responders you quoted on an earlier post. LOL! I was “peaceful about it” the instant I turned off of wierwille road onto Highway 29 and got the hell outta there on December 14, 1986! And, my peace has grown greater DAILY since then regardless of what “trials and tribulations” I may have undergone since that day. That is true partly because, DAILY I KNOW WITHOUT ANY DOUBT, that I did the “rightest” thing I ever did in my life for Jesus Christ. The ones you need to pray for are the anti-Christ pimps, whose “virtues” you seem to extol. First, pray they stop LYING and genuinely REPENT before God, Jesus Christ, and the Church, AFTER they have apologized to and sought forgiveness from their VICTIMS. VICTIMS!! Victims of TWIt “clergy”! Do YOU get that? Or, are you too busy praying for my peacefulness? I’LL FORGIVE THEM WHEN THEY HONESTLY REPENT! THEY HAVE YET TO DO SO! Do you get that Taxidev?? This has never been about vindictiveness Taxidev. This has ALWAYS been about JUSTICE! God’s justice, and HE IS THE GOD OF JUSTICE! I just pray that YOU can see beyond their seared consciences and the fair words and fancy speeches they dump all over those they lie in wait to deceive, whether YOU actually believe them or not. At least to understand GOD’S JUSTICE! Maybe that will open YOUR eyes to their habitual hubris, lies, and rule of injustice? At least to have a sense of what God’s Justice means. We’ll see, Taxidev.....we’ll see. Meanwhile, please don’t waste any more of your prayer time for me. I got peace like a river baby!!!..................peace.
  15. 4 points
    Yeah.............totally predictable. Self-appointed sleaze.........that want to sit on an elevated perch and rule over others. They just quit pimping for the twit-cult....and wanted to start their own action, in another neighborhood. Good riddance. That's why that R&R thread is SO, DAMN INSTRUCTIVE........."meet the new boss, same as the old boss." LOL
  16. 4 points
    A bit off topic now, given the (predictable) way this thread has gone, but I'm out tonight, beating the feet on the streets from about 9.30pm to about 3.30am. You folks here will easily be awake in those hours, given the time differences. So, if you think of it, please pray for -- the safety of our team and city (and the other teams out within the UK); the wisdom for us to deal with whatever we encounter; and for our tongues to speak words of peace and blessing to those we encounter. We as a team know we'll have a good time in each others' company.
  17. 4 points
    I read somewhere here, from Penworks I think, that for those who've been in a cult, it takes about twice the time you were in to recover properly from the damage. So if you were in for 10 years, you'd be recovering for 20. I don't know at what point one can say that recovery is "complete"; maybe sooner for others, maybe perhaps never for a few . A lot will depend on why one is no longer with the cult, and also what counter-information is available. For ex-Wayfers, if people have found GSC, or some other anti-Way site, then once they can accept what they read, their recovery will speed up. But first, they have to get to the point of accepting what they read. If they try to ease out of their cult-thinking by joining other like "splinter" groups, it may be a slower process. (Worse yet if they want to start their own group, as so many ex-Wayfers do.) But an ease-exit by joining a splinter may help; it helped me a little, and because I felt free to challenge (having become immersed in GSC), it became very helpful to see Way thinking for what it is. The R&R bunch can recover - if they want to. Their minds aren't seared with a hot iron, more like buried under a vast quantity of concrete.
  18. 4 points
    AOS has to be one of the great highlights of TWI’s hypocrisy...the production was to reveal the wiles of the devil and how a believer can be strong and stand up against all the deceptions and temptations...meanwhile the “star of the show” believer boy (craig) is boinking the “wrong seed” chick...oh no, Obi-Wan we lost another to the dark side!
  19. 4 points
    Hey Mike: Don’t flatter yourself with your fantasy that I am your “opponent” in some grand “debate”. I am NOT your opponent. I feel deep sorrow and pity for you, not opposition. I have already told you, again, way back on page 11, that trying to engage you in a serious discussion about anything TWIt’n’Dic is like administering medicine to the dead. ALL your “research”, “manifestos”, “statements”, “theses”, “TVTs”, “discussions” of 40-50 years ago, “learning” from Popular Science and Popular Mechanics, lie detector “experts”, quotes from “old grads”, your “theories” (e.g. “the pure evil theory” etc.), transcripts from 53 year old SNS tapes, quotes from piffle, elena’s post-sex book about dictor paul and his drunken bullshit hustle to get into her hippie underpants, revisionist wierwille-worshipping tripe, revisionist B.G., Stiles, Kenyon, Bullinger stohrees, quotes from various syllabi and lullabies, and overt lying, dealing one unicorn fantasy after another from your never ending shue of bullshit, is totally self-absorbed and IRRATIONAL. Irrational, as in illogical, unreasonable, insane. I for one, really wish the good-hearted GSCers here trying to dialogue reasonably with you would simply stop doing so. Go down to Doctrinal and pontificate your “ancient”, “overlooked” garbage there. No one should bother answering you any where else, as it leads to an incredible waste of byte-space which YOU don’t pay for! The members and Paw pay for it. Stop wasting our money and bytespace outside of doctrinal. I implore my fellow GSCers to refrain from posting to Mike or responding to him anywhere but in the Doctrinal Forums. Then, folks who really want to keep dealing with Mike’s illnesses publicly know exactly where to find him, newbies don’t have to read his garbage in Open, Way Int’l, or Offshoots Forums, and we need only see it if we choose to. Saves everyone a helluva lot of time and agita! So Mike......this will be THE last post from me to or about YOU anywhere at the GSC outside of Doctrinal Forums. I’m old enough to spot irrational bullshit, psychiatric pathologies, and insane behavior, to know I’ve had my fill of them for this lifetime. This is no ad hominem attack Mikey. This is simply a fact-filled, reasonable assessment of your mental state as evidenced by your rambling, nearly incoherent “essays”, along with your erratic and annoying posting behavior. You’re a gentle soul. Thanks for keeping yourself in Doctrinal. Happy Resurrection Day. See ya in Doctrinal only. No more “BeHappy troops” up here. Bye now.
  20. 4 points
    Mike, what are you talking about?? I think there is a lot of "good," here at the GSC. For example, if you go back, and read the threads, many people have revealed the real TWI, not the one in your imagination. Ask Sky, and DWBH. They have written extensively about TWI, under VPW, and LCM. Also, Twinky, and T-Bone, have written about their time in The Corps. Rocky, also has written about his experiences in Way World. I find most of the people who come here, speak the truth about TWI, as honestly as possible. I know I do. I had some good experiences in TWI, and some unpleasant ones. What people here discourage is Bullsheet; people have gently, and sometimes, not so gently, let me know when I am off the mark. I think most of the people who post here, are kind, patient souls, but they can "separate truth from error," in a nanosecond. If you don't want to read negative posts, be more circumspect in what you post.
  21. 4 points
    Just for the record - I’ve mentioned this before - the definition for “hard hitting” as often associated with tough journalists who do their job - is uncompromisingly direct and honest, especially in revealing unpalatable facts...so forgive me if I don’t consider your dodging and relentless promotion of a charlatan like wierwille as “hard hitting”...and honestly in my humble opinion that’s about as hard hitting as a wet noodle Especially when you often display a flair for distorting facts or simply re-imagining an “alternate truth or facts, or history” - revisionist style ! . and I find this odd too - when you said - “I've been at this a very long time, I was lucky to get a LOT of facts that none knew here, and I was sheltered from a lot of the BS of the Corps.” I tend to think the stories, incidents, facts as told by former corps, staff, WOWs, etc on Grease Spot are truly hard hitting - they reveal the dark underbelly of the charlatan ! so I’m not sure if that is the BS you’re talking about?
  22. 4 points
    Thanks DWBH.... Yes, TWIt and its offshoots hate this site. None of them have a site where open thought, discussion and questions are in public view. And lately, here at GSC......there has been many new posters coming to this site. Some are second generation kids who were raised in twi and are now grappling with the aftermath of this evolving cult that has consumed their wayfaring parents and relatives. Adding to this complexity are the dozens upon dozens of offshoots with their books and classes claiming that THEY hold the spiritual mantle of truth. Stop the merry-go-round.........and let's take a walk. In the late 60's, several factors emerged that contributed to the rise of cult leaders and those attracted to cults (lifestyle and doctrine). The socio-dynamic of church involvement was changing rapidly. The counterculture of the 60s was a diaspora into the '70s. Technology was advancing......pfal filmed on 16mm, then VHS-format Displaced youth.......searching for meaning, acceptance, belonging Note: One generation of displaced youth propelled twi forward to the cult that it is today. Wierwille cut ties with his Van Wert Church in 1957.......to follow in the steps of many elders, and contemporaries, who traveled across the country teaching at retreats and church-related seminars. Some of the men on this list and the year that wierwille encountered them: E. Stanley Jones (1944), Rufus Moseley (1946), Perry Hayden (1946), Glenn Clark (1948), J.E. Stiles (1951), Starr Daily (1952), and B.G. Leonard (1953). For thirteen (13) years, wierwille was taking notes and gleaning from their ministries......all while he was on Van Wert Church payroll. And, it seems apparent........that Leonard's foundational class in 1953 is what spurred the impetus of wierwille to, finally, break from the denominational structure. From 1958-1967, wierwille taught live pfal classes and Mal George helped teach a handful of them. Going into their tenth year........and the results were miniscule. Nearly 80% of students from all those classes never committed to The Way, Inc. The strategy of reaching church-people "with the word" was a bust......wierwille's independent undertaking was barely paying the bills. And, the BRC was a non-descript rural building with no church bells or steeple........and very few people. So, wierwille threw caution to the wind in 1967.......and stared into intense, glaring lights to teach and film a 36-hour class. Strapped for cash, time and "borrowed" furniture, wierwille was under immense pressure to get this class filmed in an allotted time frame. Crazy as all this was......the confluence of technology, the counterculture hippie movement, and displaced youth provided a wave of interest, excitement and involvement to wierwille's rogue underpinnings. Youth leaders and guitar singers bridged the gap between homiletics and hippies........and the displaced youth soon found a place in an Ohio commune. Note: One generation of youth leaders and guitar singers bridged the gap between homiletics, hippies and holy spirit. Wierwille NEEDED the youth far more than they needed him or his teachings. He exploited their involvement and their vulnerabilities. Many young leaders came and left.......but their zealous involvement and connections brought waves upon waves of other displaced youth longing for belonging. And, even though the zero corps was shut down....... those corps from 1-5 went forward with ten years of solid commitment......AND THAT CHANGED EVERYTHING. In their zeal, WOWs beget more WOWs......and corps beget more corps. The *youth factor* was the driving force of the movement.......not wierwille. And, those early years (1968-1974) at headquarters would infiltrate the minds of scores upon scores of corps grads to follow. The displaced youth had found their "family".......and a place to call home. As headquarters grew into a full-fledged compound......it became self-contained. You didn't need to go anywhere, for anything.......except beer and wine. Heck, even George Jess wine was known to be available to a select few. Hardly needed to leave grounds...... Three square meals a day...... Snack shop......and grilled burgers after meetings In-house entertainment.........indoor/outdoor, bands, dancing, fun Personal services.........haircuts, laundry, taxes, dentist at Indiana Campus Car services.......help with repairs / barter services Who needed much money?........many lived on-grounds and walked to work Note: One generation stayed so long......that they started having babies. Corps were graduating year after year and getting married. By 1976, a second generation of "cult-babies" are being pushed around in strollers. No, it wasn't many at first.......but six years later, by 1982.......babies and strollers were everywhere at corps week and roa. And, why not......the youth had "found a home." The displaced youth had moved from transition and were transferring these perceptions and identities to this pseudo-family. Wierwille addressed aspects of "this place is your home" on many a night owl. I knew many who considered Mrs. Wierwille as the mother that they never had, or knew. Others, whose father or mother died prematurely, took refuge in this "Uncle Harry Nostalgia" and was furthered when the Corps Chalet was being built.......that corps could stay for a couple days whenever they were passing by. Not only the commune lifestyle, but the doctrine.........I remember several times when wierwille taught about ownership versus stewardship. Why do you need to OWN things?.....wierwille claimed. It only slows you down, burdens you with the world. It's far better to have access of the ministry's stuff, than to own something yourself. Here you get to enjoy the way woods, the house of his healing presence, and all......without the expense and maintenance of it. All those years of evolving rhetoric......1) Burn the Ballast, 2) Burn the Chaff, to 3) Uncle Harry Day. Get rid of anything that is holding you back.......record albums, yearbooks, instruments, trinkets/jewelry, worldly books, family heirlooms and keepsakes, etc. Each year, around March 17th..... the communal fire at headquarters would roar as we rationalized the process and felt heavy guilt to obey. The manufactured doctrine and lifestyle was set ablaze......until 1985, when the death of the man and his fire ceased. What started out as a search for meaning, acceptance and belonging..........yielded years of detours, dead-ends and blind alleys. So, yeah........there's a lot to unpack from these cult travels. .
  23. 3 points
    As far as I know you've changed the topic so much the thread got moved to a completely different forum. The only evidence you've expressed as to why VPW's plagiarism should be given a pass or simple slap on the wrist is that YOU were blessed. The same reasoning as any damned Wayfer. Which is the same argument as saying you got drunk, unknowingly ran over an entire family, and should be let go because you were just having a good time.
  24. 3 points
    Hey spotters. Cool stuff. The black hole / white dwarf stuff may seem like it is on the outskirts of imagination, but just reading through this thread it is pretty powerful. I really never thought about the gravitational pull of a narcissist that much before, but it is very real. Many of your top leaders in business are this way - reportedly Steve Jobs from Apple and Larry Ellison from Oracle are two more modern or recently modern examples. You really would have to categorize all Way Presidents in this fashion also. Groomed and bred with a low concern for others welfare and a high concern for the importance of their own position, they were raised to exploit. I think it is really interesting to consider the gravitational pull of a black hole on personal relationships too, like TBone talking about spousal relationships. Definitely friendships too. DWBH - I also never fully appreciated the implications of the Way Tree having its origins in AA. If you think about it, that kind of sums up the outreach efforts and strategy for the Way - the Way tree teachings and the Vision and Direction document that surrounds it. That is all based in AA - helping recovering alcoholics. Keeping people in a disease for life, producing works to show deliverance, meeting attendance required, managed, monitored. The Lord Jesus Christ is once again, remarkably absent. So many angles of realistic evaluation and comparison for our past experiences. And to me all of it is another positive mental construct to remove the subtle anti Christ influences of the Way out of my mind.
  25. 3 points
    Hi Grease Spotters - and a great big warm welcome to newcomers! Personally I don’t buy into this “pure evil” model, a popular straw man argument used here and elsewhere by a certain poster. I usually lean heavily on a biblical model - how the Bible delineates the traits and tactics of false teachers, hypocrites, predators, exploitative “leaders”, etc. and especially take note in the passages that address these treacherous folks - you’ll see the Bible doesn’t cut them any slack or water down the criticism by saying look for the good in their life or work...I’m of the opinion the evil they do more or less nullifies anything of merit that’s not to say there was nothing to see that might be considered good - but it does make one wonder if anything - a teaching, a kind gesture, etc. was just for show, the bait in a trap or whatever to serve their hidden agenda; I tend to think they are all truly opportunists at heart if you ask me. Makes me think of the scandal of the Olympic physician Larry Nassar; don’t see a whole lot of folks standing up for him saying “but look at the good that he did...some of those YOUNG GIRLS he molested won Olympic metal.” Excuse me while I barf...sorry, but I can’t even fathom the empathetic disconnect if someone were to think like that.