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About Schwaigers

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    Can't believe how thick the coffee is here

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  1. I'm sure we know each other.

    The Kutzes

  2. Stay tuned. I'll try to dig up a picture of Dave and me in our room at the Indaina Campus, and I'll post it here when I find it. In that particular room, you had to sit on the bed to use the sink (we had to go down the hall to use a bathroom, but there was a sink in our room). However, the sink left zero room for our bed! The whole room was maybe eight feet across. And the most unbelievable part was that there were many many empty rooms at that time. Still we were assigned that tiny space. And we obeyed. Duh. Pat
  3. We received a letter of apology from the FC Coordinator, after he himself became "Mark and Avoid". In it he said ... "If there's anything I can do ..." So we wrote back and asked him to contact our daughter, who had totally severed ties with us due to HIS communication with her when WE were made "Mark and Avoid". Of course, he never followed through with his offer of "If there's anything I can do ..." when we actually asked him to do something. He never contacted her.
  4. Interesting topic. Two thoughts: 1. Those of us who loved TWI so much that we went into the Corps ... were pretty much trapped. The little home fellowships were so wonderful, so we figured it would be even more wonderful rubbing shoulders with the guys who led this outfit. We wanted to be like them, so we could extend this wonderful-ness to everyone. Instead, once we settled in at a root locale, we saw how deceitful these leaders were, and we saw how the peons in those sweet fellowships back home were being used. But by then it was too late. We had sold everything (to be out-of-debt, as required); convinced our kids it was the right thing to do - to relocate - leaving friends, pets, schools, etc behind; and we had burned our own bridges back to non-Way friends and family. Do you see the trap? Oh, you could pry yourself out of it, but it would be very painful. For us, we didn't have the guts to do that. We kept rationalizing that God would honor our intentions, and one day we could teach and live the Word like we had dreamed ... if we would just play the game and get through Corps training. So, because we wouldn't deliver ourselves, God arranged it for us, and had us Marked and Avoided. We will always be grateful for that. But at the time ... it was a nightmare - homeless, jobless, destitude. No kidding. But we survived, and we're just fine now. 2. What was it they taught us? Something like ... the closeness to the real thing is how the fake thing succeeds ... what was it? Not enough coffee yet - I can't remember. Anyhow, TWI was real close to being genuinely good. But it wasn't really good at all. In fact, it was horribly bad. I have heard it has changed. I pray this is true. -Pat
  5. Ex 10 ... Thanks, and Happy Easter to you. I didn't mean to put down My3Cents. If I remember correctly, he is one of the guys we were in Family Corps with - by another name, of course - and you are so right - he is very "balanced", one of the most sensible (cents-able?) men we encountered in that nightmare. I take his views quite seriously. And about my conscience - yes, it was developed long before TWI, but altered I think due to TWI. Wasn't yours? Professional help - yep, I've done that, am still doing that. The best advice I got from a counselor ... was just what you said: Gotta find that person I used to be. She suggested resuming my artwork, something I loved as a child, and a teen, and then got to busy to do. I started painting again a couple of years ago, and did in fact start finding that old self in the process. Thanks for reminding me. -Pat
  6. 3 Cents, You say that you make decisions by asking yourself "is this idea useful?", but in determining whether it will be useful, you consider the "inner consequences". This is what I'm talking about. My inner consequences have to a large degree been manufactured by TWI, rather than by my own conscience. And you mention asking whether it is "on the Word" (which is Way-thinking for sure, because anyone else would ask whether it is "IN the Word), there is also confusion, because we were given so much mis-information about the Word. For me, there is definitely a loss of confidence in myself as well, and so I find myself second-guessing many things that I do, or not doing things because it might be wrong - or it might not, but let's not risk it. And as time goes by, I wonder if this craziness is not getting worse, instead of better. -Pat
  7. I read a Dr. Phil book recently (yes, I know he is not the know-all, end-all, but interesting anyhow). And in this book, he said we should do "What works" instead of "What's right". I'm sure he didn't mean we should go out there and do wrong. But I think the point is that our concept of right-and-wrong is likely to be skewed, and if something isn't working, then we should re-examine the personal values behind it. Maybe it's our skewed thinking. Well, I know for a fact that TWI skewed or screwed my thinking about what's right and wrong. Nowadays, it's hard to make some decisions because of this. It may seem like something is reasonable to do - or not to do - but then TWI doctrine or some twisted interpretation of Biblical principals will pop up in my head, and ........ I'm lost. Prior to my TWI days, I was good at decision-making. Anybody else have this problem? -Pat
  8. Schwaigers


    BTW Although I basically agree (out of my common sense) with what you wrote, tell me where you got this quote: "In fact, what God said even though He hates divorce, He said If you find your spouse to be morrally unclean in any way, write up the divorce papers, put them right in their hand, and put them out of the house." -Pat
  9. Schwaigers


    Hi folks Here's a question for you. The Bible allows for divorce in situations of adultery and fornication, right? So ... what is fornication? I remember some of what TWI taught about this. But has anyone learned anything more accurate since then? And another thing ... do TWI couples who divorce tend to claim that each other is "possessed"? I am aware of this happening in more than one break-up. -Pat
  10. Papa John You asked why everyone wants to see bad things happen. I've wondered that myself sometimes. Like that Jerry Springer show ... why are people entertained by that crap? But I think this is different. While divorce is essentially a "bad thing", there are times when it is necessary and therefore a good thing. Certainly in this case, it is totally appropriate. Assuming it was Donna who initiated the divorce (which I don't know, but it seems likely) ... it would indicate that she recognizes her own worth as a woman,as well as the example she needs to set for other women who look up to her. For her to stay married to this abusive man would imply that she accepts this kind of behavior within a marriage relationship, which could lead to others being hurt who try to imitate her. And the most likely females to imitate her would be her own daughters. So, Papa John, perhaps we at Greasespot are actually celebrating this turn of events, rather than being amused by something "bad". -Pat
  11. No, you guys. They are divorced. Got it from a reliable source. -Pat
  12. Hi guys I worked as a receptionist at the Indiana Campus as late as 1997, and we would get calls occasionally from people requesting transcripts. Now maybe I'm not remembering correctly, but as I recall, the only thing we could send out was documentation that the person did attend the college. We couldn't send an official transcript, because the college was NOT accredited, and also because the "classes" were not measured by credit hours or by a standard grading system. Maybe this situation was just something that evolved in later years. I do know that Corps grads, whether still "standing" with TWI or not, can still aquire authority (from their state) to marry couples, based on their Corps training, but that's a different thing entirely from attempting to transfer college credits. -Pat
  13. John, "Dr. Wierwille would be very proud of what we are doing" ????? Who cares?
  14. Ckeer, you're really smart. -Pat
  15. Are you referring to the "Christian Family and Sex" class? If so, this is the class that taught that wives are indeed supposed to serve their husbands, wooden spoons are to be used on children, and it's OK for singles to have sex because after a certain age (30, I think) we all have certain "needs". It was a disgusting class. And look what happened to the Martindales who taught it.
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