oldiesman
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Posts posted by oldiesman
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16 minutes ago, Nathan_Jr said:
And this is the implication of Oldies’ question.
Yes. "God" isn't the only spiritual being that has been purported to exist and spoken about by man so I was thinking it might be good to know (for purposes of this thread only) we agree that no spirits exist?
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4 hours ago, Nathan_Jr said:
Do you remember what it was like before you were born?
How then do you know what it’s like after you die?
What’s wrong with the answers “nothing” or “I don’t know”?
I've heard stories that some people believe they lived before.
Just for clarification that we are all on the same page in this thread:
Does not believing in God also necessarily mean not believing in ANY and ALL spiritual beings? Thx.
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On 4/14/2024 at 1:54 PM, Charity said:
Over the past six months, I have struggled quite a bit with my relationship with God for two reasons: seeing the suffering of my 8-year-old grandson with non-verbal autism beginning to have seizures again (as well as other health issues), and the doctrine of the rapture and the great tribulation. As part of this second issue, I have seen a dear brother in Christ become very focused on warning others of the terrible wrath of God that will soon be upon those who are left behind. I won't get into specifics about these two issues right now, but instead of what I've learned in the last week or so.
I began watching videos on the MindShift website. They are done by a man named Brandon who was raised up in a fundamentalist religion and was very active in it for decades as an adult. He no longer believes there is a God and therefore believes that the Bible was written by men alone. He uses a lot of the Bible to show how the Christian god is not a good god. He also talks about how Christians defend these verses to show the opposite - that God is a long-suffering and merciful God.
I have found that what he says makes sense. I am attaching one of his videos about how living a life as a slave to Christ is very similar to what real slaves to real masters here on earth had to suffer and endure. I would really appreciate hearing what you think about this. He covers a lot in 40 minutes so it's not necessary to listen to the whole video to bring up topics for discussion.
Thanks!
It appears that Brandon very clearly lost the faith he once had. Am curious what he thinks will happen to him after his death? I didn't get to that part if he said something about that. Thx.
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12 hours ago, Nathan_Jr said:
What year was this? It sounds like that period of victor’s increasing unbelief/disbelief, hence his fatigue.
1984.
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On 4/5/2024 at 10:18 PM, Stayed Too Long said:
I now , and also at that time, live in Montana.. VPW and a group of TWI motocycle enthusists were part of a caravan riding to the Calgary Stampede in Calgary, Alberta, Canada. When the group rolled in, our twig was expected “to be blessed” by providing them with a evening meal. Our twig of 6 or 7 was expected to feed several dozen bikers.
The caravan included VPW’s motor coach which he slept in, and also pulled a notorcycle trailer, so when he got tired of riding he could jump in the the coach to relax.
Yes, that was one of those "good ole days" experiences for me. Took one whole month off from work and was very excited to be one of the participants. The believers at each stop were great, and so was all the food! VPW and Mrs. Wierwille didn't ride the Twig Hopper much at all...he had that glass eye at that time too... and along with VPW motorcoach there also was a full motorcoach for the participants to sleep in each night if they wanted to, to save money on hotel rooms. I still have the daily journal written by Elena Whiteside who also rode with me on a few of those motorcycle legs.
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On 3/23/2024 at 10:28 AM, RighteousRider said:
EVER WONDER WHAT GOD REALLY THINKS OF YOU?
What a great video! Thanks RighteousRider. Perhaps the greatest mistake man can make is to think otherwise.
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On 10/23/2023 at 9:04 PM, Rocky said:
I no longer have respect for the dogma Victor Wierwille pushed.
The topic has been talked about here at GS for a long time, i.e. is it VPW or his dogma that was offensive, or both. I've always separated the two and still feel the same way, i.e. the dogma is either true or false on its own irrespective of the sins of VPW. Remember, he didn't originate lots of it. But I think one of the biggest crimes of TWI that must be said is the ramming through of only their biblical views without discussing/considering/examining other views to see which was really biblically accurate. Not much of an open mind to other viewpoints. What a shame for all of us because there's so much more to be considered and I feel like I was ripped off all those years in that one sense.
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On 3/24/2024 at 11:41 AM, chockfull said:
Ok so before this gets banned out of the gate let me set the framework. In the US of A, sometimes otherwise referred to as ‘Murica, we have a two party political system. Some other free republics also have this construct.
I personally would prefer a four viable party system so that we have more options and aren’t restricted to a Tweedledee vs Tweedledum choice in geriatric medicine like we are currently.
However, while I was in TWI I totally noticed a complete affiliation that was unspoken to a single political party. This was all done hush-hush and never from a stage or teaching platform. Why? Political affiliations would ruin a non-profit tax status and be grounds to disqualify TWI.
I remember being on staff at TWI and the undercurrent of “suggestion” which is ever present was to get out and vote for our preferred political party.
Why does TWI present a complete falsehood to our government that they are politically unbiased? How can they get away with it without losing tax exempt status?
Mods this isn’t a political discussion so consider merits before ban hammering it. It is not presenting a one party opinion but discussing the attachments politically of a cult.
I found that TWI set a standard for what they thought was truth, or politically historical and crucial facts, and then let the member decide what political party they wanted to entertain. The one book that got me started on the anti-globalist NWO agenda was "None Dare Call It Conspiracy" which condemned both parties (republican and democrat) as being infiltrated by globalists bent on world government and to watch both parties carefully. Sometimes they did support democrats remember Hayes Gahagan? Larry McDonald? Also, remember in 1976 "Wake Up America" was trying to expose the "Newstates Constitution" as a plan to supplant our own constitution. That was under President Carter and I remember TWI actively lobbying him to make him aware of what was happening. In that sense TWI was political-party generic; didn't care which party was there they wanted both parties awake and informed.
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13 hours ago, penworks said:
Today I again spoke with a religion class at Rollins College. Students were assigned to read Undertow and we discussed it. Attached is a handout I gave them to help them understand cults.
Feel free to pass it along to others.
Cheers,
Charlene
Thx for sharing Charlene. Even with all the fond memories of mine.
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How about the Shroud of Turin? Here's a piece that says it should be thought of differently than a hoax:
New evidence supporting Shroud too strong to ignore (catholicweekly.com.au) -
Dear Friend,
I'm 67 years old and in a matter of 5 minutes, just heard 2 interpretations from friends of mine that I never heard before!
(1) Not accepting forgiveness is the unforgivable sin;
(2) Believing that Jesus was possessed; as the Pharisees had claimed he was possessed by the prince of devils.
ALL COMMENTS WELCOME.
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On 3/17/2024 at 9:19 PM, OldSkool said:
My work on GSC is complete. Thank you for giving me a place to vent and I wouldnt be where I am now if it wasnt for my time here. Some of you if not all may think im crazy. I was crazy and this isnt the same. I thought I was crazy in the beginning too...its fine.
https://www.eyesupandopen.org/index.php/articles-from-various-authors/my-testimony-expanded-version
Thank you OldSkool for the powerful testimony of Jesus' presence (as opposed to absence) in your life.
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35 minutes ago, waysider said:
Here is what REALLY happened.
Once had a friend (who came from India with a heavy Indian accent) confirming this belief that Jesus learned all of his amazing skills from India before age 30. He was very serious, but I have never studied it. Please feel free to post any evidence to the contrary:
Jesus Lived in India: His Unknown Life Before and After the Crucifixion: Holger Kersten: 9780143028291: Amazon.com: Books -
8 hours ago, Raf said:
Oldies, we were kind of dismissive of this post. Are you satisfied with my response? Or would you prefer greater detail? The lack of evidence for the martyrdom of the saints was the straw that broke the camel's back for me in my journey from faith, so it's not a topic I avoid. But in terms of THIS conversation, I think YOU get to decide whether I've adequately addressed it.
Raf, your response was fine for me, thx for asking.
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A friend recently sent me this and thought I would place it here in support of the apostles' commitment to Jesus. Have no idea if one or more of these statements are true but if so, could be powerful anecdotal evidence. Please feel free to post any historical inaccuracies of the statements made here:
HOW THE APOSTLES DIED.1. Matthew. Suffered martyrdom in Ethiopia; killed by a sword wound.2. Mark. Died in Alexandria Egypt, after being dragged by horses through the streets until he was dead.3. Luke. Was hanged in Greece as a result of his preaching to the lost.4. John. Faced martyrdom when he was boiled in a huge basin of boiling oil during a wave of persecution in Rome. However, he was miraculously delivered from death.John was then sentenced to the mines on the prison island of Patmos. He wrote the Book of Revelation on Patmos. The apostle John was later freed and returned to serve as Bishop of Edessa in modern Turkey. He died as an old man, the only apostle to die peacefully.5. Peter. He was crucified upside down on an x shaped cross. According to church tradition it was because he told his tormentors that he felt unworthy to die the same way that Jesus had died.6. James. Leader of the church in Jerusalem, was thrown over a hundred feet down from the southeast pinnacle of the Temple when he refused to deny his faith in Jesus. When they discovered that he survived the fall, his enemies beat him to death with a fuller's club. This was the same pinnacle where Satan had taken Jesus during the Temptation.7. James the Son of Zebedee, was a fisherman by trade when Jesus called him. As a strong leader of the church, James was beheaded at Jerusalem. The Roman officer who guarded James watched amazed as James defended his faith at his trial. Later, the officer walked beside James to the place of execution. Overcome by conviction, he declared his new faith to the judge and knelt beside James to accept beheading as a Christian.8. Bartholomew. Also known as Nathaniel, was a missionary to Asia. He witnessed for Jesus in present day Turkey. Bartholomew was martyred for his preaching in Armenia where he was flayed to death by a whip.9. Andrew. He was crucified on an x shaped cross in Patras, Greece. After being whipped severely by seven soldiers, they tied his body to the cross with cords. His followers reported that, when he was led toward the cross, Andrew saluted it in these words, "I have long desired and expected this happy hour. The cross has been consecrated by the body of Jesus hanging on it". He continued to preach to his tormentors for two days until he expired.10. Thomas. Stabbed with a spear in India during one of his missionary trips to establish the church in the subcontinent.11. Jude. He was killed with arrows when he refused to deny his faith in Jesus.12. Matthias. The apostle chosen to replace Judas. He was stoned and then beheaded.13. Paul. He was tortured and then beheaded by Emperor Nero in Rome in A.D. 67. Paul endured a lengthy imprisonment, which allowed him to write his many epistles to the churches he had formed throughout the Roman Empire. These letters, which taught many of the foundational doctrines of Christianity, form a large portion of the New Testament.
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2 hours ago, Rocky said:
He fretted about a communist takeover of the United States
I wish we could discuss politics here, respectfully. I'd even pay a monthly fee! LOL
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50 minutes ago, Raf said:
Please do not take a quote out of context and use it to challenge my knowledge of the gospel.
My comment was about what Josephus wrote [more to the point, what he implausible left out]. If you would like me to pick apart the gospel to demonstrate how petty, vindictive, arbitrary and stupid the whole house of cards is, I suggest you buckle up. Unlike you, I've asked those questions and considered them. So if you really want to go there, I'll be more than happy to be your guide.
Or we can continue discussing the topic instead of trying to make it about me.
I am wondering if we can make believe scripture doesn't exist. It has no authority therefore ANY references to it are mere claims, not proof. (in this thread only) LOL
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11 hours ago, Raf said:
Imagine someone claiming to have had such an experience and then bragging that he never confirmed his doctrine with the people who knew Jesus best.
A reminder that in this particular subforum, the testimony of the scripture is not authoritative. The claim of a Damascus conversion is a claim, not a documented fact.
Long way of saying I'm atheist. Scripture is a claim, not proof.
ok fair enough. I will admit that there are learn-ed folks who believe Jesus never existed in the flesh. Guess I'll be a spectator of this thread and see what's up although it's a bit uncomfortable.
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On 2/16/2024 at 3:27 PM, Raf said:
Imagine the audacity of saying I know the will of Jesus without having to consult the people who were closest to him!
Road to Damascus? Imagine having a life-changing experience from the Lord himself?
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On 2/12/2024 at 6:48 AM, chockfull said:
So with RC history the pattern seems to be accept, accommodate, and integrate. An intermediate state between death and judgement keeps the followers in dynamic tension allowing for a greater level of control. Do good? Pay your toll? You advance. Don’t pay your toll? Everlasting hellfire buddy!
I could be wrong but I've got the impression that first comes the personal judgment, then Jesus sends you to purgatory to pay for the venial sins. One of the first questions or doubts I had about it was: when Jesus sends you to purgatory for a time, how the hell can the saints pray you out of Jesus's personal sentence for you? LOL. That was when someone told me about the magic of the "community of saints". I'm still batting this around in my head.
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5 minutes ago, Mark Sanguinetti said:
Since soap is used for physical cleaning. Soap could figuratively represent spiritual cleaning or purification through God and his Son Jesus Christ. The book of Malachi, the last book of the Old Testament, looks prophetic for Jesus Christ.
All I can say to this is, if the Lord wants to wash my mouth and heart out with His kind of soap for however long he pleases, I will gladly submit myself to all that He desires of me and accept all that He permits to happen to me.
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Thought there may be some interest reading about the group "People of Praise" mentioned inside this piece that I never heard of before:
New role for Amy Coney Barrett’s father inside Christian sect sparks controversy (aol.com) -
Oh one more thing. I was taught in RCIA school that almost everyone goes to purgatory and in fact, it's very rare for someone to go directly to heaven.
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I've been praying St. Gertrude's prayer almost every day for a while:
Eternal Father, I offer You the most Precious Blood of Your Divine Son, Jesus, in union with the Masses said throughout the world today, for all the Holy Souls in Purgatory, for sinners everywhere, for sinners in the Universal Church, those in my own home, and within my family. Amen.It is said that this prayer releases souls from purgatory. I asked a devout catholic friend how is it that "we" can release souls from purgatory after Jesus's judgment, and he said simply it has to do with the "community of saints." Still working that out in my head. But still praying too.
Deconversion: Losing one's religious belief and accepting reality on its own terms.
in Atheism, nontheism, skepticism: Questioning Faith
Posted
All spirit beings believed to exist by man. God, Jesus, Holy, Gabriel, Michael, Lucifer, Watchers, Angels, Demons etc. etc.