Grace Valerie Claire

12 hours ago, Twinky said:

Oh, well, yes, but we are talking of different things.  I'm saying, selection wasn't elite.  You are saying, after graduation one became part of an elite.  Both are true.

And of course, there was the "elite elite" - the ones who had contacts/money/other stuff that They were interested in.  The ones who were treated with kid gloves and never seemed to get into trouble.  And these people were apparent, even in the in-rez training.  Nicer jobs.  Not in trouble.  Were twig leaders.  And often didn't have much empathy for everyone else there.

Twinky, personally I think having empathy is essential for living a Godly life.  I know, boy do I know, I make a lot of mistakes.  Yet God forgives me; thus I can forgive others. I can't imagine trying to live a Godly life without practicing empathy for others.

19 hours ago, penguin2 said:

We saw the "or else" in action during my time in the corpse.  People kicked out for poor performance during LEAD and all types of other craziness.  

Pen, perhaps that was a blessing in hindsight!

4 hours ago, WordWolf said:

The Corps program ran at a profit, since more tuition was paid than expenses were incurred, per student.

The Corps program was ESPECIALLY profitable because the students who paid their tuition were required to perform manual labor, for which they were paid $0 per hour salary.  They not only worked for free, they paid to be there.   So, the more workers, the more money twi made.  No wonder there were corps later who had a lot of "make-work" like cleaning things that were already clean when they arrived.

WW, gee I thought Lincoln had abolished slavery.  From what I have read here at the he GSC, people in the Corps were treated like dirt, with a few exceptions.  I know I have posted this before, but I think I was treated better in Boot Camp, than many people in the Corps.  At least in Boot Camp, you have a few rights; da-n few, but a few. And yet, I felt an enormous pressure was placed on people to go Corps.  Now I know why; because it was a BIG money-maker for TWI.  

2 hours ago, skyrider said:

And, so were they...........on every level imaginable.

• Was the Emporia Campus a place of higher learning.......or just an indoctrination camp?
• Why dangle an Associates of Theology Degree......when it was a worthless piece of paper in academic circles?
• Dozens in the 7th corps (my elder corps) were sent to Gunnison and/or Tinnie, NM for plumbing, carpentry, etc.
• And, when they missed whole blocks of classes.......it didn't matter.  Only their loyalty to Trustees' requests mattered.
• No grades, no tests......why take notes?  Maybe just feign attention to keep up with appearances for future assignments.
• Why did wierwille think that Emporia Campus needed a Dean?.......   Maybe that's why Dean Don felt betrayed?

The whole gambit wreaked of *playing the system to one's advantage.* 

Seemingly, the concept was......if you wanted to move up the ladder, you've got to go corps.  Even those who'd been leaders on the field for years, had to go thru the corps training to establish street cred [cult cred].......ie Chris Geer [7th corps], John Lynn [9th corps].  Heck, even Don and Howard were publically presented with Honorary Corps Diplomas...... why?  LOL

With corps in-residency, there was no basis for academic achievement.........no questioning, no open discussions, no tests, no voicing dissent was allowed.  Even those adept in research skills and languages were confined to the parameters of wierwille's "research." 

The whole deception was, and still is, that the corps program involved education......whereas indoctrination was its core.

Sky, wow!!  From reading your posts, it seems to me, the corps program might have been a scam.  I thought it was a big money maker for TWI; but perhaps others feel differently. Personally, Sky I am ever so thankful that I never entered the program.

On 8/28/2018 at 1:10 PM, chockfull said:

Hi AlohaAnn,

Thanks for your story.  In a "normal" church, local community church, local Catholic church, local denominational church, local interdenominational church, you would see multiple generations of people, happy and interacting with one another.

In a cult, you see families divided over the egos of the elite.  Elitism, excommunication actively in practice towards family members.  Like Scientology for instance.  Or the Way, obviously.

So when the rubber meets the road, the Way International really has more in common functionally with Scientology than it does with it's supposed brothers and sisters in the body of Christ in mainstream Christianity, denominational, or almost any other blend.

BTW I used to have the title Corps.  Until I realized it was driving towards Corpse.  So I dropped it and joined the land of the living like your kids, and you for that matter.

Peace, cheers, and a happy and long prosperous life with the Way in the rearview mirror!!!!!

 

 

Chock

On 8/20/2018 at 7:05 PM, AlohaAnn said:

Aloha to everyone who read my long story and especially my ex-TWI ohana (family) who responded. You all know exactly what to say and I am blessed! I told my daughter about GSC, maybe when the dust settles she will come on board and share her journey, ask questions from you "old-timers", and contribute. Thanks so much for the support here!

Ann, it's been a few months since your daughter left the Corps.  How is she doing in the "real world?"

On 11/5/2018 at 4:12 PM, Raf said:

I can start a thread called "The" and it will spark 40,000 posts over four threads in two forums.

 

But actually CALL IT Random Thoughts, and everyone is stuck on the point made in the opening post.

 

 

 

 

Raf, now you know we are paying attention to your posts!!

On 12/17/2018 at 1:44 PM, Twinky said:

What song most symbolises, or encapsulates, Christmas, for you?  A piece of classical music? A pop song (please, no Bing!)?  A carol or hymn?  Something choral, or maybe something orchestral?

Me, I'm thinking Dance of the Sugar Plum Fairy.  Lighthearted fun.

Twinky, I love real Christmas trees, with real lights.

On 7/11/2018 at 1:58 PM, WordWolf said:

A) I agree, but not everyone here does.

B) I agree again, but where there's people, I expect there will always be SOME caca, and I think it's referred to in prophecies of what's to come.

C)  I agree, and the splinters know there's lots of money in shoveling this caca around and selling it in one form or another.

 

WW, I asked someone here at the GSC(Sky?), why some groups spread Caca around, and he reminded me it was because of money. I agree with you, that it's Caca, but even S--T can be profitable.

On 7/12/2018 at 4:21 PM, chockfull said:

Don't you just love it when one man decides what God is going to decide regarding another man's salvation?

That line of thinking is looney in the tooney LOL.

 

Chock, 

8 hours ago, Raf said:

stop confusing me

 

 

 

Raf, are you counting down until Baseball starts?  In New York State, fishing season starts the same day, April 1st.

On 2/23/2019 at 8:05 AM, waysider said:

That's both good and bad. Some have found the closure and healing they needed and moved on. That's the good part.The flip side is that we , as individuals, are all aging. Quite a few who used to post here have since passed away. It's part of life. It's been almost 50 years since I took the PFAL class. That boggles my mind.  

Way, wow !  I took PFAL 41 years ago; it's hard for me to believe how young, and gullible I was back then.

45 minutes ago, sastian said:

I've poised for a similar meeting myself. but appreciate the maturity in this statement. At some point, till take the time to tell my story as well.. it's still being written though.

 

Sastian, take all the time you need.  Here at the GSC, people are allowed to heal, and grow at their own pace.  If you want to "tell," your story, that's fine.  If you don't, that is also fine.  

On 3/5/2019 at 3:31 PM, DontWorryBeHappy said:

Hi Volchic!

Welcome to the Spot! And, thank for sharing some of your story. I agree with you, that “working out” some of the confusing and cognitively dissonant experiences in your years with TWIt is important. The old adage, “If we do not learn from history, we are doomed to repeat it.”, aptly applies here. 

I think as time goes by, and you take your time here to gather info, make new acquaintances, and, most importantly, continue to dialogue with the other members here about your experiences, thoughts, emotions, and psychosocial interactions during your time in TWIt, in order to effectively sort through “the good, the bad, and the ugly” of your TWIt year, will be an important beginning in your full understanding of what TWIt was, and how it affected you. Doing so will relieve any anxiety, embarrassment, guilt, or shame, which may accompany your self-reflection and your journey of self-identity. At the very least, I think GSC will provide a great launching point for your objective inquiry into the whys and whats of your involvement with a destructive, fundamentalist “Christian” cult. The very first step is overcoming that twinge of discomfort that often hits when confronting the denial which usually comes with the realization that the words, “The Way” and “a religious cult” are synonymous. 

I’m sure you will find the compassionate support and understanding so freely offered here among those of us who have made and are making the same journey you are. I bid you Godspeed in your exciting, self-determined new journey!

 

DWBH; 

2 hours ago, engine said:

Thanks, Skyrider.

I found it years ago by Oral, and boy, he was good. 

I've been catching up on threads, and not only do I like the divergent views, I am glad to see it here among all of us.....most of the time...lol.

Engine, I am not sure if this will help in your search, but I do want to mention Chris G's POaP.  I believe it came out in 1986, or 1987.  To me, it was a lot of Hog Wash, but you might find it of some value.  In it, Chris whines about how hard it was for him to get The Word established in the UK.  

30 minutes ago, Twinky said:

Some people clearly have too much time on their hands.

I translated my Corps notes, not transcribed.  Translated them straight into the woodburner.

 

Twinky, good for you!!

On 2/20/2019 at 10:39 AM, skyrider said:

Hey, who wants to sit thru another 3-part series of classes?

........no, not a foundational, intermediate and advanced class series.  That would be too patently distasteful having just left twi.

........This series is tweaked ever-so-slightly and sold as repackaged courses.

1. Our Identity in Christ    -----   a 12-hour modular course
2. Our Maturity in Christ  ----   an 8-hour modular course
3. Our Stand in Christ      ----   a 4-day Biblical education course

• The first one you learn to sit and revel in the accomplished works of Christ.
• The second one you learn to walk and conduct your life from a spiritually victorious position
• The third one you learn to stand against God's enemy, against his methods and schemes.

Notice: The 3rd course is a 4-day higher commitment.  After graduation, do these students get an "advanced class" nametag?

This coming weekend, February 23 and 24, 2019........Rico is running #2 in Sidney, Ohio. 

March 21-24, 2019..........Rico is running #3 in Titusville, Florida.  So, does that mean they will have SUPER DUPER spiritual vigilance over evil enemies as they follow Rico Magnelli,(?) 18th corps grad..........the corps-Pharisee who walked in cult darkness for 30-some years.

Gawd..........do these cult-splinters do anything else besides serve refried beans?

Ugh.

 

 

.

 

 

 

Sky, how much do these classes cost?  I am not going to take any of Rico's classes, but I would like to know how much money his "students" have to pay for their classes.

On 2/21/2019 at 5:07 PM, DontWorryBeHappy said:

There is a thread somewhere here, in which I document the events leading up to my being thrown off dictor paul’s motor coach on I-35, at a rest stop on the way to WIBAP 1982 in Kansas City. He demanded that I take the lead on “fighting those .... Jews in KC who are gonna picket me at WIBAP!”. When I responded, “Dr. (sic!), what does that have to do with moving the word over the world”? That’s when the purple-faced, neck-vein-popping order was barked out to Kramden Geer, the bus driver, to “pull over and get rid of this sonofabitch!”. Thankfully, by serendipity, we were within 2 miles of a rest stop, from which I called Emporia and begged a ride from another wayfer heading toward WIBAP. What a dangshow!

DWNH, unbelievable that VPW would do that to anyone!  What a jerk!!

1 hour ago, penworks said:

This thread is a perfect place to refer people to my interview--in two parts--with an eye-witness on this topic of VPW's plagiarism. BTW,  the link was posted in another thread right after I published the interviews on my website.

Click here.

Penworks, this is wonderful!!  Thanks for posting this.

3 hours ago, engine said:

I helped with JCOP in the summer of 1978 in Gunnison. It was a Family Camp, and the theme or whatever was something like, "The Last Week of Jesus Christs' Life."  I guess 100 plus of us?

I recall vpw there of course, Walter?, but for sure Chip Stansbrry. Chip was my Twig coor.

What we did every morning and afternoon was have twigs just for study. We spread all around the grounds. 2 or 3 casual hours each time, all week. Each twig did the same. We simply read through all the gospels line byline AFTER, in my case, Chip taught us Passover, the days, customs, and so on. He made sure we had it. That was the first morning session. The start and end of the Hebrew days, and so on. Timelines. It was meticulous work.  THEN, 

We started at John 12:1...6 days before Passover.  We used that verse as our "origin." Chip gave us some work sheets broken into days, and we used it for our timelines witht he verse, and so on. We proceeded through the other areas verse by verse, word by word at times, comparing similar, and sometimes not identical, records or passages/ verses at the same time, carefully watching our timelines, and Chip would ask our opinions on how we were reading it: Did we consider this? What about this? Did we have anything to add? And, we usually did, and Chip would look at you and listen, nod his head, and scribble it down in his notes. We met under the cottonwood trees in lawn chairs. Most of the twigs did. 10 twigs? It was FUN! Sweet. 

After that week was up, never heard anything until it was published. Pretty much what we all saw. I am not confident in a couple of areas, 6 denials of Peter for one, but Chip was OK with it years later when i had an opportunity to speak with him. Me? I don't know. That week was my inspiration to go into the corps, and I did.

It's the only twit book I have. I tossed mine with everything else back around '87. Then ten years later I had a question and needed that book. I said, "WTF?!" and got a copy from ebay. LOL

Engine, I thought JCOP was a great book; it was so well-written.  What a mind-blowing read.  I knew VPW didn't write it, the moment I started reading it.  His books were garbage, and painful to read.  The one "Ministry" book I wish I had kept was JCOP, but somehow I lost in in my travels.

On 2/27/2019 at 5:38 PM, Rocky said:

Somebody who had nothing better to do with his/her time.

Can you imagine sitting through 40 years of twig fellowships teaching/listening to the same old dull, well-worn "teachings" delivered by the same old dull, boring "leaders?"

Rocky, once was more than enough for me!!  No way am I going to waste my time reading that CACA a second time.

4 hours ago, skyrider said:

Grace.......imo, there are MANY nefarious reasons for Rico to start a splinter group and run classes:

1. At his age, his resume' would look like garbage to most all employers out there.
2. Rico was a corps coordinator and long-time staffer....would have had lots of contact with recently-exited followers.
3. Right place, right time......a shoo in for another splinter group leader to rise from the ashes.
4. Opportunistic and aggressive.........fundamental qualities needed by any successful cult leader.
5. The class money pays the overhead expenses......the faithful tithing/abs is the mother lode.
6. Perks and privileges........exponential potential payoff, adulation, travel, leisure, flexibility and exploitation-longevity.
7. Power and control over others.........perhaps someday, office staff, subordinate leaders, church building, etc.
8. If narcissistic pathologies and power persists.........sexual predation and lavish toys will be extracted.

Cults and splinter-cults grease the skids for lots of shenanigans.......tax exemption status, religious masking, access to people during vulnerable times, authoritative figure, no accountability, operating "off the grid," access to counting/reporting of money, offers to "counsel" in financial/funeral situations, etc. etc. 

With wierwille being Rico's "father in da verd"..........oh my, oh my!!

 

.

Sky, in other words, RM wants to be another VPW; he wants unlimited money, and power.  I believe W was a sick POS, who ruined countless lives, and families.  I fear RM might attempt to duplicate "his father in the word," by scamming the weak, and vunerable.  I want nothing to do with him, or his followers.  Ten years in TWI taught me, not to get involved with other cults.

3 hours ago, WordWolf said:

Yes, in this case, it's people who KNOW what a cult looks like.  If they join up now, it's because they decided they can't cut it in the real world, and NEED a cult to tell them what to think, what to do, and to take their money and time, most importantly.   Rico's counting on this- which says a lot about Rico.   If Rico's right about their BEING a God, Rico will need to answer for this to Him at some point.

WW, let us hope this is true.  All of us will need to answer to God at some point; however I want God to be happy with what He gave me.  I don't want to tick Him off by using The Word to make money for myself.

4 hours ago, skyrider said:

Attention:   Skyrider is running a 3-part series this weekend........February 23 and 24.

1. The Bourne Identity
2. The Bourne Supremacy
3. The Bourne Ultimatum

Open discussion will follow movie series........detailing aspects of intense-indoctrination, discovery and survivor.

No charge.  Bring your own sleeping bag.

Popcorn and beer will be provided.

Sky, you are so witty!!  And how much will you be charging us good people from the GSC??!!  

4 hours ago, skyrider said:

Hey, who wants to sit thru another 3-part series of classes?

........no, not a foundational, intermediate and advanced class series.  That would be too patently distasteful having just left twi.

........This series is tweaked ever-so-slightly and sold as repackaged courses.

1. Our Identity in Christ    -----   a 12-hour modular course
2. Our Maturity in Christ  ----   an 8-hour modular course
3. Our Stand in Christ      ----   a 4-day Biblical education course

• The first one you learn to sit and revel in the accomplished works of Christ.
• The second one you learn to walk and conduct your life from a spiritually victorious position
• The third one you learn to stand against God's enemy, against his methods and schemes.

Notice: The 3rd course is a 4-day higher commitment.  After graduation, do these students get an "advanced class" nametag?

This coming weekend, February 23 and 24, 2019........Rico is running #2 in Sidney, Ohio. 

March 21-24, 2019..........Rico is running #3 in Titusville, Florida.  So, does that mean they will have SUPER DUPER spiritual vigilance over evil enemies as they follow Rico Magnelli,(?) 18th corps grad..........the corps-Pharisee who walked in cult darkness for 30-some years.

Gawd..........do these cult-splinters do anything else besides serve refried beans?

Ugh.

 

 

.

 

 

 

Sky, I have a serious question.  What is the real reason these classes are being run??  It seems to me, that RM is trying to make money off of TWI garbage.  I took a lot of classes from TWI, and they bored me silly.  I don't know RM, so I don't have any opinions of him.  However, knowing he is a Way Corps Grad, and is selling classes, makes me very leary of taking any of them.  Perhaps the classes are interesting, and informative.  However, TWI always had classes they wanted to sell to people.  I for one, am not going to get caught up in the Class CACA again; once bitten, twice shy.