justwannabeme

I think a loan should be paid back. I do not think the woman has to start working in the field...that's her business. Her debt to society is to pay back the loan.

Just wondering how old does a person have to be to be under the banner of their parents? Wasn't Naomi an adult? Wasn't she capable of her own believing? And isn't it true that sometimes the evil devil just gets in there and ruins peoples lives? Death and illness will be with us until the return of Christ. If Donna were right, why isn't Leah and Timothy dead yet, or even Donna herself? Why weren't they all "greasespots by midnight"? People were used as "examples" as Donna used the Polings...supposedly to show the importance of standing with LCM and the Way Ministry. How is it no one used the Martindales as examples? I remember a leader once telling me that the "Spiritual Probation" was profitable. If it was so right on, why didn't LCM emerge a changed man? Making an example of him would have been much more "profitable" than the use of believers that many people didn't know personally. Everyone could have learned a big lesson on how NOT to walk by the flesh if the sins of the Martindales was paraded before all...just as anyone in the Corps or who lived at International was well aware of. Just blow it and you're life would be served up with the noon meal! Why wasn't Donna just as quick to get on a podium and tell her own story of what happened to LCM, of what went wrong in their marriage and how it affected so many other people in such a horrible way, of how other clergy were forced out of the door when they confronted him and then accused of treason, of how LCM could have been engaging in sexual atrocities under her nose (hmmm...), etc. Why weren't the Martindale children dead long before their father went into hiding, never to emerge? Could it be that leaving the Way Ministry DOES NOT LEAD TO DEATH AND DESTRUCTION? (No...the sins of the Martindales was spoken of as the devil attacking the ministry. How absurd! Naomi Poling died because her father left the ministry, but LCM screwing wives of standing believers in the Way Ministry, as well as single women who trusted him, was hushed and treated as an attack. In other words, LCM DID NOTHING WRONG! Somehow the ol' Devil used LCM'S private parts to thwart the ministry. Other people would have been accused of being possessed...hmmm... Lets face it. The Way Ministry should be watched by the insiders. Idol worship didn't die with the removal of LCM. He was allowed to get on with life because there is a lot of Baal worship going on. Remember ...wolves in sheep's clothing. The Way got everyone looking into denominational closets for the boogey man...meanwhile he was residing in the Way International's livingroom, right in front of everyone's faces. The fact that all this was swept under the rug, and any questions were rejected as butting into other peoples personal lives (forget that these were the people who lived their lives in front of everyone and had no problem sharing someone else's personal business) shows that idolatry was alive and well in the Way International. Why wasn't it just as wrong to air the Polings personal business? This is one topic that has yet to be addressed by anyone in the Way International on a public forum.

It's you, HCW! HA HA HA

Yo, ladies! See how some guys think about you when you hit 40? Got the trophy girl friend. Time for the gals to go get those younger studs? Hey...why settle for bald heads and beer bellies? Greatest liberation for women...younger men! Ooops~ sorry to derail temporarily. Happened to a friend of mine. He got the young girlfriend, bought the nice house and his wife got the kids, welfare to pay for the expensive daycare, and all the weight of the responsibility of bringing them up. Oh yeah...and he was the one left the ministry. The ministry definitely didn't help...too bad you didn't get professional counseling for your marriage.

Oakspear! "Louie, Louie"... Oh yeah. I remember that song about interracial love. "She was black, as the night....Louie was whiter than white...took her home to meet momma and poppa, Louie had a terrible fight...Louie, Louie Louie, Louie...Louie, Louie, Louie, Lou-ahh, etc.

Geez! Am I da only one dat liked dat song? I took the Advanced Class in 1979, and beautiful Ohio played in the morning, as well as the song where VP would say to swing and sway with Sammy Kaye. That summer they started with the Beautiful Ohio. Boy...I gotta admit, I miss going to the Rock of Ages. Only hated it when I had to haul trash with a bad back. But mostly...I loved it...sigh...

Hi Smurfette, I agree more with White Dove. I yearned for Christian companionship. I think volunteering is a wonderful and necessary part of our society, on many levels...even if it is simply a financial association. What works for one person may or may not work for another. I think you ought to check them out for yourself! They don't kidnap anyone, or force you to stay. Wayne Cl*pp is wonderful. He was very straight forward when I talked with him about why he left (or was asked to leave) TWI. I personally would enjoy hanging with those folks, but physically cannot. And...no offense to anyone here who has done biblical research disputing the doctrines of TWI...your research means as much to me as anyone elses...maybe true, maybe false...probably a mix of both. Anyway, God knows, so we all just do our best. I personally am not sorry for all I learned with TWI. I got born again while affiliated with TWI. Could God have pulled that off anywhere? You bet. But my point is, He was able to help me there. Don't be discouraged from checking it out for yourself. No one has to walk in your shoes but you yourself.

Did I miss something? I thought the quote says TWI was selected. Where did the "they paid $" come into play?

Catcup... Looks like you've come full circle! Back to the interrogation...hahaha...geez...go read what got Catcup here...

CATCUP, Waterbuffalo, et al: I am reminded of a movie called "Fools Rush In". A woman, who was afraid to let her husband know she was still pregnant, and left him before he left her, is talking with her wise grandmother who tells her that she must "Surrender to love" if she wants to have it. You have to let down your fences. Following Way mandates helped end my marriage. I learned to NEVER let anyone have that much control of my life. "What I still object to is how our thinking got warped to allow people's opinions to bare so much weight in our personal lives." Waterbuffalo...How true! Some of us found out too late! For those of you who kept those marriages working the way they should, BRAVO!

I personally never knew the Moyni*ans. Based on comments made by you all, I would have to say it's hard to believe. Of course, unless many of us are privy to things, it's hard to believe. Unless you "see the picture", so to say, it's hard to believe people would straight out lie about affairs, etc. Probably because many of you couoldn't see yourselves doing that to cover up someone's hiney. Kind of like needing a picture of a horrific murder to believe anyone could do such a thing. I am convinced that there was no atrocity someone in TWI would not be willing to cover up. And you can only accept that it is still the same abusers and adulters in power. Could you see Jesus Christ saying to a believer about the Pharisees and the Saducees, "It's none of your business what they did." As wayfers were told about LCM. Gee...I can think of a few scriptures where Jesus Christ confronted the ungodly in front of EVERYONE! Actually, if the TWI believes the Word of God is the Will of God, then they WOULD CONFRONT the offenders! God in His Word confronts them for us all to read about! God's Word is so true! They are only interested in feeding their own bellies and serving their own purposes. Probably they are the last ones to think they are doing anything WRONG!

Catcup, I went back and read the thread that lead to this one! I actually got a bit tired of reading it since I read your opening statement to this thread. It made the comments go on and on and on once you had given a statement. It was like watching a dog on the trail of a scent... only this was sprayed there by someone else. I agreed that you were in an inquisition. "How long have you been a witch?" "I'm not a witch. I just know how to swim." "wouldn't that be something a witch would do?" "What?" "Cover up the fact she is a witch because she can swim?" "Can't I simply swim and not be a witch?" "But why would you want to swim if you have no desire to practice witchery and consort with the devil?!" "I already answered your question. I am not a witch." "Yes...someone who is a witch would try to deceive us with that answer. There is absolutely no reason for any person to swim...repent...go on... tell us and free your soul!" Oi Vey! Reading you list the "inquisition" questions of Song made me think of the "confrontation/ counselling" sessions in The Way. Remember those "Surprise" sessions. You'd be invited for coffee and there would be your leadership there (as a witness) and you would be confronted. And once they decided what you were wrong about, there was no way to redeem yourself but to let them give you the royal anal probe! Then jump through enough man-made hoops and write letters of apology, plan strategic comeback goals, have six months of probabation, and THEN...MAYBE...you could come back! Song...way off base. First, Greasespot is an open forum! Is this the new "Splinter" group, where you dare not speak unless you conform to the "experts" here on WayBrain? Must everyone here hold the same opinion about every topic here? Must thinkers straying from the popular ideology be "outted"? Haven't we all had enough of self-ordained experts?! HCW, I think you give too much credit to Song as being he (or she) who pulls things out of people! If that line of questioning was okay, that I would say that's Way Brain! We all had it for DECADES!!! Intimidate and accuse...accuse and intimidate. All it takes is my suspicion of who you are...and shabam...time to play 100 questions. Thanks for taking a stand CATCUP. No offense to Song or HCW.

Everyone on this thread can think of marriages that ended in part due to allowing the meddleship of TWI leadership. In one state I lived spouses running to leadership with their personal, marital decisions or problems was encouraged. Getting that leadership feedback on whether you should buy a new car became a big deal! It made TWI the leaders of every marriage! How intrusive! Still boils my blood thinking about how they tried to micro-manage everyone's lives! I myself had professional counseling after my marriage ended. The counselor said that the meddling (I told the counselor some of the TWI advice given)was the most destructive thing that could have happened in my marriage. TWI tried to became the "head of the household" in the marriage. I knew folks who had their private sexual practices nosed into. For TWI's own belief system (the man is the head), the true "head" of the marriage was replaced by the limb and region coordinators. By going to the twig coordinator with your private marital business, you could bet it would go to the branch leader, then to the limb leader, then to the region coordinator, possibly the trunk leader if it was a big enough scoop. They all needed their "multitude of counselors", so by the time it was said and done, way too many people knew what was none of their business! Then mandates were handed down from the pontiffs! Look at the incredibly wonderful marriage of LCM. Hmmm...where did that go! And why didn't Donna go with him? But that's another thread... OUTRAGEOUS!

Question, dmiller: May I ask where is that location of free PFAL, if I might ask. I never heard of that!

They are a group who still believe in the teachings of the Way International. They also have some great music from the early 1970's, etc.

Hey, You just made me remember that people were told point blank not to go on the internet. Way Dale and others were up and running. People were actually believing they might get possessed if they read all the stuff in there (all those lies about Martindale screwing around, raping people, etc). Amazing how, once they were sure their web site would pop up first in an internet search, then it became okay...then encouraged...heck, then downright spiritually right on to log onto theway.com. People were encouraged to go there and often...twig announcements told people to go to the site. Still controlling people. Is it just me, or didn't anyone else think it weird that people were told, as a twig activity, to log onto the way's website? I've learned that there was a reason, even if they weren't saying...even if it's to see how much control they still exert over people by seeing how much the counters go up when one of those mandates went out. Someone once mentioned that if you go to their website, they would track if you were posting at Way Dale, or Greasespot, by tracing the computer (I'm no savvy to computer jargon, sorry) or something like that. Anyone know? Catcup...Hope...Radar...anyone?

I remember we all believed "Man of God for the world". And it only made sense...we were God's ministry for the world. So now that the ministry denies having said that, and apparantly with Rosalie being declared the head paper pusher and nothing else, does that mean they acknowledge that The Way Ministry is no longer "God's ministry for the world"?

WATERED GARDEN: You were not spineless. You had displaced loyalty. You were duped by those who wanted to be adored. (Hmmm...who else sought that adoration over God?) You see, like most of you, you came and stayed because you believed this was "God's Ministry". It was drummed into our heads that our leadership stood for God and was there to help us. We were helping "our ministry". Spineless is only when you really believe something is wrong but go along with it anyway. People like that BC use a person's love for God and make it a win-win situation for them. "I stand for God, if you love God you will support me as God does." You are trying to serve God, they are serving their own bellies. HCW: From what I heard, LCM was asked by some ofthe dancers to do that part. I think originally they were considering Hayward Chap***l, who I thought was a little stiff as a dancer, but he had done the other Athletes dance before. Anyway, when they kept trying to think who would come across dynamically enough (like Craig, not Jesus Christ), they asked the meister himself to perform, and he did. I remember him walking in the lobby of the Auditorium, in all his tan and muscular glory because he was still doing his health routine from performing Athletes. I saw the looks he got from some of the ladies. Probably had his pick. (Ugh...sorry for all the married and single one's that he abused with his position). Sorry to derail.

SPEAKING OF TALENTED PERFORMERS: There were many talented people in the Corps, many New York stage performers. These were people who were professionally trained and seasoned. Many performed on Broadway and in prominent rolls. They were GOOD. How idiotic to think that an outstanding performance in someway exalted the performers. Their "good" would have naturally outshined the "best" of lesser trained performers. It probably would have enticed a lot more of the big wigs that top leadership enjoyed wining and dining and including in their inner circles. (Remember some of those top athletes that never went to a fellowship with regular folks! Pat Ly*n wined and dined the Pro tennis player, Paula, LCM wined and dined Tony Collins, the pro football player...just to name the couple I can think of off-hand. There were a few others that got the kid glove treatment and got top seating at dinner and ate the best of the fatted calf. HCW: How appropriate! Genuine standing ovations over the plastic protocol ones required at the end of performances. Kind of like the plastic, mandatory thank you notes at the end of each class, where you were given no time to go home and reflect and write something with more depth than a few minutes and an index card could allow. Translation for the comment about the class coordinator who wrongly yelled at the set-up person, "You should have been more sharp than me and covered my butt so I wouldn't look like the dumb schmuck I am." How spiritual and on top of things was that leader to forget he told someone to leave a room set up and when to be there (what else was he screwing up on the class and blaming other people for? Bet he felt real spiritual carrying out old CP#3. Corps Training often was simply handing a deranged or egomaniacal person a loaded gun. I am sure to this day the BOD still feel no need to apologize to the thousands of people that were trampled on. Those folks are gone, move on and never look like you have egg on your face. If those folks who left were more spiritual, or forgiving, or not into minding anyone's business but their own, they'd be seating in those classes, abundantly sharing and still a part of the ministry that endorses the teachings of someone who is long gone and apparantly didn't believe what he taught (where is he now?). Many Corps felt it was a privilege to teach TWAP class after lcm was kicked from the chicken farm. Amazing that not one person questioned what he TAUGHT that he is not living up to.

I met Ma*k, and knew of his situation when his wife died and he moved to NJ. Everyone was very supportive, and of course, very compassionate to this man with a newborn baby who just lost his wife. I remember everyone being excited when he met a single believer who apparantly connected with Ma*k and would become the mother to that baby. It seemed so perfect for all concerned, and they were genuinely wished well. I remember hearing later that they divorced, and again I felt bad for them, especially since bonds had to have been made between the new wife and the baby. I agree with LLP, though. The Catholic Church believes and teaches that they are the only true church (I was told this by more than one Catholic) and they were very obviously a haven for child molesters. The school system, as well as daycare systems, are also places to have very intimate dealings with children daily. TWI to me offers no greater opportunity than these two places for child molesters to "hunt". It provides an opportunity that a child molester can utilize, no different than those that priests have used for centuries. I agree that M.N. should get everything that he deserves legally, as every child molester should. I think the only way TWI will be held responsible, however, is if someone can prove that they were aware of his problem when they allowed him to serve in a leadership capacity (Ma*k was not ordained. He was a "minister"as all Way Corps are called "ministers"). That is what made the RC Church responsible...they knew of problems and simply relocated priests. It is incredible that Ma*k actually told a judge that garbage about being monitored! He didn't surrender, he was caught. And like any common criminal, is only concerned about his own hyde! Not a moment's concern about the child(ren) he has helped to ruin! The childhoods he has ripped off...the emotional problems he is responsible for setting in motion. I don't think six years is enough. The biblical ramification was death. That should be his sentence...then let him worry about being considered a child molester!

I also knew of one couple who were "mark and avoid" for purchasing a home. Another woman, who stuck to her guns, was constantly being "encouraged" to sell her home. She was right to assume it would be ridiculous to sell and go pay double the price of her mortgage in rent. There was constant pressure from her leadership to sell it and get out of debt.

Last knew, she was still there.

Sandra was married to Ken Workman, who did a spouse Corps 1 year program with the 11th. She was on staff.

Have the documents been removed? I tried to but couldn't get them to come up.

My list of scariest movies: 1) Night of the Living Dead (that slow chill that wouldn't go away 2) The Birds - saw that as a 12 year old, I think. Couldn't sleep for weeks! Kept wondering what would we do living in an apartment building with them crashing through the window. Where would I hide? The only place in the apartment without access to windows: the hall closet (the others had poles for curtains to cover the closet areas. 3) The