cman

what or who is god, if prelearned ideas of god are eliminated then what could it be

it's fine to not believe in god, it's mostly someone else's idea of what god is that has been introduced in some sort of biased way

an old Indian/survival book I read once called it "the spirit that moves through all things"

there will always be the old back and forth between ideas, but really what is god and what is it that is believed or not believed, something that should be answered to yourself

1 hour ago, Ham said:

I really don't agree that TWI was ANYTHING "fundamental" in the Christian arena. By no means..

I agree, a lot of the phrases used to promote wayism were not main line Christianity

"inherently accurate" was never used in the Lutheran or Southern Baptist teachings

1 hour ago, Charity said:

I get it - "the wages of sin is death" idea from Romans 6 which takes you back to the whole Adam and Eve story in Genesis 3.  For those who think this was an allegory or a fictional story posing as history to teach us something (a myth), what part of it teaches how sin really entered the world that we are born with it and therefore deserving of death?

As if death is a bad thing

Love your enemies, whether it's death or something else 

Fear not

Since everyone dies everyone gets paid lol we earned the right 

1 hour ago, Raf said:

A naturalist in philosophy is someone who believes the natural world is all that is. It is incompatible with spirit or the supernatural.

All these words have histories and overlapping definitions. Best bet is to allow people to label themselves and articulate what they mean by these labels.

yeah, the definition of a cult for sure, nothing to do with nature naturism or humanism

you can label it anything you want, but I will use the terms as they were correctly intended

the terms of naturalist and naturism has its beginnings in art and paintings of nature

of course, today the terms have been perverted

or a clear definition of what it is to die?

not meaningless at all, but it is the subject....or object

a naturalist would know that which dies will be born again

does the humanist see the same? doubt it

"Compassion becomes real

when we recognize

our shared humanity."

~Pema Chodron

13 minutes ago, Raf said:

"I don't know" is a solid humanist response.

I do like that, much I don't know.....yet.....

wow raf! lol, no problems with that thinking

you know the old saying

“When you have eliminated all which is impossible, then whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.” ― Arthur Conan Doyle, The Case-Book of Sherlock Holmes
"

Interesting....

I don't know is as good as it gets as stated there....

How do humanist account for creation? Certainly there is some explaining about how earth came to be.

1 hour ago, Raf said:

There is an end to our world here in the physical. But that doesn't make the spiritual more important unless the spiritual can be established to exist. 

yes of course, and how does that happen?

who can prove it?

who is looking for the proof?

I can't prove anything, but I can point things out to think about and consider for anyone I talk to.

If one is looking for the spiritual then the spiritual needs to be looked at.

no worries raf...

If you look at life from more than the about 100 years we live on the planet, things start making more sense.

There is no apocalypse, that is fantasy, not reality. There is an end to your world here in the physical, that is why the spiritual is more important. Cause the new heavens and earth are real and now. Just because one is blind to it does not mean it does not exist.

you hang on to these church teachings as if they are the truth, are they? or are they the anchor that keeps you asleep, sleeping comfortably in your mind-set

here is another

"If you believe it will work out,
you'll see opportunities.
If you believe it won't,
you will see obstacles."
~Wayne Dyer…

and not to put you down in any way, it's just the way it is

12 minutes ago, Charity said:

It's a beautiful quote you shared.  Biblically, it would be refuted by Jeremiah 17:9: "The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked:"  (See also Rom 3:10-18 and Gal 5:19-21)

yes we are stewards, as Jesus taught, as Paul taught 

stewards of the pearl of great price

Paul wrote to those who have been awakened from sleep, born again, yes, but what does that mean=awake, the spirit uncoiled from inside. He constantly talked about the spirit inside, as well as in the other men who wrote letters, like John and Peter and James.

These are the things Jesus taught. It, the spirit, is what he was talking about...clearly. Instead of the epistles to be read all the time, it is better to read the gospels and proverbs, psalms....to see what they were seeing....

I could try to tell you what I see, or rather what I have been shown, but words cannot convey it or convince anyone of it, you have to see it for yourself. And God is always showing everything always, one just has to wake up from the sleep we have been seduced into. Cause the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak, scared of letting go.

you can find some answers in Christian doctrines and bible readings, maybe in some church dogma....

the only true satisfying answers are from Christ in you

a quote I saw this morning from "Charter for Compassion" 

"Your soul,
that inner quiet space,
is yours to consult.
It will always guide you
in the right direction."
~Wayne Dyer

nothing wrong with dumping or keeping religious beliefs-doesn't matter that much anyway

get in touch with yourself, whatever that means to you, grow a garden or get a dog, spend some time with nature, release yourself from everything to get connected to everything in newness of your spirit

Should have been put on the green card. But there it is, we experienced it, lived it, can explain it even...today anyway.

Perhaps GSC is the only place regular wayfers look at outside of the way's indoctrination setup. You know, only reading collaterals, don't dare read anything else or look at tv.

I'm guessing this is still happening inside twi...not sure though.

nice write-up socks, on those 2 verses with considerations of other perspectives

I don't think some literal interpretation can satisfy the very human need to know, or even a curiosity to see things more clearly. Time to God is not a thing to put into the text I would think, so to us it's a tough concept to see it without a framework of assumed reality.