Oakspear

...and I think that you can assume that most didn't. Think back to the PFAL classes that you were involved in over the years and try to remember how many from each class stuck around, and were active. In my experience it wasn't many, and it seemed like it got worse over the years. My first class had nine new students. 1 didn't finish the class 1 was a lady in her 60's who never attended a twig A married couple who faded away after a few months My cousin who was gone before the ROA 5 months later That left four of us. Of that four, one left right before I went WOW 2 years later, one was still in as of 1983, but lost track of him after that, another I believe is still in, and me.

Speaking of cults:http://www.awm.org.au/pages/believe.html

I recall the "crowns" being taught as Galen outlined, but in looking at the verses, it seems to be a stretch to make the verse fit with what was taught. It also doesn't seem to me that the "crowns" were limited to five, nor to the reasons derived from the verses refered to. However, there does seem to be a kind of rewatd or recognition called figuratively a "crown", or "garland".

Huh?

Happy B'day sister weenie

...we didn't think anyone would notice

I Corinthians 9:25 And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they [do it] to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible. I Thessalonians 2:19 For what [is] our hope, or joy, or crown of rejoicing? [Are] not even ye in the presence of our Lord Jesus Christ at his coming? II Timothy 4:8 Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing. James 1:12 Blessed [is] the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him. I Peter 5:4 And when the chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fadeth not away. Revelation 2:10 Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast [some] of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life. These are the verses that they used. the way that it was taught was that there were five separate and distinct "crowns" that were given as rewards for "works". Striving for the mastery Endure persecution "Love his appearing" Endure temptation Overseeing God's people etc. I'm sure there was more

Gotcha Bramble...

A bully, IMHO, has some power, real or imagined, over the bullied. A playground bully is usually a little bigger than the other kids, so he threatens to beat them up. The workplace bully has some kind of authority over others, so he implies that he may fire the bullied. Allan really has no power over anyone here at GS. You can listen to him, or not listen to him. He isn't a bully, he's just annoying. So why get upset at what he says? He's entitled to his opinion. So what if he homes in on certain posters and attacks certain points of view? Does he ever offer a solid basis for his disagreement? Does he ever lay down a basis for his contrariness? Rarely, if ever. Kind of like a heckler. His mindset, also IMHO, has nothing to do with his supposed Christianity. Let's not lump him in with all the other Christians on this board, or tar them with his brush.

I dunno, I guess God is working in me to will and to do of His good pleasure. Well then, who am I to argue with your god? <_<

You didn't ask me, but I'll answer anyway. It's two fundamentally different ways of looking at the world. One is that everything ultimately comes from God, no matter that it may look like someone else is delivering it. The other is that the individual who is doing the giving is the one who has the compassion, who decided to give, independent of any deity. Being a non-Christian, I might have (slight) cause for offense if my charity or philanthropism was credited to a god that I don't believe in. It's one of those situations where the two views have no common ground. If the evil philanthropist in the story was as evil as he is made out to be, he might have taken back his largess after being "dissed" by the po' folk who thanked god, but not their immediate benefactor.

When I run a "ministry" that tries to get 10+% of your money, assault young women in my motorcoach and put out a class that I claim is the truth that has not been taught since the 1st century, then you can post about my sins

When we noticed it, my WOW bro' and I crawled outside and hid in the bushes and watched people go by 2 by 2. After awhile he told me "wait here", got up and joined the parade! Since they were spread pretty far apart, he was not noticed until he marched back into the church with them, sat in a pew and held hands with the church goers on either side. If I remember correctly he slipped out quietly after being recognized :o On one hand we were discouraged that we were not seeing any "fruit" during this part of our WOW year, but some of us started to develop a "martyr complex", where we figured that the devil must be mad because of the truth that we were speaking, which was why we were getting this flack. Most of the time I thought it was pretty funny, like when church members would approach us in public (sometimes where we worked) and say in a loud voice "I rebuke you in the name of Jesus!; but there were a few dangerous incidents, like rock throwing, almost getting run down by cars, and a few close calls with guys who seriously wanted to kick my foot!

Based on your previous postings, even that won't "do". Your pattern has been to state an opinion and then disregard all evidence to the contrary. It's my opinion that you take positions that will p*ss people off, whether you understand them or not.

Wow, apostle! Why do you think he was an "apostle"?And I've yet to see you discuss his teachings, or show any sign that you understand them, so what exactly are you thankful for? :blink:

free2love: If you dislike so much about what goes on here, why are you here? If you don't want to engage in the types of discussions that are common here...DON'T!

brought to the top in anticipation of an upcoming "episode"

Yeah, I think that was the one. I wasn't too impressed with the BBQ, and less impressed with the "meal package"...crappy food at high prices!

You da man, Roy

ROA's were a weekend long in the beginning, and became a week long later on. A bit longer than "a day", sunshiney or not.Yeah, what Roy said Regarding your new signature, you've demonstrated that you know little about what Mr. Wierwille taught, and that you lack the ability to intelligently discuss any of it...so what I think is that your signature is an attempt to p*ss people off.

I think we should skip the evil #6 and move straight to #7

It's fine that you're settled...not everyone is...and you are the one who suggested looking something up.

It was the last or second-to-last one, in Dallas. 1996 maybe?

One of the piano or organ guys was a pretty low key guy...never got the spotlight...kind of faded into the background...he played in some of the "bands"...but mainly did the background music while we were waiting for things to start...Nik Maxson maybe. Anyway, at one Word in Business, a bunch of us decided that he needed to be appreciated, so every time he came out we stood, clapped, hooted and hollered, shouting his name like he was Mick Jagger or somebody...it went on all weekend...he eventually started acknowledging it...and didn't get fired!

Since I was the only one of the five who was in TWI in the 90's, I can assure you that he didn't offend me. Asking the question, however, demonstrates that we often don't understand why other people do what they do. I too have friends and family who are perplexed at how I ever got involved in TWI at all, a cousin who can't understand why I didn't leave within the first year like she did and ex-Way acquaintances who got out in various years who can't understand why I stayed past their exit. Oftentimes I see posters take the position that they left at the perfect time and that they retain the perfect mix of Way doctrine: anyone who left before them was a "copout", anyone who stayed in after they left is an idiot; those who have kept more Way doctrine than they do are waybrained, those who have kept less have thrown the baby out with the bathwater - "obviously" whatever doctrine they threw out was Wierwille's error! People came and went for a wide variety of reasons