Greek2me

Hey Raf, You check your face in the mirror lately? ... my bet is that it's blue.

I've said it before and I'll say it again... Rocky, you are a piece of work.

Abigail, Good points. I think some of the difficulty lies in the fact that many times we tend to focus on forms (tongues etc.) as opposed to the function (closer, submitted and obedient relationship). It seems the Holy Spirit is more interested in function than forms.

Ex, Good question. I would have to say that YES, is the answer. Can it be that by leading us into a more submitted and obedient relationship with Jesus as Lord, is really what worshipping God "in Spirit" and "in Truth" is all about? After all, the Comforter is called "the Spirit of truth".

Ex, Yes. Clicker, "our comfort is knowing that we hear Him and not some other voice or spirit". Very well said. There is great comfort in knowing "the Spirit of truth".

Ex, I've been following with interest and wanted to "chip in" if that's alright. Btw, some really good stuff in here. Can it be that the three-fold role of the Comforter is essentially one-fold? The Comforter was sent to reprove the world of sin, righteousness and judgment. In so doing He would guide us into all truth. Christ said that He would "glorify me" (Him). In other words, to glorify Christ by reproving, convicting and guiding us into all truth, is the ultimate role of The Holy Spirit. No question but that this is done by means of having a relationship with Him, one in which Christ is glorified. That's a long way from TWI doctrine isn't it? You know, "it's god in christ in YOU!"

Dan & No-way... briliant! Lol.

Definitely Oprah. Ever see a pan of the audience with their wide-eyed, nodding in unison, shiney-happy people look as they listen to some New Age spew from "Dr." Phil? Reminds me too much of a group of brain-washed, star struck, adoring pfal students watching the "dr" spew his message of mass hypnotism and "you're too stupid to think for yourself so let me do it for you." UUUUggggghhhh!

Kit, Excellent! Who sings His praises! :)-->

Oak, Good chuckle that one... thanx still laughing out loud

No way, good point. I was never in twi, yet I had so much waybrain that I actually believed that the gospel's were written "for" us and not "to" us. UUUUmmmm let's see... God was so inconsiderate to one "administration" that He he had their doctrine written 35-50 years after their "administration" ended? Those of you still in, or you lurkers out there, think on that one a minute and get honest with yourselves!

Thanksgiving for me is the MOST missed holiday. I really miss it all. The family get together - (one of the few times we would actually get all of us together). The food - Can't get a good turkey dinner with all the trimmings here. Very hard to find yams, cranberries, etc. - plus for us it also meant overeating including seconds of pecan & pumkin pies. mmmmmmNNNNNNNmmmmmm! Damn - I've been dieting for 8 months and this is making me really hungry! After the meal, we would stake our claims on various pieces of furniture for the afternoon tradition of watching our Detroit Lions lose to Dallas or Green Bay. Then in the evening, grazing in the kitchen on left overs while enjoying some good coffee and maybe a little brandy. Those pilgrims sure new what they were doing, didn't they?

Dot said Bundles to be burned dottie, bundles to be burned...

ISTW, Rev. B.G. Leonard was ordained a Nazarene field evangelist after some study at a Nazarene Bible school (college?) in Canada. I don't know what the requirements for ordination are/were. He worked for a period of time with the Nazarene church in Canada, until he left and continued to preach and teach without any affiliation (other than God's... as attested to by the hundreds, if not thousands, of bona fide miracles wrought under his hands). I'm not sure if it was at this time that he started to prefer to be called "Brother Leonard", as opposed to Reverend Leonard. I do know that when I met him he preferred Bro. Leonard. (He was not into titles or heirarchy, in fact he called everyone brother or sister as well). He also worked and studied for a period of time in the mental health field, without completing a degree. OUT in 88, I think the missing piece you referrred to was, in fact, FAITH, ie., finally learning what it really is, and walking in it. It is most definitely not some - ridiculous renewed mind mumbo jumbo believing equals receiving mental gymnastics spew. That, coupled with allowing God to be God; as apposed to me being a god by my *believing* lol, has made a great deal of difference. Actually, now that I've written this, I would say perhaps what was missing to a great extent was "The fear of the Lord." After all, it is the beginning of wisdom. Prov. 1:7

Dot, Don't know that I can answer that. In the tape made at TWI, Bro. Leonard called him "a very apt student" or "a very capable student" I don't recall the exact phrasing. He was speaking to Mrs. Weirwille at the time who appeared briefly on the end of the tape. Apart from that, I never heard Bro. Leonard express an opinion about VP.

I've seen the tape of the Leonard's at TWI as well. It's sometimes (usually?) shown during "the Gifts of the Spirit" class. I think this practice is done when classes are mostly made up of ex-wayfers, I'm not sure. My understanding is that Martindale ordered the tape to be destroyed because it was full of lies and it wasn't "on the word". (Brother Leonard kept referring to the TWI-verbaged "manifestations" as the biblically-accurate, "gifts of the Spirit".) Only problem is, Craig forgot about the tape that was given to the Leonard's when they left TWI the day after the taping. (Warned of God according to Sis. Evelyn) Anyway, upon leaving TWI the Leonard's conducted a class in Montana or Idaho I think, and didn't return to Brownsville for about three weeks. When they returned, their house had been broken into and ransacked, though nothing was found to be missing. Amazing Coincidence? One of the great truths mentioned in this thread is that fact that Jesus said you would know men "by their fruits". When I met Bro. Leonard he was pretty much bed-ridden although he did attend a few Sunday services with us and an occasional dinner. He was 93 going on 94 I believe. What struck me most about him was the fact that... HE PRAYED ALL DAY LONG! For real. All day long you could hear him singing, praising God, praying, prophesying etc. Definitely a positive, lasting impression.

Wow, Isn't amazing to see what you miss when you're off line a couple days? A few thoughts... I've been under the impression the last few years that VPW's claim to have heard God speak to him about teaching the word like it's not been known since the first century, etc. was, in fact, part of a prochecy that was spoken over him at the graduation of Bro. Leonard's "the Gifts of the Spirit" class. Why? Bro. Leonard practised laying hands on graduates and prophesying over them at the conclusion of his classes. In many instances, a "gift" ministry was pronounced over the individual. In addition, having heard many prophecies brought forth over people these past few years, the wording or phraseology sounds much like a personal prophecy. With regards to Bro. Leonard's quote aboute God speaking to him and saying that He would give the revelation regarding these things (gifts of the Spirit) to bring His people out of Chaos, etc. Brother Leonard was speaking (conversing) to Charles Sydney Price at the time. In other words, Bro. Leonard recognised God speaking to him through Charles S. Price. Those of you reading this who have heard the voice of God speaking to you through another person will recognize this as a viable method employed by God to communicate to us. It's simply unmistakeable. Brother Leonard didn't claim that God spoke to him audibly, as VPW did. There seems to be many threads waiting to happen here. Would we all agree that the plagiarism issue has been settled at least? I, for one, vote yes.

Hey guys, Brother Leonard's book regarding the Godhead is called "The Water in the Bottle" "the Godhead". The most recent edition put out by CTC of Texas was subtitled, hence the second title. What's available now is not exactly his original work. It's been altered ever so slightly. Interesting work though. You can draw your own conclusions from it.

Hey all, Regarding the plagiarism issue - there is no question - Yes, VPW did plagiarize. Enough said. Having graduated from Rev. B. G. Leonard's "Full Bible Course", (of which "Foundations" is one of over thirty titles,) I can assure you all, that it is perhaps his best work and a must for Christians regarding the basic doctrines of the Christian faith. If you have even the slightest curiousity, I highly recommend it. Dot, enoy!

Too bad about the books...I know a Greek island that has a dump full of them! If anyone wants to go searching for them so they can get a little extra cabbage... they can be my guest. Many are still in the wrapper! We could start a new site for ex-way material. double u double u double u E-DUMP dot com ;-)

Wang Dang Sweet Poontang....Double Live GONZO! Shorty Medlocke's Harmonica intro to "Train Train" Jumpin' Jack Flash Oh yeah, I forgot one... ROCK CANDY - Montrose [This message was edited by Greek2me on February 21, 2003 at 0:35.] [This message was edited by Greek2me on February 21, 2003 at 0:36.] [This message was edited by Greek2me on February 21, 2003 at 2:36.]